No Longer Affordable JMHO

[Disney Dad Canada]

Disney is losing long term, stable, and loyal customers for...what reason? Seems, it would be wiser to build on that foundation, not weaken it.

We still visit, but spend a lot less on dining and merchandise. This money is still spent...just not at Disney.

It's all about making the most money, which dispite what some may feel, isn't evil. I'm sure Disney has very highly paid bean counters that work all this stuff out for them.

Just because you spend less doesn't mean there aren't others that spend just as much or more in your place.

 

[bicker]

It's all about making the most money, which dispite what some may feel, isn't evil.

Yes - more than that, it's actually the opposite: It is fulfillment of commitments made and obligations assumed. To do something else would arguably be evil.

Just because you spend less doesn't mean there aren't others that spend just as much or more in your place.

<raises hand>

 

[TDC Nala]

The free dining offer has also evolved. With the regular general public offers, they've moved value resorts down to free QSDP, and with the current offer you have to purchase a $90 memory book to get the dining free. It's also been offered at different times this year than was traditional before that - but with lots more blackout dates.

 

[aesalsa]

The resort restaurants seem to have a much better selection for the same price or less.
Take a look at menus for the TS places in the resorts near the parks.

OP if you want to get out of the heat you can do that at some CS places. For example Starlight Rays in Tomorrowland is indoors.

This is good advice. We love to take a break from MK and eat lunch at the Grand Floridian Cafe. We have the Tables in Wonderland card, and DH and I each get an appetizer and then share an entree. They don't look at us funny when we do this .

 

[Princesca]

IMHO, the "free dining", and the dining plan in general, was an amazing marketing idea for Disney. Genius!

1) Most people don't eat their money's worth on the plan, and food is already grossly marked up. (It is anytime you eat out, but massively so at Disney and other such 'captive' places.)

2) Because the plan includes snacks and desserts, more people are trying those things than might have previously and will come back to them.

3) When many people are doing free dining, or the dining plan generally, Disney can reduce the quality of food because it's effectively a captive audience. People will say 'Well, we could go off-park, but it's paid for, so... eh.'

4) It's getting people in the habit of spending the whole day in the parks or at the resorts, which, if done long enough, may become habitual for most people. Kids who grew up on the DDP may find that eating in Disney, as adults, is just second nature to them.

My family and I have already determined that, if we don't get free dining, we're eating breakfast in the room and are going to attempt going as cheaply as we can while in the parks. We will probably do one character meal, for my niece's sake (she looooves those princesses) at Akershuhs, but otherwise we'll be splitting CS meals, bringing snacks in with us, and buying park food as seldom as possible. There are some things I will buy, just because they're kind of legendary and I've never tried them (Dole Whips!) but pretty much just a snack a day sort of thing.

Seems like, when I was little and we went, we did just that. Ate in the room, just grabbed a hotdog at lunch, a popsicle if we were lucky. The idea of eating as if we were on the dining plan, even the QS one, would have felt so decadent!

 

[Princesca]

$31 strollers

Wow, I didn't know that. Looks like we'll be bringing our own in! For six days in the park, that's

 

[dandave]

http://www.mousesavers.com/otherwdw.html#strollers

I thought $31 was a joke! Ten years ago it was $8 for a single and $14 for a double. That's crazy!

 

[Princesca]

Oh, that's for a double... $15 would be our cost, but still. We'll be driving, so I don't see any reason not to bring our own, and then we'd have it at the resort, too.

 

[cymbaldiva]

And since we are comparing apples to oranges.....the last time I was in Myrtle Beach (2009), we wanted to do one of the big seafood buffets. We had done them in the past; usually during the early bird special, but not always. When we called for pricing at a few of them, the cost was around $30/pp. That was a bit out of our price range for that trip, so we didn't go. So Disney is not the only place that can and does charge a premium for buffets.

I would hope that at least the big seafood buffet had a lot of really good seafood...

 

[kaytieeldr]

I beg to differ, Disney does deserve the bad rap. IMO I blame, "free dining", for a large part of the decline in quality and increase in prices. They can and do raise prices, at whim..also invoke " holiday" surcharges. Much has to do with the new regime. I never thought, I would miss Eisner, but....I do.

Oh. So you think prices are raised 'at a whim' and not based at all on overall increased costs, or a great deal of advance number crunching and prediction on where costs will probably go (i.e. up) in the next year? Interesting...

