Kids in booster seat rule.

[wfloyd]

We kept our oldest in a booster seat until a couple of weeks ago. He is a little over 9 and was 54 inches/83 pounds at his last physical. However the doctor said it was safer for him to be out of the booster seat and using the regular seat belts.

 

[Colleen27]

The stats I am seeing list motor vehicle accidents as the leading cause of death

"Leading" is subjective, though, and in the case of children it doesn't take large numbers to claim that top spot simply because so few children die from illness.

Top 10 causes of death by age, from the CDC - http://www.cdc.gov/Injury/wisqars/pdf/10LCD-Age-Grp-US-2009-a.pdf.

Notice that the leading cause of death for 5-9yos - accidents - represents less than 800 deaths per year (out of roughly 20.5 million children in that age range as of the '10 census)

If you take it a step further and look at the detailed breakdown of the accidental death category you find that car accidents represent only about half the total, so if the causes were reported separately on the main cause of death list cancer, not accidents, would occupy the top spot.

Breakdown of the accidental death category, again from the CDC - http://www.cdc.gov/Injury/wisqars/p...ing_Unintentional_Injury Deaths_US_2009-a.pdf

Are you trying to argue that booster and child restraints do not make a child safer in the event of a car accident?

Not at all. I'm arguing that for an older child (over 8) the risk reduction is minimal, and that it isn't unreasonable to reach a conclusion other than "safety above all else" in light of the data regarding this specific risk.

 

[nchulka]

Remember back in the day when you would ride in the back windshield of the car or ride in the back of the truck. Lol. Those were the days.

Ahhh, the good old days before America became obsessed with being perfectly safe 100% of the time I seriously see poor little kids at the roller rink with helmets on!!! My in-laws have a 69 VW bug car that doesn't even have any seatbelts, my kiddos LOVE to ride in it! Remember the backwards seats in station wagons, or piling into the back of a pick-up, I miss the days of sanity.

 

[LittleMissMagic]

Our culture is obsessed with risk reduction, to the point of an "at any cost" attitude about it, and we very seldom stop to look at the real facts about the risk we're reducing.

This is a little OT, but I completely agree. My biggest complaint of risk reduction was the stupid HPV shots that my mother made me take because they "reduce the risk" of cervical cancer. I don't want cervical cancer, but at the same time, I don't see how there is really proof that the shot worked or didn't work. If I get cervical cancer, then they'll just say that the shot only reduced my risk, but wasn't prevention... and if I don't, they're going to claim success of the shot, when really, maybe I was never going to get cervical cancer, anyway. My mother, however, didn't buy into my reasoning and instead bought into the HPV shot fad (I hear they no longer offer what I took), and I had to get the most painful shot ever three times. Miserable! And it could've all been for nothing... who will ever be able to tell?

I'm not sure if I buy this whole "risk reduction" obsession.... because it's not risk prevention. There isn't solid proof that it works. Not saying this necessarily applies to booster seats (my HPV scenerio could be twisted that way, though... your kid gets seriously injured in a car accident not sitting in a booster seat, then he should've been sitting in a booster seat... if he was sitting in a booster seat, then that only helped prevent how injured he got... but no telling how much), but it seems that with many of the risk reduction methods, someone is profiting. And it could very well be for a good cause.... but there is no denying that there is marketing involved.

 

[Diznygrl]

If I followed the 4'9" rule, I'd be in a car seat at the age of 31 (and for the rest of my life, of course!). Fortunately the shoulder belt in my car fits comfortably and doesn't dig into my neck. But even if it did, there are little attachments you can buy to make the belt fit properly. I do have a cushion that I use to drive so I can see out and reach the pedals.

I'm seriously waiting for the day where it will be the law for everyone to wear a helmet when inside a car.

 

[Planogirl]

If I followed the 4'9" rule, I'd be in a car seat at the age of 31 (and for the rest of my life, of course!). Fortunately the shoulder belt in my car fits comfortably and doesn't dig into my neck. But even if it did, there are little attachments you can buy to make the belt fit properly. I do have a cushion that I use to drive so I can see out and reach the pedals.

