My FP+ Park Strategy WILL SAVE ME ALMOST $20,000!!!

[Shaden]

Surprised to see that a thread on theme park planning and strategy get moved to the Theme Park Community graveyard for reason: "Not Planning"

Seems to be a new approach by the mods perhaps ... though your post was clearly a strategy ... which is interesting.

 

[Laketravis]

This thread had over 6,000 views in less than 24 hours. I think people were interested in it, so I've started a new one in an attempt to focus strictly on theme park strategy and planning.

 

[flicx]

Seems to be a new approach by the mods perhaps ... though your post was clearly a strategy ... which is interesting.

They buried my poll also. Don't like the new approach. It seems to favor only good things being said about Disney.

 

[Cormoran]

They buried my poll also. Don't like the new approach. It seems to favor only good things being said about Disney.

I can't believe that anyone who doesn't agree with a post can report it and it's moved. It does feel an awful lot like censorship in favor of Disney

 

[Angel Ariel]

Are we really back to "if you don't like FP+, you just don't like change"? seriously?

 

[mom2rtk]

Are we really back to "if you don't like FP+, you just don't like change"? seriously?

And this surprises you?

I actually thought this was a helpful and interesting conversation. I hate that's where it ended up. Yet again.

Seems odd though that in a thread about changing one's touring strategy, the accusation would be that one just doesn't like change.

 

[wisblue]

Under FP+, you can guarantee yourself rides on headliners months in advance. But with tiering and ride reallocation, you cannot ride headliners as often as you used to, assuming that what you are used to is constant headliners. If you are in the "I only rode Test Track once per day anyway, so FP+ hasn't hurt me" crowd, then none of this has any meaning. But if you were in the "my trips to Epcot were not complete unless I rode Test Track 4 times a day" crowd, then there is no question that FP+ has changed the game. So your first statement..."under FP+ you can no longer enjoy the type of WDW vacation that you got used to under the old FastPass system" becomes true for that person. So they adapt and find a new way to enjoy WDW, using a system that works quite well at doing what it is supposed to do, making your second statement..."the new system works very well" equally true. Why do so many people have a hard time understanding that FP+ really has changed the way headliner commandos enjoy the parks? That is an intended consequence. Disney intentionally built a system that discourages, if not obliterates, the ability to ride headliners over and over again, leaving other guests with no opportunity to experience those attractions without huge waits. And when someone points out that the intended consequence is actually coming to fruition, some FP+ supporter has to chime in and say: "No it hasn't". But if you love the new system, you should love it for all of its consequences, and one of those consequences is ride redistribution. Take from the commandos. Give to the leisure crowd. It was intended to do this, and it is doing it. The OP is now positing a way to enjoy WDW under new and different circumstances. Would I want to ride 3 or 4 rides a day and call it quits? No. But I have no problem with anyone who wants to do that, especially if they have the luxury of multiple weeks to enjoy WDW. Heck. I have a brother who used to work there and he did that all the time. Go to park. Ride a few rides. Leave. In some circles, that was an envious life. The OP says that he is going to try it and he is called everything from illogical to idiotic.

I think you made a couple of important points here, and I have highlighted them.

First, I have always recognized that FP+ makes it more difficult, if not impossible, for people to experience the most popular attractions multiple times with short waits every time. Therefore, I understand why the guests who like to do that are not happy with the changes that FP+ has brought about.

Second, I completely agree that this redistribution of FPs for the most popular attractions was absolutely an intended consequence of FP+. I do disagree with referring to the guests who are receiving the benefits of FP+ as "the leisure crowd". A lot of the people who prefer FP+ like to enjoy a lot of attractions; they just are satisfied doing as many things as possible once. I put myself into that category. And I think a lot of first time and infrequent visitors are the same way. They want to enjoy as many things as possible ONCE on their trips, and that may include some of the minor attractions that some commandoes have shrugged off as too dull to warrant their time, in part because they have done them several times on previous visits.

While I recognize that the headliner commandoes do not like FP+, and why, I think it would be helpful if they would recognize that they represent a pretty small percentage of all WDW guests. The simple math of the capacity of the most popular attractions tells us that not very many guests can do one ride 4 times in one day. Using the numbers that someone else posted a week or two ago, the average daily attendance at Epcot is about 30,000 and the total capacity for Soarin and Test Track is about 15,000 each. If just 10% of all guests ride TT 4 times, that will gobble up 80% of the ride's capacity for the day, leaving just 3,000 rides for the other 27,000 guests. If 25% of the park's guests ride twice each, that would exhaust the entire capacity for the day.

