My husband almost beat someone's butt..

[OneLittleSpark]

Locolala, I'm so sorry you had this happen to you!! He tried to move your chair?! I use a wheelchair out and about in my day to day life, and I know how much of an invasion it is when someone touches your chair uninvited - and that's even when they're doing it to try and be helpful!

I've got Fibromyalgia, so completely understand how frustrating (OK, so this is a huge understatement, but I don't want to use the language that is running through my head, on this family website!) it is to be told that you don't 'look disabled'. I must confess, I've given up being nice to these kind of people, and am fully prepared to give them a very long-winded description of my condition (using education as punishment can confuse the heck out of people! ). I also have a line all ready prepared, in case I meet any jerks like this. You guys are all free to use it, if you wish: "I'm so sorry that my crippling pain is such an inconvenience to you; it must be so hard being you".

Sorry you encountered this ignorant, rude person on your holiday. Nobody deserves that

I'm not looking forward to this my upcoming trip. I plan on getting an ECV for when my back and left leg decides they had enough (i plan on parking it in the general facility and walk until I can't anymore). Wife will have to ride hers all day. But all I need is someone to say "hey I saw that guy walking earlier!" and wait for the domino effect...

BayouMickey, try not to worry too much about this. I know that on here you will hear a lot of the horror stories, like Locolala's, but they really are rarities. I've been to the parks a fair few times, and have had to use a wheelchair for at least some of the trip for the last 10 years or so (I have never walked around AK, so that will give you an idea of the timescale). I now use my own chair, but can still get up and walk to transfer to rides etc. I've hardly had any comments at Disney; it's more often in the 'real world' that I get this stuff.

What I have encountered a lot in Disney, is kind and caring people who go out of their way to give me a hand when I need it. Even something as simple as someone holding a heavy door for me, even though they're trying to marshal their excited kids at the same time, brings an extra bit of pixie dust to the day ! I've also found that decorating your chair / ECV / walking stick / walker etc. can get a lot of positive responses, and makes people smile at you more than they glare.

Remember, for every idiot you meet, you'll find at least 10 kind and caring people who will go out of their way to help you; I know it's hard, but try to focus on the 'good guys', not the 'bad' or downright 'ugly'!

You just have to have a spark, we Cast Members will do the rest if you let us. It's what we love to do.

MonorailGuy, it's you and other wonderful CMs like you that make Disney the magical place it is - without you guys, it would just be a place with a bunch of rides in it! I'm just so sorry you have to deal with idiots like this, sometimes; you really don't deserve it .

Wow Windjammermay, you've had some 'exciting' experiences, haven't you?! It's times like this when I wish I had a cattle prod: "try standing too close to me now!"

. OK, so I don't actually recommend this course of action, but it can be pretty dull having people's backsides shoved in your face all day!

The one I have always wondered about is the buses. I ask this question in all sincerity as I would like to know the reasoning behind it....

On the WDW buses, why do they not let everyone at a stop get off first before letting a wheelchair or ECV... Especially if the busses are uber-crowded and its packed in standing room only. To me, it seems like it would make more sense to get as many people off as possible to make it easier for the person in the wheelchair or ECV to manuever... this is why I think its logical for the bus drivers to let wheelchairs and ECVs ON first... less people so its easier to manuever. Just seems like when they have everyone piled in its pure torture for everyone involved...standing guests, the person in the ECV or wheelchair to have to wait... the person in the wheelchair is uncomfortable from all the sardined bodies and has to try and maneuver around all the standing people who are also very uncomfortable from standing and being packed in.

Does anyone know WHY Disney does it this way? It just seems to defy logic... but maybe there is a very good reason for it.

I've never seen this happen, but you're right, it is a weird way of doing it. The normal procedure is to have wheelchair users as first on, last off, for the very reason you said. As peemagg said, the only time I've ever known a wheelchair user to get off before others, is when the 'others' aren't getting out at that stop. I'm guessing the driver you had, had a good reason for doing this, but I couldn't tell you what that was, myself.

