Nemo Rides Information

[dbm20th]

Of course I didn't "rip" the ride. There's nothing like that in the post. You also completely ignored all the good things I said about the Paris 'Turtle' ride. But that's okay. It's your job to discredit anyone with a different opinion. I understand; it's all part of the game.

Let me just remind you what MJ said...

I'm very surprised you already don't like this new attraction.

And you turned this into...

vile, evil, nasty person out to rip down Disney.

Who is the one taking things out of context here?

Also, the last sentence of you post says...

And besides, I'm sure people would rather go surfing with Crush and his son than tag along as Mr. Ray describes fish.

Besides not being clear as to what a ride in Paris has to do with my enjoyment of a new EPCOT attractions, I can clearly see how this sounds like you may not like the plans very much. I made the same mistake.

 

[MJMcBride]

Mr. Hill is once again being a little too, let's just say "fan friendly". The WDW version of the ride will consist of the show elements from Disneyland's 'Nemo Sub ride. At Disneyland these elements will be filmed animation projected so that it looks like it in the underwater sets and some mechanical effects in dry boxes. WDW will basically be the same thing but without the water (i.e., the same film effects but projected against dry set pieces).

And instead of being upset about getting a downsized version of the Disneyland ride (which WDW is), we should be more upset that neither of us is getting the 'Turtle Spin' attraction from Disneyland Paris. The ride is an indoor free-spinning mad mouse ride with a story line about riding on Crush's back through the East Austrailian Current. Buzz around the company is that it's really turning our remarkable well. Instead of being just another decorated roller coaster like 'Rock n Roller', this one includes real show scenes and plenty of great effects inside the current (the roller coaster section). And besides, I'm sure people would rather go surfing with Crush and his son than tag along as Mr. Ray describes fish.

You say we should be upset that the WDW version of the ride is downsized. You say we should be upset that we're not getting the Paris version instead. You say people would like the Pais version better than "tagging along with Ray". I take it back you're not ripping anything before it opens. My bad.

And by the way, I fail to understand how on the one hand you rip Imagineering for not being inventive and then on the other say they should just import the Paris ride instead of the planned attraction, which, oh yeah, you didn't rip.

 

[Another Voice]

The theme of Mr. Hill's article was that people were upset that WDW was getting a bad and cheapened version of the Disneyland attraction. My post was to say that WDW is getting the show elements from Disneyland - I made no comment whether that was a "rip-off" because WDW isn't also getting real submarines too or that things were being downsized. The purpose of Mr. Hill's article was to set-up a strawman ("Nemo sucks") and rip it down to prove that he's as much a pixie-duster as anyone here. He tries to, afterall, make a living off you fans and needs to re-establish “cred” every once and a while. I presented the rumors and whispers as I have heard them, without the cheerleading Mr. Hill tried to put in and other seem to demand in all comments. If that qualifies as "ripping" to you - so be it.

If people what to feign being “upset” about something, I suggested people take a lot at (what I think) is a neat little attraction being built at Disneyland Paris. My hideously “negative” comment about more people wanting to go with Crush rather than Mr. Ray is a simple observation. If you could live out, in real life, one scene from the movie – how many people would choose to attend Mr. Ray’s class and how many people would want to ride the current with Crush? I think the answer is obvious – and those are also the main plots of these two attractions. It doesn’t say one attraction is “good” and the other must be “bad”, it is just a guess at the relative popularity of the two rides. And you certainly can’t make one ride “better” by remaining ignorant about other, similar, rides out there.

 

[Lanie]

I would say you have a good shot at that. Hill is not the only one that has mentioned that date. Certainly, you may see a soft opening phase

You just made me SOOOOOOOO Happy !!!!!

 

[MJMcBride]

The theme of Mr. Hill's article was that people were upset that WDW was getting a bad and cheapened version of the Disneyland attraction. My post was to say that WDW is getting the show elements from Disneyland - I made no comment whether that was a "rip-off" because WDW isn't also getting real submarines too or that things were being downsized. The purpose of Mr. Hill's article was to set-up a strawman ("Nemo sucks") and rip it down to prove that he's as much a pixie-duster as anyone here. He tries to, afterall, make a living off you fans and needs to re-establish “cred” every once and a while. I presented the rumors and whispers as I have heard them, without the cheerleading Mr. Hill tried to put in and other seem to demand in all comments. If that qualifies as "ripping" to you - so be it.

