New rule enforcement on points

[dianeschlicht]

Transferred points can be reassigned to another year, and that potentially screws up point allotment for each year. Ie. A year could theoretically accumulate more points than rooms to accomodate them and, based on what I've read here, DVC has no way to track those accumulating points.

Rented points however, don't have that problem. And DVC can evidently keep track of banked/borrowed points. I recall that they reserve the right to put a hold on banking/borrowing -- I assume to prevent too many points from accumulating in one year.

Assigning resort and use year to points as someone mentioned above would take care of that problem by allowing tracking. Then maybe limits to transfers could be set similar to the ones for banking and borrowing.

That is a very good point, and brings up that maybe the end of multiple transfers is infinitely better than the alternative....the end of banking and borrowing.

 

[keishashadow]

Our 380 is actually 2 contracts...an original of 230 (which I believe used to be the minimum buy in), and an add-on of 150 because 230 wasn't enough for what we were using. Back when they changed the minimum buyin to 150, lots of folks speculated that it would cause all kinds of problems for DVC. Perhaps we are seeing some of that now.

The second part of your quote above is one I'm not sure I understand. What is meant by "adjusting sub-contracts"? I know our guide never mentioned anything like that to us back in '94 when we first toured, and I don't recall him ever saying anything like that since that time either.

We have our 1st resale, then added on a "sub-contract" @ another resort thru DVC directly & will probably do the same for the next add-on. All are under our main contract but, designated by XXX.01 & XXX.02.

Beside the 11 month window, our original intent was to have 3 sep. contracts to gift to our DS in the distant future, if they are interested, otherwise we'll probably sell portions off if we find that we're not using them.

One of the main reasons we bought into DVC in lieu of renting was the fact that we didn't want to deal with the hassle, same reason that would keep us from renting points out. Could just be my interpretation on the enforcement but, "casual" renting still okay and not limited as to 1 per member per year? Don't see an inherent difference between transferring points between members & renting out a ressie to same.

Can state that the guides still feature the banking & borrowing selling point strongly, cannot imagine that disappearing. Even large owners use it for Grand Villas/cruises.

DH (who had to originally be drug - kicking & screaming, into the whole DVC membership) now has the mind-set down pat & is clamoring to buy lots more points & upgrade to 1 BR's...I plan on holding out in the studios as long as possible. I've found that I like to stay @ DVC during the weekdays & then finish up @ a different deluxe or even go offisite for a few days...it's all good

 

[dianeschlicht]

We have our 1st resale, then added on a "sub-contract" @ another resort thru DVC directly & will probably do the same for the next add-on. All are under our main contract but, designated by XXX.01 & XXX.02.

Beside the 11 month window, our original intent was to have 3 sep. contracts to gift to our DS in the distant future, if they are interested, otherwise we'll probably sell portions off if we find that we're not using them.

One of the main reasons we bought into DVC in lieu of renting was the fact that we didn't want to deal with the hassle, same reason that would keep us from renting points out. Could just be my interpretation on the enforcement but, "casual" renting still okay and not limited as to 1 per member per year? Don't see an inherent difference between transferring points between members & renting out a ressie to same.

Can state that the guides still feature the banking & borrowing selling point strongly, cannot imagine that disappearing. Even large owners use it for Grand Villas/cruises.

DH (who had to originally be drug - kicking & screaming, into the whole DVC membership) now has the mind-set down pat & is clamoring to buy lots more points & upgrade to 1 BR's...I plan on holding out in the studios as long as possible. I've found that I like to stay @ DVC during the weekdays & then finish up @ a different deluxe or even go offisite for a few days...it's all good

But explain what you meant by "managing sub contracts". That's the part I was having difficulty understanding. I too have a "sub contract" in that my add-on is listed like that. The difference is that my add-on is at the same resort.

 

[OneMoreTry]

Sorry, but I still stand by my original statement. Needing to constantly make transfers into or out of an account sounds like nothing more than poor planning to me. If you don't share that opinion fine, but then don't ask others to discuss it if you don't want to hear that opinion.

I agree.

Having to plan months -- even years -- in advance to manage points properly is probably my biggest complaint with DVC. But it goes with the territory and I accept it.

