ObamaCare Info

[eliza61]

The problem is that the focus keeps shifting to the welfare segment. The people who need help are the working poor.

Of course they will, very simply because the poor are easy targets.

How many stories do we read here how people on welfare are going to Disneyworld, getting their nails professionally manicured, buying escalades etc etc.

It's far easier to believe that then to admit that our health care system stinks and is expensive and that our education system is great if you can afford private school and college tuition.

 

[manning]

Ignoring that food stamps is a completely different program....and not really relevant (and...I'm not going to debate the pros and cons of specific systems):

But how many of those 28 year olds do you think there actually are?

A majority of them?

I suggest data shows they are the exception...by a lot...rather than the rule.

Once again, I'm not saying there are no examples of people who take advantage of the system. There certainly are.

Is your position that any system that has ANY abusers should be completely abandoned?

Simple answer... too many of them.

 

[pryncess527]

Simple answer... too many of them.

Except that doesn't really answer the central question.

Is your position that any system that has ANY abusers should be completely abandoned?

 

[mikek]

Of course they will, very simply because the poor are easy targets.

How many stories do we read here how people on welfare are going to Disneyworld, getting their nails professionally manicured, buying escalades etc etc.

It's far easier to believe that then to admit that our health care system stinks and is expensive and that our education system is great if you can afford private school and college tuition.

Boy you are a doner for the people of NJ- no wonder why people think NJ sucks- now you are telling them our public education system is pathetic and we're ignorant unless we go to private school.

Kidding aside-

The problem in education is basically the the same as healthcare in that a sizable percentage are left out. And that's a problem and SHOULD be addressed. But just like NJ's experience with the abbot(sp?) districts has shown that the problems run deeper than money alone. The ACA will ensure that the poorest will get insurance for free- but I'll bet you a fastpass or two that the infant mortality rates for that segment of people will still trail the upper classes in a year or two even though they'll be getting the appropriate prenatal care if they avail themselves. So while the country might move a few places up the infant mortality charts compared to Europe it still will likely trail a bunch and that will be with "affordable healthcare"

it's way complicated.

 

[Colleen27]

I find offense to this statement I have several friends who work in low poverty schools in Philadelphia. They are great teachers - as good or not better than any you'd find in suburban districts. And their districts spend much more per dollar per student than any school in our area, so again proving that government throwing money at problems does NOT work.

But where is that money going? Is it educating students, or is much of the difference attributable to maintaining century-old schools, busing kids from half-vacant neighborhoods, providing security, etc? City districts tend to have a lot more upkeep and repair expenses than better, newer districts and unlike more affluent districts they don't often have access to the funding required to replace outdated and inefficient facilities.

These jobs were never meant to support a family! These jobs were meant to be taken by students, housewives, retired people who have insurance through parents, spouses, etc. To earn a living wage you must either get an education or learn a trade, it's as simple as that.

But again, you're reducing it to the individual level. What those jobs are "meant" for is irrelevant. The fact is, those are the jobs we have. And we have far more of them than we have people working just for something to do. We don't have manufacturing jobs any more and many trades are following suit, though the benefits started getting cut in those sectors well before the jobs started disappearing. And there aren't nearly enough skilled professions in this country to provide for a healthy middle class.

Honestly, our problem is that we have to FIND a new direction for our economy. Manufacturing, as we know it, is gone and not likely to return. Service jobs work as a stop gap..but you have to have people who can spend money to be "served" for them to be worthwhile. And there are simply not enough with means to support the service industry/retail industry as it stands right now. Look at the retail numbers....they're terrible. "Flat" is considered a success story right now.

And this leads me back to something I said earlier... Aren't we much more likely to find that direction and start generating real growth again if people are free to start businesses and pursue ideas rather than punching a clock because they need to keep their insurance?

 

[mikek]

But where is that money going? Is it educating students, or is much of the difference attributable to maintaining century-old schools, busing kids from half-vacant neighborhoods, providing security, etc? City districts tend to have a lot more upkeep and repair expenses than better, newer districts and unlike more affluent districts they don't often have access to the funding required to replace outdated and inefficient facilities.

actually in NJ we've proven that money ALONE doesn't matter. We have a thing based on court rulings where these ~30 poor districts - the "Abbott districts" after the court case that made them- (Out of almost 600 districts in the state) get the majority of all the state aid. In 2011 the Abbotts spend about 20k per kid compared to the state average of 17k.

