NY Times article - UNBELIEVABLE! "Stragglers sully marathons..."

[MouseDogMom]

This article was reprinted in the local paper today. Here's a link to the original article in yesterday's NY Times. http://www.nytimes.com/2009/10/23/sports/23marathon.html?_r=1&hpw

I've been fuming ever since I read the article, but after I went to the Times site and read the comments that poured in after publication, I felt considerably better. I particularly liked the comment from the executive editor of Runners World.

Since many of the WISH team are the "stragglers" to which they refer, I thought we'd appreciate a chance to defend ourselves!

Jackie

 

[dislvr74]

Oh I saw that too and was so mad!

I love the part where they make fun of a 11 min mile pace. I dream of an 11 min mile pace!

This is why I continue to run Disney races. I've never felt like a second class runner and I always say that I would rather be with my people in the back of the pack because we have so much fun!

 

[bunnyfoo]

Wow! Just wow!

Who cares if someone wants to walk a marathon or only run part of it... And I didn't think that an 11 m/m pace qualified someone as a "plodder". Sheesh!

 

[jmasgat]

Jackie,

Thanks for the post. I thought the comment from the woman First Timer Virgina was wonderful.. Here's a snippet of her comment.....

"I have been training for six months specifically for this this event, sacrificing time with friends and family not just to get in the requisite training miles but also in the name of rest and recovery. I have run before dawn, after dark, in the rain, in the hot of summer, in the recent cold spell, in near 100% humidity - you name the conditions and I've probably been out there along with the rest of my compatriates in my training program working towards this tremendous life goal........I do not know how my run will go. I know I will finish, if I have to walk the whole way. And if I do, I will do so with my head held high."

I think that says a lot, and while I respect fast people (and even try to be a little more like them--as much as my 50 year old body will allow) I think that people who are training and trying their hardest, regaardless of pace, are true marathoners.

If I finish my first marathon in January, I will feel great no matter my finish time.

 

[VernRDH]

I too found this article a bit condescending. I am a solid 11 min miler, and I don't think I am a "plodder".

John Bingham is one of my heroes, and I think he is very well respected, as he should be. Why should someone else care how long it takes me to finish.

When I did my first half last month, I finished in 2:36. I was 475 out of 486. Apparently this was an elite runners race, even though it was open to everyone. Clocks were taken down before everyone finished, which I thought was sad.

If you only want elites to run, then state a time requirement. Maybe someone should have marathons/halfs ONLY for plodders. Tell those who think we are "ruining the mystique" of running to go run somewhere else, we are having races only for those runners/walkers who are out there despite what the snobs think. Maybe Bingham could start a Penguin Marathon, and no elites allowed.

I respect everyone who completes a half or full marathon, it is not an easy task for many of us. If you run, walk, skip, crawl, dance or wheel your way, I am proud to be a fellow runner with you.

 

[Tiger Lily 03]

...If you only want elites to run, then state a time requirement...
I respect everyone who completes a half or full marathon, it is not an easy task for many of us. If you run, walk, skip, crawl, dance or wheel your way, I am proud to be a fellow runner with you.

Yes.

This "elitist" attitude is always distressing, but in our world there are apparently always a few who want to think they are better than everyone no matter what the venue. It is sad when the news media buys into this attitude.

Many of the elite participants welcome any participant and understand the effort to be out there putting in the steps is commendable.

We count! "They" cannot make me feel inferior. I/We do not give them permission.

 

[deekaypee]

I just came here to post a thread on this--read it this morning and my 18 mile plodding training run is this afternoon. Yes, I 'm running even though I won't make the time goals touted by the people in the article. I'm running even though I do run/walk intervals. And when I walk, I'm still training to my utmost. Like my WISH buddies, I'm training with strength and spirit and determination. With style if not with grace, at least in my case.

I say, let these kinds of elites stay at the front of the pack, waaaayyyyyy away from me. That way their toxic attitude won't interfere with my good time in the back of the pack. I'll be competing--oh, yes I will--but with myself, not them. And isn't that what a race is about?

And FWIW, this attitude reminds me a lot of the articles in Marathon & Beyond, whose writers often bemoan, sometimes overtly, these modern marathons with their water/sports drink stops and food on the course. Wussies.... Seems to me that some of the people in the article misremember how the sport has evolved long before the penguin, making it easier for many athletes to compete--not just elites.

And speaking of elites, I'm not sure that the people in the article qualify. They seemed all, I don't know, a little slow for that term. It sounded like they're more behind the elites with delusions of grandeur.
Nawww, that's too bitter a comment. I take it back.

