MM+ never materialized?

[itchin2go]

I had the same opportunity as everyone else that chose to do what they had to do to get a FP. And the same thing can be said of FP+. If you want a near guarantee of getting a FP+ for anything, there are choices you can make to insure that- just as there has always been.

We made the choice that touring the way we wanted to was more important than getting a particular fp. People who choose to stay off site or who make the choice to stay shorter amounts of time make the choice that those things are more important to them than getting an A&E or SDMT FP+- because really, those are the only 2 rides that are affected much.

All choices aren't equal ... or even choices.

If you chose not to wake up early on your vacation, that is a true choice. You could have. You had the means. You had the opportunity. You chose a different path. You controlled all variables, and in the face of a fairly simple choice, you chose no.

If I don't stay for 10 days CL at a deluxe resort, that may not be because I CHOOSE not to. It may be because I simply can't afford that choice. I can't just set an alarm clock and magically have additional funds in my bank account. Could I choose to switch jobs? Go back to school? Borrow money? Rob a bank? Yes, but to compare those choices with the choice of whether to set an alarm clock and be somewhere at a certain time is not even tenable.

You know, even if someone can afford the 10 day CL vacation, to equate getting up out of bed at a predetermined time with throwing an additional $5K at a vacation is not even apples and apples.

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

I was surprised at how the gardens were transformed to accommodate fireworks FP. Lots of little special places to go. If those remain Fastpass only and not cash that is intriguing. I did use a FP for fireworks in October 2013 (I was able to pull Legacy too) and liked being in a designated non crowded space.

Those FP are going fast when preplanning, and I couldn't justify giving up one of my three for it.

But if they handled it like DLR where you could get one early in the day and it wouldn't affect your other rides, I would get up early to grab one.

They are building more little nooks in the MK right now. I assume they will be more secluded spaces.

I really liked the FP for wishes.

Like you, I had a hard time "giving one up" for it, but I won't do Wishes any other way, now. We just did it on an arrival day when we did a park in the evening. (Admitted AP perk in that we did not lose an admission day to do this.)

Now that I have done it, I *would* be willing to use it as my 3rd FP.

I have stated before that I would like to see it as its own FP that doesn't count against the 3.

 

[DoingDisney]

I had the same opportunity as everyone else that chose to do what they had to do to get a FP. And the same thing can be said of FP+. If you want a near guarantee of getting a FP+ for anything, there are choices you can make to insure that- just as there has always been.

We made the choice that touring the way we wanted to was more important than getting a particular fp. People who choose to stay off site or who make the choice to stay shorter amounts of time make the choice that those things are more important to them than getting an A&E or SDMT FP+- because really, those are the only 2 rides that are affected much.

I wont argue about "choice" though I think we disagree on whether people are really making choices.

That isn't what this discussion is really about.

It doesn't matter how long I stay, it doesn't matter if I am onsite or offsite ... every day of my trip, except for the 10th and beyond, someone has had an advantage in selecting the Fps for the day. On my first day, when I have had 60 days to select, someone else had 70, when I had 61 (on day 2) someone else had 70, when I had 62 (day 3) someone else had 70. That is not and equal opportunity to get the FPs that I want.

Not staying a shorter amount, staying onsite. FP+ creates an unequal opportunity to get FPs, by the very design of it.

If instead you could book 60 days out, period (the way I think offsiters can book 30 days out, and have to do it each night), that would be as equal a playing field (at least for onsiters) as legacy FP. The current system, isn't that.

Not talking about the "effect" of this either, not about whether you are still able to get what you want, or someone is etc.

Pure and simple concept: its not an equal opportunity to get what you want when people have between a 1 and 10 day head start on selecting the FPs for that day.

I don't see anyone pointing out how this isn't true, you can bring up other things, talk about how it works out for you, but that doesn't address the core issue.

 

[Tarheel girl 1975]

I was surprised at how the gardens were transformed to accommodate fireworks FP. Lots of little special places to go. If those remain Fastpass only and not cash that is intriguing. I did use a FP for fireworks in October 2013 (I was able to pull Legacy too) and liked being in a designated non crowded space.

They are building more little nooks in the MK right now. I assume they will be more secluded spaces.

I wish they would take it one step further and put some of the benches back in. It would be nice to have a few places to sit down and relax.

 

[ArwenMarie]

It was fantastic really. We travelled with different groups. Disney does a great job of creating a bubble in Anaheim. I stayed in the Grand Californian and Wyndmark Up the street.

It is amazing that DCA has more rides than Epcot and Dhs combined. I think Disney should combine Epcot and DHS at WDW and create one good experience. It would be larger in space but equal in ride capacity to DCA

That's a great idea, at least until this overhaul of DHS is done...make Epcot and DHS one park and you can hop between them for free and pool the FPs.