If people what to feign being “upset” about something, I suggested people take a lot at (what I think) is a neat little attraction being built at Disneyland Paris. My hideously “negative” comment about more people wanting to go with Crush rather than Mr. Ray is a simple observation. If you could live out, in real life, one scene from the movie – how many people would choose to attend Mr. Ray’s class and how many people would want to ride the current with Crush? I think the answer is obvious – and those are also the main plots of these two attractions. It doesn’t say one attraction is “good” and the other must be “bad”, it is just a guess at the relative popularity of the two rides. And you certainly can’t make one ride “better” by remaining ignorant about other, similar, rides out there.

I'm going to try avoid going on and on about this. It certainly seemed that you were ripping the ride before it even opened by stating all things we should be upset about. I have re read your initial post several times and I still think you're ripping it. If you don't see that well - so be it.

I am not sure how you can "observe" that people would rather go Crush rather than Mr. Ray since the Living Seas exhibit is not open yet and I take it neither is the Disneyland Paris exhibit. Again, you appear to be criticizing a ride you haven't seen and speaking for the public who hasn't experienced either attraction.

As for the Disneyland Paris ride, it sounds great. But frankly, so does the Living Seas proposal. I say bring them both to WDW. Maybe the Crush ride could fit somewhere in DAK. Maybe by the new Nemo Musical coming.

 

[dbm20th]

Maybe the Crush ride could fit somewhere in DAK. Maybe by the new Nemo Musical coming.

Just another cheap re-hash from another Disney park showing no imagination at all. Just a re-tread...right?

(Which essentially describes MK..besides the cheap bit)

 

[flatline]

I say we port out Stitch's Great Escape to every other Disney park on the planet, they'll feel our pain.

 

[DannyDisneyFreak]

Will L. wrote in with the following question/comment and them Jim follows with his response:

Will L. writes in to say:

Have you seen the concept art for Epcot's new "The Seas with Nemo & Friends" attraction yet?

Copyright Disney Enterprises LLC

Originally I was very excited when I saw all of this stuff.

Copyright Disney Enterprises LLC

But then I got to see some of the concept art for Disneyland's "Finding Nemo Submarine Voyage."

Copyright Disney Enterprises LLC

And these two attractions look virtually identical. Except for the fact that Disneyland now appears to be getting twice as many fish as Disney World will be getting.

Why does the Walt Disney Company keep doing this? First create a truly great attraction, then quickly throw together a half-*** clone of that same ride on the cheap. Don't they understand how doing something like really hurts Disney's reputation? Don't they realize that the public isn't stupid? That it's obvious to us when they cut corners on these things?

When is Disney finally going to start learning from the mistakes of its past? That what the theme-park-going public really wants aren't all of these clones but top-dollar quality attractions.

Dear Will L.

My, that was one very impressive anti-Disney rant you had going there. Do you feel better now? Did you get it all out of your system?

Good. I hope so. Because -- to be blunt here, Will L. -- you don't know what the hell you're talking about.

You see, Disneyland's new "Finding Nemo Submarine Voyage" ride and Epcot's "The Seas with Nemo & Friends" pavilion aren't clones. They're entirely different attractions. To be honest, these two couldn't be more dissimilar if they tried. Disney World's "Nemo" dark ride will basically serve as the new introduction for the Future World pavilion that WDW guests will encounter once they exit their "clamobiles." So the emphasis at this particular attraction is being placed on education.

Whereas Disneyland's "Finding Nemo Submarine Voyage" ... This ride is a stand-alone that's just meant to be entertaining. So as you putter along below the surface of Tomorrowland Lagoon, you won't be hearing any annoying factoids about how many fish there supposedly are in the sea or how we have to work even harder at keeping the world's oceans pollution-free. This radically revamped version of the old "Voyage through Liquid Space" ride is deliberately not going to be educational.

The "Finding Nemo Submarine Voyage" is just meant to an exjoyable experience for Disneyland visitors. A chance to briefly get up-close-and-personal with the cast of this smash hit Pixar film. And nothing more.

So you see what I'm saying here, Will? We're talking education versus entertainment. More importantly, one attraction is basically a continuous-loading dark ride that pretends to take you under the water. While the other ride actually does take guests below the surface aboard a series of slow moving, small capacity vehicles. So -- if you actually get cold-blooded here and start comparing storylines, overall themes, ride systems and THRC (Theoretical Hourly Ride Capacity) ... You'll see that "The Seas with Nemo & Friends" and the "Finding Nemo Submarine Voyage" are not in fact clones.