Since wholesale throwing money didn't work the court further ruled circa 1998 that it most be the lacking facilities so the state spent 2 billion in upgrading schools . Although the engineering study figured that only ~1.8 billion was needed the state wasted so much money that didn't get the job done so there's like another 1-3 billion in progress finish the job (again that's just for these ~30 districts) . Due to cost overruns and incompetence (probably some crimes too) many of the poor districts still have crappy schools - as an example I have a friend that tells me the Phillipsburg high school still has like 50 classroom trailers even though it was identified ~15 years ago that they needed a new school. But there are plenty of new schools- and there's no discernible difference in the places that managed to get the new schools.

Now we're on to providing preschool for under 5 year olds even though our state constitution says kids from 5-18 are the ones that the state needs to educate. Basically we're trying to give the 5 year olds a running start to see if that helps.

Despite all this its still a mess- I dont assume there haven't been any strides made, but still In Camden & Newark the kids are horribly disadvantaged. It's been found to way more complex than money alone. It's sad but there's something(s) else going on besides a lack of cash.

I think that the poorest should get insurance (my complaint is there's nothing significant to control costs) but becasue of the experience with the schools I'm sure that alone isn't going to magically make them as healthy as everyone else. I'd love to be proven wrong and this just makes us #1 in all the statistics compared to Europe- but i dont see it.

But again, you're reducing it to the individual level. What those jobs are "meant" for is irrelevant. The fact is, those are the jobs we have. And we have far more of them than we have people working just for something to do. We don't have manufacturing jobs any more and many trades are following suit, though the benefits started getting cut in those sectors well before the jobs started disappearing. And there aren't nearly enough skilled professions in this country to provide for a healthy middle class.

Totally agree that lots of people are stuck- but is the solution really for McDonalds to pay $20/hr or should the government do something about it so there are real jobs above McDonalds?

 

[mikek]

all the discussion aside.

anyone have any luck getting in the exchanges yet?

Although i seem to get a little farther each time i try- I still get "come back later" messages in the end.

I'm dying to see what the rates really will be.

 

[leahjade]

And you automatically assume that the government was paying the free high speed internet?

I'm not assuming - it is government paid.

The FCC just approved an extension of the free government cell phone program that will offers cheap, high-speed broadband internet service to the downtrodden, the deadbeats and the drug dealers. You’ll be eligible for CenturyLink’s Internet Basics and Lifeline Internet if you also participate in other government giveaways (such as food stamps (SNAP), public housing assistance, Medicaid, Section 8 housing, Supplemental Security Income, various Home Energy Assistance Programs, National School Lunch and other programs.

They are actually free Reagan phones

No wonder California is almost bankrupt.

Starting this week, California's poorest residents will be eligible to receive free government subsidized cellphones as part of a controversial program recently approved by the state's Public Utilities Commission.

All California residents who receive food stamps, Medicaid, earn less than $14,702 in annual income or are enrolled in any one of a host of federal and state programs are eligible for the Lifeline Assistance program, which offers a free cell phone along with a selection of three plans that range from free to $30 per month.

City districts tend to have a lot more upkeep and repair expenses than better, newer districts and unlike more affluent districts they don't often have access to the funding required to replace outdated and inefficient facilities.

Last time I checked kids can still learn in an outdated facility. Here's the website - educate yourself and see how many millions are being spent on EDUCATION. https://apps.philasd.org/SchoolBudgets/servlet

 

[Muushka]

all the discussion aside.

anyone have any luck getting in the exchanges yet?

Although i seem to get a little farther each time i try- I still get "come back later" messages in the end.

I'm dying to see what the rates really will be.

Do you have to give any personal data? SSN? There is no way I would trust my info with this bunch.
Oops. Sorry. They are a wonderful group of navigators. I would trust them to do anything.
It is a great program. Everything is perfect.

 

[rwielatz]

As long as you’re bashing the poor don’t forget that moochers, liars, and cheats exist at BOTH ends of the financial spectrum. There are plenty of people with fat bank accounts who “earned” it by doing their own share of working the system and without any second thoughts will lie, cheat, or steal to make a buck or get ahead. Having money doesn’t magically make you an honest and upstanding citizen and being poor doesn’t automatically make you a deadbeat sitting on a couch.

These people will always exist and it’s the ones in the middle that have to clean up the mess.

 

[mikek]

Do you have to give any personal data? SSN? There is no way I would trust my info with this bunch.
Oops. Sorry. They are a wonderful group of navigators. I would trust them to do anything.
It is a great program. Everything is perfect.

so far all I've managed to do is get a log in name, set up my password recovery questions, then have them confirm my email via an email where you click the link. (that took about 20 tries) I think I've literally tried to log since i got set another 50-100 times (all since 8:15am eastern) and I get varying degrees of "we're busy try again later".