Wow, this is a long post even for me!

 

[merryweather20]

The one I have always wondered about is the buses. I ask this question in all sincerity as I would like to know the reasoning behind it....

On the WDW buses, why do they not let everyone at a stop get off first before letting a wheelchair or ECV... Especially if the busses are uber-crowded and its packed in standing room only. To me, it seems like it would make more sense to get as many people off as possible to make it easier for the person in the wheelchair or ECV to manuever... this is why I think its logical for the bus drivers to let wheelchairs and ECVs ON first... less people so its easier to manuever. Just seems like when they have everyone piled in its pure torture for everyone involved...standing guests, the person in the ECV or wheelchair to have to wait... the person in the wheelchair is uncomfortable from all the sardined bodies and has to try and maneuver around all the standing people who are also very uncomfortable from standing and being packed in.

Does anyone know WHY Disney does it this way? It just seems to defy logic... but maybe there is a very good reason for it.

I've never seen this done. The wheelchair user or ECV is always loaded first for the reasons you mentioned. However they always wait till everyone is off at a stop before unloading.

 

[KPeveler]

i think i actually would have requested the guy be removed from the park - touching a wheelchair is the same as touching a person without permission: assault. I would have requested that the CM remove the man immediately and not let him back in, to teach him a lesson!

or my fiancee would have decked him j/k, she is a former CM so knows the rules, but it would have been a close one!

 

[ntsammy5]

Your husband showed more restraint than I would have. Some people are real idiots. Sorry you had to go through that episode.

 

[yitbos96bb]

I have never seen them let a wheelchair or scooter user off first, unless it was a bus with multiple stops and the person in the wheelchair or scooter was in one of the first stops. In that case I would think that they would let off all for that stop first then the wheelchair or scooter.

When have you seen this practice? Most of the times the wheelchair or scooter is the last off the bus.

My Last two trips... Jan of 2007 and Dec of 2007. Everytime the ECV was first off... Really it only was an issue for all involved when the busses were crowded. Even the ECV people didn't like it.

 

[Eeyores Butterfly]

I am so sorry that happened to you. People like that really burn my butt. I'm glad the CM stood up for you and gave that guy what for.

Schmeck: That is a common protocol for most shows. In Philhar we have a special section of the lobby because the designated row has its own doors. It also helps to keep the people from being run over. People are totally oblivious- if it's not at eye level they will not see it and it can be dangerous. It is also hard to maneuver without hitting somebody in a crowd like that- especially if the wheelchair is rented and the person is not used to maneuvering it.

It makes sense to me that they would load parties with wheelchairs first. Believe me, it can take some creative maneuvering to keep families together and make the best use of your spots. You're right that the spots are at the top, but they are out of the way enough that once situation the person will not be a hindrance to traffic flow. Most shows load the people with wheelchairs first so they are not jostled/bumped/hurried, etc. It's easier to get everybody in place when other people are pushing and shoving.

I can understand the frustration for people waiting in line and seeing what they perceive is cutting on the part of the person using the wheelchair, but it really is the best way to do it.

 

[Schmeck]

Isn't it just as hard to get the people using wheelchairs and ECVs through the crowd though in the beginning? The OP mentioned being in the crowd and taken through it to go in first - that's just as much jostling and squeezing, maybe even more as people are ahead of them and not paying too much attention to what is going on behind them. I'm just thinking of the 'crowd mentality' and the difficulty in getting a large group of people to make a path open for others to get through. Doesn't make sense to me for it to be handled this way. As a PP stated, sounds like a poor design for Fantasmic, that's for sure.