I mean, sure. These two soon-to-be-opened attractions do share the same set of Pixar characters. And -- yes -- the same Imagineer (I.E. Chris Turner) did create pieces of concept art for both "The Seas with Nemo & Friends" and the "Finding Nemo Submarine Voyage." And -- yes -- two of these concept paintings do look very much alike. But that coincidence doesn't then give you the right to play the clone card, Will. To get on your soapbox and then start ranting & raving about how Disney's cutting corners again.

Because (the way I hear it) the Imagineers are throwing an awful lot of money at this Future World redo. And that's all Disney dough, Will L. "The Seas with Nemo & Friends" doesn't have a corporate sponsor anymore. I mean, it's been years since United Technologies actually footed the bill for the operation of this Future World pavilion.

Copyright 1986 The Walt Disney Company

And -- to be honest -- maybe it's a good thing that UT is finally gone. From what the folks at WDI have told me, United Technologies management was pretty tight with a buck. Which meant -- if you approached these guys with two plans for "The Living Seas" pavilion -- and one of these plans was ground-breaking but expensive while the other was uninspired but inexpensive ... The money guys at UT would invariably go for the cheaper plan.

Which is why this Future Word pavilion eventually wound up with the underwhelming pre-show that it got (I.E. That introductory film, a quick trip "below the surface" in a hydrolator, followed by a 3-minute-long ride in a sea cab to Seabase Alpha) ...

Copyright 1986 The Walt Disney Company

... rather than the truly impressive introduction that the Imagineers had originally designed for "The Living Seas" pavilion. Where guests would have initially encountered an oversized Audio Animatronic version of Poseidon, the God of the Sea. Who -- after railing at the humans in the pre-show area for daring to enter his realm -- would have then pulled back a curtain of water.

Which would have revealed the load area of the "Living Seas" main attraction. Where Epcot visitors would have boarded large clear-plastic bubbles and then gone off on this 10-minute long journey through wet-for-dry recreations of some of the wonders of the deep. Before finally exiting the attraction and then exploring the slightly-futuristic wonders to be found at Seabase Alpha.

Copyright 1982 Walt Disney Productions

But -- as you might have guessed -- because over-sized AA figures & clear-plastic bubble-shaped ride vehicles were expensive ... The folks at United Technologies eventually took a pass on the Poseidon-themed pre-show idea. Opting instead to spend their money on exhibits that would then talk up UT's own cutting-edge inventions, like this deep sea diving suit.

Copyright 1986 The Walt Disney Company

Realizing that -- as a direct result of United Technologies going the cheap route with "The Living Seas" -- that this water-filled Future World pavilion wound up being rather dry & academic ... The Imagineers did what they could to liven the place up. Bringing in characters like Diver Mickey ...

Copyright 1986 The Walt Disney Company

... wherever they could. With the hope that that might then make "The Living Seas" that much more palatable to people vacationing at Walt Disney World.

Speaking of which ... For those of you who continually complain about how the Walt Disney Company nows seems determined to shoehorn characters into each & every new ride & attraction that they build for the parks ... Let me tell you that Epcot's managers actively campaign to get shows for their theme park that prominently feature the Disney & Pixar characters.

Why For? Because these guys know that it's the public's relationship with these characters that factors heavily into their decisions about which theme park they will visit during their next Disney World vacation. Which is why these folks were absolutely thrilled to first land that "Turtle Talk with Crush" show for "The Living Seas," and then to follow that up with a complete "Finding Nemo" -themed redo of this entire Future World pavilion.

Anyway ... Getting back to Will L.'s original complaint about how "The Seas with Nemo & Friends" will allegedly just be a half-assed clone of Disneyland's "Finding Nemo Submarine Voyage" ...

Copyright Disney Enterprises LLC

... To be fair, I guess that I should acknowledge that these two attractions will be sharing some techology (I.E. That innovative digital projection system that WDI is still trying hard to keep under wraps. Which will make it appear as if photo-realistic versions of your favorite "Finding Nemo" characters are alive & well, frolicking just outside your porthole window). More importantly, there will some animated footage that will be shown at both "The Seas with Nemo & Friends" and Disneyland's "Finding Nemo Submarine Voyage."

FYI: This footage is not being farmed out to some outside firm. It's actually the folks at Pixar who will be animating Marlin, Dory & Co. Just like they did for the original animated feature. Though (I probably shouldn't be saying this, but ... ) I hear that these animators who are working on this project aren't all that happy with WDI is asking them to do.

Why For? Well, you see, these animators think that the Imagineers who are in charge of these two projects have written some awfully lame dialogue for the "Finding Nemo" characters. And that -- given their druthers -- the folks at Pixar would prefer to have written their own scripts for these two attractions. So that these characters would then look, sound and behave just as they did back in the Summer of 2003. Back when "Finding Nemo" was first released to theaters.