So I'm not sure about what i have to give them.

BUT from what i gather you have to give them your life history which they verify with every government entity under the sun (immigration, SS, IRS, Etc) AND EVEN PULL A CREDIT REPORT to confirm your employer- JUST TO GET PRICING.

It seems they insist on figuring out your subsidy information first before showing you pricing. I'd like to see the pricing first and i think so would many others. Probably wouldn't break the website so bad if they allowed a simple price check first.

it's 9:41pm eastern as I type and the after being placed in a queue to get a chance to login I can enter my login id and password - but then i get "The requested URL /serverdown.html was not found."

I didn't think it would be fast at all today, but i am shocked it's been this offline all day. One bureaucrat said "the most we've ever had on medicare is 250,000 and we got a million people on this" as if they can't handle a million. They planned based on what 65 year olds do with computers to predict what "27 year olds" would do? And medicare is up every day of the year forever, they refused to publish pricing last week when they had it and insisted on holding it all back till this morning- what did they expect?

I really wish they would have done 5 states at a time- even disney IT didn't try all the resorts at once for MB's.

anyway- I'm so disgusted with the harassment of buying a 'small business plan" for myself that I'll gladly give my own, my wifes, and my 3 kids ss#s in the hope that i can get decent pricing. Lately everyone seems to be saying my pricing should go down for family coverage so I'm looking forward to actually getting on.



Seems I'm the only one here that is actually interesting in an exchange plan right now? I'm kind of surprised by that.

 

[mikek]

As long as you’re bashing the poor don’t forget that moochers, liars, and cheats exist at BOTH ends of the financial spectrum. There are plenty of people with fat bank accounts who “earned” it by doing their own share of working the system and without any second thoughts will lie, cheat, or steal to make a buck or get ahead. Having money doesn’t magically make you an honest and upstanding citizen and being poor doesn’t automatically make you a deadbeat sitting on a couch.

These people will always exist and it’s the ones in the middle that have to clean up the mess.

exactly, there's jerks at any level and any profession.

 

[njcarita]

so far all I've managed to do is get a log in name, set up my password recovery questions, then have them confirm my email via an email where you click the link. (that took about 20 tries) I think I've literally tried to log since i got set another 50-100 times (all since 8:15am eastern) and I get varying degrees of "we're busy try again later".

So I'm not sure about what i have to give them.

BUT from what i gather you have to give them your life history which they verify with every government entity under the sun (immigration, SS, IRS, Etc) AND EVEN PULL A CREDIT REPORT to confirm your employer- JUST TO GET PRICING.

It seems they insist on figuring out your subsidy information first before showing you pricing. I'd like to see the pricing first and i think so would many others. Probably wouldn't break the website so bad if they allowed a simple price check first.

it's 9:41pm eastern as I type and the after being placed in a queue to get a chance to login I can enter my login id and password - but then i get "The requested URL /serverdown.html was not found."

I didn't think it would be fast at all today, but i am shocked it's been this offline all day. One bureaucrat said "the most we've ever had on medicare is 250,000 and we got a million people on this" as if they can't handle a million. They planned based on what 65 year olds do with computers to predict what "27 year olds" would do? And medicare is up every day of the year forever, they refused to publish pricing last week when they had it and insisted on holding it all back till this morning- what did they expect?

I really wish they would have done 5 states at a time- even disney IT didn't try all the resorts at once for MB's.

anyway- I'm so disgusted with the harassment of buying a 'small business plan" for myself that I'll gladly give my own, my wifes, and my 3 kids ss#s in the hope that i can get decent pricing. Lately everyone seems to be saying my pricing should go down for family coverage so I'm looking forward to actually getting on.



Seems I'm the only one here that is actually interesting in an exchange plan right now? I'm kind of surprised by that.

im in nj and you have gotten farther than me............ i cant get past the 3 recovery questions.....

 

[scrapquitler]

so far all I've managed to do is get a log in name, set up my password recovery questions, then have them confirm my email via an email where you click the link. (that took about 20 tries) I think I've literally tried to log since i got set another 50-100 times (all since 8:15am eastern) and I get varying degrees of "we're busy try again later".

So I'm not sure about what i have to give them.

BUT from what i gather you have to give them your life history which they verify with every government entity under the sun (immigration, SS, IRS, Etc) AND EVEN PULL A CREDIT REPORT to confirm your employer- JUST TO GET PRICING.