I have found that with every significant purchase in my life comes a degree of bondage. If the DVC bondage becomes too much, I'll sell, but for now I gladly accept it. Otherwise I realize I have to watch the banking deadlines.

This may sound overly-simplistic to those with multiple contracts. I wouldn't want another contract because of all the hassles involved.

My philosophy, when in doubt, I BANK!

 

[LisaS]

Don't see an inherent difference between transferring points between members & renting out a ressie to same.

In the specific example you mention, no there isn't a lot of difference. But if indeed some members were making hundreds of point transfers per year then MS must have been getting a lot of calls to make lots of small to medium sized point transfers and it was getting out of control.

Also, DVC may view limiting transfers as a way to get members with fewer points than they really need to add on. It's probably not cost effective for DVC to have members who own fewer than 150 points so this may be a way to address that problem as well. We've already seen Disney get more aggressive exercising ROFR on nonmembers trying to purchase small contracts.

 

[dianeschlicht]

*snip* It's probably not cost effective for DVC to have members who own fewer than 150 points so this may be a way to address that problem as well. We've already seen Disney get more aggressive exercising ROFR on nonmembers trying to purchase small contracts.

I think there is a lot of truth in that too. They obviously haven't tracked the smaller contracts well enough to know that folks are getting full membership rights with fewer than 150 points.

 

[Beca]

Dean is absolutely right about this too. I keep thinking the occupancy limits are going to be the next thing strictly enforced. Really, why not? I guess I have a hard time understanding why a "rule" should be in place if it is allowed to be broken anyway. By the way, Dean has every right to keep repeating his opinion as well. Why not? We keep getting all these threads with virtually the same topic, so repetition is going to happen.

And then, there are those of us who would read pretty much anything Dean has to say....as often as he wants to say it!!! Man...I love smart people!!

 

[keishashadow]

But explain what you meant by "managing sub contracts". That's the part I was having difficulty understanding. I too have a "sub contract" in that my add-on is listed like that. The difference is that my add-on is at the same resort.

By "managing" sub contracts I just meant:

* the ability to bank & borrow to be able to use each one every 2 or 3 years for a ressie

**option to divest ourselves of a single sub-contract & still be able to enjoy the DVC membership, ex 1/year or every 2 or 3 years if we so choose

***ability to combine all points for a 7 month ressie if desired

Don't want to debate if any method of ownership is right or wrong because I think it's irrelevant. Still, glad that we went the route of several smaller contracts for a multitude of reasons. There aren't different levels of membership based on points. Until it is stated otherwise a 25 point owner is considered a member just the same as a 1,000 point holder.

DVC evidently didn't have a problem with smaller members having "full" membership rights in the past and I'm sure it occured to people to buy a smaller membership if only for the percs. Of course, they are subject to change & disappear all together @ the whim of management.

It is true that the transfer enforcement will require smaller point holders to rethink their strategy & either add-on or adapt with the new reality.

 

[Dean]

It is true that the transfer enforcement will require smaller point holders to rethink their strategy & either add-on or adapt with the new reality.

They may change but I doubt it'll be for the better for those that are upset with them. More likely they'll just do larger transfers and book prime time weeks to rent out more than they would have previously.

 

[Dean]

I think it is affecting the vocal members on this forum, I like Diane do not transfer either.

I am curious though why so many have complained about the change yet few have a realistic opinion on how to stop the problem of Commercial Renting and still allow the transfers or if they do have not communicated it to DVC.

And Yes we allow Diane to state in these discussions she does not transfer and does not see the concern just as we allow Dean to say over and over that: this will likely hurt the average member more than anyone else

LOL and we even allow SSR members to post.

 

[Steamboat Bill]

Unfortunately, it is the honest average DVC owner that will suffer if he/she is short 3 points to book a reservation.

Perhaps DVC should rent points to them for under $10 per point.

 

[Doctor P]

Unfortunately, it is the honest average DVC owner that will suffer if he/she is short 3 points to book a reservation.

Perhaps DVC should rent points to them for under $10 per point.