 

[mom3sonstt]

Last year I was one of the "park it and walk til you can't" people. I don't recall hearing anyone say anything. I do have a very noticeable limp when I walk and I usually grabbed my cane just in case so that - and the fact that I had 4 noisy teenagers could have been a factor. This year, other than going in crowded counter service restaurants or shops I will probably stay on more than I did last year. Ironically - it isn't the limp that has put me on an ECV - I've had that all my life. Its one of the perks from dialysis that has me needing the ecv.

 

[disneydeb]

ya should have let your husband punch him

 

[stitchfan23]

I think there was an arrogance convention going on in Disney last week. I had to use a wheelchair due to having a slipped disk in my back and the arrogant people that I ran into (some literally) were unbelievable. I found though that it wasn't just with the wheelchair. The line cutting, the rude comments, the pushing and shoving was terrible. I saw one poor lady in an ECV just about get tipped over in the line for EE because some teenagers didn't want to wait behind her and tried to run past her. When she tried to avoid them she had to steer to the right and kind of went up on a banking and it just about tipped her over. DH was pushing me towards Toy Story at opening one morning and again 2 teenagers jumped in front of us and hubby clipped the one kid. A little further along a man jumped and I mean jumped right over my lower leg and the footrest to get in front of me. Well he was so close when he landed that his foot was actually under my footrest and when he tried to continue moving me slammed my footrest and jammed my leg up and jarred my hip. Luckily he hit my good leg because if he had hit my right foot my left foot would have ended up his ****! He just glarred back at us and never said sorry or anything like it was our fault. His heel must have hurt but he probably told his wife that a wheelchair ran him over.

We were waiting for a bus one night and a couple of ladies in ECV's pulled up so that they would get on the bus when it came in and some lady in line started yelling at them that they weren't in the parks anymore and weren't entitled to jump to the front of the line anymore. It was terrible. The thing that really upsets me about comments like that is that yes on some rides we did get on faster that those standing in the regular lines but on quite a few others if we had stayed in the regular line we would have been on the ride faster than at the wheelchair area. One of those was the safari. We waited 25 minutes to ride the safari after the weelchair cutoff so that they could fill the jeep (we didn't mind waiting). I did run into one CM who needed a little dixie dust sprinkled his way (everyone else was wonderful). We were waiting in line for a ride and he starts to ask the questions about can I transfer, walk a certain distance etc excpet he is asking my SIL. She didn't want to answer for me so I spoke up and started to answer his questions, he glared at me and continued to repeat the questions until my SIL answered him. It was really strange.

 

[Eeyores Butterfly]

Isn't it just as hard to get the people using wheelchairs and ECVs through the crowd though in the beginning? The OP mentioned being in the crowd and taken through it to go in first - that's just as much jostling and squeezing, maybe even more as people are ahead of them and not paying too much attention to what is going on behind them. I'm just thinking of the 'crowd mentality' and the difficulty in getting a large group of people to make a path open for others to get through. Doesn't make sense to me for it to be handled this way. As a PP stated, sounds like a poor design for Fantasmic, that's for sure.

In most shows (Philhar, Lion King, etc) the people are put into a separate queue before the preshow. In Philhar you go through the standby line, then split off once you get to the lobby. I can't speak for Fantasmic since I have never paid attention there. It does sound like a poor design based on the descriptions.

 

[SueM in MN]

My Last two trips... Jan of 2007 and Dec of 2007. Everytime the ECV was first off... Really it only was an issue for all involved when the busses were crowded. Even the ECV people didn't like it.

That is very strange.
We go twice a year and usually stay for 7-12 days each time, riding the bus almost every day with DD in her wheelchair. I have never seen the driver let the guests with ECVs or wheelchairs off first. We have never been let off before the other guests.
The only exception is when there are more than one stop at a resort and not everyone is getting off at that spot. But, even then, the other guests for that stop got off and then the guests with wheelchairs/ECVs.

