New policy for reservations based on check IN date

[alldiz]

But doesn't this now create an easy scenario for speculative renting? Let's say it's that much easier to get the time period you want, longer stay. What's to stop someone with a few thousand points from making 4, 5, or more reservations for that same period? With day by day, these folks too had to call day by day and try to grab what they needed. If this does make it easier, then these folks are going to have a field day and the only way to get prime weeks at prime locations will not be via DVC, it will be via eBay.

We'll have to wait and see the cancellation policies....if any. As usual DVC is doing a bang up job of implementing policies with wonderful communication to it's members
Kerri

 

[jdg345]

But each one at least had an equal chance.

Now, say I want the latter half of a week for Food and Wine. I will likely have NO chance because the room will likely have been booked by people taking the whole week. That is, unless I book the whole week myself, even though I have no intention of keeping the first few days.

I also agree we need to wait and see what the EXACT policy is. We only know what people have been told thus far, with regards to bookings. We have heard nothings about cancellations or changes (that I've seen).

Don't forget that the goal of a timeshare is 100% occupancy 100% of the time, not including maintenance reserve. Since our points systems allows flexibility in when we can book, there will always be more popular times than others - which will always result in demand exceeding supply.

Actually, according to a PP, they were able to book ahead and a day later, drop the last days creating a shorter (and complete) reservation and then they were able to book 7 more from that day as a new reservation. It seems dropping days off the end aren't a big deal. We don't know about changing arrival date yet. Someone could always call and try it.

 

[tjkraz]

It is very possible that ONE standard view room will not be available at the BWV during early December when you call. Those rooms sell out on the first day of the window starting the week of Thanksgiving. Heaven help you if you want to arrive in the middle of the week or on a Thursday.

It's unlikely that a BWV owner who only wants to stay a few days in a BW or SV room over NYE will ever be able to do so unless a waitlist comes through.

I doubt that is true. You're ignoring the staggered nature of vacation plans.

Let's say "Joe" has a 10-night trip booked, arriving Sunday and departing the following Wednesday. The remainder of that week--Wednesday forward--would be impossible for another member to reserve using the +7 guideline. Joe has the room occupied thru Tuesday night, so nobody can book his vacated room prior to 11 months before his Wednesday departure.

There will be many people who vacation outside of the Sunday-Thursday window, and those people's trips will leave orphaned arrival days which are available mid-week.

Another interesting byproduct of this change is the fact that it seems to encourage weekend arrivals. I do envision that those who are willing to arrive on a Friday or Saturday will have a much better shot of booking their entire trip. If this change increases weekend occupancy, we will ALL benefit from it. We're dealing with resorts that have a finite number of points. If weekend point usage increases, that means there will be fewer trips loaded into the Sun - Thurs window.

 

[tjkraz]

Those with enough points would be able to book the first 7 days, wait 3, and book the next 7 though. In fact, based on the PP, one could book 7, call in 3 days, change the first reservation to 3 days only (ending it) and then book the last 7 and link them -- no extra points needed. They've already allowed this -- it's another way to 'walk' a reservation forward.

For example:

Today: I book for 11 months + 7 days.
Tomorrow: I cancel the last 6 days (effectively making it a 1 day reservation) and then book 7 more days on a new ressie. Then I link them.
Day After: Rinse, lather, repeat.

You can speculate about that if you wish, but I doubt DVC will permit it. My sense is that they will allow one transaction per 7-day period.

 

[jdg345]

I'm happy with the new change. It puts me on equal footing with those who always call day-by-day to get what they want. Calling at 9am, every day for a week, is just not possible for me. It's not a question of not wanting to do it, it's just not an option for me.

You could still make only one call, you just needed to do so based on your departure date. While now you don't need to deal with day by day, you still need to call early to beat out those who are calling with the same goals you have, *plus* you might already be at a disadvantage based on those that booked 1, 2, 3 or more days before you for part of the same period.

 

[Paticake]

This new policy has me a little stressed. We are planning to do a GV at SSR late June 2009. I figured I would do day by day and have a very good chance. Now I am a little more nervous. Anyone know how many GVs are at SSR. TIA

 

[jdg345]

DVC is rarely consistent on information. I can assure you that if day 1 is not available, you can't book the following days unless you're inside the 11 month window. For #2, you'll likely not be able to book past any unavailable days but at 11 months out from the first day, this should not happen, it could only happen one the days in question are inside the 11 mo window.

