Not sure if I did right thing...situation at Drs office

[The Mystery Machine]

May I ask a question? Would you have been as offended if she had said something to the effect of "This has worked for me, and I wonder if it might help you as well... either as an addition to the pills, or as an eventual possible solution?"

I am Bi-polar and I don't take meds - it took me a long time and a lot of study and effort to learn to control this without meds, but I finally made it. That said my wife suffers from Depression and is on meds.

I think whether to take drugs or not is a very personal choice and there are no wrong answers. But I do like to try to help others by offering them the solutions that have worked for me - but I never suggest that they actually use them much less that they stop taking medications that are working for them. I just want them to know there is another way - what they do with that information is their path to take.

Unless I am seeing you for counseling, I find it wrong.

You could debate of should reg. doctors be prescribing psychiatric meds in the first place?

I understand if you are on maintenance for life but someone in the initial stages of crisis should be seeing a psychiatrist and a counselor. My youngest did and WOW what a difference in her treatment. My oldest did not and I don't know if she is on the right path of treatment.

Now I know it may not be possible for everyone to do that but I am just throwing it out there.

 

[fey_spirit]

I always suggest a therapist if that is an option open to someone suffering from a mental disorder of any sort... always. Much of what I learned about cognitive and behavioral therapy I learned from therapists.

That said, may I ask why you think it would be wrong for me to share what worked for me? Esp if I do not do it in a context of not taking meds or seeking therapy? I actually don't see it as any different then anyone offering information on what has worked for them when it comes to any other illness... (not that there simply is not a way to type this that will not look defensive with the lack of tonal inflections that are part of the net - but I'm not defensive, simply curious.)

Unless I am seeing you for counseling, I find it wrong.

You could debate of should reg. doctors be prescribing psychiatric meds in the first place?

I understand if you are on maintenance for life but someone in the initial stages of crisis should be seeing a psychiatrist and a counselor. My youngest did and WOW what a difference in her treatment. My oldest did not and I don't know if she is on the right path of treatment.

Now I know it may not be possible for everyone to do that but I am just throwing it out there.

 

[disney_mommy]

You did right. The fact that doctor looked so surprised when you told him is because she should not be saying anything like that to his patients. He was probably amazed at the cahones she had.

 

[fey_spirit]

You know - I really should have been more clear on this to start with, but just to be sure we're on the same page... to the OP you did the right thing. She had no business suggesting you stop taking medication, nor did she have the right to bring a specific religion into the situation.

I'm not sure that I think that it's wrong to offer suggestions to others as to what worked for us when we have challenges in common, however there is a right and a wrong way to do that - and this nurse beyond a shadow of a doubt chose the WRONG way.

 

[diznygirl]

I think if she was just sharing with you what works for her, that's okay. But as soon as she recommended you try it, that's when she stepped over the line.

I think you were right to let the doctor know.

 

[2binak]

May I ask a question? Would you have been as offended if she had said something to the effect of "This has worked for me, and I wonder if it might help you as well... either as an addition to the pills, or as an eventual possible solution?"

Either way, she would have been giving medical advice and it's not her place to do so. She's not the dr. She does not know the OP's medical history.

 

[fey_spirit]

Now I am completely confused.
How is "I have that problem and this worked for me" giving medical advice?
And people share this type of information every day on these boards, how they dealt with illnesses and such that they share in common... what's the difference?

Either way, she would have been giving medical advice and it's not her place to do so. She's not the dr. She does not know the OP's medical history.

 

[happygirl]

Not a big deal to me. I'm sorry it caused you a problem

 

[RitaZ.]

You know - I really should have been more clear on this to start with, but just to be sure we're on the same page... to the OP you did the right thing. She had no business suggesting you stop taking medication, nor did she have the right to bring a specific religion into the situation.

I'm not sure that I think that it's wrong to offer suggestions to others as to what worked for us when we have challenges in common, however there is a right and a wrong way to do that - and this nurse beyond a shadow of a doubt chose the WRONG way.

I agree with you that it isn't wrong to share information with others that may be dealing with a similar situation. However, the setting and the tone of voice in which this is done make all the difference. The OP went to see her doctor because she is in a vulnerable state right now. Maybe the M.A's tone was demeaning. Maybe the OP felt ambushed by her advice. I don't know. The bottom line is that OP didn't welcome her advice.

If the information is shared in an equal setting where there is a mutual exchange or conversation about a topic, then I see nothing wrong with it. I may not agree with the advice given, but I wouldn't be offended by it. Conversations are less about the words used and more about the tone of one's voice.

