Kids in booster seat rule.

[morethananyonex]

So other kids saying something trumps safety? I don't understand when people say things like that.

In 1993 it is possible the laws were different. One stat I was looking at showed a correlation in changes in restrain laws (use of car seats, boosters, rear facing to a certain age and so on) and reduction in deaths by year for the given age group. It was interesting to see (but I can't seem to find it again to post) the connection between use and reduction in death/serious injury.

I don't understand that either. If a kid gets made fun of for wearing a seat belt does that mean he no longer has to wear it? How about sitting in the back seat?

As for the "good ole days" how many people do you know that walked away from an accident without seat belts unharmed? How many babies that didnt have carseats actually got into accidents and survived? I don't understand some people.

 

[Coconut36]

I don't understand that either. If a kid gets made fun of for wearing a seat belt does that mean he no longer has to wear it? How about sitting in the back seat?

As for the "good ole days" how many people do you know that walked away from an accident without seat belts unharmed? How many babies that didnt have carseats actually got into accidents and survived? I don't understand some people.

This exactly! I don't parent in a manner where something like "my friends don't do that" influences life/death and safety decisions for my kids. Some things are non negotiable. I agree if the kid said "well Susie makes fun of me for wearing a seat belt" would you say "OK no seat belt" because after all..wouldn't want another kid to say something, right? Johnny got made fun of because you don't want him to ride down the middle of the road..should you say it's OK to ride in traffic because he might get made fun of?

I also agree about the "old days". For all those that state "I did X and I was just fine" are the lucky ones. The ones that died or were seriously injured aren't here to share their tales are they now? All those helmet less kids in the "good old days" that died, the kids who didn't survive the car accident due to lack of seat belt, the boosterless children, the infants in the wrong seat, no seat..etc are all gone so it seems like "everyone" did fine because people can't see and/or don't realize the number that didn't survive or do OK and they obviously can't chime in on these types of things.

 

[mad madam mim78]

I love how the laws are so strict and the "guidelines" boarder on unreasonable, yet school busses have NO seatbelts at all.

 

[Colleen27]

In 1993 it is possible the laws were different. One stat I was looking at showed a correlation in changes in restrain laws (use of car seats, boosters, rear facing to a certain age and so on) and reduction in deaths by year for the given age group. It was interesting to see (but I can't seem to find it again to post) the connection between use and reduction in death/serious injury.

I don't doubt that. Some of the state laws were scary-lax until rather recently.

When my son, now 14, was little the law was he only had to be in a car seat until his 4th birthday. When that was the standard I did go over and above what the law required, and he got teased some in K & 1st grade about his booster. He's always been thick skinned about stuff like that and it never seemed to bother him - he cared more about being able to see out of the windows and reach his cupholder (built into the booster; there's no way a properly restrained child, even in the shoulder belt, could reach the van's cupholders). And at that age, the social aspect doesn't carry much weight in my mind.

The law changed before my daughter, now 10, was out of a car seat/booster. I think she was probably 5 or 6 when the 8yo rule went into effect because I remember some of her friends' parents' complaining about their kids resisting going back into a carseat, but she'd never been out of one so we didn't have that issue.

 

[The Wise One]

I never called it "the good ole days" I was just remembering that I never had a booster seat. It probably was very dangerous for me to ride in the front seat of the car and I would never do that with my own children.

I was bullied as a child through to my teenage years to the point that I had to leave school and had lots of issues for a long time. I never want my child to go through that. I would always make my child use a seatbelt no matter what other children say but unfortunately a booster seat is viewed as "babyish" and as long as my child is willing to stay in one and they need to be in it they will. However if they attend teased mercilessly and they can wear a seatbelt safely I will take them outbid the seat.

I an sure I will never be a helicopter mom. I feel like do many parents are so ridiculously safety conscious as the expense of their child's childhood.

 

[morethananyonex]

I love how the laws are so strict and the "guidelines" boarder on unreasonable, yet school busses have NO seatbelts at all.

You obviously have no idea about why school buses have no seat belts. They're not the same as regular vehicles in crashes.

 

[Coconut36]

I love how the laws are so strict and the "guidelines" boarder on unreasonable, yet school busses have NO seatbelts at all.

Read up on buses. Buses are built differently than cars so the standards are different. Do you really think the impact to a bus is on par with the impact to a Honda Accord? That the seating is the same? Of course not. Buses rely on compartmentalization for safety. There is also a risk in a bus (especially with young children) utilizing seat belts in the event of an accident children are more easily panicked and could become trapped in the belt and unable to escape. In a car/truck/SUV it is far more manageable to reach your children..a bus full of children..not so much.

