Marathon Weekend 2016

[BuckeyeBama]

I run using Hanson's and the max weekend mileage is 16 in the Beginner plan (peaks at 56 miles), but is dictated by the amount of miles you run in a week. The longest mileage day in a week shouldn't exceed 25-30% of the total of the week's mileage. If you run 20 miles in a week, your longest run is no more than 6 miles. If you run 80 miles in a week, your longest run is no more than 24 miles. The other caveat is that Hanson's prefers the time during running not exceed certain parameters (long run 2.5 hours, although 3 hours can happen). Thus, they wouldn't recommend a slower runner to run the 80 mile per week plan because many of the prescribed runs couldn't be completed in the allotted times. That's why you see elite runners putting in 120 miles per week. Because they are so freaking fast it takes them 20 miles at a 6 min mile to run for 120 minutes, whereas a different runner at a 12 min mile would only need to cover 10 miles to get the equivalent workout.

Yep - for my first marathon I used this plan and my longest pre-race run was 16 miles. I never reached the goal weekly mileage, but I did reach the 16 miles and I finished the marathon in less than 5 hours. I was overweight when I started the training and took my first running step in over 5 years on the first day of the first week of training. So, in less than 5 months I went from not running a step and needing to lose 50 pounds to running a marathon.

In other words, you don't need to run 20-30 mile long runs to prepare for a marathon.

 

[LSUlakes]

Here is my source for the information.

https://hansonscoachingservices.com/hansons-marathon-method-the-16-miler/

And the book which is a great resource.

The debate is definitely out there. On one side, there are some who state that mentally it is necessary for some to complete the 20+ mile run to have the confidence of going the distance (or length of time). I completely understand this point. In addition, its been argued that you need to train your body to be able to withstand a super long run (like 5.5-6 hours). The other side of the debate are those basing it on what starts to happen to the body after a sustained marathon training pace is taken beyond 3 hours. It takes longer to recover from runs longer than 3 hours, which carries over into the rest of the week's training. Since the debate is still ongoing, I can't give you a clear answer as to which is the better training methodology. If anyone else has any other input to add it would be greatly appreciated. Hope this helps.

The debate is a very interesting one. Like you have said earlier, faster runners can accomplish both. They are capable of running 20 miles under 3 hours or less. The very fast can do so as a training run of 20 miles a few minutes north of 2 hours. I agree that anything over 3 hours does more damage than good, and also feel that a 20 mile training run is a big confidence builder. Its a hard decision to make on which way to go. Just a random thought about the 20 mile rule is that it has been around for a while. As in when it was originally a rule a thumb, most folks attempting the marathon could complete a 20 miler near 3 hours or ~ 9:00 pace. More people of different abilities are now taking on the challenge of a marathon and I think this is why we have the debate on how to approach training. I think for each individual, the choice comes down to which program will boost their confidence the most leading up to race day. It should also be noted that ones marathon training pace should be much slower than race pace, unless of course you have a workout the includes MRP miles during your long run. Even then, the entire run isn't at race pace. This number varies but is anywhere from 30 to 90 seconds slower than goal pace. The idea here is to get you accustomed to being on your feet for a long period of time, (like you will be during the race) but at a much more comfortable pace. If that is the approach being used, it is also important to get some midweek miles in at MRP once in a while. I think I am just rambling at this point as ideas or lessons I have been taught pop into my head. Time to step away from the keyboard.

(I will admit that my theory on the 20 mile rule could be flawed as I have not put in the research on when it became popular)

 

[CamColt]

Yep - for my first marathon I used this plan and my longest pre-race run was 16 miles. I never reached the goal weekly mileage, but I did reach the 16 miles and I finished the marathon in less than 5 hours. I was overweight when I started the training and took my first running step in over 5 years on the first day of the first week of training. So, in less than 5 months I went from not running a step and needing to lose 50 pounds to running a marathon.

In other words, you don't need to run 20-30 mile long runs to prepare for a marathon.

This is very encouraging. Thank you for sharing! Having only done halves, I am in a bit of a panic over this full. I hope to up my mileage soon, but with limited time after the Wine and Dine, and who knows when the snow will come, I'm worried I wont be able to progress to 26 before January. In hearing some of the training stories I have to admit I've been feeling a bit out of my league. It's nice to see there is hope.

