MCO to begin using the new scanners within next 2-3 weeks

[kaytieeldr]

Can't explain yourself Huh! Wow! What facts. I guess your one of those drive by posters. Don't tell me your one of those Tsa agents. Sorry I get it I just read your avatar annoying egotistical. I guess that sums it up.

Explain myself how? I simply stated there are current airline employees and TSA employees who post on the Transportation Board, and that one or more of these DISers have posted in this thread. Absolute knowledge would be first-hand or current or daily experience or front-line - or any combination of these.

If you are a transportion expert. Why don't you enlighten us with your wordly wisdom instead of just posting a sarcastic comment. I'm trying to be nice I don't want to be put in time out again.

Worldly wisdom? Really? I'm flattered, but... Knowledgeable, but by no means an expert. I'm not one of the persons to whom I referred.

 

[Dax]

TSA employees have brought guns through, or around, the security checkpoints. Why don't they get screened?

TSA employees are allowed to walk right through checkpoints at all times, with no screening whatsover. The machines go off like crazy when they walk through..who knows what they may be hiding..

Its good enough for the FA's, pilots and other employees, but not TSA...

Just to clarify, while I do work at the airport, I work in an office located on one of the airsides. I am subjected to all the same security as passengers, unless I choose to use the lower entrance by the baggage claims.

 

[goofy4tink]

There have been two cases of people getting explosives on a plane since 911. The shoe bomber and the christmas eve guy this past year. Out of the millions that have flown. The Christmas Eve guy was initially screened somewhere in Africa and did not have to pass through any other screening. Maybe instead of spending millions on this new unproven technology we should work on improving security at all entry points in the world or requiring people traveling from certain parts of the world to go through additional security before they can board a plane traveling to the US.
Its only a matter of time before someone figures out how to swallow a bomb that will go off in X number of hours. Then what, we all have to fast for 12 hours before getting on a plane? For every new technology, there is someone who will figure out how to beat it.

That said, we will be on the opting out line.

Have to agree....things can be changed for the better. It's only a matter of time before they do..hopefully.

No I worked for the airline from 91-93 I was 21. I quit to go to nursing school. I never went through security. We entered a door by baggage claim when out the ramp and up the stairs to the jetway. Everybody did it. When I took flights I put my own bag on the plane. Never put it through security. Things have only changed recently since 911. So your .44 magnum theory doesn't hold water. My Dh works for the airline so I have a pretty good idea how things have changed and how employees feel about it. For me personally not so much of a big deal. I fly for free. I'll do a little dance for them if it makes their day. You guys are the ones that have to pay to be seen naked and I would expect airline taxes and to keep increasing to pay for all these wonderful machines. Happy flying.

Can't explain yourself Huh! Wow! What facts. I guess your one of those drive by posters. Don't tell me your one of those Tsa agents. Sorry I get it I just read your avatar annoying egotistical. I guess that sums it up.

If you are a transportion expert. Why don't you enlighten us with your wordly wisdom instead of just posting a sarcastic comment. I'm trying to be nice I don't want to be put in time out again.

Okay...I'm going to say this out in the open, not via PM or an infraction system. You have your opinion...and I will defend to the death your right to have that opinion. BUT..you will not come down on others here just because you feel they are wrong. We do have people on this board that are extremely qualified to speak to this type issue...and I will say that they are probably more qualified than you, or your dh. I don't think you've told any of us what it is you 'did' or what it is your dh does for the airline industry. If you have, then I apologize for not seeing it or noticing it. But, I can assure you that we have posters on this board that really are qualified to speak to any airline issue..and no, they are not just TSA workers. And no, I will not come out and say who they are and what they do. They don't wish that knowledge to be 'out there' for all to see. I know, and that's all that matters. And it is not hearsay.
So....enough of this type posting. This thread is close to being shut down...and that's too bad. A good discussion is always good for airing things out and for learning something new. But not when one or two posters feel their way is the only 100% correct way.

