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[Nancyg56]

If I am textbook something it makes me feel better that I am not alone I guess. I know I should have followed up with the therapy back a few months ago. I just got the thing that "you are clearly depressed". I guess I was kind of arrogant because I told the therapist I need a good lawyer more than a good therapist. I have been so obsessed with this whole thing for so long I guess that I forget that I come off as a ranting, raving lunatic.

No, not arrogant, just invested in an attorney to get you out, even though people who were trying to help knew you need to be healthy first. The truth is that you are looking for an easy way out, and having him placed with you in charge of his finanaces see,s to be that way out. It is not going to happen. If what you say is true, he has his sister managing his finances, you can take it to the bank you will not gain control in a divorce. If you feel better because you are in the same boat with people who have locked themselves into relationships that are so unhealthy...well mission accomplished.Until you take responsibility for your own isses, you will never be able to manage anything or anyone else.

OK Goofy Disney Dad... yes it is a sounding board, yes I plan to do something. I started this thread because I was desperate. I was never even clear to myself what I hoped to accomplish, maybe getting some of this off my chest, some way to gain permission and approval for ending my marriage.

What if YOU were in a situation where you felt hopeless? You didn't know who to talk to? Loved ones give you conflicting advice. The people you turned to for help completely abandoned you and you find out they have been doing some horrible things. Just curious, where would YOU turn?

I can tell you exactly what has happened with your support group. They got fed up. You changed your ID here because people here determined that you are not really looking to make changes, you want validation that you are the good guy and your husband is the bad guy. In real life, the people who you probably turned to daily are exhausted. They cannot or will not continue to be drawn into your drama. Years ago, many years ago, I went to a marraige counselor looking for him to say "Oh poor you! Drop that jerk and move on." Nope. he told me that the both of us were problems, and that before he could even begin to help in our marraige, we needed to work on ourselves. Best advice ever! WE both took it. I am eternally grateful that he was blunt enough and honest enough to make sure I owned my own responsibilty in the mess we had made of our marraige. You are not there yet, and if this entire thread is any indication, you won't be there tomorrow. You will still be blaming everyone else for your life, and everyone will continue to run for cover when they see you coming.

Any suggestions?

I have talked to friends and family, I either get the "I don't believe in divorce" song and dance or "get out and don't look back". Yes I am conflicted, however even rats know when to abandon a sinking ship (or so I have heard).

No, you probably have not even heard the advice to go to a good therapist and fix yourself. You cannot make your friends and family responsible for the roadblock YOU have created. I am not going to tell you to stay or to get out of this marraige, that is for you to decide. I still believe that your family has tried to help and they have given up, and I believe tht his family is not responsible for fixing what seems to be a cluster. I would nto get involved in the middle of the two of you either.

You depend on these people to help and they won't.

"This facility doesn't release somebody until they and the family are comfortable"... His sister, brother in-law and I all protested. In fact he himself said he needed more time in rehab.

They released him anyway.

We all have told you.....as long as you are there picking up the pieces, he will be released into your care. You were at the Dr with a man you say purposely soiled himself, and you did not put your foot down, tell the Dr. exactly what happened and ask for intervention. You left only when he "instructed" you to do so.

The next time he refuses to get off the couch, he soils himself, he does anything that allows for a 911 call, make the call. And then be very specific when you tell the medical personel that he is now on his own. Keep him, release him. You cannot care for him any longer because you no longer live there. But whatever you decide to do, own it and stop blaming everyone else for the decisions that you ahve made that got you to where you are.

 

[SirDuff]

It really pains me to see a human being suffer like he has. I also know that it is his choices that led him to this point. The years of ignoring his condition, the fact he would NOT stop smoking. If ever somebody has brought this stuff on themselves, he has. It is just so hard to see. It is painful to look at. It is so hard to imagine somebody who was so strong and all, reduced to what he is now. He got there himself.

The sad thing is that you can't/won't see that this paragraph also describes you.

 

[Skywalker]

Well I, for one, am not so sure the OP is abused. My take on it is, she is miserable being a caretaker, he is miserable being a patient, they fight a lot and are mutually toxic. If the OP simply leaves under these conditions then she is afraid of being branded a horrible wife who abandoned her sick husband. However, if she paints this all as being intentional on his part, and him being an abusive disgusting jerk, a-ha-! All of a sudden she is perfectly justified in leaving and no one would blame her. She gets to get out with her reputation intact. And if she stays, she is a long-suffering saint! Win-win for her, so no rush to actually make a decision.

OP is not isolated. In fact she is the one with all the power.

So that is my take and now I will think give up on this manipulative narrative and join the other fine folks before me who are now "outta here".

 

[kaytieeldr]

I looked into legal separation to separate the finances... the lawyers scoffed at that one. They said a legal separation in this state (which is very rare anyway) will keep the finances tied together anyway. So that option is out the window.