 

[DopeyBadger]

This is very encouraging. Thank you for sharing! Having only done halves, I am in a bit of a panic over this full. I hope to up my mileage soon, but with limited time after the Wine and Dine, and who knows when the snow will come, I'm worried I wont be able to progress to 26 before January. In hearing some of the training stories I have to admit I've been feeling a bit out of my league. It's nice to see there is hope.

From personal experience, I went from being overweight and never really running at all (I hated exercise) to signing up for a marathon and running it 8 weeks later. I did it, but I WOULD NEVER recommend someone try to run a marathon from ground level in 8 weeks. I was in sooo much pain afterwards my 82 year old grandfather-in-law had to lift me into the car to go home. I ran a peak mileage week of 26 miles (3+3+20). My longest timed training run was 3:42 (18 miles) and 3:32 (20 miles). Since then, I've completed 5 marathons (4:50, 4:37, 4:20, 4:27, 4:55) on a 3-day week training plan with long runs of 20 miles. The last marathon in May of this year (4:55), I pushed the hardest in training including 4x 20 mile runs. I felt so confident going into it. I hit the wall at 7 miles and almost DNF'd. I was devastated because I tried so much harder in training but when I went from 0 to marathon in 8 weeks I ran it better. I spent months reading as much as I could: books, popular magazines, websites, blogs, message boards, and scientific research. If you put in the time with any training plan (maxed at 11 or maxed at 22), as long as you toe the line in a healthy condition you'll have a great chance to cross that finish line and call yourself a marathoner!

 

[derekleigh]

I need some tips for running in cold weather. In the past I've always gone into hibernation in the winter so I have no cold weather running gear and no experience with long runs in cold weather. So far here in Michigan it's been a pleasant fall, but I know the frigid weather is coming. Any specific clothing you're fond of? Any advice is much appreciated.

Generally, my cold weather running attire follows as such:

30-40 degrees = Compression shorts, mesh shorts, long sleeve tech, MAYBE lite running gloves
20-29 degrees = Everything above, plus my Nike All Over Reflective jacket, DEFINITELY gloves
10-20 degrees = Everything above, except add a hat and replace the mesh shorts with compression pants/tights
Below 0 - 10 degrees = Everything above, but add heavier gloves and a pair of sweat pants


Hope this is helpful

 

[Waiting2goback]

I think I will keep stalking this thread to read tips and ideas for training, as I have only ever done 5Ks and my biggest achievement last summer was actually running (or as my hubby says, "a fast trot") a 5K all the way through.

Stalk away. These threads are all very helpful and supportive. But, there is no such thing as ONLY doing a 5K. A 5K could be someone's marathon. Not everybody is meant to run marathon or has a desire to run a marathon. Be proud of what you do, regardless of the distance. A 5K is still better than sitting on the couch.

I actually read an article that said in 2014 there were 550,000 marathon finishers in this country for the whole year. And these aren't unique finishers, these are total finishers so it includes the people who run multiples in a year. My point is, it isn't for everyone. If you decide to do one, great. If you BELIEVE you can finish it, you will.

This is very encouraging. Thank you for sharing! Having only done halves, I am in a bit of a panic over this full. I hope to up my mileage soon, but with limited time after the Wine and Dine, and who knows when the snow will come, I'm worried I wont be able to progress to 26 before January. In hearing some of the training stories I have to admit I've been feeling a bit out of my league. It's nice to see there is hope.

I ran my first marathon last October. I ran 2 races prior to it, a 10K for POT and the ToT 10 Miler. My longest training run was 13 miles and I did that once. I finished. Needless to say I had no idea what I was doing but I finished because I wouldn't allow myself to quit. I will be more prepared this year.

 

[Waiting2goback]

I had this link sent to me today and I couldn't stop laughing. I have to put it here for you all. It has some profanity so if you don't like that stuff (it's not bad) don't read it. I just don't want to offend anyone.

http://www.buzzfeed.com/sallytamarkin/no-youre-wearing-too-much-neon#.mmLYBVml3J

I am guilty of quite a few of these.

 

[margitmouse]

I'm FFigawi and I approve of this goal.

Breaking a full into manageable pieces is a lot easier to handle than viewing it as 26.2 miles as you're standing in your corral. The WDW course (well, the previous course anyway) lends itself very well to small pieces.

Start to TTC
TTC to MK
MK
Exit of MK to end of golf course
End of golf course to AK
AK
Exit of AK to WWoS
WWoS
Exit WWoS to DHS
DHS
Exit DHS to Epcot
Epcot
Choir
Finish

so funny you brought this up! Was coming back to the site to ask who had told me a while back to break it down to example: MK=5 miles, I like your goal breakdown. It takes it away from the number distances, its too easy to go from I'm at 5 miles to its only 21 left to go!