 

[safetymom]

I have said this many times before. If you want to see where the security flaws are at the airport ask your frequent flyers. I could tell you plenty and there are people that travel much more than I do.

I will be one of those that refuse the new machine. I think more people should refuse it also.

 

[momblanch]

Please excuse my ignorance up front. I am not a frequent flyer nor do I work in the industry where I would be subject to this screening on a daily basis. My statement would not apply to those of you. But I have to inquire about the "pat-down" option. Is this a physical pat-down or just a term to describe a wanding? Cause I have to say I would much prefer to have some random person screening my image in another room than to be subject to a physical pat-down. Just sayin...

 

[kaytieeldr]

To the best of my knowledge, it's a physical pat-down. Having gone through these in the past, while they used to be done with the back of the TSA personnel's hand - again, as far as I know - where the pat-down is the passenger's alternate choice to the backscatter scanner, the pat-down may now be done with the front of the hand.

 

[goofy4tink]

Please excuse my ignorance up front. I am not a frequent flyer nor do I work in the industry where I would be subject to this screening on a daily basis. My statement would not apply to those of you. But I have to inquire about the "pat-down" option. Is this a physical pat-down or just a term to describe a wanding? Cause I have to say I would much prefer to have some random person screening my image in another room than to be subject to a physical pat-down. Just sayin...

That's my feeling as well. I have had all types of 'screenings'. I do know that a few years ago, we were on a flight, from FtL to TFGreen that wasn't able to land in RI, but turned back to Philly, due to snow issues. We were given the option of flying back to FtL that night or staying overnight in Philly, without our luggage, and getting on a flight to RI first thing in the morning. We opted for getting our bags that night and staying in FtL and returning, again, to TFGreen/RI the next morning. There were about 20 of us who chose that option. And every one of us had to be patted down the next morning in FtL..due to our having flown so many times in a 24 hr period. It wasn't an awful thing, but I prefer the screening machines..they take less time.

I think patdowns are patdowns and wandings are another thing entirely. We have had both on different flights, for different reasons.

 

[pilotwife_02]

I'm not concerned about screening. I understand the TSA is doing what they "think" is best. I will certainly go for the pat down myself, my concern is my children. I DO have a problem with the fact that many TSA agents don't have to go through the security line. DH says it happens all the time and I personally have seen it many times. I'm trying to figure out why flight crews have to go through it, but TSA agents don't. Just because a TSA agent won't be on the plane when they are flying doesn't mean that they won't do harm in another way.

I've heard people say that they are taken to a private room for a pat down, will they do this with my 3, 4 and infant? Will I be allowed to be there? That's the problem I have, and I haven't been able to find an answer to this.

I do fear that a lot of the TSA's guidelines and their lack of consistency with them is going to lead to the airlines losing money. Even DH has stated that it is a topic of conversation they have had amongst themselves (as pilots), they are worried that people will get more frustrated with the TSA and their rules and opt not to fly.

 

[Dax]

I'm not concerned about screening. I understand the TSA is doing what they "think" is best. I will certainly go for the pat down myself, my concern is my children. I DO have a problem with the fact that many TSA agents don't have to go through the security line. DH says it happens all the time and I personally have seen it many times. I'm trying to figure out why flight crews have to go through it, but TSA agents don't. Just because a TSA agent won't be on the plane when they are flying doesn't mean that they won't do harm in another way.

I've heard people say that they are taken to a private room for a pat down, will they do this with my 3, 4 and infant? Will I be allowed to be there? That's the problem I have, and I haven't been able to find an answer to this.

I do fear that a lot of the TSA's guidelines and their lack of consistency with them is going to lead to the airlines losing money. Even DH has stated that it is a topic of conversation they have had amongst themselves (as pilots), they are worried that people will get more frustrated with the TSA and their rules and opt not to fly.