I am not saying I am without fault... yes in fact this is my 2nd marriage and I am obviously not good at this marriage thing. My first divorce was out of absolute immaturity on both our parts. If either one of us had acted like an adult we would still be married. The things we were fighting about were so silly and we both need our butts kicked. I will be happy to admit I was being young and stupid. It was a short marriage, we didn't have anything to divide, it was a very simple thing to get it undone. (as simple as it could be).

"Illinois law recognizes legal separation, although not all states do. Legal separations are somewhat rare in the state, however, because the procedure, expense and outcome are almost identical to those of a divorce. The predominant difference is that with a separation, you’re still legally married, and with a divorce, you are not."

People choosing divorce over legal separation is the only reason it's rare.

 

[Dawnlight]

I'm guessing you were talking more about depression (and even that's not always the case), but bipolar disease is not something that's always within one's control. (In fact, efforts at self-control are often disastrous.) Hopefully with psychiatric care and ongoing evaluation and med adjustment, it can be managed. But even with good care and follow up there can be highs and lows, and occasional setbacks.

No, I'm talking about a wide variety of mental illnesses, bi-polar included. I never implied that "controllable" meant self-control; you assumed that. When I speak of an illness being controllable I'm referring to an assortment of pharmaceutical and therapy-based management. This man is not taking control of his illness and the end result is that the wife needs to deal with the unbearable fallout. I understand that even with those there can be problems, but it doesn't seem to me that he's taking any responsibility for his illness and it's management. That's on him fully, not on her.

It's no different that someone diagnosed with ADHD and given meds to control it, but refuses to take them, yet expects the wife and other family members to shoulder the burden. It's no different than a diagnosed schizophrenic that has meds and doesn't take them, yet expects family to be put in harm's way due to violent tendencies. The patient needs to control, to every extent possible, their own illnesses.

 

[NewRVLady]

And where will you be a year from now. That is what matters.

Exactly a year ago she posted a similar thread- but the situation sounds much worse now

 

[lustergirl]

This is one of the saddest threads I've read in a while.
Sad if it's true...Same if it's not.

I wonder if it is all true. The OP is a desperate individual if she puts up with all of this. Disgusting to say the least.

 

[sunshinehighway]

I wonder if it is all true. The OP is a desperate individual if she puts up with all of this. Disgusting to say the least.

I think it's mostly real. From my limited experience with people in these type of toxic codependent relationships, what she's saying sounds familiar.

 

[lustergirl]

Yes it is real. The advice is being taken in. I am definitely going to seek my own help, but I just feel as if I need to get him pointed in the right direction first.

I find it very hard to let go, it is the small things every now and then that make me feel like there is love still there. I have issues, believe me I do and they need to be addressed and treated. I find it incredibly hard to just leave him, I really do. I am not saying that I cannot, I am just finding it really difficult. It's like you see that thing he got you, or he will say something that makes you feel like the days of old for just that split second you remember why you married him in the first place. I am way too sentimental I know.

I think this is pathetic. All of the abuse and nasty disgusting behavior he projects onto you is unbelievable. Grow a backbone and get out!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[lustergirl]

I think it's mostly real. From my limited experience with people in these type of toxic codependent relationships, what she's saying sounds familiar.

In my line of work I have seen some disgusting things and behavior but this takes the cake. I work in law enforcement.

 

[sunshinehighway]

In my line of work I have seen some disgusting things and behavior but this takes the cake. I work in law enforcement.

I wasn't clear. I didn't mean what she's saying about his behavior. I was talking more about the way she's coming off and the things she's saying about her situation and the way she is stuck because she refuses to do anything to change it.

 

[Frozen72]

delete

 

[lovemygoofy]

So this is my interpretation of all the drunken ramblings from last night. She wants to be the "hero" who doesn't just leave a newly handicapped guy. She doesn't want the judgments or comments. She is going to "save him" with a facility and a good doctor and then walk away. IT IS NOT GOING TO HAPPEN.

OP, you HAVE to understand something as a care giver. As a care giver you have taken the responsibility of all care on your hands that includes that bad, crappy, and miserable. It includes people fed up, giving comments/criticism, and it includes sometimes no offers of help. This is the life of a care giver. Other than being a mother, it is the most thankless job there is. Either suck it up and be a care giver and that includes doing the hard things like not getting him what is bad for him and taking the ugly heat when you do what is right. If you don't want to be a caregiver, then do him a favor and don't be one.

Many other people have told you how you can get him help and how he will get help if you decide to leave but OWN the decision. If you want out, be an adult and make a plan and do it. No one is going to rescue you and pave the way for what you want. In the end you don't even know what you want but great thing is that you're getting all the attention you can want know on here. A lot of these people are very nice people who are going to get very vested in your situation and want to give you help and you're just going to take up their caring.

