Non-Catholics in Catholic School Experiences?

[Mkrop]

You're right! I used the because I didn't want people to think that I was attacking them by asking them to show it to me in the Word. Religious talk can get volatile, sometimes

Oh, and I'm confused. Which is supposed to be the more challenging class, Honors or Ap. How do you get into each one, recommendation, grades or testing? Thanks

Well I am guessing based on what MM said you may need to look at your individual diosece if it is a dioecean school or the individual website if it is a private Catholic school.

Where I went, 20 years ago, it was AP, Track 1 Honors, track 2, 3 and 4. We were originally grouped by our grade school grades and our standard test scores. We were not eligible for AP classes until Jr yr so by then the school had a pretty good idea of our capabilities. I was never offered the AP classes, I think I was borderline in some subjects, so I dont know how a class was offered. I also struggled in some of my Honors classes and the school worked very closely with me and allowed me to drop to Track 2 which was still college prep but I was not a strong science student. I was actually bored in those classes but it helped my self esteem bc I thought at time I was pretty dumb next to all those MIT bound kids.

I believe from talking to some parents of DS10's friends with older siblings that many of our schools still handle tracking and AP classes the same way.

 

[NotUrsula]

Yea....Like I can afford Clayton and Ladue. Come on.

Ah, but that's not the point. The point is that you asserted that Rockwood is the only public school district in the St. Louis metro area that offers AP classes, and that just isn't so. Now if you had said "the only public school district in far west St. Louis County that offers AP classes" then I might not have challenged that, but as it turns out now that I've had time to check, Parkway offers AP, too.

Whether or not AP classes SHOULD be routinely offered at every school is another issue. However, if an AP class is offered I'd prefer that it be a serious one, not something slapped together by a teacher who isn't really up for it just so that the school can say that they have X number of AP classes.

I live in the city of St. Louis, and my only presently school-aged child attends a parochial elementary school. I don't care for the Archbishop, either.

 

[delilah]

I am coming in late to this thread. As background, I attended Catholic elementary school, public HS, state universities for undergrad, grad, and medical school. I pretty much was on the high honor roll all the way through school, from K-University level. I am now on the school commission at the Catholic school my son attends.

The whole AP deal mystifies me. When I was in HS, and applying to university, it was pointed out to me that if I took AP calculus, for example (and this was also true about AP biology, chemistry, and physics), and earned a 5 on the exam, I would earn credit for a lower level course than that I would be taking as an honors level entering freshman. So, it would be a way of generating credit hours, but, would be of no practical advantage in terms of college programs. Science majors start out in higher level courses than typically AP credits count. So, I took some AP courses, some honors courses, didn't take the AP exams. I actually tested out of freshman English on the entrance exams (and I didn't take AP English, or even honors, for that matter; English was just not my thing).

In terms of Catholic schools. At my son's school, usually 95-100% pass the ISTEP at each grade level, compared to about 65% statewide, and 70-80% of the public school students. So, the Catholic school compares favorably with the public schools.

A few years ago, we had alot of angst among some parents because our school didn't offer two years of algebra in middle school the way the public middle school does. Well, based on my experience, I didn't get algebra in middle school either. But, I tested into honors math in HS, made all A's all the way through, earned a total of one B in undergrad (the rest A's) in math. (I was a math major). So, it didn't really handicap me in any way that I didn't get algebra in middle school. I probably over all did alot better in math and science than some of my HS school mates who did take algebra in HS. So student motivation and ability are as important as curriculum in predicting ultimate performance. So, if you want the additional discipline that Catholic school has to offer, then, in my opinion, it won't harm a student academically to attend Catholic school.

 

[The Mystery Machine]

Whether or not AP classes SHOULD be routinely offered at every school is another issue. However, if an AP class is offered I'd prefer that it be a serious one, not something slapped together by a teacher who isn't really up for it just so that the school can say that they have X number of AP classes.

Well that is really my beef. It should be available to everyone.
I can only speak about my own children.

You will have good teachers and bad teachers....that is out of our control. Like dd has a bad AP biology teacher right now.
However her history teachers are great.

My girls need more than an average class has to offer. They don't make it into the gifted so they have to be in a class that moves at a glacial pace?

And yes I am going into the St. Louis County schools where they are ranked in Newsweek, which is Rockwood.
I can afford to move there, well in a small area of there.
I will not move into the city or North County. I have family there and they all go to Catholic schools which I will not do.

We can agree to disagree..... I think all of Missouri needs to step it up. You know they are behind. That is not a secret.

They are going to play catch up however since the HS credit requirements are changing.
Perhaps this will be positive?

 

[disneyjunkie]

Oh, and I'm confused. Which is supposed to be the more challenging class, Honors or Ap. How do you get into each one, recommendation, grades or testing? Thanks

AP classes are more challenging.

