Need urgent advice on copyright

[AndrewWG]

Everyone,

I need some advice on something. I went to get some pictures printed tonight at a local store. I will leave the name of it out of this discussion for now. After my pictures were printed, the salesperson had to show me a picture that her friend brought in to have printed. He supposedly let her have the prints. She then produces 2 calendar 8X10 prints with MY picture of a hawk that I took a couple months ago printed on them! I was not immediately sure if I was pi**ed or honored. I am still not sure, but I can say that I am not leaning towards honored. I was really mad when I thought about it more. I was asked several times by this employee if I actually took the photos I had printed (since this store has a STRICT copyright policy) then she produces MY picture! I don't mind that this person has my picture, but if it is that nice (and it is), where will this end? Will that person then be selling my picture? I just don't know how to approach this problem. Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

Andy

 

[bostran1]

I'm not a lawyer (yet) but in this sort of situation, I know what I would do. I would get the employee's name and write a letter to the the head of company that owns the store. I would CC every vice-president/director whatever who has anything to do with the company or the photography department. Maybe the store manager as well. Send the letter certified mail, return receipt. You should be able to find this information either on their website or your Secretary of State's website (since the corp. had to register to do business in the state).

Explain that you are a long-time customer (at least I think you are), and that in the past you have been happy with their company (if you have). Then write what happened, maybe include a small printout of the picture that the employee used for the calendar. Tell them that you understand the company's strict compyright policy and that you have abided by it and that you had hoped that they would follow it themselves. Definately tell them you are an unhappy customer.

Then, explain to them what you want them to do or what you think you are entitled to. Be clear and specific that you are not a happy customer and give them specific reasons why.

If I was in your position I would be pretty peeved that somone was making money off of my work without my permission. I wouldn't be upset that I wasn't the one making the money but that they used my work with no permission at all. Also, if this is a photo you took months ago (and presumably had developed months ago) I would be a little concerned that they had it sitting around still and employees had access to it.

The reason I recommend contacting the higher ups by mail is in my experience that is how things get done. No phone tag, no "misplaced" emails that garner no response. If the heads of corporations are directly notified of a problem and an unhappy customer, something seems to get done.

Most of all, be polite. Obviously, don't threaten any sort of legal action. Just let them know you think the employee was wrong and tell them what you want done about it so that you can remain a happy customer.

My girlfriend recently had some problems with alterations done at an apparel store (done poorly and costing more than the dress she bought), we did this and she got the full price of the alterations refunded.

Sorry this was so long! Good luck and let us know what happens.

 

[fitzperry]

Well, I think you can be both flattered that they thought so much of your picture, and pi**ed that they stole it--which is exactly what they've done. At any rate, I would certainly inform the manager (as well as someone higher up the org chart, depending on how large an operation you're dealing with). I'd probably tell them that I expect to be compensated for my work. I'm not sure exactly what I'd do beyond that. I suppose it would depend on their reaction.

 

[AndrewWG]

I guess I should be clear that I have no idea if this item was sold or not. It is NOT on display at the store. It was in a drawer behind the counter. It is my opinion that this was an employee who liked the photo and printed a couple of calendar prints with it on them. I don't think that it has gone further than that. They have access to the photo (I presume) because I never deleted it from my online photo album for the store. This is a BIG chain store. We all know them and probably drive by them everyday no matter where you live.

My thought is to go in tomorrow morning and have a sit down chat with the manager of the store. I don't want anyone fired over this, but I also don't want my photos pasted over every wall in my town without my permission. I personally want this to be written up by the manager as a complaint with their resolution and signatures. I don't think that is too much to ask, is it? Of course, I will NEVER user their photo services again.

Andy

 

[AndrewWG]

Well, I think you can be both flattered that they thought so much of your picture, and pi**ed that they stole it--which is exactly what they've done. At any rate, I would certainly inform the manager (as well as someone higher up the org chart, depending on how large an operation you're dealing with). I'd probably tell them that I expect to be compensated for my work. I'm not sure exactly what I'd do beyond that. I suppose it would depend on their reaction.

Yes, flattered was the word I was looking for. I am flattered, but more so pi**ed right now.

Andy

 

[Pea-n-Me]

You should be able to prove it's yours by bringing in a disc (when you see the manager/district manager/owner/whomever) that has others from the same period - you should be able to see the # sequence, similar shots, etc.

At the very least you should be assured the store will review its policies with its employees so it doesn't happen again to someone else. In reality, I wonder how much it does happen - what's to stop someone from taking photos they like from a batch they're developing? I don't know the answer.

From a different standpoint, congratulations on taking such a sought-after picture!

 

[bostran1]

My thought is to go in tomorrow morning and have a sit down chat with the manager of the store. I don't want anyone fired over this, but I also don't want my photos pasted over every wall in my town without my permission. I personally want this to be written up by the manager as a complaint with their resolution and signatures. I don't think that is too much to ask, is it? Of course, I will NEVER user their photo services again.

Andy

I think that is a reasonable plan. But if you leave unsatisfied, definately think about writing to the top (being from MA you should get the T reference!).

 

[AndrewWG]

You should be able to prove it's yours by bringing in a disc (when you see the manager/district manager/owner/whomever) that has others from the same period - you should be able to see the # sequence, similar shots, etc.

I do. I am making a disc right now with all 200 shots of the same bird in the same tree. I also have the print that they made for me if they need that too. I can also show that it is in my store photo album still.