Then doesn't this make it touch to book things like NYE when the week before is likely going to be completely booked based on those that booked Christmas? On #2, it's possible depending on how they allow changes, etc. I can see people booking 7-10 days and then deciding that they want to switch resorts somewhere midstay.

Not really. You have the option of calling earlier also if you know that will affect your chances of success.

By earlier, do you mean the day (or days) before? Again we go back to those who have more points having an advantage. For example, Thanksgiving week it's usually pretty easy to grab Fri/Sat night before, but that Sunday is pretty tough and it gets tougher the closer you get to Thanksgiving Day. Those with more points can just book from Friday and lock themselves in. If you can't waitlist for the beginning days, then those same folks also have an advantage as they can extend their stay day-by-day by closing the 7 day ressie (making it one day) and then booking 7 more for a total of 8. Rinse, lather, repeat -- and now you have 10, 14, or more days which you can link together. And, ironincally, DVC didn't reduce day-by-day calling for this member anyways.

 

[jdg345]

We'll have to wait and see the cancellation policies....if any. As usual DVC is doing a bang up job of implementing policies with wonderful communication to it's members
Kerri

Speculative renters likely wouldn't be affected by a cancellation policy though.

I certainly agree with your last point though.

 

[jdg345]

You can speculate about that if you wish, but I doubt DVC will permit it. My sense is that they will allow one transaction per 7-day period.

Didn't someone already do something similar? They had a ressie started on May 13th which they were doing day by day. They closed it out and created a new 7 day ressie.

Besides, there is nothing in the POS that would prevent it.

And what about people going in groups with staggered stays? I call today and book 7 days (out of a total 10 day stay). But, I arrive early. More folks in my group are arriving tomorrow, and the balance the day after. Each group is getting their own room, but under my points. So tomorrow, I need to call and book 7 more days (+2) for the second group, and the day after, I need to call and book 7 more days, (+1) for the last arriving group. Then I need to wait until the end (or cancel/close/rebook day-by-day) to get my total 10 days.

Yuk. That's a mess. It would have just been easier to call day by day.

 

[CarolMN]

You can speculate about that if you wish, but I doubt DVC will permit it. My sense is that they will allow one transaction per 7-day period.

How could they ever enforce that? What if I had guests who were arriving a day later than me (and we both wanted studios at the same resort)? Are they going to stop me from reserving units for family and friends? If not, I could just wait a while and then change the name on the reservation. At a minimum, DVC would have to refuse all name changes for existing reservations to stop this. Who knows what other restrictions they'd have to implement.

I don't see how they could stop members from booking anything that is available as long as they have the points.

For what it's worth, if a member doesn't think that everyone should have the same chance to reserve a given day in a given room type, I don't see why he/she is so concerned about preventing others from "gaming" the new system. The "gamers" are just a different set of people who have a better shot at getting what they want than you have. (And you are free to join them if you so choose). So, in essence, it's just about picking which group will be advantaged.

As I've said before, this is a values discussion and we aren't going to agree. It's like discussing religion or politics. (But still fun and interesting to discuss).

 

[DVC Grandpa]

I'm happy with the new change. It puts me on equal footing with those who always call day-by-day to get what they want. Calling at 9am, every day for a week, is just not possible for me. It's not a question of not wanting to do it, it's just not an option for me.

You were always on equal footing but you opted out of calling day by day. If that was impossible for you to do you could have listed an Associate Member and had that member do it for you.
Under the old system EVERY MEMBER had the same opportunity, if they take that opportunity is there decision but under the new rule those staying a few days or a lengthy stay do not have the same opportunity as stated in many of the replies you read here.

Those who would like to let Mr Lewis himself know there feelings, his address is

Mr. James Lewis
Senior Vice President - Disney Vacation Club
Executive Office
Walt Disney Resort
PO Box 10000
Lake Buena Vista, FL 32830-1000

 

[DVC Mike]

I've had some time to think about the policy change, and read everyone's comments, and I'm now thinking the change is a positive thing. I'd rather know that I can get all of a 7-night stay than worry day-by-day that after I got 3 nights, I might not get night 4. I feel the same way with the new waitlisting policy.