One last thing, get some perspective. You are not the only person being a caregiver in the world in miserable situations. There are many people here that can testify to it as I can myself. I have spent an awful, miserable summer caregiving to my mother. She's manic depressive addicted to medicine, any kind of medicine. It sucks and it's not fun and it's not easy but I will go to my grave knowing I did everything I could to try to give care and in the end I did have her placed in a facility because I could not give her the care she is due. That's a big statement of love honestly but comes with people's looks and criticisms. They can suck my toe. I don't care.

Put away your self medicating wine, give up the pity party, be a grown up and just make some decisions and own it.

 

[cabanafrau]

I saw a couple lawyers about getting a divorce under our current situation a year ago.... circumstances changed. I spent lover $1000 on all that and nothing became of it.

I have seen and elder lawyer.

I have seen 3 lawyers in another state about divorce and talked to at least 2 more on the phone about my options in this other state... all told me the same thing. One said I do NOT do free consultations, I was like that's cool I will pay. After talking to him, he was like... yea just go home, no charge.

I have paid lawyers here and did a couple free consultations that have said they can do this "piece of cake" if it is uncontested.

The lawyer who consulted with you after you said you would pay and sent you home, gratis, at the end of the consult -- he could tell you were unlikely to follow through. Rather than take your money for what was going to be a fruitless exercise he did the ethical thing and sent you on your way. Plenty of lawyers in his situation would not do the same. Suggesting that divorce in America in this day and age is so difficult to obtain is complete and utter nonsense. It's not a stray thought to be entertained or a game to be played without intent. Do or don't, but remember you can only ride one horse at a time because you only have one behind.

I'll give you the benefit of the doubt since you say you have no children and I'll assume you don't know this parenting tactic. When a child throws a tantrum to get their way the parent knows never to cave in to that behavior or the child will continue to throw tantrums. Your DH can yell and scream all he wants, but if it doesn't produce the results he wants he will stop it. Throwing a tantrum is exhausting. He doesn't sound like he'll be super keen to exhaust himself for nothing. Tantrums will stop. Problem solved. No, this solution will not solve every problem, end world hunger or bring world peace either. There's no magic wand to be waved to fix everything. It's going to take commitment to change, a lot of hard work and plenty of problems to be solved along the way. That's life.

There's an old saying I think will be valuable for you to keep in mind and spend some time really thinking about. Wherever you go, there you are.

 

[Dawnlight]

I think this is pathetic. All of the abuse and nasty disgusting behavior he projects onto you is unbelievable. Grow a backbone and get out!!!!!!!!!!!

This is a really uncaring comment. The sort of situation that the OP has been dealing with erodes a person's sense of self and sense of self-worth. It can not be fixed by someone saying "grow a backbone" anymore than one can tell a person with clinical depression to "just snap out of it". You work in law enforcement and hold this attitude? That's pathetic.

 

[lustergirl]

This is a really uncaring comment. The sort of situation that the OP has been dealing with erodes a person's sense of self and sense of self-worth. It can not be fixed by someone saying "grow a backbone" anymore than one can tell a person with clinical depression to "just snap out of it". You work in law enforcement and hold this attitude? That's pathetic.

Isn't any more rude that you calling me pathetic The OP obviously has some issues. She has been given some great advice here on this thread but continues feeling stuck in her situation. Until she is ready to get help with her situation she is going to do nothing. I just can't believe a person would endure all of the things that her husband is doing and not want to run away. Feeling trapped is one thing but this kind of behavior is appalling.

And yes I do hold an attitude. I have seen the damage this type of behavior causes and its not pretty. The abused are offered a way out and they don't take it. Senseless tragedy occurs sometimes and it is heartbreaking.

 

[gwynne]

OP, I know it's been suggested many time, but I strongly recommend you get some therapy. Now. You need to work with someone to figure out what needs to be done for both your husband and you.

 

[cabanafrau]

This is a really uncaring comment. The sort of situation that the OP has been dealing with erodes a person's sense of self and sense of self-worth. It can not be fixed by someone saying "grow a backbone" anymore than one can tell a person with clinical depression to "just snap out of it". You work in law enforcement and hold this attitude? That's pathetic.

It's far more damaging to accept the notion that nothing's your fault, accept no responsibility for your choices and actions/inactions, everyone else has all of the knowledge and power and they're shutting me out, despite the fact I'm doing nothing to gain knowledge, power or even participate in critical activities that impact my life.

 

[cabanafrau]

OP, I know it's been suggested many time, but I strongly recommend you get some therapy. Now. You need to work with someone to figure out what needs to be done for both your husband and you.

I agree, to a point.

OP, all you need to do right now is work on you. That's a big enough job at this point, and all you can control in the end anyway.

 

[North of Mouse]

What a 'therapy' session this has been! This poor dead horse has been beaten over and over again, and at 17 pages nothing much has changed.

OP, this is 'way' beyond Dis Board advice - you need 'local' help - and fast, it seems like. Hope you can get it.