I have many random conversations with both airline workers and passengers, and this is the general opinion of many. I personally do not like the attitude of the TSA agents...much of that spills over into after work....a quick example of this..Our employee shuttle bus that takes us to the parking lot gets full quick. Unfortunatly, chiverly is also dead, and many men love to cut to the head of the group and board before most of the older woman who also wait. Well a large grp of TSA employees where holding up the line for some reason or another, and someone said something about moving along, well a TSA agent mutters something about "I guess someone wants extra acreening now".

Its attitude like that that gives TSA a bad name.

 

[princesspeach]

I bet you would be shocked to know there are people on the DIS - heck, on the Transportation board, even on this specific thread - who work for airlines or the TSA and have absolute knowledge (not just married to airline employees, not just with a pretty good idea) how things have changed and how employees feel about the changes.

I found this post to be insulting. I never claimed to be an expert. I have not seen to many posts by airline employees on this thread. Because my dh works for the airline and I don't doesn't mean I'm clueless. I disagree with you so you feel it necessary to take that response. Who really has absolute knowledge on anything. These are just opinions. If I had made these remarks I wouldhave been reprimanded.

 

[princesspeach]

Sounds like you're wanting us to have another terrorist attack so that more people can be killed just to prove your point? How compassionate and kind of you!

I've got a better idea - don't like being searched - don't fly. don't like the way the government runs things? leave - go somewhere where they do things more to *your* liking.

I have to say that as someone who is a nervous flyer - someone who HATES to get on a plane (and the only reason I do it is so that my DH doesn't have to drive 15 hours to get us to WDW), security measures make me feel safer about flying.

Also, if you have nothing to hide, then what's the big deal? I'd rather give them 10 seconds of my time, let them take a picture of me that they can't trace back to me, and move on to my gate, than have no security and another 9/11/01 on our hands.

I'm not telling you what to do - I'm not insulting you - I'm just saying that if you don't like it - you have options. It's up to you to decide what you want to do. But if you make a decision to stay here in the US and to continue flying, you're making the choice to either go through the scanners or be pat-down if necessary - just make a choice and stick with it. But don't hope for the worst just to prove a point - that's unecessary and insulting to those who have lost loved ones in the previous terrorist attacks on our country.

Telling someone they wan't another terrosist attack or wishing people to die is also insulting. There are a lot of things implied in your post. If I respond sarcastically I will get in trouble. The mod agrees with you. I will try to respond nicer. It amazes me somebody can say something as awful as you just said and not get in trouble, but sarcasm will. I will answer your question No I don't want people to die. Not liking xrays does not equate to wanting people to die. How would people dieing prove any of my points anyway? Thats really an awful thing to say.

 

[ironz]

To the best of my knowledge, it's a physical pat-down. Having gone through these in the past, while they used to be done with the back of the TSA personnel's hand - again, as far as I know - where the pat-down is the passenger's alternate choice to the backscatter scanner, the pat-down may now be done with the front of the hand.

What is being reported on FlyerTalk is that the "new" pat down is with the front of the hand, with the hand going directly over genital areas and maybe the breasts. Some have reported groping. Some have reported that the agents are not warning where they will be touching you---even doctors will give you a warning before your gyn exam. Maybe some of it is getting blown out of proportion, and I haven't experienced it just yet. I will certainly report if I am selected.

This is why some people are upset. We can be irradiated, or we can be groped. I would support profiling, truthfully.

 

[princesspeach]

I'm not concerned about screening. I understand the TSA is doing what they "think" is best. I will certainly go for the pat down myself, my concern is my children. I DO have a problem with the fact that many TSA agents don't have to go through the security line. DH says it happens all the time and I personally have seen it many times. I'm trying to figure out why flight crews have to go through it, but TSA agents don't. Just because a TSA agent won't be on the plane when they are flying doesn't mean that they won't do harm in another way.

I've heard people say that they are taken to a private room for a pat down, will they do this with my 3, 4 and infant? Will I be allowed to be there? That's the problem I have, and I haven't been able to find an answer to this.

I do fear that a lot of the TSA's guidelines and their lack of consistency with them is going to lead to the airlines losing money. Even DH has stated that it is a topic of conversation they have had amongst themselves (as pilots), they are worried that people will get more frustrated with the TSA and their rules and opt not to fly.