Thank you for this, I often struggle mentally on my long runs and its even happened during some of my Half Marathons where Ill hit like mile 5 and be like "oh jeez I'm not even half how am I gonna finish this" but the whole thing about breaking it up has really helped me, Ill do that with my runs now where say its and 8 miler Ill break into quarters and be like "just gotta run the first 2 miles, that's easy" "Ok now 2 more, see now your halfway" so on and so forth, so having this breakdown really helps for landmarks. I also so a great quote for the marathon that said "Don't think of it as running 26 miles, but think of it as running just 1 mile, 26 times" I think this will become my mantra for the race

like this too!

According to the calculator a VO2max of 37 is equivalent to a vVO2 of 7.68mph or a 7:49 pace. This means a desired goal of a 5:45 marathon pace (13:09) is 59.3% of your VO2max. Most marathon runners are somewhere between 60%-70% (for you 13:01 min/mile to 11:10 min/mile) but elite runners can take the percentage as high as 85%. So a 5:45 pace is perfect for your current fitness level, and even suggests without any other injuries or other factors I'm not aware of you could improve your goal the more you train.

Over the entirety of the marathon you will burn an estimated 3548.2 kcals. Given your pace is 59.3% VO2max, it is estimated that 1928.1 kcals of the 3548.2 total calories burned will come from glucose. Assuming an average female leg muscle mass of 16.8kg (21% of your body weight), you have 1345.5 calories of glucose stored in your leg muscles. This means without tapping into any other source you will have a deficit of 582.7 calories of glucose. The average person can take an additional 100 kcals of glucose from the liver without putting the body in danger, thus your final deficit total is 482.7 calories.

This means that either through a carb loading schedule prior to the race, or a nutrition plan during the race you need to consume an extra 482.7 calories to complete the marathon without hitting the wall at the pace you desire (5:45 marathon) given your current fitness level. This breaks down to 83.9 calories per hour (or 21g of carbs per hour) if you decided to only use a nutrition plan during the race. To properly absorb 21 g of carbs per hour you would need to consume 10.5 ounces of water per hour (in ideal environmental conditions). For your fitness level and desired goal, you are well within striking distance of completing the marathon without having to do any additional carb loading prior to the race. My suggestion would be to make sure to practice with whatever nutrition you decide to use on any runs longer than 90 minutes at about 21g per hour or slightly higher.

Best of Luck and let me know if you have any questions.

Thanks so much for this information! I'm running faster than the time used to calculate goal time... at least i was before I got sick. (At this point I'm worried about getting to the start line.. but still working on seeing myself finishing!)
I'm really blown away by this information, I will have to look at myself as a different runner now! : ) amazing what a little information can do!

Thanks again for the sharing your knowledge and experience here!!

@SunDial I'll check the course later and choose my spot!

Any ideas?

I'm sure experienced runners will give you some great ideas. Some good viewing areas were discussed on around page 134 of this thread!

Are there training apps for this? I was looking at some different ones and it shows starting off running 3 miles a day and ramping up from there...

I used the Galloway 5k Training app. to start. It starts you off slowly by time more than distance. I didn't like the c25k, it was too aggressive for me, but a lot of folks here used it. Maybe some OP's will chime in and give you some input. Also, read the reviews for the apps you're looking at.

I would also go to your local running store and see if they have a running club or group runs. You might have to check around a bit to find one that feels like a fit, but it will be worth it. For Seattle, I believe I've seen some great running and training clubs referenced. I also like runners world magazine. They've had some great articles that have been timely for my training.

Most importantly, come back and post! This is a great cheer zone and you will find great support and info here!

 

[IamTrike]

I am a bit confused on the time constraint, if you are a slower paced runner then you are going to have to get used to running longer to actually complete the marathon, so wouldn't it be necessary to train for running longer then 2.5 hours since you wouldn't be able to complete the marathon in that time?
maybe I just don't understand the inner workings of the Hanson method so forgive me if that's the case

The theory about time bounding training runs is that past a certain point time wise the benefit you get training wise is outweighed by the damage being done to your body. It may give you more confidence because you have run 20+ miles but your body isn't actually any more prepared because of it.