 

[bgirldeb]

You did the right thing. She was out of line.

 

[2binak]

Now I am completely confused.
How is "I have that problem and this worked for me" giving medical advice?

The employee didn't just say "I have that problem and this worked for me" She actually suggested, in a medical office setting, that the OP stop taking medication. See the OP's post below.

She then suggested I use prayer instead of continuing to take "all these pills" to control and stop my anxiety problems.

And people share this type of information every day on these boards, how they dealt with illnesses and such that they share in common... what's the difference?

The difference is that people on these boards aren't in a medical setting, expecting to get medical advice from an educated, trained doctor. They are here as peers, having conversations.

 

[fey_spirit]

It never occurred to me that anyone would approach this with anything but kindness and love when dealing with another human being. I know, I can be naive.

The setting of a doctor's office also seemed kind of ify... at least I think in that situation I might want to get to know the patient a little first and build up a rapport. That said I can see how one might be inspired to share if that was going to be their only contact with that person and they really thought they could help.

It is just very important to me that people know there are other ways to deal, either with or instead of medication. It's not that I'm anti medication because I'm not and I know they can help. What I am, is anti "pop a pill change your life." in other words using medication and medication alone instead of teaching people other means of coping as well.

I agree with you that it isn't wrong to share information with others that may be dealing with a similar situation. However, the setting and the tone of voice in which this is done make all the difference. The OP went to see her doctor because she is in a vulnerable state right now. Maybe the M.A's tone was demeaning. Maybe the OP felt ambushed by her advice. I don't know. The bottom line is that OP didn't welcome her advice.

If the information is shared in an equal setting where there is a mutual exchange or conversation about a topic, then I see nothing wrong with it. I may not agree with the advice given, but I wouldn't be offended by it. Conversations are less about the words used and more about the tone of one's voice.

 

[escape]

I agree with you that it isn't wrong to share information with others that may be dealing with a similar situation. However, the setting and the tone of voice in which this is done make all the difference. The OP went to see her doctor because she is in a vulnerable state right now. Maybe the M.A's tone was demeaning. Maybe the OP felt ambushed by her advice. I don't know. The bottom line is that OP didn't welcome her advice.

If the information is shared in an equal setting where there is a mutual exchange or conversation about a topic, then I see nothing wrong with it. I may not agree with the advice given, but I wouldn't be offended by it. Conversations are less about the words used and more about the tone of one's voice.

I was just about to post something similar. fey_spirit, I agree - I don't think it's wrong to offer suggestions to others - especially if something works for you. However, as you know and stated, the nurse had no business suggesting anything unless the patient asked for her advice. Even then, the nurse would have to carefully choose her response so it wouldn't appear to take the place of what the doctor recommends.

 

[fey_spirit]

Yes, but I never said I would approach it as the nurse in question did - I have already conceded that she handled this wrong on every possible level. I asked if she had handled it differently would it have been a different situation.

I can see your point in reference to the setting - and I don't know that I disagree. I just think that it's a little more complicated, if you feel that is your one and only chance to help another person I think I might have to take it... of course I would have said "I suffer from that too - and this is what I do" and that would be the end of it... well except maybe "I know it's scary right now - but there is a light at the end of the tunnel, it gets better I promise."

The employee didn't just say "I have that problem and this worked for me" She actually suggested, in a medical office setting, that the OP stop taking medication. See the OP's post below.


The difference is that people on these boards aren't in a medical setting, expecting to get medical advice from an educated, trained doctor. They are here as peers, having conversations.

 

[fey_spirit]

I guess that's another difference - I don't take anything a nurse says as medical advice anyways... but maybe that comes from having a nurse as a mother =)

I was just about to post something similar. fey_spirit, I agree - I don't think it's wrong to offer suggestions to others - especially if something works for you. However, as you know and stated, the nurse had no business suggesting anything unless the patient asked for her advice. Even then, the nurse would have to carefully choose her response so it wouldn't appear to take the place of what the doctor recommends.

 

[angie@dvcstore]

If she's an MA she's not supposed to give medical advice she is just supposed to do her job she was out of line big time and this is coming from another another MA

 

[phragmipedium]

Now I am completely confused.
How is "I have that problem and this worked for me" giving medical advice?
And people share this type of information every day on these boards, how they dealt with illnesses and such that they share in common... what's the difference?

I think the problem is that the MA was not the patient's doctor and presumably is not licensed to give that level of medical advice, but the MA's position of working in the office might lend her a sense of authority anyway. It's really not her place to make those suggestions about medical or spiritual treatments, but the fact that she is employed in the medical field could make someone give more credence to what she has to say than some random person on a message board.