It is not remotely valid to compare them to each other as they are not the same in regards to the impact and how they handle a crash or the impact to a child's body in a crash

The interior of a school bus uses a design called ‘compartmentalization’. The purpose of this design is to minimize the impact and injury on students should a collision occur. To achieve this, the seats are made with high backs with padding on the front and back made from impact absorbing material. These seats have strong anchorage and are spaced closely together to create compartments. The premise of this design, backed by vast amounts of continuing research, is that if a collision were to occur, these special compartments would absorb the impact dispersing it throughout the entire body as opposed to solely the head and neck. For this reason, the compartmentalization model is generally more favoured than the seat belt model.

 

[morethananyonex]

I never called it "the good ole days" I was just remembering that I never had a booster seat. It probably was very dangerous for me to ride in the front seat of the car and I would never do that with my own children.

I was bullied as a child through to my teenage years to the point that I had to leave school and had lots of issues for a long time. I never want my child to go through that. I would always make my child use a seatbelt no matter what other children say but unfortunately a booster seat is viewed as "babyish" and as long as my child is willing to stay in one and they need to be in it they will. However if they attend teased mercilessly and they can wear a seatbelt safely I will take them outbid the seat.

I an sure I will never be a helicopter mom. I feel like do many parents are so ridiculously safety conscious as the expense of their child's childhood.

I wasn't quoting you, there's been multiple people who pointed out how awesome it was when no one wore seat belts.

To be blunt, would you rather have a dead kid or a kid who's told they're "babyish"? What are you going to do if your childs peers decide seatbelts are babyish? It's incredibly sad that you feel making sure a child is safe in a car sacrifices their childhood. For your future children's sake I hope your views change once they are more then hypothetical children.

I have a hard time believing children would bully a child so much because of a carseat to the point it would cause them to leave school in their teenage years.

ETA: you would never let your kids ride in the front? What if their friends make fun of them because babies sit in the back?

 

[Colleen27]

I don't understand that either. If a kid gets made fun of for wearing a seat belt does that mean he no longer has to wear it? How about sitting in the back seat?

Everyone is going to draw the line in a different place, based on personal opinions, experiences, research, and comfort levels. There are some risks I'm willing to accept because of a child's opinions - not keeping my middle schooler in a booster seat, letting my son play a sport that has a high risk of injury - and others that I'm not. But in these conversations, the parents who are the most risk-adverse never fail to get on the "I just care more about my child" high horse to look down their noses on the rest of us.

Besides, seat belts are the law. No one here is advocating throwing out the car seat in violation of any laws. A few of us just don't see the sense in making our smaller-than-average kids a target for bullying by insisting they ride in their booster seat to middle school.

 

[Coconut36]

I never called it "the good ole days" I was just remembering that I never had a booster seat. It probably was very dangerous for me to ride in the front seat of the car and I would never do that with my own children.

I was bullied as a child through to my teenage years to the point that I had to leave school and had lots of issues for a long time. I never want my child to go through that. I would always make my child use a seatbelt no matter what other children say but unfortunately a booster seat is viewed as "babyish" and as long as my child is willing to stay in one and they need to be in it they will. However if they attend teased mercilessly and they can wear a seatbelt safely I will take them outbid the seat.

I an sure I will never be a helicopter mom. I feel like do many parents are so ridiculously safety conscious as the expense of their child's childhood.

Are you actually trying to say that keeping your child safely restrained in the car is on par with a RIDICULOUS safety measure? That it is ridiculously safety conscious to make sure the restraints work?

I don't see anyone here stating a child should be in a booster when they safely fit in a seat belt. Most kids however don't magically fit into a seatbelt at 8 years old..some are much smaller than others (50% of kids are going to be under the average height for the age..some by a little and some by a lot). So obviously if a child does not safely fit in a seat belt they should remain in a booster..nobody said keep them in one for the rest of their lives but rather until they meet the minimum height/weight/age requirements to be safely restrained in just the seat belt.

 

[Coconut36]

Everyone is going to draw the line in a different place, based on personal opinions, experiences, research, and comfort levels. There are some risks I'm willing to accept because of a child's opinions - not keeping my middle schooler in a booster seat, letting my son play a sport that has a high risk of injury - and others that I'm not. But in these conversations, the parents who are the most risk-adverse never fail to get on the "I just care more about my child" high horse to look down their noses on the rest of us.