I was surprised at how the gardens were transformed to accommodate fireworks FP. Lots of little special places to go. If those remain Fastpass only and not cash that is intriguing. I did use a FP for fireworks in October 2013 (I was able to pull Legacy too) and liked being in a designated non crowded space.

Those FP are going fast when preplanning, and I couldn't justify giving up one of my three for it.

But if they handled it like DLR where you could get one early in the day and it wouldn't affect your other rides, I would get up early to grab one.

They are building more little nooks in the MK right now. I assume they will be more secluded spaces.

I think they will leave the Wishes FPs as is because they slow people down.

 

[cakebaker]

If you chose not to wake up early on your vacation, that is a true choice. You could have. You had the means. You had the opportunity. You chose a different path. You controlled all variables.

Who said I was sleeping in? I've answered this one a hundred times. We never, ever, not once in any trip ever to WDW slept in. We go to a park in the morning, usually rope drop, we go to another park in the evening. If the evening park was Epcot or HS, fp's were gone for headliners.

If I don't stay for 10 days CL at a deluxe resort, that may not be because I CHOOSE not to. It may be because I simply can't afford that choice. I can't just set an alarm clock and magically have additional funds in my bank account. Could I choose to switch jobs? Go back to school? Borrow money? Rob a bank? Yes, but to compare those choices with the choice of whether to set an alarm clock and be somewhere at a certain time is not even tenable.

I've never once stayed CL at a deluxe resort. That is nowhere near a requirement for fp+ availability. The values are quite affordable- and they offer the same exact fp+ availability of any deluxe in booking fp+ in advance.

Whether one can afford a particular thing or not shouldn't be a concern of WDW. In that case, let's just shut the gates because there are plenty of people who can't afford to go at all under any circumstances.

 

[ArwenMarie]

All choices aren't equal ... or even choices.

If you chose not to wake up early on your vacation, that is a true choice. You could have. You had the means. You had the opportunity. You chose a different path. You controlled all variables, and in the face of a fairly simple choice, you chose no.

If I don't stay for 10 days CL at a deluxe resort, that may not be because I CHOOSE not to. It may be because I simply can't afford that choice. I can't just set an alarm clock and magically have additional funds in my bank account. Could I choose to switch jobs? Go back to school? Borrow money? Rob a bank? Yes, but to compare those choices with the choice of whether to set an alarm clock and be somewhere at a certain time is not even tenable.

You know, even if someone can afford the 10 day CL vacation, to equate getting up out of bed at a predetermined time with throwing an additional $5K at a vacation is not even apples and apples.

Yeah but an individual's money situation isn't Disney's problem. But I see your point, it's definitely made the parks less fair.

They also could have done something with paper FP to help the late sleepers. But that wasn't the point of all this!

 

[itchin2go]

Who said I was sleeping in? I've answered this one a hundred times. We never, ever, not once in any trip ever to WDW slept in. We go to a park in the morning, usually rope drop, we go to another park in the evening. If the evening park was Epcot or HS, fp's were gone for headliners.

I've never once stayed CL at a deluxe resort. That is nowhere near a requirement for fp+ availability. The values are quite affordable- and they offer the same exact fp+ availability of any deluxe in booking fp+ in advance.

Whether one can afford a particular thing or not shouldn't be a concern of WDW. In that case, let's just shut the gates because there are plenty of people who can't afford to go at all under any circumstances.

Yeah but an individual's money situation isn't Disney's problem. But I see your point, it's definitely made the parks less fair.

They also could have done something with paper FP to help the late sleepers. But that wasn't the point of all this!

Nobody's money situation is Disney's problem. That was not my point.

Another PP attempted to make the point that these things are 100% a matter of choice. My point was, not necessarily. Not all choices are available to all people. Should they be? I don't know - not the point I was making.

With legacy, it really was as simple as choose the behavior, choose the consequences. The behavior was really available to all, except, I don't know ... vampires? You either did what you had to to get a FP, or you chose not to.

It's not quite so simple now.

And you're right - that wasn't the point of this thread. But when I see certain statements made, I feel the need to at least offer a counter to them. I am extremely susceptible to being pulled down the rabbit hole (see Ride/Attraction controversy '15).

Regarding CL, there was talk upthread about extra FPs for CL. Thus my CL reference. Regardless, we all know that the longer your stay, the greater the chances of snagging certain highly sought after FPs. Extending a vacation extra days may be, strictly speaking, a "choice". But I still think comparing that "choice" with the choice of whether to show up to a certain park early is not comparing apples to apples.