 

[kaytieeldr]

I disagree, it is Disney's fault. There was a time, when we had three squares a day, but we no longer enjoy their dining. We book one ADR, per day, convenience only.

I'm . The economy and the sharp increase in food costs are Disney's fault? Great, if you don't enjoy their dining, use alternatives.

 

[kaytieeldr]

3) When many people are doing free dining, or the dining plan generally, Disney can reduce the quality of food because it's effectively a captive audience. People will say 'Well, we could go off-park, but it's paid for, so... eh.

That genuinely makes no sense, even if it were true - which it's not. Why alienate all the guests who, for various reasons, eat onsite without participating in ANY dining plan?? Interestingly, there are thousands of people who choose to eat onsite. Most are local residents; some are visitors with cars and no dining plan; others are visitors with favorite restaurants. Why would any successful business - which Disney surely is - punish, as it were, these guests?

 

[catne]

We've seen big increases in food costs everywhere we travel...either prices have gone way up, or the portions have gone way down...in some cases both! We do road trips to Florida several times a year, spend a lot of time in Tampa vicinity, and travel to at least one other major metro area every year (like Denver, Chicago, etc.) For that matter, we've seen big cost increases at the grocery store...the truly excellent steaks we used to get a year or two ago in the $7 per lb. range are now in the $8.50-9.00 range. And they're not nearly as good as they were. We know the grocer...he says he can't get the previous kind of steaks for less than $12 lb and not worth it to him to carry that because people won't pay that much for steaks around here.

I really don't think Disney prices are bad for a resort destination...on our most recent trip (to Vegas) our flight time was such that we were at the airport in Omaha for lunch, and 5 hours away from our destination (We were in OMAHA, no less. NOT a major city, lol. Out in the sticks where prices are supposed to be "reasonable". Not. ) we paid $40 for 3 personal pizzas and 3 bottled waters. That's all--no chips, no small salads or anything. The pizzas were small--like 6" in diameter. No way was that $40 worth of food, but not many options once you check in. In Vegas, the good buffets were running $30-40 per adult (guess the days of the cheap Vegas buffets are long gone too, at least on the Strip in the big hotels/casinos.)

 

[cymbaldiva]

That genuinely makes no sense, even if it were true - which it's not. Why alienate all the guests who, for various reasons, eat onsite without participating in ANY dining plan?? Interestingly, there are thousands of people who choose to eat onsite. Most are local residents; some are visitors with cars and no dining plan; others are visitors with favorite restaurants. Why would any successful business - which Disney surely is - punish, as it were, these guests?

I'd be truly interested to see any documentation that supports that statement. To the best of my knowledge the local guests would be the ones most harshly affected by the dining plan and the 180 ADR policy. My local friends don't chose Disney as a dining destination because of pricing.

Disney is a very successful business - one that appears to cater to it's largest customer base. In Florida that's tourists, not locals.

 

[dandave]

I have lots of Disney complaints, but they are good to Florida residents. We get discounted rooms, discounted tickets, access to TIW, etc.

 

[Tiger926]

That genuinely makes no sense, even if it were true - which it's not. Why alienate all the guests who, for various reasons, eat onsite without participating in ANY dining plan?? Interestingly, there are thousands of people who choose to eat onsite. Most are local residents; some are visitors with cars and no dining plan; others are visitors with favorite restaurants. Why would any successful business - which Disney surely is - punish, as it were, these guests?

It does make sense. I would suspect there are far more guests who buy the DP, or get it for free, over those of us cash paying guests. I would love to see the numbers, but based on the frenzy that overtakes guests in booking Free Dining promos, Disney's genius marketing with the DP has proven to be very successful, so it seems like they do want to protect those guests.

A perfect example of this is how they take care of the DP guests - for example: Peak season cash guests pay a $4.00 buffet upcharge, whereas DP guests only pay $2.00 more for peak season DP. Why is this?

Cash guests are penalized, as far as I'm concerned, and this is a perfect example of that. Except for those of us DVC folks, as we aren't subject to any peak season upcharges for the DP, but we are for cash meals.

Tiger

 

[Stinky_Pete]

Given that Disney offers a wide range of options, from low-end to high-end, at commensurate price-points, what do you see missing from their approach?