But I will comment on this one NYT reader post, excerpted:

I think purists might be best served by looking at the ultra running community. Their races are blissfully devoid of rock bands and people in funny costumes, and they approach their races with the respect and seriousness the distances demand. Most of their races have strict cut-offs. Given enough time, any armchair warrior can walk 26.2, but put those same people on a 50 mile race course and the wheat separates from the chaff pretty quickly.

Having just spectated at my first ultra--DOOD's 50K (not 50 miles, but still)--and started research on others, I can tell you that this person knows little about the ultra sport. It may not be costumes and rock bands, but people on many ultras do eat lunch-like items at fueling stops, stop to chat with their family and friends, and even walk on the course. Oh, the horror.

Anyway, turns out I had a lot to say on the topic, but overall it was just good for a laugh. For the rest of the day I think I'll let my feet do the walking, er, do I mean talking?

 

[Sarah_Rose]

I also fumed for awhile about this article (and still am to a certain extent) but have decided that it is simply ridiculous and does not reflect the dominant feeling among people who run marathons. The majority of reader comments (including ones from ACTUAL elite runners) could not believe that the writer found runners willing to put those thoughts on paper with their name attached.

And the simple fact is that it IS NOT the dominant opinion. I am currently a head coach for the Girls on the Run program, a program that emphasizes that running is an inclusive activity that anyone can do, irregardless of speed or body type. If you get out there and put in the steps, you are a winner; the faster girls cheer on the slower girls, just like the slower girls cheer on the faster ones. The founder of the program? An elite runner and four-time Ironman triathlete.

My favorite reader comment was from the person who said that it should take "weeks, perhaps months" to train for a marathon, and that the slow runners are obviously not putting in that effort. Well said, by someone who clearly has never gotten up off his couch. During our 8 miler today, DH quipped at one point, "I can't believe we have weeks, perhaps months, left of this!"

 

[Steffwalks]

I read the article. Personally, I thought it was kinda funny. It didn't make me angry, but I admit to some pity. Imagine if you will, that your self worth and running/racing identity is directly tied to, not just your own time; but how much better you are than someone else? And as a result, how much better you feel about yourself. So, you spend your time making waves about how good you are and all the LOSERS shouldn't even get to play with you. What happens then if that person gets their way and all marathons are restricted to 4 hours? or 3:30? That racer's 4:05 won't mean much, they won't get to race and then...well they lose their identity and they become what they despise! Or what happens if they are lucky enough to age gracefully and can't make a 5 hour ever again? Or perhaps, they have an injury and can never finish a marathon in less than 7 hours? I suspect that the rule changes she wants today, will NOT be the same ones she wants tomorrow. We should all remember that we must be careful what we wish for, because we might just get it, and in the worst way!

 

[Cruella de mom]

Imagine if you will, that your self worth and running/racing identity is directly tied to, not just your own time; but how much better you are than someone else?

Absolutely perfect response!

How dare anyone assume what effort someone else is making simply by time? Surely, we are more enlightened than that.

I have watched the finish of a couple races from winner to the last runner. I can tell you that many of the back of the packers worked a whole lot harder than some of those that cruised in at the 4 hour mark.

I think the author of this article needs to actually stick around until the end of a race and witness a few of those 6 and 7 hour finishers cross the line. I can't watch the end with out getting a big lump in my throat and shedding a few tears too. Funny, but its not nearly as moving as watching the winners or the bq groups for that matter.

 

[VernRDH]

I also fumed for awhile about this article (and still am to a certain extent) but have decided that it is simply ridiculous and does not reflect the dominant feeling among people who run marathons. The majority of reader comments (including ones from ACTUAL elite runners) could not believe that the writer found runners willing to put those thoughts on paper with their name attached.

And the simple fact is that it IS NOT the dominant opinion. I am currently a head coach for the Girls on the Run program, a program that emphasizes that running is an inclusive activity that anyone can do, irregardless of speed or body type. If you get out there and put in the steps, you are a winner; the faster girls cheer on the slower girls, just like the slower girls cheer on the faster ones. The founder of the program? An elite runner and four-time Ironman triathlete.

My favorite reader comment was from the person who said that it should take "weeks, perhaps months" to train for a marathon, and that the slow runners are obviously not putting in that effort. Well said, by someone who clearly has never gotten up off his couch. During our 8 miler today, DH quipped at one point, "I can't believe we have weeks, perhaps months, left of this!"

Sarah-thanks for being a GOTR coach!! My DD just started this program (going today actually) and what a wonderful program and organization!!! This is what we should teach our kids, its not always about winning, but about doing your best. Not everyone can finish first.

Love the comment by your DH!! I feel that way sometimes too!