We were waiting for a bus one night and a couple of ladies in ECV's pulled up so that they would get on the bus when it came in and some lady in line started yelling at them that they weren't in the parks anymore and weren't entitled to jump to the front of the line anymore. It was terrible. The thing that really upsets me about comments like that is that yes on some rides we did get on faster that those standing in the regular lines but on quite a few others if we had stayed in the regular line we would have been on the ride faster than at the wheelchair area. One of those was the safari. We waited 25 minutes to ride the safari after the weelchair cutoff so that they could fill the jeep (we didn't mind waiting).

We have had our longest extra wait for the Safari - 40 minutes.
I think one thing that has made people more rude is that they read things on places like this website where people post things like no one using ECVs or wheelchairs wait. And, many of them don't believe people like you (and those of us on this board) who post opposite experiences.
Sometimes those kind of threads come up once a week. There is one right now about buses on the Family Board.

In most shows (Philhar, Lion King, etc) the people are put into a separate queue before the preshow. In Philhar you go through the standby line, then split off once you get to the lobby. I can't speak for Fantasmic since I have never paid attention there. It does sound like a poor design based on the descriptions.

Sorry to hear about the OP's experience.
We had a scary experience at Fantasmic too in the handicapped area.

I think the answers to why this happened to the poster are related to 2 things.
1) Fantasmic used to be every night, but has been cut back to several times a week.
2) They went to the 10 pm show (the 2nd show of the night)
For the first show, they start opening up the theater to start seating people 1 to 1.5 hour before the show. That gives a fairly long time period to bring all the people into the theater. For the first show, there is a line of people waiting, but once the theater is opened, the line clears pretty quickly and the wait is pretty much just in a slowly moving line. The area available for going in is very wide, so the people waiting are not really crowded together that much. As people using wheelchairs and ECVs enter the queue, the CMs tell them to stay to one side. And, just past the area where strollers are left, CMs take the guests using wheelchairs and ECVs in and show them to seats.

As I read, the OP, their family went to the 10pm show, which was the last show. That is a totally different situation. The entry area that is used for the first show is divided in half, with one side for people coming in to the 2nd show and the other side for guests leaving. Since there is only half the space for waiting for the second show, it is more crowded. A lot of times, the 2nd show has not been as full, but if it is, that's a lot of people. Guests for the second show are held in that area until all the guests from the first show have left the theater and trash has been picked up from the theater.
So, I can see how there would be crowding. Being in a crowd with a wheelchair or ECV is especially hard because everyone you can't really see well from that height, so you can't see where you are going. It's uncomfortable for most people even when the crowd is orderly.
In the case of the 2nd show, the people who have been waiting are anxious to get in so that they can get the best seats. If there is a group of people with wheelchairs in one area, they may not be visible from the back of the crowd, so people might start pushing forward to fill what they see as an empty spot.

 

[yitbos96bb]

Maybe that's the case and it was a multistop or maybe It happened less than I thought it did and I'm remembering it wrong. I'll concede the possibility.

That is very strange.
We go twice a year and usually stay for 7-12 days each time, riding the bus almost every day with DD in her wheelchair. I have never seen the driver let the guests with ECVs or wheelchairs off first. We have never been let off before the other guests.
The only exception is when there are more than one stop at a resort and not everyone is getting off at that spot. But, even then, the other guests for that stop got off and then the guests with wheelchairs/ECVs.

We have had our longest extra wait for the Safari - 40 minutes.
I think one thing that has made people more rude is that they read things on places like this website where people post things like no one using ECVs or wheelchairs wait. And, many of them don't believe people like you (and those of us on this board) who post opposite experiences.
Sometimes those kind of threads come up once a week. There is one right now about buses on the Family Board.

Sorry to hear about the OP's experience.
We had a scary experience at Fantasmic too in the handicapped area.

