My Pop review 9-12 to 9-19

[minnie61650]

...I just think that Disney puts Wheelchair/ECV users in a hard place, becuase they are not really given the option of waiting in line... and I think most of them would be more than happy to wait in line and not have all the attention called to them that comes along with getting on a Disney bus in a chair of any kind. Also, on a recent trip, we saw a woman in an ECV who actually tried to wait in line.. she informed the bus driver when he pulled up that her family was in line and that she would be waiting for them to get to the front of the line. But, he just looked at her a little funny, and insisted, in a very polite way, that her and her family get on this bus. It was very strange. ....

I think it is much easier on the bus driver if he /she can load the ECV/WC user and his/her party on an empty or a partially full bus because of the room it takes to manuver the EVC/WC into the tie down area. That is most likely why the bus driver wanted to load her and her family first.

I am an EVC user and I also would much rather stay in the same line with the able bodied guests. I am glad that Disney has mainstreamed most of the ride/ attration lines so I can wait with everyone else.

It can be very nerveracking to try to backup an EVC onto the bus lift with all the guests in the bus line staring at me. I have heard some of the rude comments from some able bodied guests. And it does hurt my feelings.
Only my DH loads with me so he can help the bus driver tie down the EVC in a more timely manner. The rest of my family stays in the regular line and they too have heard heard the moans and complaints when I am loaded first.

-----------------------------------------------------------

After I became disabled and had to use an EVC at Disney I found a lot of guests stared me and made snide remarks that I was "cheating" because I was able to get up off the scooter and walk a few feet to get on a ride.

They did not know that yes, I do have limited mobility but it is very limited (iI have a spinal disorder and I can walk 50-100 feet before my legs would go numb and would buckle beneath me).

It really did sadden me that others who did not know my situation would judge me.

So I went home and did a little problem solving.

Now when I go to Disney I feel a little better because......

I found somthing that makes me more at ease using an EVC at Disney .....

I have a handicapped hang tag .(BTW in order to receive one in Michigan I had to take a form to my MD to fill out. They are not given to just anyone who asks for one.)

I took the hang tag and made a photo copy on a magnetic printer sheet.

I cut the tag out. Then I used a hole punch to punch holes in the 4 corners than used some DIS green curling ribbon to tie the hang tag to the basket of my EVC.

It just helpes me feel a little more comfortable.

It is kinda sad that I feel so judged by others I need to advertise my
disABILITY.

Have fun planning your next Disney vacation!

 

[SondraD11]

I'm also having a bit of trouble not taking this post personally. Yes, I'm fat but the reason that I'm considering an ECV for my December trip is that my stamina for a full day at the parks is not what it used to be after 15 months of treatment for breast cancer. One of the reasons that I don't want to rent an ECV is feeling that so many people will be judging me based on my weight. On the other hand, if I don't rent one, I will slow down my family (adult sons and daughter-in-law) with all the breaks I will need and also feel bad. On top of all that, I have another "invisible" handicap in that I'm basically deaf although I wear hearing aids and I use any captioning assistance available. Luckily, that assistance usually doesn't inconvenience other guests.

For me celebrating the successful completion of my cancer treatment and for most people, Disney is a dream vacation come true. It's too bad that real world prejudices have to be a part of the magical world we all love.

Sondra

 

[wishesdocometrue]

I just had to reply to this thread regarding ECV's and babies. My DD (26) and I were at POP the same time 9/12-16 and what I found more annoying than the ECV riders were parents with strollers. At night leaving the parks we had several parents wanting to leave their sleeping little ones in the stroller and board the bus that way. On night at Epcot we waited a good 5 minutes to board because the person at the front of the line was arguing with the driver..she did not want to wake her 4 year old to get on the bus, and I am talking yelling at the poor man. Finally people starting walking around her and by the time she and her husband got the child out of the stroller, folded it up (evidently that was the real problem they couldn't fold it!) and onto the bus..yup there were no seats. She had to put the toddler on the hump by the wheel in the front. Needless to say she was not happy..but she did get alot of smirks from those around her. Now let me also say that my family has been to disney many times since they were small and many times my kids fell asleep on the bus and yes the buses do get crowded (but we also live in NY and Disney buses I liken to our city bus in rush hour). Last week we left Fantasmic when it ended,about 9:30pm and was back in the POP food court eating ice cream by 10pm; another night We had dinner in Rose& Crown and watched Illuminations from there, walked to the entrance and was on the bus 5 minutes after getting in line. The Friday night of the Halloween party I think POP buses came so quickly that we had to run to make them..there was no line and this was right after the parade ended.To me I think the buses were better than last year and I do agree that they need a covering-- that 95 degree sun at 8am gets your day off to a bad start..granted they can't beat the walk from the Beach club or the monorail ride to the Poly but it is only 10-15min ride anyway. We were in the 50's lady building 1st floor end room around the corner from the pool. We had a 1 minute walk to the pool and about a 3 minute walk to the food court. The only time we saw it crowded was late at night when everyone came back from the parks. We did have some quick breakfasts there about 8am with no real wait and when we came back around 12-1pm for lunch...it was empty! We enjoyed it so much that I again booked the bounceback for next year...just have to love the free food!