So, while I can understand that guests who are used to getting this many rides on certain headliners in a day are unhappy, I always have to chuckle when they suggest that their dissatisfaction is going to lead to lean times for Disney. I think Disney has made a very sensible decision to create some dissatisfaction for a very small percentage of its guests in exchange for greater satisfaction for a much larger number. For every guest who is upset that they can only get one FP for TT and Soarin, there are several times more than that who are glad to have one more than they found themselves with before. There are also those who will like being able to pick the return time for their FP instead of relying on what happens to be available when they arrive at a FP distribution point. And, I suspect that Disney also is banking on the fact that a lot of those disgruntled commandoes will not abandon WDW completely. This thread offers pretty good evidence of that. If those guests cut back on their Disney spending, or even cut it out completely, it will not amount to much in Disney's grand scheme of things.

I have no real comment on the underlying premise of this thread other than to observe that a strategy that requires two weeks in the Orlando area and an annual pass is not going to be a practical option for very many guests who don't have the luxury of the time and/or the money to pull that off. If it works for the OP and anyone else, good for them.

Maybe now that I have made my FP+ selections for a more traditional weeklong trip over Easter (April 4-11), I should offer some suggestions for how people can use FP+ to do every major attraction in the parks at least once (and some more than once) in just one week, with one day at Universal thrown in for good measure. Yes, doing that will require getting to the parks early on at least a few days, but during those holiday times that has always been important.

 

[Planogirl]

This is exactly what Disney wants people to do IMO...spend less time in the parks and more time everywhere else...onsite of course

For us, I do not buy airfare to Orlando of all places to do anything but go to theme parks. There are far more scenic places, many nearby, where I can go to swim, golf or shop.

And then, like you said, I am always doing a price-per-day calculation in terms of value.

People might just discover how many lovely resorts are close to WDW and also how many fun things someone can find to do in Florida.

Seriously, if you have done nothing but WDW vacations for 40 years, you are so far out of the median that losing that small amount of business won't amount to half a penny for Disney. They only had FastPass since 1999. What the heck did you do before that?

It is amusing to see people basically taking their proverbial ball and going home in a tantrum over FastPass changes. Way to look grown up.

Grown up is not attacking people just because they're trying to do something a different way. IMO of course.

Yep. This is the adaptation that everyone's been talking about. If you love WDW, but don't like (or even hate) FP+, you basically have 3 options:

1. Continue to go as you normally would, but most likely spend your trip frustrated and angry.
2. Adapt your WDW vacation to make the system work better for you.
3. Don't go anymore.

As I see it, Lake is choosing Door Number 2. I think it's a good choice and I'll be interested to see how it works out.

I was ready for #3 but I'm liking #2 more and more. That is at least until our next trip.

 

[Planogirl]

This notion of hating change doesn't make sense to me. Isn't it possible that most people just don't like what they see as bad changes? Some could be accused of just loving everything no matter what happens but that's unrealistic IMO.

 

[Laketravis]

...I have no real comment on the underlying premise of this thread other than to observe that a strategy that requires two weeks in the Orlando area and an annual pass is not going to be a practical option for very many guests who don't have the luxury of the time and/or the money to pull that off.

Apparently some made that mistaken assumption. So I've tried to make it clear in the new thread:

Objective: Optimize a touring plan that makes maximum use of FP+ and park time at minimal cost.

Description: This will be a 7 day plan that will utilize park choice, FP+ availability, high crowd days, and additional off-site options to increase vacation yield.




.

 

[SmithSmith]

It seems to me the reason this thread would be moved is because under the guise of "strategy", it really was just someone announcing that they're no longer taking Walt Disney World vacations, and instead just taking trips to Central Florida.

 

[JimmyV]

I think Disney has made a very sensible decision to create some dissatisfaction for a very small percentage of its guests in exchange for greater satisfaction for a much larger number. For every guest who is upset that they can only get one FP for TT and Soarin, there are several times more than that who are glad to have one more than they found themselves with before.

I don't disagree with anything you said, especially the quoted passage. And just as the small percentage (10% according to Pete?) of commandos should understand your position, the other side should acknowledge that FP+ really does have a negative impact on some touring styles and it is not just idle whining. You and some others get it. Others think that the complaints are just sour grapes without foundation.

 

[Laketravis]

It seems to me the reason this thread would be moved is because under the guise of "strategy", it really was just someone announcing that they're no longer taking Walt Disney World vacations, and instead just taking trips to Central Florida.

Not at all. You don't think discussing how to accomplish as much as possible at a WDW park in the shortest amount of time possible at the lowest cost possible isn't a strategy? I suppose if you are perfectly content with the way you are doing something you'll never understand why someone wouldn't do it exactly the way you do. But it wasn't a guise, it wasn't an announcement about no more WDW vacations. I think the ones who it can help are readily identified by the comments to that effect.