Here is my source for the information.

https://hansonscoachingservices.com/hansons-marathon-method-the-16-miler/

And the book which is a great resource.

The debate is definitely out there. On one side, there are some who state that mentally it is necessary for some to complete the 20+ mile run to have the confidence of going the distance (or length of time). I completely understand this point. In addition, its been argued that you need to train your body to be able to withstand a super long run (like 5.5-6 hours). The other side of the debate are those basing it on what starts to happen to the body after a sustained marathon training pace is taken beyond 3 hours. It takes longer to recover from runs longer than 3 hours, which carries over into the rest of the week's training. Since the debate is still ongoing, I can't give you a clear answer as to which is the better training methodology. If anyone else has any other input to add it would be greatly appreciated. Hope this helps.

. I'm probably in the middle of the road in terms of number of marathons done on this board. I've currently done 11 of them and I've used several different training plans including the furman run less run faster plan and Hanson's training plan. For the first 9 marathons my pace was pretty consistent I ranged between high 3s and about 4:30 for my marathon paces. I ran at least 1 20+ miler training run for each of these and yet I still struggled during the races. I just did marathons 10 and 11 this past week. marathon 10 was a road marathon which I PR'd by 16 minutes. I could have gone faster but a buddy was struggling in the last 6 miles. Through mile 20 I was on pace for a 25 minute PR. Six days later I ran a trail marathon and PR'd that course by about 15 or 20 minutes. Thanks to the Hanson's training plan I am definitely in the best shape of my life. The big change though wasn't in my long run. It is shorter but the pace for that in training hasn't changed drastically. The big change has been the focus and duration of my midweek runs. Midweek tempo and speedwork runs are what really improved my running ability. If you want to get faster and improve your strength those are the workouts I'd be focusing on.

The debate is a very interesting one. Like you have said earlier, faster runners can accomplish both. They are capable of running 20 miles under 3 hours or less. The very fast can do so as a training run of 20 miles a few minutes north of 2 hours. I agree that anything over 3 hours does more damage than good, and also feel that a 20 mile training run is a big confidence builder. Its a hard decision to make on which way to go. Just a random thought about the 20 mile rule is that it has been around for a while. As in when it was originally a rule a thumb, most folks attempting the marathon could complete a 20 miler near 3 hours or ~ 9:00 pace. More people of different abilities are now taking on the challenge of a marathon and I think this is why we have the debate on how to approach training. I think for each individual, the choice comes down to which program will boost their confidence the most leading up to race day. It should also be noted that ones marathon training pace should be much slower than race pace, unless of course you have a workout the includes MRP miles during your long run. Even then, the entire run isn't at race pace. This number varies but is anywhere from 30 to 90 seconds slower than goal pace. The idea here is to get you accustomed to being on your feet for a long period of time, (like you will be during the race) but at a much more comfortable pace. If that is the approach being used, it is also important to get some midweek miles in at MRP once in a while. I think I am just rambling at this point as ideas or lessons I have been taught pop into my head. Time to step away from the keyboard.

(I will admit that my theory on the 20 mile rule could be flawed as I have not put in the research on when it became popular)

your statement about the 20 mile rule is correct it is an older one.

I agree with the rest of your comments too

 

[margitmouse]

I had this link sent to me today and I couldn't stop laughing. I have to put it here for you all. It has some profanity so if you don't like that stuff (it's not bad) don't read it. I just don't want to offend anyone.

http://www.buzzfeed.com/sallytamarkin/no-youre-wearing-too-much-neon#.mmLYBVml3J

I am guilty of quite a few of these.

 

[SarahDisney]

So, to entirely change the topic...
How are people doing on costumes?

I just finished a 2.5 hour sewing marathon making a lot of progress on what may be the skirt for my 5K costume. I have a little more work to do before I can test it out, and if the skirt works out okay, I'll be DisneyBounding Ariel's pink dress.
I also got the fabric for my 10K skirt (Dumbo - yellow and red) in today, and probably be starting work on that next week. My goal is to have the costumes done by the end of November so that I can take them for test runs in December (it takes me a while to get things done because I do all of my sewing by hand).

 

[Z-Knight]

I just finished a 2.5 hour sewing marathon ...

That's a fast pace, good job. Did you have to take any GU to make it through? Most importantly, what's the medal like?

