Norway not happy with Disney wanting to replace Maelstrom with Frozen ride

[JoshuaShaw]

I certainly didn't expect that to be presented as a challenger.

Cocktail remains his most esoteric movie, even when contrasted with Eyes Wide Shut and Vanilla Sky. Absolutely bizarre.

I'm sticking with Les Grossman. His dance was the most awesome of Cruise's career as well, to heck with Risky Business.

Can we just turn this into a Tom Cruise Animated .gif thread?

 

[hookedonears]

http://www.dailyfinance.com/2014/07/24/frozen-norway-disney-epcot/

I'll be unhappy as well. Frozen would be perfect for a completely re-imagineered Imagination Pavilion. They've already screwed up the Mexico Ride. They need to leave Norway alone.

 

[surferdave]

Cocktail remains his most esoteric movie, even when contrasted with Eyes Wide Shut and Vanilla Sky. Absolutely bizarre.


Can we just turn this into a Tom Cruise Animated .gif thread?

I'm in!

 

[CaliTex]

What people seem to be missing is Walt Disney Company is a MEDIA company that uses their Parks to promote their media business. They are not a charitably NGO.

Last year (2013) Disney showed Revenues as follows-

Media $20.3B
Parks $14.0B
Studios $5.9B
Products $3.5B
Interactive $1B

Since they aren't an NGO tasked with promoting Norway or tourism or anything else, I see no problem with them saying, bail out your pavilion or else we can stick something into it that will make us more money.

EPCOT Center long ago lost the character battle. When EC opened, characters (except for the ones made just for the park, like Figment) were banned from the park. That ship sailed long ago the process has been slow but slowly EC has turned into just another theme park, with thrill rides and character meet and greets.

I do love EC. I would love to see the FW pavilions taken over by tech companies in each sector and really done up to showcase what they do. I would love to see more local culture in each of the WS pavilions. But that model hasn't shown to be sustainable.

I didn't see this much outrage when Kim Posible was added to WS, no outrage when Kim was converted to P&F. I've heard people complement what adding the princesses to Norway did for the pavilion.

And as a few others have said $9m isn't much it would barely show in the annual report (Parks in Millions is 14,087 I rounded up earlier)

This.

This is a fascinating look at where we are at in OUR culture, education, and awareness.

ECONOMICS 101: we live in, enjoy, and benefit from living in a capitalist society. DISNEY is a business. They have no obligation to do anything other than make sound business decisions that make money for their stockholders, to whom they have a fiduciary duty. If one does not like the decisions DISNEY CORP makes, then buy a majority of their stock and start asserting your influence. However, you may find that your priorities change when it well and truly affects *your* bottom line.

Side note (but not really) Askershus was an extremely unpopular, under-utilized restaurant. Herring for breakfast? Come on. That's just not going to fly in our (American) culture. Yes, yes, yes, for those of you that are so greatly and wonderfully and awesomely multi-culturally diversity embracing and like herring in sour cream at 8 am, good for you. All both of you. But in the meantime, Americans like something different. Let's not be hating on our own culture while wonderfully embracing everyone else's culture. And BTW; the changes are not "dumbed down"--they are simply different, because I am pretty sure herring and Mickey Waffles have the same number of IQ points. Ha ha.

BOTTOM LINE: DISNEY CORP is attempting to have a reasonable capitalist negotiation with a very socialist country that is used to sharing in the wealth of other people's hard work. They have also grown accustomed to the free advertising. Tough luck for them. That ride is about to end. (No pun intended.)

To expound on this: I own my own small business. I would love to be able to set up a pavilion advertising my business in the World Showcase and have Disney maintain it for free. Since I am in landscape design, it would even fit the theme. Heck, I will settle for a booth during the flower show. Just. You know. Don't make me pay for anything, Disney. Oh, and I will send several employees to work the booth. But Disney, you pay them.

For the Norwegian CMs that are upset--take that up with your government, and work to change things from within. Whining is a waste of time. Write that down somewhere and keep it handy.

That said, I love the Norway pavilion. I am of Swedish and Norwegian ancestry, so it is special to me. I don't particularly want it to go all "Frozen" marketing, but that is not *my* decision to make. I do not own stock, I am merely a humble tourist, one among thousands and thousands.

You all are wonderful. Love this place. But I really need to get to work.

 

[sabrecmc]

Ok, well, I'll go against the grain and say that I like WS for food and shopping, but cultural education? Um, no. The Maelstrom is outdated and boring. Bring on Frozen!!! My daughter would be so excited by that. La, la, la, can't hear you!

 

[CaliTex]

PS; the Tom Cruise thing? No. Way.

 

[CaliTex]

Ok, well, I'll go against the grain and say that I like WS for food and shopping, but cultural education? Um, no. The Maelstrom is outdated and boring. Bring on Frozen!!! My daughter would be so excited by that. La, la, la, can't hear you!