Also, to the highly specific point of whether you could go to one park (say, MK) in the morning, show up at Epcot in the evening and pull legacy FPs, here's my thought. You didn't have to hop. You knew when you hopped to Epcot that there would likely be no FPs for your desired rides. But you hopped anyway. I'm assuming you only did this once before you realized what the outcome would be. If you kept doing it anyway, then the outcome must have been ok with you. Otherwise, the choice I can see making is not to hop in that circumstance. And that was a legitimate, easy-peasy choice.

 

[bcrook]

IF you show up at rope drop. Or at least early in the morning- that is dependent of course on what your schedule was because there was really no way to plan what time you'd get a fp for. You were at the mercy of the machine. At fp time I cannot use is no better than no fp at all. So for those of us who didn't want to rope drop a certain park, or want to be a park only in the evening, we were just out of luck.

Need a fp for after 5? Not happening for the headliners at Epcot or HS.

For this thread I basically asked if Disney delivered on their press releases? I would contend that they didn't. Is this post claiming that this is the magic behind MM+? You can book your FP for whatever time you want?

If so, I would agree that would have been magical without the other trade offs. I mentioned that earlier... If Disney truly wanted to go for customer satisfaction they would have created a system to work like legacy that allowed customers to choose a time for their ride appointment.

But they didn't go that route for some crazy reason. I contend greed. I wish they would have stuck with Magic + customer service rather than + referring to a CEO bank account.

And yes I know that Disney is a business.

 

[larryz]

One calls it ride rationing, others call it leveling the playing field. Everyone now gets the same opportunity to get FPs, and get them at a time that works for them. Under FP- my daughter never would have made it to a random evening FP for a ride if we were up at RD. now I was able to make those plans from the comfort of my home and no FP was booked for later than 4pm. Three ride she wanted, guaranteed. No racing to get them, no timing when we could pull another, no hoping we didn't pull A&E for 11pm.

Perhaps.

But it seems to me the random, spur-of-the-moment trip takers will get no E-tickets unless they spring for the VIP Thrills tour or a plaid.

 

[larryz]

Actually to get in to college you both have to have the grades and be able to PAY for it ...

Or just be able to pay for it by such an excess amount that they name a building after you...

 

[wisblue]

For this thread I basically asked if Disney delivered on their press releases? I would contend that they didn't. Is this post claiming that this is the magic behind MM+? You can book your FP for whatever time you want?

If so, I would agree that would have been magical without the other trade offs. I mentioned that earlier... If Disney truly wanted to go for customer satisfaction they would have created a system to work like legacy that allowed customers to choose a time for their ride appointment.

But they didn't go that route for some crazy reason. I contend greed. I wish they would have stuck with Magic + customer service rather than + referring to a CEO bank account.

And yes I know that Disney is a business.

I don't have the energy or desire to wade through the archives to find Disney's press releases or marketing materials about MM+ and what they claimed they would deliver. Do you have specific ones that you could point to?

I have always considered some of the things that you pointed to (like being able to greet guests by name at attractions) as very incidental features of the whole MM+ project. When I saw the title of this thread, I expected something quite different than the points you made. Maybe it should have been titled "Some features of MM+ haven't materialized yet. Will we ever see them?"

 

[Angel Ariel]

I don't have the energy or desire to wade through the archives to find Disney's press releases or marketing materials about MM+ and what they claimed they would deliver. Do you have specific ones that you could point to?

I am on my phone at the moment, so I'm not entirely sure, but I believe the OP has a link to the collection of press releases that he compiled over the roll out period in his signature.

 

[bcrook]

I don't have the energy or desire to wade through the archives to find Disney's press releases or marketing materials about MM+ and what they claimed they would deliver. Do you have specific ones that you could point to?

I have always considered some of the things that you pointed to (like being able to greet guests by name at attractions) as very incidental features of the whole MM+ project. When I saw the title of this thread, I expected something quite different than the points you made. Maybe it should have been titled "Some features of MM+ haven't materialized yet. Will we ever see them?"

Incidental???

This is a great article from Robert Niles that explained the Theme Park as a Platform concept. Theme Park Insider.

I wonder if all those features will be kept or discontinued?

Here is his ending paragraph.

"But Disney isn't spending more than a billion dollars on MyMagic+ just to make a new ticketing and payment system. This is the key that unlocks a new stage in the evolution of theme parks, where interplay between visitors and the park itself becomes something that happens in real space, instead of people's imaginations. Yes, Disney's Imagineers still needs to make this happen. They haven't yet pulled it off. But they're trying, and that should excite any theme park fan with a love for innovation and experimentation in the parks."
​

The article referenced in the OP explained how they were going to start with this idea within other areas of the resort. They quickly added monitors and started adding technology in MK and Epcot. I was really expecting to see it this trip.

