light room ? about exporting = darker than the photo before export

[jann1033]

i have been processing my stuff into srgb then exporting to my main photo folders since i 'm still using the beta lightroom. however they look just a little darker when i export...same computer , same monitor, any idea what would be doing that? before i was saving as rgb but since mpix prints as srgb they looked washed out after printing so i went to srgb. sometimes not a problem but sometimes esp in b&w/darker photo it's enough to lose some details in shadows. i could lighten up a little but that would be kind of a pain to have to keep redoing/resaving it till i got the right look after export if there is someway i can get it to look the same as it does in lightroom before i export the first time i export

 

[SWDopey]

Are we talking raw files or jpegs? And how are you viewing the exported sRGB files?

 

[jann1033]

i shoot raw , the processed files i am exporting as jpg. I'm viewing them on the same computer and monitor so it's not that. as far as i can tell it's not doing any kind of automatic preset when it exports( the beta doesn't have a help). but they are definitely darker . when i view the jpg in lightroom it looks the same as when i did it. when i view it in photoshop it looks the same...however, this morning i noticed the change must be when i download it to zenfolio since when i look at the same photo before and after it's downloaded to there it's darker after it's downloaded. so guess i need to ask there why that would be. i know they do some conversion since they print as mpix but i thought by doing it myself and saving to srgb( what they convert to) i would be alleviating that.

 

[DueyDooDah]

Two things:

1) I had this same issue with LR 1.x until I calibrated my monitors. After using Spyder 2, the issue went away.

2) I have seen on the LR 2 beta forum that there are color issues (I don't remeber what the issues were). These are being addressed in the final release.

 

[jann1033]

since i'm only using one monitor shouldn't it show up the same no matter what program i open it in?

i looked at the files on my computer, as the jpg in light room and jpg opened into photoshop , they all looked fine/the same. but once i downloaded to zenfolio they darkened.. i asked about it on their forum but nothing yet...not sure why they would do that...would it necessarily mean it's something on zen or could it be reading the file i created in lightroom wrong due to lightroom?

interesting about the color problems though as i got some prints from mpix that looked much less saturated than what they looked like on zen...they were rgb and that is why i started saving as srgb so they would print the way i saved them...but maybe it was something with lightroom after all...i wanted to get some prints made but guess i'll wait till i get all this worked out since i don't want to just flush $$$ down the drain.

i think i might be compulsively picky bordering on insanity anyway so probably will never be happy

 

[SWDopey]

DueyDooDah, the colour issues you're referring to are people complaining that Lightroom doesn't render their raw files in the same way as the camera... which is entirely true, because the camera manufacturers don't share their settings. Watch this space though.

Jann, let's address one or two points then.

The logic that since you're only using one monitor, the files should be the same in all programs works on a Mac, as they're colour managed at operating system level. It doesn't work on Windows though - each program has to do its own colour management, and most don't bother. So Lightroom and Photoshop are colour managed, but web browsers, Windows Picture and Fax Viewer, and numerous other programs aren't. So ignore all of the other programs for now, and let's focus on LR/PS.

If the re-imported exported jpeg (confused yet? ) is the same in LR as the version that you exported, that's great. One thing down. And it looks right in PS too. Great, two things down.

Now, what are your export settings? If you're exporting for the web (Zenfolio etc) or for other non-colour-managed programs (desktop, screensaver, windows picture viewer, etc) or for consumer labs (walmart, mpix etc) then you want to export as sRGB. It still won't be a 100% perfect match as those programs aren't colour managed, but it's as close as you'll get.

How are we doing so far?

 

[SWDopey]

Ok, next... (my browser's doing funny things at the mo, I didn't want to lose all that typing!!)

Now, do those exported sRGB files look about right in Zenfolio, as compared to Lightroom? Again, won't be a perfect match as it's not colour managed. You could download Firefox 3 and google how to turn on the colour management - that'll get you closer.

Ok, then we're onto getting your prints right. Now, have you calibrated your monitor using a hardware calibration device? Because if you haven't, don't expect to get an accurate match, although we can get a darn sight closer yet, I'm sure.

 

[Steve's Girl]

Jann - I've had some of the same issues with prints being "washed out" from Mpix. I have since started requesting that they not color correct my prints and so far I have been happier. Although, I have only received one or two print orders since I started doing that. I also found that they were printing my photos on the "cool" side. I have color calibrated my monitor, but am not sure how it matches to their printers. I've spent hours trying to figure out this color issue with getting my prints right. It drives me crazy!

 

[jann1033]

Jann - I've had some of the same issues with prints being "washed out" from Mpix. I have since started requesting that they not color correct my prints and so far I have been happier. Although, I have only received one or two print orders since I started doing that. I also found that they were printing my photos on the "cool" side. I have color calibrated my monitor, but am not sure how it matches to their printers. I've spent hours trying to figure out this color issue with getting my prints right. It drives me crazy!

i did have color correction off ( actually i think i have "don't touch anything" on ) but i do think from what i read that was due to the rgb since (if i recall) the srgb is less saturated/ has a smaller color gamut so when you convert rgb to srgb ( which zen and mpix do) the colors end up washed out looking compared to the rgb
i haven't ordered anything since i changed it all to srgb so can't say how it would look, better worse or no change. although it's odd because i didn't really notice with orders i had before this last one...

 

[Steve's Girl]

i did have color correction off ( actually i think i have "don't touch anything" on ) but i do think from what i read that was due to the rgb since (if i recall) the srgb is less saturated/ has a smaller color gamut so when you convert rgb to srgb ( which zen and mpix do) the colors end up washed out looking compared to the rgb
i haven't ordered anything since i changed it all to srgb so can't say how it would look, better worse or no change. although it's odd because i didn't really notice with orders i had before this last one...

I've always used sRBG, so I can't blame it on that. I'm sure it's some form of user error on my end. I just can't seem to figure out exactly where the error is.

 

[jann1033]

Ok, next... (my browser's doing funny things at the mo, I didn't want to lose all that typing!!)

Now, do those exported sRGB files look about right in Zenfolio, as compared to Lightroom? Again, won't be a perfect match as it's not colour managed. You could download Firefox 3 and google how to turn on the colour management - that'll get you closer.

Ok, then we're onto getting your prints right. Now, have you calibrated your monitor using a hardware calibration device? Because if you haven't, don't expect to get an accurate match, although we can get a darn sight closer yet, I'm sure.

i downloaded the color manager and zen is slightly cooler for color than lightroom but i have to really look to see the difference, but still considerably darker in the shadows for b&w. i can't really remember if i converted all the b&w to srgb since i wasn't sure how much of an effect it would have on B&w anyway . i know i have lightroom set up to save as srgb so anything recent would be for sure and those are still darker.

my printer on the other hand is way way way way off doesn't matter cause i never use it to print photos cause i don't like the way they turn out.

i'll have to get a calibration device but i was kind of waiting since i figure my monitor is so old it practically is hand tinted black and white not sure how or if i could calibrate it or not since none of the menu options on it work very well
hopefully a new computer is in sight in a few months if all goes well, the house doesn't blow up, the cars fall apart, etc etc etc

 

[SWDopey]

Do you want to drop me the exported file Jann, and a link to the zenfolio version, and I'll check it out for you. http://vbftp.net - username webupload, password 123