 

[minnie61650]

I'm also having a bit of trouble not taking this post personally. Yes, I'm fat but the reason that I'm considering an ECV for my December trip is that my stamina for a full day at the parks is not what it used to be after 15 months of treatment for breast cancer. One of the reasons that I don't want to rent an ECV is feeling that so many people will be judging me based on my weight. On the other hand, if I don't rent one, I will slow down my family (adult sons and daughter-in-law) with all the breaks I will need and also feel bad. On top of all that, I have another "invisible" handicap in that I'm basically deaf although I wear hearing aids and I use any captioning assistance available. Luckily, that assistance usually doesn't inconvenience other guests.

For me celebrating the successful completion of my cancer treatment and for most people, Disney is a dream vacation come true. It's too bad that real world prejudices have to be a part of the magical world we all love.

Sondra

Sondra,

Please rent that ECV.
This is your vacation.
Make the most of it.


Here are some questions to ask yourself.
I read these on the disABILITIES board and I keep a copy in my file to remind myself it is my vacation and I want to make the most of it.

http://disboards.com/showthread.php?...9&page=1&pp=15

Still trying to accept that I have to have a ECV... .

Anita, welcome to disABILTIES!

I remember the first time I used an ECV at WDW. Judy told me it was a great relief for her since I did not have to stop every few hundred feet.

To really set your mind at ease, please ask yourself the following questions. Here are the suggested answers to go with them.

1. Are you disabled (even temporarily)? Yes.

2. Do the people you are travelling with, such as your family, know you are disabled? Yes.

3. Do you expect to meet anyone you know during this trip who may not know you are disabled. Probably No!

4. Do you expect to meet a bunch of people who you will probably never meet again in your life? Probably yes!

5. Is there any reason at all that you should care what these people think about you? Absolutely No!!

6. Will using a wheelchair or ECV make for a better vacation for you and your family? Absolutely YES!

-------------------------------------------------

Here ia another post I found on the disABILITES board:

I have a trip planned for August. I have been only a partial participant in many family trips and adventures due to stamina and distance issues.
Like you I feared what "others would think", my own expectations and self image as well as my families.

after visiting these boards and pondering it How exactly is my using a wheelchair or scooter bothering or taking away from anyone else??? How am I taking advantage? I still pay the same to get in, I still wait in the same lines, still need to get to fireworks early to find a spot..
maybe I don't know about some hidden "perks" of having a chair or scooter but as I understand thus far the only effect I will have is taking up a bit more space in line.
But I won't need that space on the park bench for 5 hours now so you may have a shady place to sit!!
If you can not participate in your family vacation without a chair,scooter or GAC then GET ONE!
These things are designed not as "extras" but to allow EVERYONE to experience the magic of disney.
It provides equal access and opportunity.
Wee! I am so excited my kids are laughing at me!

So do rent that EVC and have fun at Disney!

 

[kapoof]

minnie, i think it is terrible that you get rude comments as you board the bus! i can understand how uncomfortable it would make you feel having people watch you board and unboard. i think the ECV is is Godsend for most people. i do think they can be abused however, and some (not all) don't really need them. i am always polite to evc users...but i have seen many evc users fly right thru crowds and knock into people. if people need one i think they are truly helpful but if those who really don't are clogging up the system, and not being fair to those that do.

 

[disneydeb]

ok my opinion, i am a nurse in a nursing home, i have seen it all believe me i am 50 , i have seen people who generally need the ecv, and i have also had patients who were younger than i , that really do not need them and they are just fat and lazy, some of my fellow nurses will tell you that, they are the biggest whiners, they have no motivation, and they just want everyone to feel sorry for them, dont get me wrong i am fat too but with these people i am fat and stressed, they whine and whine and whine, i cant do it my sciatica hurts, blah blah blah, i tell them you know what my sciatica hurts too, but get up and exercise it out like i have to, and be on my feet for 8 hours catering to your every whim when i have 33 other patients who really need attention too, some of them are actually sick, so i can understand the op sounding off she wasn't targeting those with actual disabilities, she was targeting those who abuse it period!!!