I'm seriously waiting for the day where it will be the law for everyone to wear a helmet when inside a car.

While motorcyclists don't have to. It's a wacky world.

 

[Bungle]

No offense but if you're insisting on taking safety to its highest level you should insist on helmets and knee pads in the car as well. I think it gets rediculous to a point. I still think it is safe to put children in a decent car (air bags more safety features etc) with just a safety belt and feel like we can get across town ok.

I take no offense. I just prefer my kids safe over cool. It is each parents decision.

Our culture is obsessed with risk reduction, to the point of an "at any cost" attitude about it, and we very seldom stop to look at the real facts about the risk we're reducing. Heck, there was a thread on the theme parks board a few days ago about taking an 11yo boy into the ladies room for fear something would happen to him using the men's room or waiting for his mother outside.

According to the NHTSA only 19% of children that should be in a booster seat actually use one. Still, for 2009 - the most recent stats I have on hand - car accidents accounted for fewer than 400 deaths of 5-9yos (nearly all of whom should be in boosters) and fewer than 500 of 10-14yos (the age group under discussion by many of us who "sacrifice safety" due to social/peer concerns). Boosters reduce risk, but at the older/bigger end of the recommended age/weight/height range it is a small reduction, not the huge difference you see in the statistics for babies and toddlers.

Death is not the only consequence of having your kids improperly secured. Like I said if you feel like you can not be part of a statistic or have some magical bubble that prevents your kids from being hurt it is your decision. However with that decision can come a lot of heartbreak.

 

[PaulaSB12]

I looked up the UK rules its 5ft 4 or twelve,


Children aged 3 and above, until they reach EITHER their 12th birthday OR 135cm in height

In the Front Seat

The child MUST use the correct child restraint.

In the Rear Seat

The child MUST use the correct restraint, where seat belts are fitted.

There are three exceptions where there is not a child seat available. In each case the child MUST use the adult belt instead. They are -

1) in a licensed taxi or private hire vehicle;

2) if the child is travelling on a short distance for reason of unexpected necessity;

3) if there are two occupied child restraints in the rear which prevent the fitment of a third.

In addition, a child 3 and over may travel unrestrained in the rear seat of a vehicle if seat belts are not available.

It is the driver's legal responsibility to ensure that the child is correctly restrained.

 

[Coconut36]

"Leading" is subjective, though, and in the case of children it doesn't take large numbers to claim that top spot simply because so few children die from illness.

Top 10 causes of death by age, from the CDC - http://www.cdc.gov/Injury/wisqars/pdf/10LCD-Age-Grp-US-2009-a.pdf.

Notice that the leading cause of death for 5-9yos - accidents - represents less than 800 deaths per year (out of roughly 20.5 million children in that age range as of the '10 census)

If you take it a step further and look at the detailed breakdown of the accidental death category you find that car accidents represent only about half the total, so if the causes were reported separately on the main cause of death list cancer, not accidents, would occupy the top spot.

Breakdown of the accidental death category, again from the CDC - http://www.cdc.gov/Injury/wisqars/p...ing_Unintentional_Injury Deaths_US_2009-a.pdf



Not at all. I'm arguing that for an older child (over 8) the risk reduction is minimal, and that it isn't unreasonable to reach a conclusion other than "safety above all else" in light of the data regarding this specific risk.

And how exactly are you determining that the risk reduction is "minimal" for children 8 and up? The reality is if the seat belt does not fit the child properly it will not work to safely restrain them and that results in greater risk of death or serious/permanent injury. It's why many of us have said the height/weight requirements are the more important thing not the age. If the child is not tall enough or heavy enough then the seat belt is not going to help. If however they were in a booster the seat belt would then fit the body properly resulting in reduced risk of injury or death. There is plenty of data that supports this. It's really not so difficult to understand.

I personally could never live with myself if I made the decision to not keep my kid in a booster and they died or were seriously injured. If you can live with that decision that is your business. Your choice is on your shoulders not mine. My choice to restrain my child to a certain height/weight doesn't harm or impact you (although your choice will likely lead to your child teasing another because you have taught them it is unimportant/wrong to be restrained past a certain age) so I guess I can't see why someone would argue that someone shouldn't keep their child in a restraint as they see fit for height/weight.