Besides, seat belts are the law. No one here is advocating throwing out the car seat in violation of any laws. A few of us just don't see the sense in making our smaller-than-average kids a target for bullying by insisting they ride in their booster seat to middle school.

But the laws are archaic in most places and are not remotely on par with what is recommended for safety.

By your logic a 5 year old does not need any form of restraint..not a booster and not a seat belt because you feel the law is enough and in my state there is NO law governing restraints of any kind of a child 5 or older in the back seat. Just following the law is inadequate.

 

[morethananyonex]

But the laws are archaic in most places and are not remotely on par with what is recommended for safety.

By your logic a 5 year old does not need any form of restraint..not a booster and not a seat belt because you feel the law is enough and in my state there is NO law governing restraints of any kind of a child 5 or older in the back seat. Just following the law is inadequate.

Yup, this.

The law for turning a child forward facing is a minimum of 1 year. The AAP recommends a minimum of 2 but most say until you meet the limits of the seat. The law is hardly the safest option.

It's not the law to hold your children's hand crossing the street or in parking lots, does that mean its safe to let a toddler run free?

 

[Coconut36]

Yup, this.

The law for turning a child forward facing is a minimum of 1 year. The AAP recommends a minimum of 2 but most say until you meet the limits of the seat. The law is hardly the safest option.

It's not the law to hold your children's hand crossing the street or in parking lots, does that mean its safe to let a toddler run free?

Considering people here seem to equate child safety restraints with ridiculous caution and helicopter parenting I am going to speculate they would think anyone who holds their toddlers hand is just taking ridiculous safety measures and being a helicopter parent!

 

[Colleen27]

But the laws are archaic in most places and are not remotely on par with what is recommended for safety.

By your logic a 5 year old does not need any form of restraint..not a booster and not a seat belt because you feel the law is enough and in my state there is NO law governing restraints of any kind of a child 5 or older in the back seat. Just following the law is inadequate.

Parents need to make that call for themselves. I'd agree that your law is inadequate, and when our law was similarly archaic I kept my kids in boosters beyond what the law required. I believe our law now is acceptable. I don't think kids need to be riding to middle or high school in booster seats, even if that is the current expert recommendation. I've yet to see any data documenting a significant advantage to booster seats for kids older than 8, and as kids age the social element of their lives does gain prominence whether we as parents are willing to acknowledge that or not.

 

[The Wise One]

Are you actually trying to say that keeping your child safely restrained in the car is on par with a RIDICULOUS safety measure? That it is ridiculously safety conscious to make sure the restraints work?

I don't see anyone here stating a child should be in a booster when they safely fit in a seat belt. Most kids however don't magically fit into a seatbelt at 8 years old..some are much smaller than others (50% of kids are going to be under the average height for the age..some by a little and some by a lot). So obviously if a child does not safely fit in a seat belt they should remain in a booster..nobody said keep them in one for the rest of their lives but rather until they meet the minimum height/weight/age requirements to be safely restrained in just the seat belt.

I do not mean keeping a child in a care seat is ridiculous. I was making a general statement that as a society we are becoming WAY too safety conscious.

To be blunt, would you rather have a dead kid or a kid who's told they're "babyish"? What are you going to do if your childs peers decide seatbelts are babyish? It's incredibly sad that you feel making sure a child is safe in a car sacrifices their childhood. For your future children's sake I hope your views change once they are more then hypothetical children.

I have a hard time believing children would bully a child so much because of a carseat to the point it would cause them to leave school in their teenage years.

ETA: you would never let your kids ride in the front? What if their friends make fun of them because babies sit in the back?

I all ready said I would always enforce the seat belt rule. As Colleen27 pointed out

Everyone is going to draw the line in a different place, based on personal opinions, experiences, research, and comfort levels. There are some risks I'm willing to accept because of a child's opinions - not keeping my middle schooler in a booster seat, letting my son play a sport that has a high risk of injury - and others that I'm not. But in these conversations, the parents who are the most risk-adverse never fail to get on the "I just care more about my child" high horse to look down their noses on the rest of us.

Besides, seat belts are the law. No one here is advocating throwing out the car seat in violation of any laws. A few of us just don't see the sense in making our smaller-than-average kids a target for bullying by insisting they ride in their booster seat to middle school.

I completely agree with this statement.