It seems they insist on figuring out your subsidy information first before showing you pricing. I'd like to see the pricing first and i think so would many others. Probably wouldn't break the website so bad if they allowed a simple price check first.

it's 9:41pm eastern as I type and the after being placed in a queue to get a chance to login I can enter my login id and password - but then i get "The requested URL /serverdown.html was not found."

I didn't think it would be fast at all today, but i am shocked it's been this offline all day. One bureaucrat said "the most we've ever had on medicare is 250,000 and we got a million people on this" as if they can't handle a million. They planned based on what 65 year olds do with computers to predict what "27 year olds" would do? And medicare is up every day of the year forever, they refused to publish pricing last week when they had it and insisted on holding it all back till this morning- what did they expect?

I really wish they would have done 5 states at a time- even disney IT didn't try all the resorts at once for MB's.

anyway- I'm so disgusted with the harassment of buying a 'small business plan" for myself that I'll gladly give my own, my wifes, and my 3 kids ss#s in the hope that i can get decent pricing. Lately everyone seems to be saying my pricing should go down for family coverage so I'm looking forward to actually getting on.



Seems I'm the only one here that is actually interesting in an exchange plan right now? I'm kind of surprised by that.

I was able to see the plans and pricing and use the subsidy calculator on the CT exchange website without giving any personal information at all beyond the ages of everyone in my family and our zip code. I guess that it is just different for different states.

I need to get more information. It looks like its kind of a wash between my current plan and the exchange plans. My plan is more expensive but has better coverage. I could save a couple hundred each month by buying an exchange plan, but then I'd be subject to high deductibles that I don't currently have and my current plan pays 100% of cost above my copays, which the exchange plans don't. I'm definitely going to have a lot of thinking to do as I weigh my options. But I'm not ruling the exchange plans out yet.

 

[lauradis]

Government at its best.

Hope everyone gets great prices.

 

[scrapquitler]

so far all I've managed to do is get a log in name, set up my password recovery questions, then have them confirm my email via an email where you click the link. (that took about 20 tries) I think I've literally tried to log since i got set another 50-100 times (all since 8:15am eastern) and I get varying degrees of "we're busy try again later".

So I'm not sure about what i have to give them.

BUT from what i gather you have to give them your life history which they verify with every government entity under the sun (immigration, SS, IRS, Etc) AND EVEN PULL A CREDIT REPORT to confirm your employer- JUST TO GET PRICING.

It seems they insist on figuring out your subsidy information first before showing you pricing. I'd like to see the pricing first and i think so would many others. Probably wouldn't break the website so bad if they allowed a simple price check first.

it's 9:41pm eastern as I type and the after being placed in a queue to get a chance to login I can enter my login id and password - but then i get "The requested URL /serverdown.html was not found."

I didn't think it would be fast at all today, but i am shocked it's been this offline all day. One bureaucrat said "the most we've ever had on medicare is 250,000 and we got a million people on this" as if they can't handle a million. They planned based on what 65 year olds do with computers to predict what "27 year olds" would do? And medicare is up every day of the year forever, they refused to publish pricing last week when they had it and insisted on holding it all back till this morning- what did they expect?

I really wish they would have done 5 states at a time- even disney IT didn't try all the resorts at once for MB's.

anyway- I'm so disgusted with the harassment of buying a 'small business plan" for myself that I'll gladly give my own, my wifes, and my 3 kids ss#s in the hope that i can get decent pricing. Lately everyone seems to be saying my pricing should go down for family coverage so I'm looking forward to actually getting on.



Seems I'm the only one here that is actually interesting in an exchange plan right now? I'm kind of surprised by that.

I was able to see the plans and pricing and use the subsidy calculator on the CT exchange website without giving any personal information at all beyond the ages of everyone in my family and our zip code. I guess that it is just different for different states.

I need to get more information. It looks like its kind of a wash between my current plan and the exchange plans. My plan is more expensive but has better coverage. I could save a couple hundred each month by buying an exchange plan, but then I'd be subject to high deductibles that I don't currently have and my current plan pays 100% of cost above my copays, which the exchange plans don't. I'm definitely going to have a lot of thinking to do as I weigh my options. But I'm not ruling the exchange plans out yet.

 

[lauradis]

I was able to see the plans and pricing and use the subsidy calculator on the CT exchange website without giving any personal information at all beyond the ages of everyone in my family and our zip code. I guess that it is just different for different states.