 

[Familyof4lovesDW]

In OH it is 8 years old I know for sure. Just because it says 8 does not mean the booster gets thrown out at 8. They are supose to be n it the whle time they are 8, so theroetically, they get out on their 9th bday.

BTW DS asked the cops, because he wanted out. They are the ones that said once you turn 9 you can get out, regardless of height and weight.

 

[alex9179]

My son will be 8 in three weeks and we're counting the days until we can ditch the booster. My kids are big for their age and his head almost hits the ceiling, but the law says 8. He was also rear facing to 1....with his knees up around his ears. I work in healthcare and fully understand the why (having worked cases where kids aren't properly restrained) but the law gets silly sometimes in both directions.

I would double check this. Our state law does list an age, but it also has the minimum height. If the child has reached 4'9", but is six, then the booster is not required by law.

 

[Colleen27]

And how exactly are you determining that the risk reduction is "minimal" for children 8 and up?

Because the risk is minimal to begin with - a few hundred deaths in a nation with millions of children.

I personally could never live with myself if I made the decision to not keep my kid in a booster and they died or were seriously injured. If you can live with that decision that is your business. Your choice is on your shoulders not mine. My choice to restrain my child to a certain height/weight doesn't harm or impact you (although your choice will likely lead to your child teasing another because you have taught them it is unimportant/wrong to be restrained past a certain age) so I guess I can't see why someone would argue that someone shouldn't keep their child in a restraint as they see fit for height/weight.

I'm not one to play the coulda/shoulda game over past decisions (and I've had that tested under difficult curcumstances) so yes, this is a risk I'm comfortable with. I know a lot of parents with an "I could never live with myself..." feeling about many things that I don't consider risky enough to avoid, from my son playing football to letting my kids bike to school to giving them some age-appropriate freedom when we're traveling. Accidents happen. Not all risk can be prevented. And I'm comfortable with that.

BTW, bullying isn't a risk associated with booster seat use. Just because we don't use one doesn't mean my kids have the sort of personality that would make fun of others for doing so. My DD is bookish, wears glasses, isn't into pop culture, and has a very unusual/ethnic last name... She's been teased enough to know it doesn't feel good, and she's not one to tease others.

 

[alex9179]

In OH it is 8 years old I know for sure. Just because it says 8 does not mean the booster gets thrown out at 8. They are supose to be n it the whle time they are 8, so theroetically, they get out on their 9th bday.

BTW DS asked the cops, because he wanted out. They are the ones that said once you turn 9 you can get out, regardless of height and weight.

Ohio has the same law as Tx. Must use a booster until 8 yrs old OR 4'9". If the kids is 4'9" the booster is not required no matter what the age. Alternatively, if the kid is 9 but shorter that the min. height, the booster is not required. However, I would use one until the kid fit the seat properly and utilize a belt-positioning apparatus if the shoulder harness didn't lay properly.

 

[laughinplace199]

I didn't follow the 4 ft 9 rule, but my kids were in booster seats for quite some time.

DD is petite and was in a booster until the beginning of 5th grade. At that point, even though she wasn't 4 ft 9, she could sit properly in the seat with her knees bent, feet touching the floor, seatbelt not hitting her neck, etc.

DS is two years younger than DD but almost the same height. She is all torso and he is all legs, so he was still in a booster when she was done with hers. I don't recall exactly when he stopped using it, but he wasn't in it by the end of 4th grade.

Another poster mentioned never seeing a 5 yr old in a 5 point harness. Well, I have one. I'd love to put DS in a booster seat, it would be much easier this fall in the carpool line at school as well as going to playdates in his friends' cars. But, the little guy just won't put on enough weight to hit that 40 pound mark (he's been hovering at 36-37 lbs for almost a year) and I can't find a booster that is made for kids under 40 lbs. So, until he gains a few more pounds, he will be in his 5 pt harness.