Everyone draws a line somewhere. Not all parents are going to follow the same safety rules. I am simply willing to take more risks with my children than you are with yours. I would never force my child to be in a car seat if they were over the age of 9. I can't imagine a 4th/5th grader being in a car seat, but that is just my opinion. I respect your beliefs but they are not going to change mine.

Considering people here seem to equate child safety restraints with ridiculous caution and helicopter parenting I am going to speculate they would think anyone who holds their toddlers hand is just taking ridiculous safety measures and being a helicopter parent!

I did not say that car seats = helicopter parenting. Again I was simply stating that I feel that many parents keep their children from doing so many things because it isn't "safe". Holding a toddler's hand when crossing the street is common sense, I do it with my nieces every time we cross the street. You are putting words in my mouth.

 

[alex9179]

I an sure I will never be a helicopter mom. I feel like do many parents are so ridiculously safety conscious as the expense of their child's childhood.

Using car seats/boosters as recommended isn't the same as running every minute of your kid's day and it certainly doesn't ruin a kid's childhood. When it comes to traveling among several thousand pounds of vehicles, the laws in place are not ridiculous (really, they are the minimum of safety) and parents who choose to follow the AAP and NHTSA recommendations are not helicopter parents.

For me, it's not about worry but protecting them in the event of a crash. I can't stop a car crash but I can up the chances of my kids coming out of one alive and intact. It's not like you're putting them in a roll cage every time you go somewhere. or refusing to allow them in a car for fear of what might happen.

Maybe it's important to me because still have my dad because of the seatbelt, or that I worked at a children's hospital and saw the aftermath, or because of a sense of responsibility to my kids' other family members, or because I live near Houston where I've encountered the worst driving I've EVER seen.
It really comes down to listening the the manufacturers when they tell you how to use their equipment.

 

[mad madam mim78]

"Mom....I got my period today and it got all over my booster seat.". HahahahahahAhahahahahahaha

 

[Colleen27]

Considering people here seem to equate child safety restraints with ridiculous caution and helicopter parenting I am going to speculate they would think anyone who holds their toddlers hand is just taking ridiculous safety measures and being a helicopter parent!

Really? That's ridiculous. But that's how these conversations always go... Disagree with the safety-at-all-costs thinking and you're a terrible parent who would let a toddler play in traffic.

I do think 4'9" is a ridiculous standard. My SIL would have gone to her freshman Homecoming in a booster seat by that standard (she's 4'11" as an adult), and my youngest likely would too. DD3 isn't on track to be tall enough even to ride Soarin' until she's almost 6, and if she stays where she's at on the curve she'll be 14 and in high school before hitting 4'9".

And I think most parents who claim they will keep their kids in boosters as long as necessary actually have a line too, they just haven't been pushed to it yet. I really don't think any parent is going to send their teenager out the door with a booster seat and a reminder that they aren't big enough to sit up front.

 

[alex9179]

I do not mean keeping a child in a care seat is ridiculous. I was making a general statement that as a society we are becoming WAY too safety conscious.



I all ready said I would always enforce the seat belt rule. As Colleen27 pointed out


Everyone draws a line somewhere. Not all parents are going to follow the same safety rules. I am simply willing to take more risks with my children than you are with yours. I would never force my child to be in a car seat if they were over the age of 9. I can't imagine a 4th/5th grader being in a car seat, but that is just my opinion. I respect your beliefs but they are not going to change mine.



I did not say that car seats = helicopter parenting. Again I was simply stating that I feel that many parents keep their children from doing so many things because it isn't "safe". Holding a toddler's hand when crossing the street is common sense, I do it with my nieces every time we cross the street. You are putting words in my mouth.

Fair enough, I was referring to the topic of the thread and assumed you were to.

Honestly, you have no idea what you'll be ok with if you don't actually have a child. Things change all of the time and being open to those changes is a part of parenting.

I think holding a toddler's hand and making sure the seat belt is positioned properly on a little kid are both common sense actions. Will I require my 4'8" high schooler to be in a booster? No, that's silly. I will make sure the belt isn't across her neck, though.

 

[The Wise One]

Using car seats/boosters as recommended isn't the same as running every minute of your kid's day and it certainly doesn't ruin a kid's childhood. When it comes to traveling among several thousand pounds of vehicles, the laws in place are not ridiculous (really, they are the minimum of safety) and parents who choose to follow the AAP and NHTSA recommendations are not helicopter parents.
.

I was not saying that the booster seat = helicopter parents. I was making a general statement.