My son's school requires a teacher to nominate students for the AP classes.(English - 11th grade and American History 12th grade). These students then have to interview be interviewed by the department chair. He/she then makes a recommendation to the VP of academics. She reviews their grades, gets feed back for their previous teachers, then makes the final decision.

 

[ilovecountry]

I'm only 23 but I'm a Southern Baptist & I was sent to a catholic grade school from K-8th grade. Then I attended a Catholic HS for 2 years. My parents didn't want me going to a public school around here (the surrounding ones were horrible) and the only private school around us that was close to our house was this particular catholic one. For the most part there wasn't any problems, there were a few other students who were Protestant in my classes- however there were 2 teachers who acted like we were going to hell for not participating in the May Crowning or saying the Rosary. There was however an assistant principal who was also a Southern Baptist and she quickly "Set the two teachers in place" My only advice would be to talk to the teachers before hand if you don't want your child participating in certain things- may crownings, rosaries, etc. Anything along those lines simply because if your child isn't participating, it may cause problems if their teacher isn't aware of the different Religion (remember it's naturally assumed pretty much all are Catholic) From aside letting the teachers know, I don't think there's any probs w/ it. I also came into the thread late too lol

 

[Uuaww]

I went to K-8 Catholic school, had two friends who were not Catholic and it really didn't matter, we were nice and sheltered before high school. I went to a public high school and was experiencing a whole new set of stuff. Varsity football freshman year (punter) really put me in the middle of it. The catholic school girls next door... even worse...

 

[kandeebunny]

I went to Catholic high school. I am Catholic, but we had a few Jewish kids, they did NOT have to attend mass, but EVERYONE had to attend religious studies. These were more debate classes, based on what is true and what isn't what is the Catholic version, what is the common good, morality and things like that. You could get a lot out of those classes either way, we did study scripture though, and studied it how it was taught int he Catholic religion. As long as you aren't opposed to your daughter learning about Catholic traditions then it should be fine. We prayed every morning and at the beginning of every class from a general prayer book. Each school is different though.

Good luck!

 

[NotUrsula]

And yes I am going into the St. Louis County schools where they are ranked in Newsweek, which is Rockwood.

Specifically, if you want the Newsweek ranked schools, it is Marquette or Lafayette HS. The other two are not very AP focused.

For you that's fine, but for anyone else I'd remind people that the Newsweek survey is based ONLY on schools that are heavily invested in the AP program. There are plenty of truly excellent schools out there that don't participate (or participate only marginally), that are not on Newsweek's ranking. I'd be very wary of depending too heavily on what Newsweek thinks.

 

[Crankyshank]

NO,but the phrase Mary ,Full of grace is from Luke 1:28

Yes, that's what I said. It is inspired by Gabriel's greeting to Mary.

 

[Crankyshank]

You're right! I used the because I didn't want people to think that I was attacking them by asking them to show it to me in the Word. Religious talk can get volatile, sometimes

Oh, and I'm confused. Which is supposed to be the more challenging class, Honors or Ap. How do you get into each one, recommendation, grades or testing? Thanks

FWIW I didn't think you were attacking. I hope you didn't feel chagrined from my response. I was just answering your question.

I also wanted to tell you that, in my experience, Catholic High School is a lot less Catholic than elementary school because they assume you've had the foundations all ready and don't need it drilled in further. Ex: In elementary school we went to Church more frequently, did the stations of the cross every year, learned prayers in Latin and French (this is post Vatican II), etc.. High school not so much, but knowing prayers in Latin was really helpful come SAT time and it impresses non Catholic school educated friends 15yrs later .

 

[Christine]

I also wanted to tell you that, in my experience, Catholic High School is a lot less Catholic than elementary school because they assume you've had the foundations all ready and don't need it drilled in further.

This has been our experience.

One big difference I see between the Catholic school and the public school that my daughter attending was discipline.

My daughter has received detentions in Catholic school for chewing gum, not having her shirt tucked in properly, talking out of turn during a study hall, and challenging a teacher when the teacher told her she did something out of line. By "challenging the teacher" I mean that when the teacher told her to stop talking, she would say "I wasn't talking" and then the teacher would get mad as they don't allow that type of "arguing" once you have been reprimanded.

In public school, my daughter was enrolled in Advanced Biology (as a freshman). Everyday, she came home with beautifully done makeup. Apparently they applied makeup to each other during class. In her History class in public school, they had a "mean" teacher. The students and the teacher spent the first 10 minutes of class arguing about who was tardy, who was disrupting the class etc. (Oh this was Advanced History too).

I'm not saying that every public school is like this. In fact, some classes my daughter had there were fine and well controlled, but half of them were not. And PE, whooo boy, that's where you'd here some really good stories. I just noticed an overall lack of control at the public high school level unless you could ensure you got in all the upper level courses.

This was a huge factor in our decision to switch and I haven't regretted that.

 

[Deb in IA]

In public school, my daughter was enrolled in Advanced Biology (as a freshman). Everyday, she came home with beautifully done makeup. Apparently they applied makeup to each other during class.

