Newest MS change and future of dvc Resales

[CarolA]

WOW!!!! WAS this necessary? I mean I have to ask? I am not a BC owner or SSR owner. I happen to love two others. I think we need to unite and get a grip!!!


Just my 2 cents.

Probably not, I was actually trying to be scarastic.. Didn't really work so I will remove it.

However, there is a lot of the "Sky is falling" on here. I think it's actually pretty funny.

I mean ONE day after the policy is announced a poster can TELL that the listings on a resale sight are due to the policy. (The same poster is planning to sell if EP or another mega resort gets announced and assumes that lots of us are joining them.. NOT ME!)

 

[Mickey Fliers]

If you were going to buy that 50 pt add on through Disney, then it would be a true add on (subcontract if you like) to your master contract and you cannot transfer points between an add on and a master contract. The points can be combined at the 7 month window to make reservations without transferring any points -- it functions as if it were one big contract containing all the points of both contracts.

So to do what you are talking about, a member has to purchase that small second contract as another master contract. If buying from Disney, you would have to purchase a minimum of 150 points so you would have to purchase it on the resale market, allowing you to purchase as few as 25 points.

I'm not suggesting you do that, but just wanted to clarify since the recent announcements have caused confusion among some members who have true add on contracts and are concerned, unnecessarily, about transferring points between the add on and the master.

I answered you in the other thread, , but I was using this scenario with a small resale contract or and add-on through Disney with a different UY. Thanks for the heads up.

 

[LIFERBABE]

Probably not, I was actually trying to be scarastic.. Didn't really work so I will remove it.

However, there is a lot of the "Sky is falling" on here. I think it's actually pretty funny.

I mean ONE day after the policy is announced a poster can TELL that the listings on a resale sight are due to the policy. (The same poster is planning to sell if EP or another mega resort gets announced and assumes that lots of us are joining them.. NOT ME!)

Well I wont be selling either!! The sky has been falling for a long time!!

Maybe its VWL and BCV that threw the system out of whack. OKW and BWV, VB, SSR, and HHI are all Dedicated DVC's. To clarify, BWV was planned from the word go as a mixed use property. How can these small resorts be made the standard for DVC and all others discounted. And what is so deluxe about having the valet cart you, your inlaws and all your groceries through the lobby? And as stated before, I own 4 of the 5 onsite DVC's and BCV is 1 of 2 master contracts we have.

The sky has been falling ever since DVC announced the additional phases at SSR before it even opened. (Officially) Mind you, BCV did not sell out until mid 2003, after the announcement of SSR was made. So all these people complaining about availability being affected, have no true data on BCV availability because they had been reserving units that were not completely sold. How many vacations did they really take to BCV in the first 3 years of opening? My guess is no more than 3. So 3 times you get what you wanted and that is an established availability indicator for future use? Even in 2003, F&W fest was extremely difficult to book.

In 2004 SSR points were added to the mix. So how can one ever blame SSR for the availability issues when it is clear that BCV owners are Spec booking at 11 months and renting.

Why does CRO still have BCV units available for Cash but MS has none on points? Because BCV owners are undercutting CRO and CRO is left holding the bag. Thats why DVC made the changes. Because they needed to, to preserve the working relationship they have with WDWTC. It has nothing to do with SSR causing a chemical imbalance or any imbalance.

We have renters right here from the DIS that posted that they cancelled their CRO ressies and then told CRO exactly why they were cancelling. They told CRO that DVC renting is cheaper, they can add the Dining Plan, and they dont have to add tickets. Then they came back here and posted. If your partner (thats what DVC and WDWTC are) was undercutting you or allowing you to be undercut, how long would that partnership last?

Who do you think grants us access to the WDW perks? The WDW Collection? The AP discount?

I really feel for the new people on the boards that are here to learn about DVC and dont know some of the history behind the hysteria of what we have become. It's difficult to sift thru what is fact and what is fiction especially when it has become an alternate reality. There was a time we dealt mostly in facts but that has changed right along with the POS.

 

[JimFitz]

Sorry Beca, its not that I feel you do, I can see and read that you do. You just do it in a nicer way then B3.



Ok, what do you suggest they do about point transfers?



I have no problems with DVC stopping the commercial renters. They shouldn't be here at mine or your resort....period! And if you have addition information, share it. As we say back home...."Put up or shut up!".



Now here is a perfect example of your "nice" hate, OKW and SSR are condos, the rest are Deluxe-Resorts. Honey, they are all Deluxe Resorts. Maybe you should mosey on down to a Motel 8 to get back in touch with reality of what is and is not deluxe accomadations.

I think you are guessing that the value of BCV or any other resort will drop in value because of the rules being enforced. Has the price of any resorts ever dropped? I don't think so.



Again, here is the "nice" hate thing...at least B3 put it out there. You hide behind apologies and excuses to make it softer, kinder, gentler. I got news for you, that you don't like to hear. After seven months, your DVC is my DVC, and vica versa.