 

[Neoflynn]

The debate is a very interesting one. Like you have said earlier, faster runners can accomplish both. They are capable of running 20 miles under 3 hours or less. The very fast can do so as a training run of 20 miles a few minutes north of 2 hours. I agree that anything over 3 hours does more damage than good, and also feel that a 20 mile training run is a big confidence builder. Its a hard decision to make on which way to go. Just a random thought about the 20 mile rule is that it has been around for a while. As in when it was originally a rule a thumb, most folks attempting the marathon could complete a 20 miler near 3 hours or ~ 9:00 pace. More people of different abilities are now taking on the challenge of a marathon and I think this is why we have the debate on how to approach training. I think for each individual, the choice comes down to which program will boost their confidence the most leading up to race day. It should also be noted that ones marathon training pace should be much slower than race pace, unless of course you have a workout the includes MRP miles during your long run. Even then, the entire run isn't at race pace. This number varies but is anywhere from 30 to 90 seconds slower than goal pace. The idea here is to get you accustomed to being on your feet for a long period of time, (like you will be during the race) but at a much more comfortable pace. If that is the approach being used, it is also important to get some midweek miles in at MRP once in a while. I think I am just rambling at this point as ideas or lessons I have been taught pop into my head. Time to step away from the keyboard.

This makes sense, I guess I was looking at it from a personal point of view, as has been mentioned before here distance running is a mental game and its a thing that I have struggled with a bit recently, so for me I like that my plan (Nike+ Running App Beginner Marathon if anyone is curious) takes me up to 22 miles before race day because I feel that if I can nail that training run it will give me the boost I need mentally on race day. But I see the flip side of it as well where running too many long runs could be damaging, I have been trying to take my long runs at a slower pace but I tend to stick around what I think I will run on marathon day, My half PR is just a bit over 9 min miles but I know I wont be able to run that for a full so ive been trying to run around 10-10:30 per mile and this feels very comfortable for me and something that I should be able to maintain for the longer distance

http://www.buzzfeed.com/sallytamarkin/no-youre-wearing-too-much-neon#.mmLYBVml3J

Thanks for the laugh...

 

[mrsg00fy]

That link was hilarious. I'm still baffled by the hatred of treadmills though. I like training on the treadmill. If mine broke down I would be out buying a new one the same day. I started with the treadmill as a method of exercise for weight control and still view that as the primary purpose although I am also training for some upcoming races as well. I like the controlled temp environment and I watch tv or listen to music. I have never been bored.

 

[Pixie Heart]

Good job, @SarahDisney ! I am way behind you.
The only thing I got so far is the yellow legging for my Daisy Duck costume...nothing else! hahaha
I should probably start my Mary Poppins (white dress) costume as soon as possible, because I should probably give the hat a try during my trainings.

 

[cavepig]

So, to entirely change the topic...
How are people doing on costumes?

I just finished a 2.5 hour sewing marathon making a lot of progress on what may be the skirt for my 5K costume. I have a little more work to do before I can test it out, and if the skirt works out okay, I'll be DisneyBounding Ariel's pink dress.
I also got the fabric for my 10K skirt (Dumbo - yellow and red) in today, and probably be starting work on that next week. My goal is to have the costumes done by the end of November so that I can take them for test runs in December (it takes me a while to get things done because I do all of my sewing by hand).

I'm almost done with all 4 of mine, I need to attach a lot of pieces to my run clothes when it gets closer, but yesterday I sewed a tail (stuffed and all)...I'm pretty proud of it, testing it on a run out here should be interesting for sure. My ideas are a little out there but I'm having fun with it, if only training would be the same Sewing your own skirts is cool & by hand, that's impressive.

With regards to training and the 20 miler, I did one last December before the marathon, but don't plan on it again, it was just too long. I'll max at 3 hrs or 16 miles this time. My first marathon 8 yrs ago I didn't go beyond 14 in training but my weekly mileage was up there. My plan is to have higher weekly mileage, but we'll see.

 

[SarahDisney]

That's a fast pace, good job. Did you have to take any GU to make it through? Most importantly, what's the medal like?

Well, I'm a Clif Shot girl personally, but I made it through this marathon with nothing but water. Yeah, I know, that probably wasn't the best idea. I did have a chocolate chip cookie for recovery.
Although the lame thing about this marathon was no medal ... really, I don't know if I'll do this one again. It's not worth it if there's no medal and all I get is a little pain from pricking myself with the sewing needle.

That link was hilarious. I'm still baffled by the hatred of treadmills though. I like training on the treadmill. If mine broke down I would be out buying a new one the same day. I started with the treadmill as a method of exercise for weight control and still view that as the primary purpose although I am also training for some upcoming races as well. I like the controlled temp environment and I watch tv or listen to music. I have never been bored.