LOL. And there we have it, folks; the truth is out. You want education? Go to school. You want culture? Travel. And I don't mean to Florida. Visit museums. EPCOT is an amusement park.

 

[BrianL]

I don't necessarily mind if they made the Maelstrom into a Frozen ride. It does need an update and it's not like the current storyline is exactly non-fiction anyway. However, I draw the line at that and do not want to see the Norway Pavilion become Arendale. One attraction that fits the theme? Fine, no problem. It's be like having a Mulan ride in China or a BATB in France, but don't let it spill out everywhere!

 

[flicx]

This.

This is a fascinating look at where we are at in OUR culture, education, and awareness.

ECONOMICS 101: we live in, enjoy, and benefit from living in a capitalist society. DISNEY is a business. They have no obligation to do anything other than make sound business decisions that make money for their stockholders, to whom they have a fiduciary duty. If one does not like the decisions DISNEY CORP makes, then buy a majority of their stock and start asserting your influence. However, you may find that your priorities change when it well and truly affects *your* bottom line.

Side note (but not really) Askershus was an extremely unpopular, under-utilized restaurant. Herring for breakfast? Come on. That's just not going to fly in our (American) culture. Yes, yes, yes, for those of you that are so greatly and wonderfully and awesomely multi-culturally diversity embracing and like herring in sour cream at 8 am, good for you. All both of you. But in the meantime, Americans like something different. Let's not be hating on our own culture while wonderfully embracing everyone else's culture. And BTW; the changes are not "dumbed down"--they are simply different, because I am pretty sure herring and Mickey Waffles have the same number of IQ points. Ha ha.

BOTTOM LINE: DISNEY CORP is attempting to have a reasonable capitalist negotiation with a very socialist country that is used to sharing in the wealth of other people's hard work. They have also grown accustomed to the free advertising. Tough luck for them. That ride is about to end. (No pun intended.)

To expound on this: I own my own small business. I would love to be able to set up a pavilion advertising my business in the World Showcase and have Disney maintain it for free. Since I am in landscape design, it would even fit the theme. Heck, I will settle for a booth during the flower show. Just. You know. Don't make me pay for anything, Disney. Oh, and I will send several employees to work the booth. But Disney, you pay them.

For the Norwegian CMs that are upset--take that up with your government, and work to change things from within. Whining is a waste of time. Write that down somewhere and keep it handy.

That said, I love the Norway pavilion. I am of Swedish and Norwegian ancestry, so it is special to me. I don't particularly want it to go all "Frozen" marketing, but that is not *my* decision to make. I do not own stock, I am merely a humble tourist, one among thousands and thousands.

You all are wonderful. Love this place. But I really need to get to work.

While you make some valid points you are forgetting a few others. Disney is keeping all profits from world showcase, none go to the countries themselves. Disney had the idea to build the world showcase not the other countries ,Disney went to them. The way I see it, you can't have it both ways. If you want to run a quote "world showcase" and make money from it, don't expect countries to fork over a lot of dough for you to do it. Now maybe Disney is changing gears and instead of a world showcase it will be a cartoon world showcase like some have suggested, the three cabileros and frozen , mulan etc.

 

[surferdave]

PS; the Tom Cruise thing? No. Way.

You wanted a fascinating look at our culture, why not Tom? I just can't seem to get away from him.

 

[JoshuaShaw]

I think this is a case where both sides have a good point (Norway and Disney that is, not people who want Frozen in the WS). There is no reason for Norway to part with such a large sum of money to a theme park in a completely different country. Why should they want a stake in something that, most likely, sees small returns for them? Conversely, if Disney is footing the bill then they will, and should, have complete creative freedom. The question for Disney becomes, is it more lucrative for them to appeal to EPCOT purists or Frozen fans? As a purist, I'm not sure I want to know the answer.

Josh out.

PS; the Tom Cruise thing? No. Way.

Don't fight it.

EDIT: ACK! Too slow!

 

[csjordan]

Ok, well, I'll go against the grain and say that I like WS for food and shopping, but cultural education? Um, no. The Maelstrom is outdated and boring. Bring on Frozen!!! My daughter would be so excited by that. La, la, la, can't hear you!

This!

 

[Dan Murphy]

No, I think that means Disney is basically blackmailing Norway! "Pay 9mil or your country's pavilion turns into FrozenLand!"

I read it as such also.

 

[jco_direwolf]

While you make some valid points you are forgetting a few others. Disney is keeping all profits from world showcase, none go to the countries themselves. Disney had the idea to build the world showcase not the other countries ,Disney went to them. The way I see it, you can't have it both ways. If you want to run a quote "world showcase" and make money from it, don't expect countries to fork over a lot of dough for you to do it. Now maybe Disney is changing gears and instead of a world showcase it will be a cartoon world showcase like some have suggested, the three cabileros and frozen , mulan etc.

Nope they didn't. Well they did go to the countries first, and all the countries turned them down, except one who they didn't go to (so goes the story) that the King/Royal Family/Prince (not sure of the title) of Morocco came and said "I'm jazzed about this how do I make this happen." (okay may not those words but ...)