I have been taken in a back room to be patted down. Coming back from South America. Randomly picked for a drug search, I was 21. It was very humilating being patted down including your crotch by a women with a bunch of men watching. I assume I was chosen because why else would a 21 year old girl go to south America but to get drugs. They also tore apart my luggage. Its an experience I will never forget and its probably why I have such a bad taste in my mouth for security guards at airports. I would never wan't to see this done to people on a regular basis.

 

[kaytieeldr]

I know when I've had back-of-the-hand patdowns, the Agent has always told me where she was going next. I'm surprised they're not still following the same procedure - unless they're embarassed. Think about it. These are the same TSA personnel as before the choice between backscatter-or-patdown. Not sure why anybody thinks they're comfortable doing this. They probably feel more awkward than the passenger. Keep in mind, they're just people*. Any time one is displeased with one's treatment, there are ways to report that treatment. Note names, times, locations, etc. Request a manager. If that doesn't work, go online.

*No, I'm not one of these people. But I know if my job involved the occasional wanding or back-of-hand patdown, then changed to requiring a more invasive patdown procedure - while the training might show me how to do it, it sure as heck wouldn't show me how to be more comfortable doing it.

 

[princesspeach]

Explain myself how? I simply stated there are current airline employees and TSA employees who post on the Transportation Board, and that one or more of these DISers have posted in this thread. Absolute knowledge would be first-hand or current or daily experience or front-line - or any combination of these.

Worldly wisdom? Really? I'm flattered, but... Knowledgeable, but by no means an expert. I'm not one of the persons to whom I referred.

First hand experience. Well my dh does go to work everyday. We are one of those couples that actually communicate with each other. So I guess I meet your criteria. I have only made reference to how his fellow employees feel about the scanners. No we don't get into which way a tsa agent holds his hand and such thing.

 

[kaytieeldr]

I have been taken in a back room to be patted down. Coming back from South America. Randomly picked for a drug search, I was 21. It was very humilating being patted down including your crotch by a women with a bunch of men watching. I assume I was chosen because why else would a 21 year old girl go to south America but to get drugs.

Respectfully, that's not random. It's profiling, but it's not random. It also has nothing to do with preventing bombs or other risky (to the plane/passengers/crew) items onto a flight. You don't say if it happened in South America or in the United States, but that's not our business anyway.

 

[princesspeach]

Respectfully, that's not random. It's profiling, but it's not random. It also has nothing to do with preventing bombs or other risky (to the plane/passengers/crew) items onto a flight. You don't say if it happened in South America or in the United States, but that's not our business anyway.

Yes I realize its profiling I was trying to be nice and use the word random. We cant profile for terroist just drug runners I guess. It was in Houston. I guess are governments method of keeping drugs from entering the country is to check 21 year old girls to see if they have some stashed in their crotch. This is why I have little faith in the government, and their ability to stop anything.

 

[LyssaLovesStitch]

The first time I got patted down the tsa got a little close to my hoochies and then she asked me if I had a maxi pad on. I didn't. She looked at me for about 10 seconds then let me go. I was wondering if I was going to have to pull my pants down to prove it. I should have complained to a manager, but I have never complained to a manager about anything so I just let it go. I am so looking forward to the next******* bomber so we can have our cavities searched. You know its coming.

Sounds like you're wanting us to have another terrorist attack so that more people can be killed just to prove your point? How compassionate and kind of you!

I've got a better idea - don't like being searched - don't fly. don't like the way the government runs things? leave - go somewhere where they do things more to *your* liking.

I have to say that as someone who is a nervous flyer - someone who HATES to get on a plane (and the only reason I do it is so that my DH doesn't have to drive 15 hours to get us to WDW), security measures make me feel safer about flying.

Also, if you have nothing to hide, then what's the big deal? I'd rather give them 10 seconds of my time, let them take a picture of me that they can't trace back to me, and move on to my gate, than have no security and another 9/11/01 on our hands.