If I'm sitting next to you (general you - not saying you'd do this) at a dinner party and you start telling me how prayer took away your anxiety and could take away mine too so I should lay off the pills, I can pretty easily take your unsolicited advice with a grain of salt, consider you an over-sharer who makes me uncomfortable and just avoid you in the future. But if a medical professional at an appointment is supposed to be doing basic procedures and starts making health recommendations that it's not their place to make, especially when it goes outside of the medical setting into religious advice, I think that's a real problem and needs to be corrected.

The OP was right, I think, to be polite to the MA but mention it to the doctor, so there can be clarification about what scope of care and advice, particularly unsolicited spiritual advice, is to be given by someone other than the doctor. The MA likely meant well but needs to be careful about what she says when she's at work and wearing her "medical professional" hat so she doesn't cross lines. Honestly, I'd have been offended whether it was an MA or a doctor offering advice like that - if I came to a medical doctor, I'm looking for medical advice and would feel uncomfortable receiving spiritual guidance in that scenario.

 

[fey_spirit]

See this as I said was part of the puzzle that was missing for me.
It never occurred to me that anyone would take a nurse's advice as medical advice. I suppose you only have to hear "Fey I'm a nurse not a doctor" (heard often from my mom) before it sinks in that they can't give medical advice and usually not jut because it's illegal but because they don't know.

I am one that feels that spirituality should span everything we do, so I don't think there is any place that it does not belong... that said I do think there are many many places where religion does not belong.

Also as I said - I would NEVER suggest that someone stop taking medication... at most I might suggest that it might be possible for them to eventually build themselves up to the point where they do not need to rely on it... and even then if they still want to use it to make the task easier, great! I just don't feel that we should train people to have no ability to exist without medications for the rest of their lives when there are ways that can help supplement or in some cases even surpass the need for these meds.
I think the goal should be to help people be able to cope without meds should they choose as often as possible.

Regardless I now concede that the setting matters more then I might have at first considered, accounting for the number of people who might give too much credence to the medical validity of the source.

I think the problem is that the MA was not the patient's doctor and presumably is not licensed to give that level of medical advice, but the MA's position of working in the office might lend her a sense of authority anyway. It's really not her place to make those suggestions about medical or spiritual treatments, but the fact that she is employed in the medical field could make someone give more credence to what she has to say than some random person on a message board.

If I'm sitting next to you (general you) at a dinner party and you start telling me how prayer took away your anxiety and could take away mine too so I should lay off the pills, I can pretty easily take your unsolicited advice with a grain of salt, consider you an over-sharer who makes me uncomfortable and just avoid you in the future. But if a medical professional at an appointment is supposed to be doing basic procedures and starts making health recommendations that it's not their place to make, especially when it goes outside of the medical setting into religious advice, I think that's a real problem and needs to be corrected.

The OP was right, I think, to be polite to the MA but mention it to the doctor, so there can be clarification about what scope of care and advice, particularly unsolicited spiritual advice, is to be given by someone other than the doctor. The MA likely meant well but needs to be careful about what she says when she's at work and wearing her "medical professional" hat so she doesn't cross lines. Honestly, I'd have been offended whether it was an MA or a doctor offering advice like that - if I came to a medical doctor, I'm looking for medical advice and would feel uncomfortable receiving spiritual guidance in that scenario.

 

[The Mystery Machine]

I always suggest a therapist if that is an option open to someone suffering from a mental disorder of any sort... always. Much of what I learned about cognitive and behavioral therapy I learned from therapists.

That said, may I ask why you think it would be wrong for me to share what worked for me? Esp if I do not do it in a context of not taking meds or seeking therapy? I actually don't see it as any different then anyone offering information on what has worked for them when it comes to any other illness... (not that there simply is not a way to type this that will not look defensive with the lack of tonal inflections that are part of the net - but I'm not defensive, simply curious.)

What if the person you are giving advice to has already tried what you are suggesting?

You do realize that you would be making them feel like crap worse than they are.

Giving your advice here or out in public is fine. People can take it or leave it.

In a private medical setting you need to let the doctor give the advice.

 

[fey_spirit]

Already conceded (as to the location).

What if the person you are giving advice to has already tried what you are suggesting?

You do realize that you would be making them feel like crap worse than they are.

Giving your advice here or out in public is fine. People can take it or leave it.

In a private medical setting you need to let the doctor give the advice.