The reality here is that you don't respect "The Condos" as you put it. (see above if not sure) You lump OKW and SSR as some sort of lesser thing. Heck, you don't even mention HH or VB like they don't exist. And then you ask for respect. You have to give it, to get it. Since I have joined the DISboard in March, I have encounter many other SSR bashing posts from you. I have always respected BCV and all the other DVC resorts. There are things about all the resorts that I don't like, but I try to keep those opions to my self. Maybe you should try that too. Like my Grandfather says, "If you can't say something nice..........you know the rest.

Meow!! Catfight!

 

[CarolA]

This whole thread has a life of it's own.

I need more popcorn.

(If this much energy were being expended on Middle East Peace we could solve the whole mess LOL! Some of you are acting like this is the worst thing in the world today. It's not and if a change in transferring your DVC is the worst thing to ever happen to you, thank someone up high!)

As I look at the thread where people are posting about thier actual transfers and then the posts on here, it appears the MAJORITY of us will probably never be impacted or will be impacted positively. (I book my BCV around 10 months out. that puts me BEFORE those VWL folks trying to trade thier "valuable" MK location for my valuable Epcot location during the Food & Wine Festival)

And think of the other benefit. If the "rumors" of CR are true, then I won't be able to buy 25 points and transfer my OKW and BCV points there to book ALL the prime rooms at Christmas for my family. I could transfer ONE of my contracts and book some space, but not as much as if I could transfer ALL my points.

I actually sent DVC an email and told them I thought this was a great idea. (Pulls on flameproof suit)

(And on a side note. I have expereinced no difference in getting resorts pre and post SSR. WIth the exception that on my late bookings I often have a choice of SSR or OKW where before I would have only had OKW)

 

[greenban]

This whole thread has a life of it's own.

I need more popcorn.

(If this much energy were being expended on Middle East Peace we could solve the whole mess LOL! Some of you are acting like this is the worst thing in the world today. It's not and if a change in transferring your DVC is the worst thing to ever happen to you, thank someone up high!)

As I look at the thread where people are posting about thier actual transfers and then the posts on here, it appears the MAJORITY of us will probably never be impacted or will be impacted positively. (I book my BCV around 10 months out. that puts me BEFORE those VWL folks trying to trade thier "valuable" MK location for my valuable Epcot location during the Food & Wine Festival)

And think of the other benefit. If the "rumors" of CR are true, then I won't be able to buy 25 points and transfer my OKW and BCV points there to book ALL the prime rooms at Christmas for my family. I could transfer ONE of my contracts and book some space, but not as much as if I could transfer ALL my points.

I actually sent DVC an email and told them I thought this was a great idea. (Pulls on flameproof suit)

(And on a side note. I have expereinced no difference in getting resorts pre and post SSR. WIth the exception that on my late bookings I often have a choice of SSR or OKW where before I would have only had OKW)

If only the Middle East Peace Process could be solved that easily!

-Tony

PS No flames for you! Oh and here

 

[Plutofan]

Has Disney ever thought about allowing members to sell back extra points that they do not need during the year? This would cut down rentals (less points available to be rented) and Disney could rent off those points which would reduce MS dues. I know that my mother has part of a timeshare that allowed members to give a week back and then they sold if off on behalf of the member. Any thoughts?

 

[tomandrobin]

Has Disney ever thought about allowing members to sell back extra points that they do not need during the year? This would cut down rentals (less points available to be rented) and Disney could rent off those points which would reduce MS dues. I know that my mother has part of a timeshare that allowed members to give a week back and then they sold if off on behalf of the member. Any thoughts?

Buy back....Ha, Disney would rather let them expire and not be used. Then they can use them as a promo or turn the available pointr for cash reservations. I think that is one of the reasons of the staggared user years that come with your membership.

 

[tomandrobin]

Why does CRO still have BCV units available for Cash but MS has none on points? Because BCV owners are undercutting CRO and CRO is left holding the bag. Thats why DVC made the changes. Because they needed to, to preserve the working relationship they have with WDWTC. It has nothing to do with SSR causing a chemical imbalance or any imbalance.

We have renters right here from the DIS that posted that they cancelled their CRO ressies and then told CRO exactly why they were cancelling. They told CRO that DVC renting is cheaper, they can add the Dining Plan, and they dont have to add tickets. Then they came back here and posted. If your partner (thats what DVC and WDWTC are) was undercutting you or allowing you to be undercut, how long would that partnership last?

This is an Excellent point! Goes back to a earlier post I made. Its all about the money! Not mine or your money, but Disney's money. Disney is the biggest owner of contracts at all the DVC resorts. All of thier units/points are for cash reservations (and maintenance they say). Why would Joe Scmoe rent from Disney for a gazillion dollars, when he can rent points for a third or fourth of the cost?

 

[greenban]

This is an Excellent point! Goes back to a earlier post I made. Its all about the money! Not mine or your money, but Disney's money. Disney is the biggest owner of contracts at all the DVC resorts. All of thier units/points are for cash reservations (and maintenance they say). Why would Joe Scmoe rent from Disney for a gazillion dollars, when he can rent points for a third or fourth of the cost?

Because his name *IS* Joe Schmoe?????

Only those in-the-know, know about renting, a very small percentage of Disney Vactioners. In fact, it seems alot of people don't know or understand FastPass, and that is a free, (and to me) well publicised system!