The ONLY innovative piece to the MM+ is the "Theme Park as a Platform". If they can pull that off it could have the same impact animatronics had in the 1960s. I do think it's a big deal. It would be TRANSFORMATIVE. I was hoping to see progress this trip. Even having an interactive Scuttle would have been a start.

I am now skeptical that Pandora will really have this technology. This article may be a little ambitious. But think if it did. See I'm getting too excited again.

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

I am on my phone at the moment, so I'm not entirely sure, but I believe the OP has a link to the collection of press releases that he compiled over the roll out period in his signature.

I searched and saw no press releases.

I saw a time article, a handful of links to a few blog articles and a time line. I saw no official press releases announcing that features were promised.

Happy to read them if they are provided.

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

Incidental???

This is a great article from Robert Niles that explained the Theme Park as a Platform concept. Theme Park Insider.

I wonder if all those features will be kept or discontinued?

Here is his ending paragraph.

"But Disney isn't spending more than a billion dollars on MyMagic+ just to make a new ticketing and payment system. This is the key that unlocks a new stage in the evolution of theme parks, where interplay between visitors and the park itself becomes something that happens in real space, instead of people's imaginations. Yes, Disney's Imagineers still needs to make this happen. They haven't yet pulled it off. But they're trying, and that should excite any theme park fan with a love for innovation and experimentation in the parks."
​

The article referenced in the OP explained how they were going to start with this idea within other areas of the resort. They quickly added monitors and started adding technology in MK and Epcot. I was really expecting to see it this trip.

The ONLY innovative piece to the MM+ is the "Theme Park as a Platform". If they can pull that off it could have the same impact animatronics had in the 1960s. I do think it's a big deal. It would be TRANSFORMATIVE. I was hoping to see progress this trip. Even having an interactive Scuttle would have been a start.

I am now skeptical that Pandora will really have this technology. This article may be a little ambitious. But think if it did. See I'm getting too excited again.

From the link:
"This isn't anything Disney's provided details on, yet."

Where are the official press releases if what Disney has provided officially?

 

[bcrook]

I searched and saw no press releases.

I saw a time article, a handful of links to a few blog articles and a time line. I saw no official press releases announcing that features were promised.

Happy to read them if they are provided.

I would say the article in time and interviews on news networks are press releases. When the president and VP post on official Disney Blogs I would count that too.

As for promise, I am not claiming they broke promises and my trip was ruined.

I am saying that what Disney released to the media had the potential to be very cool. A real chance at innovation. I was disappointed that none of it came through. I was hoping to discuss this with people who were interested in the topic.
I am not trying to defend a masters thesis here.

 

[wisblue]

Incidental???

This is a great article from Robert Niles that explained the Theme Park as a Platform concept. Theme Park Insider.

I wonder if all those features will be kept or discontinued?

Here is his ending paragraph.

"But Disney isn't spending more than a billion dollars on MyMagic+ just to make a new ticketing and payment system. This is the key that unlocks a new stage in the evolution of theme parks, where interplay between visitors and the park itself becomes something that happens in real space, instead of people's imaginations. Yes, Disney's Imagineers still needs to make this happen. They haven't yet pulled it off. But they're trying, and that should excite any theme park fan with a love for innovation and experimentation in the parks."
​

The article referenced in the OP explained how they were going to start with this idea within other areas of the resort. They quickly added monitors and started adding technology in MK and Epcot. I was really expecting to see it this trip.

The ONLY innovative piece to the MM+ is the "Theme Park as a Platform". If they can pull that off it could have the same impact animatronics had in the 1960s. I do think it's a big deal. It would be TRANSFORMATIVE. I was hoping to see progress this trip. Even having an interactive Scuttle would have been a start.

I am now skeptical that Pandora will really have this technology. This article may be a little ambitious. But think if it did. See I'm getting too excited again.

OK, this is an article, not a press release or marketing materials from Disney's PR machine. Because the article uses Avatar as the example, it would suggest to a reader that some of these things are coming in the future, not necessarily within the next year or two.

 

[IrishNYC]

Here is the article from Theme Park Insider about the power of the Magic Band that provided much hype! It discusses potential in Pandora. If you read that article, and then plan a trip in 2017??? Then none of it comes to fruition, shouldn't I be disappointed? That is basically what happened this trip.

Second paragraph, first sentence says, This isn't anything Disney's officially provided details on yet. Heck, Disney's still working on inventing some of this technology." so, why would you hedge your expectations on what they are stating as speculation?

 

[WillAustin]

No, Barry, almost none of the "magical" items from the press releases have come to fruition. I have come to the same conclusion as you did.