Are you saying that they just did each other's makeup in Advanced Biology?

 

[NotUrsula]

I also wanted to tell you that, in my experience, Catholic High School is a lot less Catholic than elementary school because they assume you've had the foundations all ready and don't need it drilled in further.

It isn't so much that, as it is that there are no sacraments to be prepared for during high school. In most parishes these days, the Confirmation decision comes in 8th grade, so once you are in high school, you have most likely already been confirmed and are now officially an adult member of the Church. As such, religion class becomes much less about indoctrination and learning the ritual, and more about explorations of religion, faith and mores as a concept.

High school level religion class in a good Catholic school (and I won't lie, there are some bad ones out there, same as with public schools) tends to be very discussion-heavy, and will explore many religions and their various beliefs and traditions throughout history. They won't just be Christian denominations -- there is usually a great deal of discussion re: Islam, Buddhism and other faiths of the eastern traditions. Personally, I think this is a very good idea, but I have met some people who dislike it.

And to answer another question:

Oh, and I'm confused. Which is supposed to be the more challenging class, Honors or Ap. How do you get into each one, recommendation, grades or testing? Thanks

That would depend upon the school. In some places AP are the most challenging courses, and in some places honors-level courses are more challenging. Some schools require nominations, grade threshholds, or testing-in for either of these programs, but some do not. The College Board administers the AP testing program, and has the right to audit the syllabus of any course that calls itself AP. However, just because a given topic is listed as being covered, that does not guarantee that it will be covered well. The AP program tends to encourage teaching to the test, because that is the whole point. If you don't like that style of learning, then AP may not be the best choice. Here is the College Board's checklist for the basic standards (which by the way only became mandatory this school year): http://apcentral.collegeboard.com/apc/public/courses/teachers_corner/51267.html

 

[Christine]

Are you saying that they just did each other's makeup in Advanced Biology?

They had a lot of downtime in the class apparently, and the teacher would give them "free time" during the last 15 minutes of class. NOT what I expected for Advance Biology (note this was not AP Biology but it was a higher level Freshman Biology).

 

[lg3]

OP, Why don't you just have your children attend a parochial school of your own religion (or "non-demoninational Christian" type instead of a Catholic one then? I don't understand.

 

[JennyMominRI]

Yes, that's what I said. It is inspired by Gabriel's greeting to Mary.

LOL, Sorry..I didn't actually read 1:28, I just knew I read it came from there..I had no clue Gabriel said it.

 

[Christine]

OP, Why don't you just have your children attend a parochial school of your own religion (or "non-demoninational Christian" type instead of a Catholic one then? I don't understand.

Not the OP here, but most other religions do not have high schools. In our area, besides Catholic, the only other religion that has what I would call a "true" high school experience is the Episcopal church. The have one high school as compared to the 4 high Catholic high schools. I don't think any other religion has "done high school proper" like the Catholic church!

 

[NotUrsula]

I don't think any other religion has "done high school proper" like the Catholic church!

Eh, depends on where you are. This area also has several Lutheran High Schools, 2 Jewish high schools, and a Seventh-Day Adventist high school, plus the half dozen or so "Independent" nondenominational private high schools that are not affiliated with any religion. There are also a couple of "Christian" high schools and a Muslim school which was created so that they could have a gender-segregated school that allowed time for the ritual prayers.

We just like our religion-based private education tradition around here. To give you an example: within a one mile radius of my home there is one Catholic Diocesan HS, 4 Catholic grade schools, 2 Lutheran grade schools, and one grade school each affiliated with Baptist, Methodist, and Greek Orthodox congregations. Of course, we also have 106 public school districts in the metro area; 24 of them in St. Louis County alone.

I put Christian in quotes above because, of course, the existing parochial schools are also Christian. These particular schools are not associated with any single denomination AFAIK, but they tend to align themselves very closely with fundamentalist principles. Schools like this are most common in the South, but they are getting founded all over the place these days. (In the bad old days when I was a kid, schools like this tended to be founded to enable white flight for people who lived in smaller communities. That motivation is pretty much gone now, but most of them still tend not to have a lot of minority enrollment, for whatever reason.)

PS: All of the schools I mentioned above are real schools in the brick-and-mortar sense, with cafeterias, gyms, libraries, etc. I know there are some of those church-basement schools operating in the area, too, but I wasn't counting those.

 

[SydSim]

LOL, Sorry..I didn't actually read 1:28, I just knew I read it came from there..I had no clue Gabriel said it.

I think that's kind of what my Sunday School talks about. You hear a phrase and it's attributed to being in the Bible, but the actual scripture is different...


28And the angel came in unto her, and said, Hail, thou that art highly favoured, the Lord is with thee: blessed art thou among women.


I think that one of the other posters was right in that some denominations take the Bible more literally than others (not that either is right or wrong )

But we also have to remember that the Bible is actually someone's recollection of what actually happened and that people interpret it differently.