At the very least you should be assured the store will review its policies with its employees so it doesn't happen again to someone else. In reality, I wonder how much it does happen - what's to stop someone from taking photos they like from a batch they're developing? I don't know the answer.

Just a guess, but I'm pretty certain that this happens all the time. I KNOW for a fact that it happened when I was in college, because an old friend of mine used to come in with many cool photos from his days in a one hour lab. I thought it was wrong then, just as much as I do now. Well, maybe even more now given the circumstances.

From a different standpoint, congratulations on taking such a sought-after picture!

Thanks! I love the picture, and I am going to eventually donate it to my DD's schools art auction so they can raise money for their art program. If everyone has it already, though, it won't sell for much!

Andy

 

[AndrewWG]

I think that is a reasonable plan. But if you leave unsatisfied, definately think about writing to the top (being from MA you should get the T reference!).

Oh, no doubt about it. I will certainly write to the top brass if need be. I have no problem with that at all. I just think that I need to get in there in the morning while the photos may still be there. Hopefully they weren't taken home tonight. That would be just my luck. I do have my DD who was with me and said "that looks like your hawk". That statement alone could scare the pics right out of the store, I would think. My answer to that was "kind of, but not really". I didn't want to act on it right away as I was too shocked. In hindsight, I probably should have, but I didn't want my DD involved in it either, so I 'm glad I didn't.

Andy

 

[MarkBarbieri]

You should always put a big old nasty watermark on your pictures before you take them in to get printed.

 

[ktulu]

I would ask for some sort of compensation, and contact $chains legal staff telling them that your copyright was violated and you have no way of knowing to what extent, but that you would like for them to tell you and then come up with some crazy price per photo and haggle from there

 

[AndrewWG]

You should always put a big old nasty watermark on your pictures before you take them in to get printed.

At least you guys can make me laugh about it!

Andy

 

[MICKEY88]

I do. I am making a disc right now with all 200 shots of the same bird in the same tree. I also have the print that they made for me if they need that too. I can also show that it is in my store photo album still.



Just a guess, but I'm pretty certain that this happens all the time. I KNOW for a fact that it happened when I was in college, because an old friend of mine used to come in with many cool photos from his days in a one hour lab. I thought it was wrong then, just as much as I do now. Well, maybe even more now given the circumstances.



Thanks! I love the picture, and I am going to eventually donate it to my DD's schools art auction so they can raise money for their art program. If everyone has it already, though, it won't sell for much!

Andy

I would do a screen capture of the online album just in case the store has access and can delete photos..


when I worked at Ritz camera our poilicy was very strict, we had to destroy all waste prints at the end of the day, occassionally we would have an awesome shot from a customer that we wished to use as a sample of our printing, we always got the customers permission..



good luck, be firm, but calm,

if they don't resolve the issue to your satifaction, or give you a hard time, tell them that PPA is always more than happy to supply their legal team to
take on copyright violation issues .

 

[MICKEY88]

You should always put a big old nasty watermark on your pictures before you take them in to get printed.

I agree 100% I have found this watermark to be a great deterrent to theft of my images..

 

[polkadotladybug]

is it a photo you have posted here? You just got me thinking - they are always asking for donations for stuff for my girls' school - I wonder if I have (or can take) photos that would be "auction quality" (meaning - others would be interested in buying LOL). Something to think about - I'd love to see your photo - feel free to watermark it of course - I'm just wondering what you would think others would buy - I've framed some of mine, but just small ones - mostly flowers. But that gets me thinking...hmmm. What can I do?

Of course - you probably have a much nicer and fancier camera and better photography skills than I, but I might be able to conjure up something - LOL!

 

[Amy]

Keep us posted on what happens, Andy! Congrats on the fact that they liked your photo well enough to keep a copy, but I can understand how you feel ripped off. Like Mickey88 said, they should have asked your permission before making extra copies. And you prob. WOULD have given them permission, but now it's the principle of the thing.

I wonder if this happens often at photo shops? I know if they're developing/printing photos and see porn or something illegal, they're supposed to notify the police. But stealing someone's photo like yours just isn't right.

And what about all of us, uploading our photos to Photobucket or wherever to post here? All the photos I've uploaded to Kodak to have prints made?

 

[Pea-n-Me]

This whole thing begs the question - are the photos we take actually copyrighted? I thought you had to apply and pay for a copyright.

 

[jann1033]

i've been wondering about that as well, on the bottom of my upload page where you can put your name it also has a space for copyright but i always thought you actually had to do something ( ???)to copyright something

 

[bostran1]

This whole thing begs the question - are the photos we take actually copyrighted? I thought you had to apply and pay for a copyright.

Actually, your works are automatically copyrighted when you create them and they are in a tangible form that can been seen by anyone (this includes things saved on a compute, like digital photos).

However, if you want to enforce your rights against a potential copyright infringer and receive damages, you will have to register your copyright with the US copyright office. But there is no time limit as to when you register I think. The statute of limitations starts on the year of creation, rather than registration. Also, if you register the copyright shortly after creating the work and before the infringment, you are able to get more damages I think (like attorney's fees and damages set out by law) instead of actual damages and profits.

Hopefully that was clear.

 

[bostran1]

I just checked the registration requirements on the Copyright Office's website and it looks like it costs $45 to get a copyright for a photo registered.