 

[Jedi Master Gonzo]

so i can understand the op sounding off she wasn't targeting those with actual disabilities, she was targeting those who abuse it period!!!

I agree. The OP wasnt targeting true disabled ECV users. She was targeting the fat, lazy people. Granted, she could've worded her post a bit better or started a different thread about it.

I'm in the medical field myself. There are a lot of lazy fakers out there. I've even seen a truck that was a 4X4 that was lifted about 3 feet up.........and had disability tags.

Those that are legit and have true disabilities...............enjoy your Disney vacation. I do respect your disability and your right to have a vaction. If you need any help getting about, look me up.

 

[kapoof]

ok my opinion, i am a nurse in a nursing home, i have seen it all believe me i am 50 , i have seen people who generally need the ecv, and i have also had patients who were younger than i , that really do not need them and they are just fat and lazy, some of my fellow nurses will tell you that, they are the biggest whiners, they have no motivation, and they just want everyone to feel sorry for them, dont get me wrong i am fat too but with these people i am fat and stressed, they whine and whine and whine, i cant do it my sciatica hurts, blah blah blah, i tell them you know what my sciatica hurts too, but get up and exercise it out like i have to, and be on my feet for 8 hours catering to your every whim when i have 33 other patients who really need attention too, some of them are actually sick, so i can understand the op sounding off she wasn't targeting those with actual disabilities, she was targeting those who abuse it period!!!

well put disneydeb!

 

[MrsJackSparrow]

Regardless of why a person would be using an ECV, does an obese person have less of a right to enjoy their vacation than an person of normal weight? If using the ECV allows them more time in the park for which they paid the same as an normal sized person, what is wrong with that? Would you OP prefer to be on the bus with your family and then have to vacate the handicapped seating that you are in so that an ECV could load? When were you granted permission to judge?

 

[DAniece]

ok my opinion, i am a nurse in a nursing home, i have seen it all believe me i am 50 , i have seen people who generally need the ecv, and i have also had patients who were younger than i , that really do not need them and they are just fat and lazy, some of my fellow nurses will tell you that, they are the biggest whiners, they have no motivation, and they just want everyone to feel sorry for them, dont get me wrong i am fat too but with these people i am fat and stressed, they whine and whine and whine, i cant do it my sciatica hurts, blah blah blah, i tell them you know what my sciatica hurts too, but get up and exercise it out like i have to, and be on my feet for 8 hours catering to your every whim when i have 33 other patients who really need attention too, some of them are actually sick, so i can understand the op sounding off she wasn't targeting those with actual disabilities, she was targeting those who abuse it period!!!

Ditto, very well stated.
EG

 

[MiaSRN62]

I agree. The OP wasnt targeting true disabled ECV users. She was targeting the fat, lazy people.

Really ? But how can any of us judge and really tell who is being "fat and lazy" or whining about sciatica ???? My uncle had sciatica and it was so bad he needed medicine and physical therapy. I'm a nurse and suprised this comment came from another nurse. My uncle is the most fit 78 yo I know ! He plays golf 3 times a week....volunteers with a children's club....he's made the local papers several times in his community in FL for his volunteer work. Yet he lives with chronic moderate pain that makes walking for long periods (even more than an hour) very painful. So who are we to judge ? So sad. If you all can just look at a person in an ECV/wheelchair and deem them fat and lazy is just beyond me.........do you have x-ray eyes and can see into their body to know their afflictions ? Or do u have their medical record at your disposal ? Must be nice for some of you to be judge and jury.

 

[Jedi Master Gonzo]

Really ? But how can any of us judge and really tell who is being "fat and lazy" or whining about sciatica ???? My uncle had sciatica and it was so bad he needed medicine and physical therapy. I'm a nurse and suprised this comment came from another nurse. My uncle is the most fit 78 yo I know ! He plays golf 3 times a week....volunteers with a children's club....he's made the local papers several times in his community in FL for his volunteer work. Yet he lives with chronic moderate pain that makes walking for long periods (even more than an hour) very painful. So who are we to judge ? So sad. If you all can just look at a person in an ECV/wheelchair and deem them fat and lazy is just beyond me.........do you have x-ray eyes and can see into their body to know their afflictions ? Or do u have their medical record at your disposal ? Must be nice for some of you to be judge and jury.