.

 

[wisblue]

Apparently some made that mistaken assumption. So I've tried to make it clear in the new thread:

Objective: Optimize a touring plan that makes maximum use of FP+ and park time at minimal cost.

Description: This will be a 7 day plan that will utilize park choice, FP+ availability, high crowd days, and additional off-site options to increase vacation yield.

.

I don't think it was a mistaken assumption because you have said in the past, and the first post in the thread starts with the premise, that you have extended your trips to two weeks because you think it is necessary to visit that long to do everything you want to do at WDW.

I haven't seen the other thread you're referring to, but if you are now offering suggestions for how to maximize the value of a WDW while only spending one week in the Orlando area, I think that would be of interest to more guests planning their trips.

 

[SmithSmith]

Not at all. You don't think discussing how to accomplish as much as possible at a WDW park in the shortest amount of time possible at the lowest cost possible isn't a strategy? I suppose if you are perfectly content with the way you are doing something you'll never understand why someone wouldn't do it exactly the way you do. But it wasn't a guise, it wasn't an announcement about no more WDW vacations. I think the ones who it can help are readily identified by the comments to that effect.



.

I think what you don't realize is that: accomplishing as much as possible, in the shortest amount of time possible, for the least possible money is how MOST people already vacation! This is nothing new to us!

 

[Laketravis]

I don't think it was a mistaken assumption because you have said in the past, and the first post in the thread starts with the premise, that you have extended your trips to two weeks because you think it is necessary to visit that long to do everything you want to do at WDW.

I haven't seen the other thread you're referring to, but if you are now offering suggestions for how to maximize the value of a WDW while only spending one week in the Orlando area, I think that would be of interest to more guests planning their trips.

Yeah, sounds like you haven't caught up yet. While I will have the opportunity to BE in Orlando for two weeks, the exercise is based on 7 days and the principles are intended to be applicable to visits of shorter length. In fact, the shorter the visit the more beneficial the impact should be.

 

[Laketravis]

I think what you don't realize is that: accomplishing as much as possible, in the shortest amount of time possible, for the least possible money is how MOST people already vacation! This is nothing new to us!

That's not news to anybody. Feeling like you haven't been able to accomplish that is. And there are apparently others who feel that way.

 

[wisblue]

I don't disagree with anything you said, especially the quoted passage. And just as the small percentage (10% according to Pete?) of commandos should understand your position, the other side should acknowledge that FP+ really does have a negative impact on some touring styles and it is not just idle whining. You and some others get it. Others think that the complaints are just sour grapes without foundation.

I think it would be nice too if some people who dislike FP+ would recognize that someone might prefer FP+ to paper FP without being paid by Disney to express that opinion.

If you are getting that 10% number from the poll in which 10% of respondents said they hate FP+, I'm not sure that's the right conclusion. Putting aside the unscientific nature of any poll like that, there are people who dislike, or even hate, FP+ for reasons that are based as much or more on the amount of planning involved to take maximum advantage of it than the fact that it reduces the number of rides they can do. I really think that the percentage of all guests who are not satisfied unless they ride a certain attraction 3 or 4 or more times in a day is a lot lower than 10%. I also think that the percentage of people who are regular posters on the Dis that fall into this category is a lot higher than the percentage of all guests.

 

[JimmyV]

Using the numbers that someone else posted a week or two ago, the average daily attendance at Epcot is about 30,000 and the total capacity for Soarin and Test Track is about 15,000 each. If just 10% of all guests ride TT 4 times, that will gobble up 80% of the ride's capacity for the day, leaving just 3,000 rides for the other 27,000 guests. If 25% of the park's guests ride twice each, that would exhaust the entire capacity for the day.

I do have to comment on this. The math never works because FP- was regulated and limited so FP commandos could never monopolize the ride's entire capacity. And commandos don't wait 80 minutes for rides. Put another way...no one who ever got into the SB line at Test Track or Soarin' at 7:00 pm was ever turned away. So the idea that under the old system people were being denied the opportunity to ride headliners because other people were riding 4 times doesn't hold. No one has ever posted here that they could not ride a headliner because there was no capacity for them. Show up. Get in line. Done.

As for the 10%, it was said sarcastically. The percentage is utter nonsense.

 

[JimmyV]

I think what you don't realize is that: accomplishing as much as possible, in the shortest amount of time possible, for the least possible money is how MOST people already vacation! This is nothing new to us!

It may not be new, but is a strategy. As opposed to other threads in this zip code like: "Name A Ride That Starts With The Letter A".