I don't mind the treadmill for walks or short runs. I could walk for an hour on the treadmill, but if I'm running for more than 3-4 miles, it bothers me. For me, there are a few reasons, but boredom isn't really one of them. One big one is that my treadmill automatically stops after an hour, so I'd have to start from scratch partway through my run, which bothers me. Also, the sound of the belt at higher speeds starts to bother me after a while, even if I have music or TV on. But the biggest problem I have with it is that I don't feel it translates to outdoor running - I don't think that (for me) being able to run a given distance on the treadmill means I can definitely run the same distance outdoors. It's too controlled of an environment for me, and since races will be a little unpredictable, I'd rather run in a slightly less predictable environment (obviously this is irrelevant if you're just using it for weight control).
I think it is a very personal thing, though.

Good job, @SarahDisney ! I am way behind you.
The only thing I got so far is the yellow legging for my Daisy Duck costume...nothing else! hahaha
I should probably start my Mary Poppins (white dress) costume as soon as possible, because I should probably give the hat a try during my trainings.

You've still got some time to work on it! But yes, I definitely recommend training in the hat. I've worn things when running that I didn't think would bother me but really did. You don't want to get to the race and have the hat bother you while you're running!

I'm almost done with all 4 of mine, I need to attach a lot of pieces to my run clothes when it gets closer, but yesterday I sewed a tail (stuffed and all)...I'm pretty proud of it, testing it on a run out here should be interesting for sure. My ideas are a little out there but I'm having fun with it, if only training would be the same

Wow, you're doing even better than me - I've only got 2 costumes and I'm not done with either one.
I'm impressed that you're running in a tail - I've seen people do it and I don't know how you can manage to run without it bothering you!
And yeah, it really would be great if the training was as much fun as making the costumes ...

 

[FFigawi]

That link was hilarious. I'm still baffled by the hatred of treadmills though. I like training on the treadmill. If mine broke down I would be out buying a new one the same day. I started with the treadmill as a method of exercise for weight control and still view that as the primary purpose although I am also training for some upcoming races as well. I like the controlled temp environment and I watch tv or listen to music. I have never been bored.

I envy you. I have to do most of my runs on a treadmill these days, and while an hour or two is tolerable with an iPad, when the time gets up to the three or four hour mark, it's just plain awful.

 

[cavepig]

Wow, you're doing even better than me - I've only got 2 costumes and I'm not done with either one.
I'm impressed that you're running in a tail - I've seen people do it and I don't know how you can manage to run without it bothering you!
And yeah, it really would be great if the training was as much fun as making the costumes ...

Well I've run in a small crochet one for the Disneyland Half as Dumbo...this tail is stuffed and like 2 feet, we shall see, not sure if it will be for the 5k, 10k or half, not the full for sure. Luckily our weather is still decent so hopefully I can get a test run in it before it turns too cold. The tail (and some spikes & horns) are my only sewing, the rest is regular running clothes with paint or laminated pieces and then one has a crochet hair piece. I'll need to share pictures when they are all done.

 

[LSUlakes]

That link was hilarious. I'm still baffled by the hatred of treadmills though. I like training on the treadmill. If mine broke down I would be out buying a new one the same day. I started with the treadmill as a method of exercise for weight control and still view that as the primary purpose although I am also training for some upcoming races as well. I like the controlled temp environment and I watch tv or listen to music. I have never been bored.

I dislike the TM and the only time I use one is if its hot outside and I have 8 or miles to get in. I enjoy my outdoor runs like I had yesterday evening. I started a few minutes before sunset and get to see all of the colors of the sky, the ducks and geese come to roost, and the peacefulness of being outdoors. The TM is loud, and watching TV/listening to music is one of the last things I want to do while running. I also feel very weird after finishing a run on a TM, similar to the feeling you have when you get off a boat after a full day of fishing. I deal with it on the occasion I get to salt water fish because redfish on the half shell is amazing! With the TM your pace is predetermined and only varies by your control, as in when I run outside I am forced to think about keeping a steady pace and get a very good idea of what it takes to maintain that pace.
I know its probably an overrated experience, but running in the snow sounds like an awesome idea. the closest thing I have come to actually getting snow is some sleet about two years ago. I ran in it and it was awesome. I hope it snows this year here in Baton Rouge!