Never said I was judging. Never said I was a nurse either. Just speaking from my experience.
Kudos to your uncle! My grandmother in law is 99 years old. Still drives. Goes to her hairdresser. Goes to her senior center for bingo and flirting. Just recently returned from train trip to Alaska. You would never know she is profoundly deaf.

Moral? You read into my post. I never said I can look at someone and know they are fat and lazy. I was just pointing out that there are some that are like that. I'm guessing you didnt see the bottom of my posting offering help to those that are legit.

 

[disneydeb]

well your uncle who is 78 is playing golf 3 times a week, guess what thats exercise or didnt you learn that in medical school, also i know your trying to be nice but as a nurse you would think that you could weed out the patients that are legit to the patients that are not, are you new? dont worry you'll be able to tell with experiance,

 

[maxiesmom]

i think alot of you are being unfair to the op. yes alot of people have disabilities, but some, you have to admit are just fat and lazy. she was calling those people out...i think a bus built to handle ECV's would be a great idea and more comfortable to everyone.

Yeah, they can have a seperate bus (after all, who wants to deal with these people?) and while they are at it, they can black out all of the windows so the rest of us don't have to even see them! That way we can all go about our lives without having to look at people who have mobility problems!

Just to clarify: That is called sarcasim.

The OP is free to express their opinion, and the rest of us are free to disagree with some of the judgements the OP made. As the Op is not a doctor, and did not bother to even talk to anyone in a scooter or wheelchair, how could they possibly back up their point of view? I find the comments about the fat, lazy people in the wheelchairs highly offensive.

 

[Jedi Master Gonzo]

as a nurse you would think that you could weed out the patients that are legit to the patients that are not, are you new? dont worry you'll be able to tell with experiance,

 

[MiaSRN62]

Jedi :Never said I was judging. Never said I was a nurse either.

To both Jedi and disneydeb....with your sarcastic comments about me being a nurse and what I learned etc. I never said YOU were a nurse Jedi.....I was responding to the fact that you sided with the opinions of disneydeb (who is a nurse) and agreed with all she had to say as well as the OP.

I was referring to the fact that Jedi AGREED with a nurse's comments---that would be you disneydeb. I feel you are making judgemental remarks/comments by assuming some people don't really need wheelchairs or ECV. To you and disneydeb.....how do you know who is faking and who is not ? What criteria to you use ? Just curious.

My point --which both of you completely missed---was that my uncle appears fit and gets excercise and tries and stay active----YET---he lives with pain. So, OUTWARD appearences can be deceiving.

Jedi : Moral? You read into my post. I never said I can look at someone and know they are fat and lazy.

But you and others are acting like you know what's going on with a person who might be "fat", "young" etc. You are automatically assuming a fat person in an ECV is lazy.......a skinny person could be too ya know ? But truthfully, both of them could have just had hip surgery...or have MS etc. Age/weight are all judgements some of you are making.

also i know your trying to be nice but as a nurse you would think that you could weed out the patients that are legit to the patients that are not, are you new? dont worry you'll be able to tell with experiance

No disneydeb, I'm not new.....been an RN for 17+ years. And I hope to never become as jaded and judgemental as you appear to be in your posts towards those in wheelchairs/ECV's. I just don't comprehend how you can spot a person in an ECV for all of 5 min in WDW and automatically KNOW they are fat and lazy ??? You and Jedi and some others lose me there.........I have a condition called Fibromyalgia. I live with chronic pain every day. I have never used a wheelchair or ECV but I have no idea what my future holds. Nothing about me on the outside would make anyone think or know I live in pain. But I sure would hate to be judged by some of the posters on this thread. I have learned very well to cover up and hide my pain.

It's funny.....came into this thread wanting to hear about the OP's POP experience as we will be checking in there on 9/27 and got sucked into this. I sure hope this thread is closed soon. It's really quite mean-spirited & judgemental...........

Quite frankly....I am sure there are fakers.....but how do we know for sure ? That is the moral of my point. When you spot someone on the bus or in the park for all of a couple minutes, can you really diagnose their medical condition with just a glance ? I don't feel the majority of people using the ecv's are fakers......not enough to be a huge issue.

 

[marianleah]

I, too, am a breast cancer survivor and am leaving in 15hrs to celebrate being a survivor! My stamina isn't nearly what it used to be and I gained over 40 pounds from the drugs I was given during chemo. I haven't been able to loose all of that weight yet. I won't be using an ECV, but I am sure I will walk a little slower and may take a little longer to get on and off the buses. I'm glad the OP has returned home, I wouldn't want her to have to wait on the fat, lazy woman who is taking so long to get on and off.