I'm not telling you what to do - I'm not insulting you - I'm just saying that if you don't like it - you have options. It's up to you to decide what you want to do. But if you make a decision to stay here in the US and to continue flying, you're making the choice to either go through the scanners or be pat-down if necessary - just make a choice and stick with it. But don't hope for the worst just to prove a point - that's unecessary and insulting to those who have lost loved ones in the previous terrorist attacks on our country.

Telling someone they wan't another terrosist attack or wishing people to die is also insulting. There are a lot of things implied in your post. If I respond sarcastically I will get in trouble. The mod agrees with you. I will try to respond nicer. It amazes me somebody can say something as awful as you just said and not get in trouble, but sarcasm will. I will answer your question No I don't want people to die. Not liking xrays does not equate to wanting people to die. How would people dieing prove any of my points anyway? Thats really an awful thing to say.

What I wrote, I wrote in response to what you did. You wrote "I am so looking forward to the next******* bomber " - that implies that you're either being sarcastic, or you're wanting another terrorist attack. I just called you on it. That's all.

I'm not insulting you - just reading what you say and then responding to it.

As for the latter part, about how would people dieing prove your point - well, it would prove that even with all the security measures, terrorists and bombers still got through, and now we're going to be subjected to even more screening, even though, according to you, it's not necessary or doing anything to stop those who wish to do harm.

If the screenings stop just one bomber, one terrorist, or one person who wishes to do harm to Americans via their airline transit system, then the screenings have been effective.

Again - don't like them? don't fly. don't like the way the government is choosing to run things (without checking with you first) - leave. it's that easy.

By the way, you aren't the first person I've run across with this type of attitude, and you are simply hearing what I tell anyone else with the same attitude. However, I will agree that you have the right to your opinion and your attitude, just as I have a right to mine. Our country has many rights and freedoms that other countries don't. One of those is the freedom of speech.

 

[pilotwife_02]

Well a large grp of TSA employees where holding up the line for some reason or another, and someone said something about moving along, well a TSA agent mutters something about "I guess someone wants extra acreening now".

Its attitude like that that gives TSA a bad name.

That's so frustrating. It's like some of the TSA agents are legal bullies. I've experienced their broad spectrum of regs when my son was young and I brought a bottle through security. Even though I "knew" I was right because I've 1) done it before 2) read about it on their website and 3) asked another agent at the ID checkpoint about it I was still harassed about it and all I could do was nod my head and agree with them for fear I'd be pulled from the line and given a hard time. I fear that all these inconsistencies and fear the fear that people have will keep them off the planes and more people will just choose to drive.

I have been taken in a back room to be patted down. Coming back from South America. Randomly picked for a drug search, I was 21. It was very humilating being patted down including your crotch by a women with a bunch of men watching. I assume I was chosen because why else would a 21 year old girl go to south America but to get drugs. They also tore apart my luggage. Its an experience I will never forget and its probably why I have such a bad taste in my mouth for security guards at airports. I would never wan't to see this done to people on a regular basis.

This is certainly my fear of with small children.

I know when I've had back-of-the-hand patdowns, the Agent has always told me where she was going next. I'm surprised they're not still following the same procedure - unless they're embarassed.

I wonder if this goes back to SOP. They should have a SOP of how to preform pat-downs (how to do them, telling the person where they will be checking next, etc.).

DH is good friends with a TSA director and he will even admit that they need SOP, but the TSA is broken down into 6 (I think) divisions and each one does things their own way.

 

[CPT Tripss]

TSA employees are allowed to walk right through checkpoints at all times, with no screening whatsover. The machines go off like crazy when they walk through..who knows what they may be hiding..

Its good enough for the FA's, pilots and other employees, but not TSA...

Just to clarify, while I do work at the airport, I work in an office located on one of the airsides. I am subjected to all the same security as passengers, unless I choose to use the lower entrance by the baggage claims.

Thanks Dax . . . but I was hoping to hear from one of the resident experts on TSA the answer to "why?"