Yes, there may be a small bit less fairness than the old method, but it won't have much of a negative impact to me. I don't tend to book extremely hard to get ressies, and I think this will have less impact to those that book at the 11-mo window (which I always do) than to those that book at the 7-mo window.

The biggest negative impact to me is the limitation of only being able to book up to 7 nights. If it was bumped up to 8-10 nights, I probably wouldn't have any complaints at all (except for the way DVC botched the rollout of this change).

 

[CarolMN]

This new policy has me a little stressed. We are planning to do a GV at SSR late June 2009. I figured I would do day by day and have a very good chance. Now I am a little more nervous. Anyone know how many GVs are at SSR. TIA

Assuming you own at SSR, you won't have a problem. Nothing at SSR sells out for June in the first week the window opens. Nothing. You never had to call day by day for that under the old booking method.

No worries for you. You are one of the members who will end up liking the new policy. Just call when your 11 month window opens and you will have get what you want. It's as close to a guarantee as anything at DVC can be.

 

[Kathi OD]

You were always on equal footing but you opted out of calling day by day. If that was impossible for you to do you could have listed an Associate Member and had that member do it for you.
Under the old system EVERY MEMBER had the same opportunity, if they take that opportunity is there decision but under the new rule those staying a few days or a lengthy stay do not have the same opportunity as stated in many of the replies you read here.

Those who would like to let Mr Lewis himself know there feelings, his address is

Mr. James Lewis
Senior Vice President - Disney Vacation Club
Executive Office
Walt Disney Resort
PO Box 10000
Lake Buena Vista, FL 32830-1000

I've already sent Mr. Lewis my comments. I'm really happy about the change.

I should not have to add an Associate Member to my membership to be on an equal footing with those who want to call day-by-day. With the new system, everyone who wants a reservation beginning 11 months from today can call and try to get it without tying up MS's phones for days on end while they book a day at a time.

 

[CarolMN]

I doubt that is true. You're ignoring the staggered nature of vacation plans.

Let's say "Joe" has a 10-night trip booked, arriving Sunday and departing the following Wednesday. The remainder of that week--Wednesday forward--would be impossible for another member to reserve using the +7 guideline. Joe has the room occupied thru Tuesday night, so nobody can book his vacated room prior to 11 months before his Wednesday departure.

There will be many people who vacation outside of the Sunday-Thursday window, and those people's trips will leave orphaned arrival days which are available mid-week.

Another interesting byproduct of this change is the fact that it seems to encourage weekend arrivals. I do envision that those who are willing to arrive on a Friday or Saturday will have a much better shot of booking their entire trip. If this change increases weekend occupancy, we will ALL benefit from it. We're dealing with resorts that have a finite number of points. If weekend point usage increases, that means there will be fewer trips loaded into the Sun - Thurs window.

I don't care about Joe's trip, LOL. I care about my preferred time to visit which is the Saturday after Thanksgiving through the following Friday or Saturday. Due to the popularity of Thanksgiving week and Thanksgiving weekend, I think there is a very REAL possibility that there will not be a SV room available to me for arrival on that Saturday. There will certainly be less availability for that day and thus my chances of winning the dialing derby will go from almost a sure thing to something less than that - maybe zero!

That said, I don't think DVC cares about equal opportunity (rooms will be full no matter how they do it) and I don't think they are going to change the policy based on complaints. I don't like the new booking method (and you won't change my mind about that, LOL), but I will either learn to live with it or sell and move on (probably the former).

As far as benefiting from increased Friday & Saturday usage, we disagree on that, too, LOL. Friday and Saturday nights are the ones most wanted by the general public booking through CRO. Those weekend nights are the ones that really support the bulk of members' non-DVC choices. I predict point increases for those or fewer options. This I personally don't care about, because I only use points at DVC resorts. But I always thought the higher points for weekends made it easier for DVC to offer the non-DVC choices.

Wouldn't it be fun if we could all have this discussion in person somehow?

 

[Mattsmommy]

I wonder what's going to happen to those who own at VB or HHI and want to make reservations for the summer.