 

[Sabeking]

Wow! I just ran the MCM yesterday. I dropped my time 30 minutes from last year (with a personal trainer; no I'm not serious about running). Since I was just above the 11 min pace should I have quit? I had a 10 minute pace by 1/2 marathon; so maybe I was a competitor for the first half of the race and an inconveniance to the elite by 13.3!!!

 

[Sabeking]

I went out for a 10 min. pace jog this morning and a man in a weiner suit passed me; the nerve!!!

 

[FireDancer]

I can't say articles like this make me angry because I know that it doesn't represent the majority of runners out there but it is a bit disappointing for a couple of reasons.

First, in a country that has a very obvious obesity epidemic people should be encouraged to do anything physical, and a marathon sure is physical. No one starts out an elite runner so that person plodding along in their first marathon might be qualifying for Boston in a future one.

Second, it's those plodders that make the events we like large enough to be worthwhile for cities, charities, and organizers to put on. If the fields were limited to the people who can do a sub 5 hour marathon they would be much smaller and harder to justify not only to city governments but to all the companies that support the races. While there is probably a genuine feeling of camaraderie for those companies they have to justify the expense and the exposure to 20,000 people instead of 3,000 goes a long way towards that justification.

Third, there are events limited to faster runners. They are just harder to find and not common. Why, BECAUSE THERE ARE SO FEW PEOPLE WHO CAN DO THEM!!!!!!!!!!!! There is a place for a marathon with a very strict minimum pace or a qualification necessity but that isn't every marathon and it sure doesn't diminish the accomplishment of finishing 26.2 at any pace.

Depending on the distance and size of the race sometimes I am in the front, sometimes near the front, sometimes in the middle, and sometimes struggling home (read my experience at my first marathon). I don't see how a runner finishing 3 hours after I finish diminishes what I do one bit. Sure, there are new runners that sometimes don't follow race etiquette and it is a pain on a course that loops or is an out and back, but that is rare. If someone wants to plod around at an 11 or 12 or whatever minute mile pace good for them. It is better to finish last than to sit on the couch and not start at all. There is a saying I heard somewhere, Dead Last Finisher > Did Not Finish > Did Not Start, or something like that. I just can't remember where I heard it .

 

[syko]

The same people who don't like walkers / jogers don't like the crank / push rim chairs either.
I'ver herd many times that we re only allowed in a race because it's the law!!

One of my team mates finished 4 hours after me at MCM.
To me, and the rest of the team he faced the same hills and finished, time is not an issue, he is a marathoner, just like all the people who walk, woggle or run.

At the NYC marathon next weekend the elites have a seperate start away from the slow disabled!!!!!!!

 

[FireDancer]

At the NYC marathon next weekend the elites have a seperate start away from the slow disabled!!!!!!!

I don't mind the elites starting separately or earlier than us normal people. In an event like NYC they have camera men and TV coverage following them and it is probably safer for everyone if they aren't competing with vehicles carrying commentators and camera men. They are also running for money and this for many of them is their job. I have no issue with them getting some preferential treatment as long as the rest of us get to run the race behind them.

 

[dislvr74]

I'm lol about the "slow disabled" because the winning wheelchair athlete finished the Indy mini-marathon at the exact same time that I made it to the START line!

 

[mandac]

It is great to read the comments to this article. As someone who is really new to this sport, and starting out as a walker/jogger, it is good to know that not all elite runners consider me to just be in the way. I have tried to find races where slower participants are acceptable (I usually check the last year finish times to make sure the race isn't too elite) and I sure try to stay out of the way of those who are faster than me.

I was lucky that I found the Disneyland half marathon, and I knew that it would be perfectly acceptable for me to walk and finish in 3 hours. I knew that I didn't have to worry too much about being thought less of, because there were so many people like me, working really hard and just happy to be there and finish. I have been afraid of other races because I am not fast, and I didn't want to be the joke of the event. So I am happy to hear that not everyone feels the way the people in the article do. I am going to continue to do what makes me happy, and getting out and moving makes me happy.

 

[sunstress]

Opinions like the ones in the article make me crazy. I "plod" along at at 11-minute mile average and am thrilled when I finish a race. I've completed one marathon and 6 halfs and, well, that's as fast as I expect to go. Why does it matter to people who start in corrals ahead of me and finish long before me when exactly I finish? It's not like I'm blocking their way on the course, or taking the last of the blue Powerade at the finish. Heck, they'll be home and showered before I finish!

I remember reading somewhere that the true elites have a lot of respect for us back-of-the-packers because we're out there on our feet way longer than they are!

Best,
Sunny

 

[scrump]

I saw that article, and am glad I found this thread. I'm new to the sport, and would be considered a "straggler". Yay me!