Even in such a circumstance, the member would not be shut out. They would just need to change the plan of attack. You would rent one nights accomodations and bank the partial nights points. This is where the issue of planning enters into the equation. With effective point managment, the need for a TRANSFER should be able to be avoided or at least postponed in most circumstances. The only significant exception would in general be for members who only make one trip using points every three years.

 

[dianeschlicht]

Even in such a circumstance, the member would not be shut out. They would just need to change the plan of attack. You would rent one nights accomodations and bank the partial nights points. This is where the issue of planning enters into the equation. With effective point managment, the need for a TRANSFER should be able to be avoided or at least postponed in most circumstances. The only significant exception would in general be for members who only make one trip using points every three years.

That's true, and in the case of the every third year member, it is often that they have a few too many one time. We have a dear friend who only owns 151 points. She usually goes every third year, but sometimes has that odd 11 points left over. Not really enough to rent or do anything else with.

 

[Steamboat Bill]

DVC is marketed as a very flexible timeshare. I in fact, do not really consider it a timeshare as much as a club to get great hotels at great prices. Unfortunately, this rule enforcement is very RIGID and non-flexible.

 

[Sammie]

That's true, and in the case of the every third year member, it is often that they have a few too many one time. We have a dear friend who only owns 151 points. She usually goes every third year, but sometimes has that odd 11 points left over. Not really enough to rent or do anything else with.

Happens to us all the time, ending up with an odd number of points or needing a few. We simply adjust as you and Dr.P stated. We either don't stay that extra day and bank the leftovers. Or bank the leftovers and pay cash for the extra day. I would never expect it to work out evenly.

 

[Steamboat Bill]

Here is someone desparate for 4 points to complete a reservation....sad

http://disboards.com/showthread.php?t=1202056

 

[Maistre Gracey]

Why would this hurt the average DVC Member? I doubt the average DVC Member comes to Disboards to get 3 points transfered to complete a ressie.

Even if they do, why would they need to do that more than once per year?

I know I'm late to the conversation, but what am I missing here?

MG

 

[MommaluvsDis]

Catching the tailend of the conversation here, but would someone please explain this new rule to me?

 

[dianeschlicht]

Why would this hurt the average DVC Member? I doubt the average DVC Member comes to Disboards to get 3 points transfered to complete a ressie.

Even if they do, why would they need to do that more than once per year?

I know I'm late to the conversation, but what am I missing here?

MG

I don't think you are missing anything. In fact, you hit the nail on the head! I think this whole thinkg is being blown out of proportion by the very people it has effected....the people who were abusing it.

 

[Beca]

Well, I have never "abused" the situation...if "abusing" means transferring to rent.

But, here is how I ended up needing more points. I thought my trips were planned for the year. So, I "banked" my remaining points. Then, I got an invitation to visit WDW with some friends I hadn't seen in many years. I had already planned all my points for the next year...had even included my "banked" points in the total (I was taking students to WDW for their senior year, as a gift). So, in order to take this additional trip, I transferred in points. Then, my dh had a conflict come up. He could only get to stay one night at WDW...hardly worth going at all for him. So, we decided that, in order for him to come to WDW, we would make our trip longer...we would show up early with DH and "do" WDW. Then, our friends would come and dh could see them for two days, then he would go home and dd and I would play with our friends. That way, we all got a WDW trip. So...I had to transfer in some more points.

Now, some would say we should've "added-on". Well, first...we had 540 points, secondly...we couldn't afford it, and thirdly...the year before we had too many points and actually transferred out.

Maybe, I have just "mis-managed" my points. Or maybe, the "flexibility" is what made DVC perfect for me. However, I was totally using DVC for my family's enjoyment....and, still found myself needing two transfers in one year.

I will miss that "saftey net" of flexibility. Also, I honestly don't feel that DVC did it to stop commercial renters. I don't think DVC cares who they "stop"...they just want more room left in the "system" at the 7 month window. Whether they limit flexibility for people who are renting, or for people who use their points themselves doesn't matter to them...as long as rooms are available at all resorts at the 7-month window....DVC is happy!!! They can, in good conscience tell prospective members....sure, you can stay ANYWHERE with these points. I'd certainly be looking for more restrictions in the future.