 

[morethananyonex]

I choose not to gamble with my child's life. To each their own.

 

[Bren's Mom]

As a CPST, I'd just like to clear some things up:

Seat belts are designed to fit and protect adult males.

State laws vary by state, and each state sets a minimum (height/weight/age or some combination of those) after which a child is not legally required to use a booster.

Once a child reaches the legal minimum, that does not automatically mean the child is safe using just the adult seat belt.

(This is similar to state laws that say infants MUST rear-face to at least age 1 and 20lbs. It doesn't state they should ONLY rear-face to that age/weight, only that that is the legal minimum in that state.)

The 4'9" is a best practice recommendation, but even that is flawed. A child who is 4'9" with a very short torso might still not fit in the adult belt correctly.

The BEST PRACTICE for optimal safety is first booster to the legal minimum for your state then do the 5 Step Test in each vehicle. This helps you to determine whether the adult belt fits properly. If it does, great! If not, a booster should continue to be used in that vehicle until the child passes the test. Try again every few months. And a child might fit well in 1 vehicle and not in another, or fit well in one row of a multi row vehicle and not in another.

Link to the 5 Step Test for those interested:

http://www.carseat.org/Boosters/630.htm

 

[TheIncredibles!]

Does anyone actually follow the 4ft 9in rule on boosterseats? My son is 4'5 and going in the 4th grade. If we followed the rule I guess most kids wouldn't be out of the seat till 5th or 6th grade. Even though I know it's safest, I can't imagine putting my 4th grader in a booster. Anyone follow this? Opinions?

For the safety of my child - yes I absolutely followed the booster seat rule. Here in NJ it is not (or at least was not) based on height but age/weight. 8 years/80 lbs. None of my kids aged 14, 11 and 8 are 80 lbs. Because my two oldest are very small for their age I kept them all in booster seats till my youngest turned 8. At that time my oldest was 13 and my middle child was 10.

All three of my kids are pretty much the same size. They all wear size 8 clothing, are all within a few inches of each other in height and all weigh between 50 and 60 lbs.

Safety first in this house.

 

[The Wise One]

I'm only 4'11 so I would have been in a booster seat until I was about 15-16 and there is NO WAY my mother would have gotten me to do that.

I don't ever remember being in a booster seat. I remember riding to kindergarten in the front seat of my mom's car. (I'm 24 so this would have been in 1993) not sure what the laws were then?

One of my nephews quit riding in a booster seat when it came time for kindergarten because he was made fun of. I didn't see any of the other kids in his class in booster seats either.

My niece will be 8 this year and still rides in a booster and gets made fun of for it, I feel bad for her.

I don't have any children yet but I don't think I'll keep them in the seat past 7 or 8 years old because socially I don't want them to be made fun of/bullied like I was growing up.

 

[luvsJack]

DD has a friend that chose to start riding the bus to school so that she could get out of the booster seat. She gave her mom different reasons but told her friends she couldn't stand everyone seeing her in that seat.

She was probably 8 or 9 then. She's 14 now and still has not hit 4'9",

 

[Coconut36]

I'm only 4'11 so I would have been in a booster seat until I was about 15-16 and there is NO WAY my mother would have gotten me to do that.

I don't ever remember being in a booster seat. I remember riding to kindergarten in the front seat of my mom's car. (I'm 24 so this would have been in 1993) not sure what the laws were then?

One of my nephews quit riding in a booster seat when it came time for kindergarten because he was made fun of. I didn't see any of the other kids in his class in booster seats either.

My niece will be 8 this year and still rides in a booster and gets made fun of for it, I feel bad for her.

I don't have any children yet but I don't think I'll keep them in the seat past 7 or 8 years old because socially I don't want them to be made fun of/bullied like I was growing up.

So other kids saying something trumps safety? I don't understand when people say things like that.

In 1993 it is possible the laws were different. One stat I was looking at showed a correlation in changes in restrain laws (use of car seats, boosters, rear facing to a certain age and so on) and reduction in deaths by year for the given age group. It was interesting to see (but I can't seem to find it again to post) the connection between use and reduction in death/serious injury.