I think the answers to why this happened to the poster are related to 2 things.
1) Fantasmic used to be every night, but has been cut back to several times a week.
2) They went to the 10 pm show (the 2nd show of the night)
For the first show, they start opening up the theater to start seating people 1 to 1.5 hour before the show. That gives a fairly long time period to bring all the people into the theater. For the first show, there is a line of people waiting, but once the theater is opened, the line clears pretty quickly and the wait is pretty much just in a slowly moving line. The area available for going in is very wide, so the people waiting are not really crowded together that much. As people using wheelchairs and ECVs enter the queue, the CMs tell them to stay to one side. And, just past the area where strollers are left, CMs take the guests using wheelchairs and ECVs in and show them to seats.

As I read, the OP, their family went to the 10pm show, which was the last show. That is a totally different situation. The entry area that is used for the first show is divided in half, with one side for people coming in to the 2nd show and the other side for guests leaving. Since there is only half the space for waiting for the second show, it is more crowded. A lot of times, the 2nd show has not been as full, but if it is, that's a lot of people. Guests for the second show are held in that area until all the guests from the first show have left the theater and trash has been picked up from the theater.
So, I can see how there would be crowding. Being in a crowd with a wheelchair or ECV is especially hard because everyone you can't really see well from that height, so you can't see where you are going. It's uncomfortable for most people even when the crowd is orderly.
In the case of the 2nd show, the people who have been waiting are anxious to get in so that they can get the best seats. If there is a group of people with wheelchairs in one area, they may not be visible from the back of the crowd, so people might start pushing forward to fill what they see as an empty spot.

 

[Eeyores Butterfly]

Fantasmic has always been only a couple of nights a week during the off season. I can't remember at what point they moved to every night, but I'm thinking it wasn't until mid May after schools let out, so this may not be a departure from normal procedure. It's the same thing with Spectromagic (I used to perform in Spectro). During the off seas we would only do the parade a few times a week and we may only have one parade a night. They tend to base these things on projected crowd levels.

 

[anewvance]

I totally feel for you, that man really had some nerve. When Jack has his brace on for 6 hours a day at Disney, I can say that no one ever complains about us using the GAC and handicapped entries... I mean this kid looks pretty pitiful and most people are just happy it's not their kid.

Of course you have to endure the "I can't believe that woman would bring her son to Disney World like that" comments which irk me to no end.

But then at night when he is done wearing the brace, I do still use the GAC because he has low muscle tone in many parts of his body, severe asthma and a immunity disorder.... I do get odd looks when I wheel the stroller through the lines at that point, but I don't let it bother me, it keeps my son safe and let's him enjoy Disney like a 2 year old little boy should.

 

[SueM in MN]

Fantasmic has always been only a couple of nights a week during the off season. I can't remember at what point they moved to every night, but I'm thinking it wasn't until mid May after schools let out, so this may not be a departure from normal procedure. It's the same thing with Spectromagic (I used to perform in Spectro). During the off seas we would only do the parade a few times a week and we may only have one parade a night. They tend to base these things on projected crowd levels.

I know there was a change starting January 2009 about the hours. There was a lot of discussion on the Theme Parks Board about cutting back of the number of nights it is performed and how that would impact the crowds, so I think it had actually been every night all year for at least a couple of years (at least until Jan 2009, when the schedule changed to less often). If it wasn't every night to start with, I wonder if they had added shows when the Fantasmic dinner shows became popular.

Up until this March, it's always been every night when we have been at WDW, but we go in the Spring during the least busy parts of Spring break and in the fall during the Food and Wine Festival, so maybe those are busy times. I do know last fall when we were looking when to go, the DIS site's calendar had one show of Fantasmic every night for all of September and October, with 2 shows a night on the weekends or holidays.

Spectro was always only on the weekends/busy week nights when we have gone in the fall, so we've usually only had one or 2 chances to see it per trip.