The park is run on gate fees, and revenue from sales in the park. Most of the pavilions are other private companies (both FW and WS).

 

[Planogirl]

I don't know what's worse truthfully. People who don't care about Epcot and how it might change into MK Lite or Disney for its heavy-handed tactics. I hope that Norway gives in and pays for my own selfish reasons but if they don't and Norway in essence disappears then I hope that they no longer send the CM's or products for the gift shop that will apparently still be there. Let Disney staff their own "Norwegians".

 

[mdsouth]

If Disney wants Frozen in Norway, maybe Disney should consider replacing the princesses at Akershus with Frozen characters. There's already a princess meal at the castle with the same princesses and Cindy and the gang at 1900 Park Fare. So put Anna, Elsa, Olaf and Kristoff at Akershus. Belle used to be the feature princess at Akershus for the picture (is she still?) and Belle doesn't have one thing to do with Norway. The Frozen sisters are at least based upon Norway and would make more sense there. Plus, I think boys would be more interested in a Frozen meal than the princess meal because of Olaf and maybe Kristoff.

Great idea!

 

[speedo]

While you make some valid points you are forgetting a few others. Disney is keeping all profits from world showcase, none go to the countries themselves.

This doesn't make sense - I just bought some designer perfume at Norway last weekend and the designer - Geir - was there signing the products sold. Pretty sure profits are going to his company with commission going to Disney. And his company is Norwegian and since he is Norwegian, he pays taxes in Norway - Norway and it's citizens are definitely benefiting from sales of Norwegian products in the stores. It is all connected.

Plus there is a tourism benefit to these pavilions. It encourages people to visit Norway.

Many Norwegian and Norwegian-ish companies sponsored the original pavilion in the 80s. You can still see the signs throughout - like SAS and Norwegian Cruise Line. I still think Norway and these companies are getting a free ride in terms of advertising and should put in more money though corporate sponsorships, Norway's tourism bureau, etc to update the pavilion since there is a benefit to Norway.

But that is up to them to decide. And seems like what they are deciding now - does the benefit of the pavilion out way the cost to update?

I agree with some previous comments that perhaps this model of relying on sponsorships just doesn't work that well?

 

[AndreaA]

Ok, well, I'll go against the grain and say that I like WS for food and shopping, but cultural education? Um, no. The Maelstrom is outdated and boring. Bring on Frozen!!! My daughter would be so excited by that. La, la, la, can't hear you!

Gotta say that I agree with this. Epcot is AT MOST a half-day park for us. Often, we skip it altogether. I honestly don't understand those who rate it as their favorite park.

The FutureWorld section is just plain sad. Somehow I managed to miss that it's all funded by various companies (which explains the dearth of attractions) but seriously, if more companies didn't chip in, the Disney should have stepped up to the plate to fill the gap. Both Futureworld pavilions are far less impressive than our local Boston's Museum of Science or even the Boston Children's Museum! The aquarium is ridiculously small and I feel badly for the poor dolphins in that small and totally boring tank. Living With the Land is basically the only exhibit that remains interesting and relevant.

Having done the WS a couple of times, I have to say it's a total snore and I absolutely LOVE everything about Chinese and Japanese culture, but I certainly didn't learn anything in those pavilions other than the fact that HelloKitty really is a force of nature in Japan. The only interesting parts are the occasional performers here and there.

All that to say that if Disney wants to rejuvenate the place by "Disney-fying" it a bit, then more power to them.

 

[Planogirl]

Gotta say that I agree with this. Epcot is AT MOST a half-day park for us. Often, we skip it altogether. I honestly don't understand those who rate it as their favorite park.

The FutureWorld section is just plain sad. Somehow I managed to miss that it's all funded by various companies (which explains the dearth of attractions) but seriously, if more companies didn't chip in, the Disney should have stepped up to the plate to fill the gap. Both Futureworld pavilions are far less impressive than our local Boston's Museum of Science or even the Boston Children's Museum! The aquarium is ridiculously small and I feel badly for the poor dolphins in that small and totally boring tank. Living With the Land is basically the only exhibit that remains interesting and relevant.

Having done the WS a couple of times, I have to say it's a total snore and I absolutely LOVE everything about Chinese and Japanese culture, but I certainly didn't learn anything in those pavilions other than the fact that HelloKitty really is a force of nature in Japan. The only interesting parts are the occasional performers here and there.

All that to say that if Disney wants to rejuvenate the place by "Disney-fying" it a bit, then more power to them.

I don't think that most would mind a bit of Disney-fying however the rumor is that Norway would in essence vanish and become a fake land of princesses and that has some people upset. The Frozen characters being around in some way isn't so bad but them taking over is or at least I think so.

 

[Reddog1134]

The aquarium is ridiculously small and I feel badly for the poor dolphins in that small and totally boring tank.

It's the 2nd largest aquarium tank in the world.