I didn't say I saw anything missing from WDW's food options. I was commening on the posts stating that other venues (ball parks, one-day theme parks) have worse dining options at higher prices. My point was that if WDW expects people to spend an entire week onsite, they need to do better than those places - and they do. Especially with all the choices. I love the people who post that they don't want to do CS because they don't want to eat hamburgers all week. I guess they've never actually looked at the CS menus.

As I said, if I tried to find more expensive dining options to make WDW seem like a bargain, I could too. See a PP comment about the Omaha airport. But yes, it is more expensive than at home, but not outrageously so.

 

[Lionqueen2]

I'd be truly interested to see any documentation that supports that statement. To the best of my knowledge the local guests would be the ones most harshly affected by the dining plan and the 180 ADR policy. My local friends don't chose Disney as a dining destination because of pricing. Disney is a very successful business - one that appears to cater to it's largest customer base. In Florida that's tourists, not locals.

Actually, there are many excellent restaurants in the greater Orlando area with convenient access and parking. It isn't necessary for locals to have to choose Disney for a dining destination unless they were spending the day there and didn't want to leave the property.

 

[eliza61]

Eliza, this thread started out being about affordability at WDW. Character meals at $30 and $40 a pop are, IMHO, expensive - especially if someone is determined to experience those character meals multiple times, sometimes daily.
My point is that experiencing a character meal really has nothing to do with the affordability of a Disney vacation. A family can eat for far less money at other TS restaurants, thus bringing back the affordabilty of a WDW vacation.
My DH and sons hate character meals. Even though I really enjoy the Garden Grill, it's not easy to talk them into visiting. When we do, we simply make it clear that we're not interested in the characters, even though we have paid extra to dine in their presence. They wave at us, we wave at them, and we eat. A large chunk of the tab goes to the characters, but I know that I had a choice to eat elsewhere for less.

Thanks Dave,

I know in general we were talking about affordability and I total admit that it's hard for me to get around what would probably be better called as "Value". For me generally when I decide to go to Disney I already know I'm kicking out way more money than a "regular" restaurant so it's more of a question of "do I feel that what I received for that cost was good" and too often now at disney the answer has been no. So then I really feel it's more expensive because basically I left with a feeling of "I could have eaten at applebees and gotten the same meal".

I think the root of what most people don't like when they complain about the prices. they don't like paying the top dollar prices and at the end saying "I've had better food at Olive Gardens".

I guess my objection is always the question that never seems to get answered. Why is it not possible to get both? Yes, I know the major reason is to see the characters but really how hard is it to fix decent scramble eggs?

I just can never accept the excuse "well yes the food is horrible but you don't go there to eat"? What? really? Even with characters I pretty much would like my family to be able to enjoy the food. I just never understand why it is tolerable to get rotten food simply because there is a dressed up mouse going around the room.


So you're right it's probably more of an issue with me. How I look at affordability. I hear people who say the time it takes to drive off site doesn't make it "worthwhile". I'm the opposite, the time I waste eating a ho-hum meal while on vacation is far more "expensive" and valuable. I hate wasting both time and money.

but you're right it is a choice. I'm supremely happy my kids are older and now quality food is now way more important than characters. We skip them all together.

 

[Disney Dad Canada]

I guess my objection is always the question that never seems to get answered. Why is it not possible to get both? Yes, I know the major reason is to see the characters but really how hard is it to fix decent scramble eggs?

The reason is because enough people pay for the meals with the crappy eggs, so there is no incentive for Disney to change.

Personally, I refuse to go to any Disney restaurant for breakfast, character meal or not. $30 per person for $1 worth of food? Anyone who runs a restaurant will tell you that breakfast is the biggest money maker for them.

Just look on the boards here at restaurant reviews. On our last trip, I was considering the Rose and Crown, and time and time again the reviews come back "It's a great restaurant becuase it's a great place to watch Illuminations from." Well I'm sorry, that tells me NOTHING about the food. What it DOES tell me is that enough people will pay for a crappy meal if they get something else out of it, whether that is an expensive seat for fireworks or seeing a character ot two for 2 minutes.

I'm not even saying that those choices are wrong, as if they feel happy about their choices, who am I to argue. But with enough people paying top dollar for meals because of fireworks seatings or character meet-ups, why should Disney change a thing?