Mind you, I don't mean to say that every single show scene that the Imagineers have written for Disneyland's new "Finding Nemo Submarine Voyage" ride is absolutely awful. I mean, how can you not love an attraction that shows Gill & the Tank Gang (Who for years held initiation ceremonies at the top of their tiny fake aquarium volcano, Mount Wanna-hock-a-loogie) ...

Copyright Disney Enterprises LLC

... finally getting the chance to throw a party at the base of an active underwater volcano?

So I guess what I'm saying here, Will L., is ... This time around, you were wrong. Epcot's new "The Seas with Nemo & Friends" is not going to be some cheap, half-assed clone of Disneyland's "Finding Nemo Submarine Voyage." If you don't believe me ... Then fine. Go see for yourself.

The way I hear it, all of the major construction on this new Future World attraction will be completed by late July / early August. So -- with any amount of luck -- the Imagineers will then be able to begin holding "soft openings" of this dark ride in late August / early September. Just so they can then make sure that the ride portion of "The Seas with Nemo & Friends" will actually be ready in time for this for this Future World pavilion's grand re-opening during the first week of October. Where I hear that this new Epcot attraction is supposed to be one of the real high points of this year's WDW press event.

As for Disneyland's "Finding Nemo Submarine Voyage" ...

Copyright Disney Enterprises LLC

... Given that John Lasseter has supposedly asked that some small changes be made to several show scenes & that additional effects be added to this radically revamped Tomorrowland ride ... No one wants to go on record just yet about when the official opening date for this new Disneyland attraction might be. Other than to say that the "Finding Nemo Submarine Voyage" will undoubtedly probably be open to the public sometime in the Spring of 2007.

There. Is that vague enough for you?

Anyway ... That's all the news that I have (to date) about these two new Disney theme park attractions. So -- for the time being -- can we just seas-and-desist with all this negative talk about these "Finding Nemo" -based shows?

Your thoughts?

Published Friday, June 02, 2006 12:00 AM
Filed Under: ANIMATION, DISNEY, MOVIES, THEMEPARK, WHYFOR
www.JimHillMedia.com

 

[Golf4food]

How about a Mary Poppins ride?

Only if it has Penguins. That's the rule.

 

[SFLTIGGER]

Looks like the DW will lose this one! I think this will seal the deal with 4yr old DS. We weren't planning on all the parks this trip.

Can any one tell me more about "soft openings"? Open to public? How to find out if open for sure? We will be at WDW 8/27 thru 9/4.

 

[jaycns]

Here's hoping for a chance to ride it sometime between 9/16 -9/23

 

[BlakeNJ]

I think Epcot is looking to bring more pre-schoolers into the park. I personally skipped this park last trip since I felt there wasn't enough to keep my 3yo & 1yo interested. With more rides/attractions for the kiddies, you'll get a more diverse crowd--even if they only stay for half the day. With the addition of the above attractions, I will def. include Epcot into my touring plans in Nov.

 

[MJMcBride]

I think Epcot is looking to bring more pre-schoolers into the park. I personally skipped this park last trip since I felt there wasn't enough to keep my 3yo & 1yo interested. With more rides/attractions for the kiddies, you'll get a more diverse crowd--even if they only stay for half the day. With the addition of the above attractions, I will def. include Epcot into my touring plans in Nov.

I'm going to have to disagree with you here fellow Jerseyian. I always thought Epcot did a decent job for the real young set, better than the Studios anyway. Many of the Future World rides are good as is Maelstrom and El Rio in Mexico. MGM is more geared to the teen set to me with ToT, Rock N Roll, and Star Tours as well as those boring adult things like Sounds Dangerous.

 

[jillmo1474]

I am sooo excited that they are finally getting rid of the whole entry into the living seas! I thought the whole museum/ movie area was boring.. I could have gone without it!

 

[mmiller711]

Oh, I would love to see this when it opens but we go Aug. 18 - 26 and it isn't looking good for a "soft" opening that early...do I dare to hope!?

 

[magicforever]

I am just excited that you can ride in the seacabs again. My husband and I have been to WDW three times. Everytime we went to the Living Seas I would say, "I remember riding under the water in these moving cars. That was really cool." I know that he thought that I was crazy, but know he knows I am not. Seacabs, shells, whatever. It is just nice to see another point of view.

 

[heartsy77]

I agree my family was disappointed with the movie!!! ZZZZZZZ!