Poor, poor Joe!

-Tony

BTW is a fourth or third of a gazillion dollars a bazillion or googleplex of dollars? TIA

 

[CarolA]

There have been a LOT more changes at DVC in the last few days than those that have been discussed here. I know about some of them, but cannot post without putting a source in jeopardy. Suffice it to say, commercial renters have been "taken care of"...this transfer step is completely unnecessary. I actually keep watching these boards to see who else knows what I know....hoping someone else will post it. I know some others on this board have got to know it as well.





Beca

It get better and better. (The above paragraph just cracks me up..... Think of a second grader singing "I know something you don't know, I know something you don't know" )

 

[tomandrobin]

(And on a side note. I have expereinced no difference in getting resorts pre and post SSR. WIth the exception that on my late bookings I often have a choice of SSR or OKW where before I would have only had OKW)

And having extra options is a good thing!

 

[tomandrobin]

Because his name *IS* Joe Schmoe?????

Sorry, inside joke.....changed the name to protect the innocent!

Only those in-the-know, know about renting, a very small percentage of Disney Vactioners. In fact, it seems alot of people don't know or understand FastPass, and that is a free, (and to me) well publicised system!

Isn't that an amazing thing! We just shake are heads as we breeze by the 2 hour line at Soaring.

BTW is a fourth or third of a gazillion dollars a bazillion or googleplex of dollars? TIA

Don't know, I,m not up to par with all that higher math! Where is the calculator?

 

[Deb & Bill]

Is it me or does it seem like newer DVC members are the most upset? I remember reading messages on these boards about potential members looking to buy more points than they needed so they could rent them out and make back their dues? I knew about the transfer rules when I bought in 1997. I knew about MS when I bought in 1997. Are the guides at fault? Do some of the newer guides need to be educated by the older, senior ones?

Must be my OKW upbringing that I don't even think about renting out points.

 

[llp479]

There will always be the chance that accomodations aren't available at a resort during the "home advantage" window for any set of dates. There are only a set number of rooms available, and should that time period be "highly desirable" for whatever reason, there may not be availability.

We also own two weeks with Marriott, and I listen to those owners complain about all the unavailable "prime" weeks and blame that as well on people who book the top weeks at a resort to either rent or trade. It's life, folks, and no one ever said that life was fair. Timeshares in general work well for those who can plan at the 11 -12 mos window, and/or are flexible in what they will take.

Maybe DVC is limiting the transfers because they know they have a glitch in their system that is currently allowing transfered points to "morph" - ie - BWV points become VWL when transfered. Plus, think of the added cost to the DVC system with all of the transfers tying up MS time.

 

[Deb & Bill]

... Plus, think of the added cost to the DVC system with all of the transfers tying up MS time.

I bet there will be a lot of repetitive motion injuries at MS now with all the thumb twiddling going on. Is that going to cost us?

 

[rinkwide]

...Maybe DVC is limiting the transfers because they know they have a glitch in their system that is currently allowing transfered points to "morph"...

Exactly, it's the membership being made to pay for a DVD mistake.

 

[DBBN]

Has Disney ever thought about allowing members to sell back extra points that they do not need during the year? This would cut down rentals (less points available to be rented) and Disney could rent off those points which would reduce MS dues. I know that my mother has part of a timeshare that allowed members to give a week back and then they sold if off on behalf of the member. Any thoughts?

I doubt this could ever happen. If it did what do you think they would pay for your points? Maybe they would offer as good a value as the value offered when using your points for the Disney Cruise Line!

Then there is the matter of if Disney did have a program to allow owners to rent their extra points through them there would (likely) be many fewer points expiring resulting in less breakage income to offset our dues. If Disney did have this program I expect our dues would go up.

Does anyone know how many points expire each year? For each resort? I think I would be shocked at how many owners don't use all of their points and let them expire or worse don't use any of them.

 

[Plutofan]

I doubt this could ever happen. If it did what do you think they would pay for your points? Maybe they would offer as good a value as the value offered when using your points for the Disney Cruise Line!

Then there is the matter of if Disney did have a program to allow owners to rent their extra points through them there would (likely) be many fewer points expiring resulting in less breakage income to offset our dues. If Disney did have this program I expect our dues would go up.

Does anyone know how many points expire each year? For each resort? I think I would be shocked at how many owners don't use all of their points and let them expire or worse don't use any of them.

At least someone has thought about it since everytime I buy resale they collect the rental information and provide to to Disney. This is information that would be used if Disney was to purchase points from an owner and have to issue a tax form.

 

[NMW]

Is it me or does it seem like newer DVC members are the most upset? I remember reading messages on these boards about potential members looking to buy more points than they needed so they could rent them out and make back their dues? I knew about the transfer rules when I bought in 1997. I knew about MS when I bought in 1997. Are the guides at fault? Do some of the newer guides need to be educated by the older, senior ones?

Must be my OKW upbringing that I don't even think about renting out points.

We bought in 2004-resale BWV. We never intend to rent or transfer. We bought our points for us to use every year. If for some reason we could not go to Disney one year we would bank all our points for the next year. I would never even think about renting.