 

[sherry8253]

 

[vettechick99]

Hmm, we knew this would take a turn for the worse, huh? I think it was clear that the OP meant malingering ECV users - and they are out there. They openly post on these boards.

OP, I hate the WDW bus system with a passion. That is why we rent DVC points and stay at the BCV (studio is $120/night, no taxes). We walk to Epcot, boat to MGM and take our own car to DTD and MK. And next time when we take DD for the first time and have that stroller, we'll be extra thankful we made that resort choice.

Sorry you had a crummy experience with the bus system. I can understand your frustrations.

 

[SueM in MN]

First, about obesity...
Recent studies have shown that 32.9% of Americans age 20-70 are heavy enough to be considered obese. So, if you look at any 100 people at WDW, 33 of them are likely to be obese (BMI of 30 or higher), whether they are using ECVs or not.
People have also posted on this thread that they can "tell who the malingerers are".
We've run into some of those people who can tell who is "cheating" just by looking at them. Some have looked at my DD in her wheelchair and said "look at that cheater using a wheelchair" (loud enough for us to hear - obviously one of the points of saying it).
Their 'evidence' that she was 'cheating' was that she was sitting on a bench next to her wheelchair. Because they could see her on the bench, with her legs crossed, swinging her top leg, they concluded that she didn't need the wheelchair. What they didn't see was how she got onto the bench (I lifted her) or how her leg got crossed (she held onto her sock and dragged her leg over the other one to cross it). She actually owns 2 wheelchairs - a $12,000+ power one and a $8000+ manual one, but I'm glad to hear she may not need them any more since some people could look at her and decide she didn't (very heavy sarcasm here).

Users of wheelchairs and ECVs boarding before everyone else is not a priviledge. It is because it is easier to load a wheelchair or ecv when the bus has relatively few people on. If everyone else boards first, there is not as much room to manouver and some people may have to move (some of the back seats flip up for wheelchairs and ecvs to sit there.) If the person using an ECV or wheelchair is not boarded first, it will take longer to board them and tie the wheelchair/ECV down. Also, since there are only 2 wheelchair spots, there are only 2 chances for someone with a wheelchair or ECV to board that bus. They don't have the ability to choose any seat, just those 2.

This information is in the disABILITIES FAQs thread on the disABILITIES Board:
Can my whole party board with me?
If the bus has a lift, only the person with a wheelchair and one other member of your party may go on the lift.
As for the other members of your party, please be considerate of other guests who are waiting for the bus. In general, WDW considers a party of 6 (5 plus the person with a wheelchair/ECV) to be party. If there are few people waiting for the bus when you arrive with a party of that size or smaller, the bus driver may invite you to board at the back door after the wheelchair/ECV is loaded.
If your party is larger or you can see a long line of people waiting for the bus when you pull up, it's considerate have the other members wait in line for the bus or to wait for the next bus.
It will be much easier and less stress for everyone if you can avoid taking the buses at the busiest times (like right at park closing). Taking a leisurely stroll out of the park will usually help you avoid a long line at the bus stop.

If you get to the bus stop and see a long line, here are some considerate ways my family (SueM in MN) have used to handle it:
If you have a small party; keep track of the last person in line when you arrive in the area. Wait off to the side until you can see that party would get onto the next bus (you don't have to wait until they get to the door of the bus), then go to the wheelchair boarding area with your party .
If your party is larger, have the other members of your party get into line. When you can see that they would be able to get onto the next bus, then go to the wheelchair boarding area.

I DO HAVE TO ADD though, that on our trip last April, we were very considerate and DH, my MIL and my DD in her wheelchair boarded together. The rest of our party waited in line. When it was our turn to board, my sister, my mother, my older DD, my niece and I walked all the way to the back of the bus and still were able to get seats.
Despite that, we were 'entertained' by several riders (who did have seats, so I don't know why they were complaining) talking about why "THOSE PEOPLE" get to board first with their wheelchairs and how unfair it was that the wheelchair took up 2 seats. They didn't know that I was the mother of one of THOSE PEOPLE. It upset my older DD a great deal and my sister was ready to tell someone off (but we didn't).

I just filed it away in my mind as another experience with rude people who are tempting Karma. We have at least a couple each trip. You get to expect it, even though you never get used to it.