I need to get more information. It looks like its kind of a wash between my current plan and the exchange plans. My plan is more expensive but has better coverage. I could save a couple hundred each month by buying an exchange plan, but then I'd be subject to high deductibles that I don't currently have and my current plan pays 100% of cost above my copays, which the exchange plans don't. I'm definitely going to have a lot of thinking to do as I weigh my options. But I'm not ruling the exchange plans out yet.

Make sure the cost of your current coverage is in the "Cadillac" class of insurance, because you could end up with user tax fee.

 

[scrapquitler]

so far all I've managed to do is get a log in name, set up my password recovery questions, then have them confirm my email via an email where you click the link. (that took about 20 tries) I think I've literally tried to log since i got set another 50-100 times (all since 8:15am eastern) and I get varying degrees of "we're busy try again later".

So I'm not sure about what i have to give them.

BUT from what i gather you have to give them your life history which they verify with every government entity under the sun (immigration, SS, IRS, Etc) AND EVEN PULL A CREDIT REPORT to confirm your employer- JUST TO GET PRICING.

It seems they insist on figuring out your subsidy information first before showing you pricing. I'd like to see the pricing first and i think so would many others. Probably wouldn't break the website so bad if they allowed a simple price check first.

it's 9:41pm eastern as I type and the after being placed in a queue to get a chance to login I can enter my login id and password - but then i get "The requested URL /serverdown.html was not found."

I didn't think it would be fast at all today, but i am shocked it's been this offline all day. One bureaucrat said "the most we've ever had on medicare is 250,000 and we got a million people on this" as if they can't handle a million. They planned based on what 65 year olds do with computers to predict what "27 year olds" would do? And medicare is up every day of the year forever, they refused to publish pricing last week when they had it and insisted on holding it all back till this morning- what did they expect?

I really wish they would have done 5 states at a time- even disney IT didn't try all the resorts at once for MB's.

anyway- I'm so disgusted with the harassment of buying a 'small business plan" for myself that I'll gladly give my own, my wifes, and my 3 kids ss#s in the hope that i can get decent pricing. Lately everyone seems to be saying my pricing should go down for family coverage so I'm looking forward to actually getting on.



Seems I'm the only one here that is actually interesting in an exchange plan right now? I'm kind of surprised by that.

I was able to see the plans and pricing and use the subsidy calculator on the CT exchange website without giving any personal information at all beyond the ages of everyone in my family and our zip code. I guess that it is just different for different states.

I need to get more information. It looks like its kind of a wash between my current plan and the exchange plans. My plan is more expensive but has better coverage. I could save a couple hundred each month by buying an exchange plan, but then I'd be subject to high deductibles that I don't currently have and my current plan pays 100% of cost above my copays, which the exchange plans don't. I'm definitely going to have a lot of thinking to do as I weigh my options. But I'm not ruling the exchange plans out yet.

 

[LovinPooh]

Pardon me for my dumb question here.. just recently i have been looking into this. And have been trying to keep up with this thread. I m in nh and i guess we have anthem to choose from. I played around with the calculator and it told me that if your employer offers coverage you are not entitled to a subsidy... am i reading this correct? The confusion gets me where a family of four qualifies under $90,000. How many people make that with a company that doesnt offer ins. And i thought all employers had to offer ins now.
So confused! Dh just started a new job...so we are currently without ins. So i figured i would play with this marketplace thing. But when it told me that a person who can get it thru work cant get it thru this i got confused.
I hate how every state is dif. That i dont understand...
Any insight would be great.
Hope everyone is faring well in this crazy time

 

[scrapquitler]

Pardon me for my dumb question here.. just recently i have been looking into this. And have been trying to keep up with this thread. I m in nh and i guess we have anthem to choose from. I played around with the calculator and it told me that if your employer offers coverage you are not entitled to a subsidy... am i reading this correct? The confusion gets me where a family of four qualifies under $90,000. How many people make that with a company that doesnt offer ins. And i thought all employers had to offer ins now.
So confused! Dh just started a new job...so we are currently without ins. So i figured i would play with this marketplace thing. But when it told me that a person who can get it thru work cant get it thru this i got confused.
I hate how every state is dif. That i dont understand...
Any insight would be great.
Hope everyone is faring well in this crazy time

Not all employers are required to provide insurance (I think there's a certain number of employees allowed before it's required), some people don't work full time, and there are many of us who are self employed and don't have an employer to provide insurance for us. And there are also many employers who provide insurance for the employee but not their family members.