 

[HonnyDipp]

I am suffering from a rare muscle disease, I'm learning how to walk all over again. I'm in remission now, getting stronger every day! To look at me, I look completely healthy, I just can't walk very well. So when we went last November I was in an ECV. I went to WDW with my parents and my 3 children. Bording the busses was the hardest part of our trip. Especially when the busses were already full. That meant some of the people had to get up and move so I could board the bus. One night we were leaving MK. The bus pulled up, when the ramp lowered, I heard the driver tell a woman she would have to move because he had to board a chair. She and her husband started yelling because they had sleeping children in their laps. Well, I didnt worry about it, I also had 3 tired kids, you do what you have to do you know? So I boarded the bus. The woman had a collasped stroller in the aisle. I asked her to move her stroller, she mumbled something under her breath. I turned my head to look at the driver, he was busy trying move things out of the way to lock my chair, so I knew I would have to handle this chick. So, I told her, "Lady, if you want to keep me from raming that stroller up your a$$ you will move it now!" I had also been in the parks all day, I wasnt dealing with this broad. It was either me or her. So, she moved the stroller, she was still mumbling under her breath. Her husband was now running his mouth. So I turned to my dad and let him know that we were having trouble. My dad, all 6'8 inches tall made his point clear. Once they saw where the heavy voice came from, we had no more trouble from. We were there for 6 days. That was the only problem I had with the ECV.

 

[Eeyores Butterfly]

I know there was a change starting January 2009 about the hours. There was a lot of discussion on the Theme Parks Board about cutting back of the number of nights it is performed and how that would impact the crowds, so I think it had actually been every night all year for at least a couple of years (at least until Jan 2009, when the schedule changed to less often). If it wasn't every night to start with, I wonder if they had added shows when the Fantasmic dinner shows became popular.

Up until this March, it's always been every night when we have been at WDW, but we go in the Spring during the least busy parts of Spring break and in the fall during the Food and Wine Festival, so maybe those are busy times. I do know last fall when we were looking when to go, the DIS site's calendar had one show of Fantasmic every night for all of September and October, with 2 shows a night on the weekends or holidays.

Spectro was always only on the weekends/busy week nights when we have gone in the fall, so we've usually only had one or 2 chances to see it per trip.

I did CP's in 04, 05, and 06 (leaving Jan 07) and all three times during the off season Fantasmic! might only be two or three times a week. This was even with the dinner packages. Most people don't go during the off season (hence off season). If I remember correctly, this would typically be in late Jan to mid February or early March, then again between the spring break and summer crowds, and then again in the fall.

It often kept a similar schedule to Spectro. I wish they had Spectro every night. I had so much fun performing in that parade, and for those of us who performed in the 3:00 parade it helped to give us some more hours. There's just so much stuff that goes into both Spectro and Fant that it is just not practical to run them every day during the off season.

 

[SueM in MN]

I did CP's in 04, 05, and 06 (leaving Jan 07) and all three times during the off season Fantasmic! might only be two or three times a week. This was even with the dinner packages. Most people don't go during the off season (hence off season). If I remember correctly, this would typically be in late Jan to mid February or early March, then again between the spring break and summer crowds, and then again in the fall.

I was curious about the Fantasmic dates since I remember it being always being every night and there has been a lot of discussion on the Theme Parks Board about what 2 nights a week would mean as far as crowds. That didn't make sense to discuss if it always went to 2 nights a week during the slow times (like Spectromagic or the Electric Light Parade before it did); people would just talk about what happened the year before when it did that.

Here is something from AllEarsnet from 1998, announcing the beginning of Fantasmic. The article says it was a 7 night a week show when it started. (It's the next to the last article).

You can look at the 2008 schedules that are still posted on the internet and see that it was every night in 2008. It was every night in 2008 and then the switch to several times a week began in January 2009.
Here's a link to an article from July 2008 that talks about it being cut from a 7 day a week show to twice a week starting in January 2009.

So, I think you are mistaken about Fantasmic having been less than every night before January 2009.

 

[Eeyores Butterfly]

Maybe my memory is bad. Joanna and I are talking about it right now and she thinks it was a only a few nights a week during the off season. I wish I had access to some of my old information pamphlets they put out every week. I'm genuinely curious now.