 

[tjkraz]

I've had some time to think about the policy change, and read everyone's comments, and I'm now thinking the change is a positive thing. I'd rather know that I can get all of a 7-night stay than worry day-by-day that after I got 3 nights, I might not get night 4. I feel the same way with the new waitlisting policy.

I'm starting to lean that way, too.

This isn't a moral or ethical debate...it's simply procedural. I'd be a little more concerned if other industry leaders were all using the day-by-day system and this was (seemingly) a hare-brained idea on DVC's part. But it appears both methods are tried and true.

If DVC had been founded on the +7 system and was now changing to a day-by-day booking, we'd be having the opposite debate. "You mean I have to call seven times to book my week-long trip? And there's a chance I won't get every night that I want??? The commercial renters will just grab all of the prime times as soon as the phones open!!!!!"

I think there's a lot to be said for minimizing the amount of time that a member has to spend on the phone just to book a vacation (again, a vacation!!!) And I also like that emphasis is being placed on getting the member all of the nights they need, albeit within reasonable boundaries. I wouldn't even oppose expanding it beyond the 7 nights (the number of people who take trips longer than that has to be a tiny percentage of all members, and those people are going to be calling to book their extra nights anyway.)

Those are the facts.

Everything else that I'm seeing appears to be purely speculative. We're just getting opinions on how the system can be abused, how people will be shut-out of resorts, etc. I'm not going to condemn the change based upon our speculation which may have no basis in fact.

Going back to what Chuck said a few pages ago, I say give it a shot and let's see what happens. The real test won't come until January 2009, which should be plenty of time for DVC to tweak the rules and procedures as necessary.

But shame on Disney for not handling the communications better than they have!!!

 

[mello]

I must have worn MS out on my very recent concierge booking.

And here I thought it was me wearing them out with my convoluted December booking!

 

[tjkraz]

I don't care about Joe's trip, LOL. I care about my preferred time to visit which is the Saturday after Thanksgiving through the following Friday or Saturday. Due to the popularity of Thanksgiving week and Thanksgiving weekend, I think there is a very REAL possibility that there will not be a SV room available to me for arrival on that Saturday. There will certainly be less availability for that day and thus my chances of winning the dialing derby will go from almost a sure thing to something less than that - maybe zero!

Going back to my analogy, what I'm trying to point-out is that not everyone arrives and departs on the same schedule. You want to arrive on a Saturday. Even though Thanksgiving week is a very popular period, I'm confident that the resorts actually do have SOME departures on Saturday morning.

So, one member has a trip booked thru Friday night, the room they are vacating simply CANNOT be booked by anyone until 11 months from Saturday. That's the day you will be calling.

Also the audience against which you are competing will now be much smaller. In the past let's say there were 100 people calling every day at 9am to book a BW Standard View for that period right at 11 months. Under the new system, 90 of them may already have their room booked as part of the +7 rule. Yes, the room inventory will be lower by the time you can call, but the number of guests seeking to fill those rooms will also be lower.

As far as benefiting from increased Friday & Saturday usage, we disagree on that, too, LOL. Friday and Saturday nights are the ones most wanted by the general public booking through CRO. Those weekend nights are the ones that really support the bulk of members' non-DVC choices. I predict point increases for those or fewer options. This I personally don't care about, because I only use points at DVC resorts. But I always thought the higher points for weekends made it easier for DVC to offer the non-DVC choices.

With the explosion of point renting, do people really pay $600 per night for a One Bedroom on the weekend?

Wouldn't it be fun if we could all have this discussion in person somehow?

Maybe then it wouldn't sound like we were all yelling at each other. Talking-over each other, perhaps, but not yelling.

 

[robinb]

again.....I'm not seeing any difference in how many points you own. The majority of owners call and will book the vacation they want...end of story.

Then let me explain. If you bought a small resale for BLT for the purpose of staying only a few weeknights at BLT in a Magic Kingdom view at even a slightly busy time you are screwed under the new system. By the time you are able to call, your few days may already be booked in advance by people who are staying a full week. Sure, you can bank and borrow 3 years to be able to stay 7 days but not everyone likes to use their points on the weekends.