Just watched "Song of the South"......

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If Disney didn't release things that somebody somewhere might find offensive, they wouldn't release anything.

Did anyone here collect the Disney "Treasures" series? The ones that were released a few years ago, around the holiday seasons each year, in the silver collectable tins? They have since stopped releasing them, more's the pity, still SO much material they could release.... anyway...

A lot of what was released on those DVD could have been considered "offensive" to someone, somewhere. The older cartoons poked fun of just about every racial stereotype possible. And the WWII era ones were particularily good at this. So at the beginning of each disc, there is a lovely little monologue of a Man in a Suit giving us the speech about "different times, different worlds, different belief systems... may not be suitable for children today, view with caution, etc". Then, having covered their collective legal butts, they went ahead and relesed the cartoons anyway. There was no backlash, the darn things sold like hotcakes, and today, since they are now out of print, they resell for hundreds of dollars.

I own most of them, and my kids watch them and love them, but they have also watched the monologue at the beginning, and they understand the difference between HISTORICAL beliefs and how we believe NOW.

Anyway, I always felt it was a shame they didn't use that platform to release SOTS. It would have been the perfect way to do so.
 
If Disney didn't release things that somebody somewhere might find offensive, they wouldn't release anything.
I mentioned The Princess & The Frog earlier. Here's a rather interesting critique of that film that finds plenty offensive of racial stereotypes in that film that are just as biting as those pointed out in SOTS. And there are also plenty of racial stereotypes the author (and others that I have read) points out that other Disney films contain. From the crows in Dumbo, to the jive-talking monkeys in The Jungle Book, to the brutish portrayal of Huns and the sugar-coating of misogyny in Imperial China in Mulan, to the equation of Native Americans defending their homeland with European attempts to take it as being morally the same in Pocahontas.

But I also agree with other posters that due to the potential of bad PR from some members of the African-American community, that Disney will never release SOTS for purchase. There's really isn't much upside for them to do so. It won't be a sales blockbuster, and they can make money from releasing something else out of the vault.
 
Did anyone here collect the Disney "Treasures" series? The ones that were released a few years ago, around the holiday seasons each year, in the silver collectable tins? They have since stopped releasing them, more's the pity, still SO much material they could release.... anyway...

A lot of what was released on those DVD could have been considered "offensive" to someone, somewhere. The older cartoons poked fun of just about every racial stereotype possible. And the WWII era ones were particularily good at this. So at the beginning of each disc, there is a lovely little monologue of a Man in a Suit giving us the speech about "different times, different worlds, different belief systems... may not be suitable for children today, view with caution, etc". Then, having covered their collective legal butts, they went ahead and relesed the cartoons anyway. There was no backlash, the darn things sold like hotcakes, and today, since they are now out of print, they resell for hundreds of dollars.

I own most of them, and my kids watch them and love them, but they have also watched the monologue at the beginning, and they understand the difference between HISTORICAL beliefs and how we believe NOW.

Anyway, I always felt it was a shame they didn't use that platform to release SOTS. It would have been the perfect way to do so.

Agreed.

How about this? They release it. I want to watch it so I do. If you don't want to watch it, you don't. Simple.
 
By this same logic, someone who happens to have their birthday on September 11 can never celebrate the joy of their birthday because something tragic happened on that same day.

Just because someone celebrates their birthday on Sept 11 does not mean that the tragic events are any less significant.

Sure they can. They are a private citizen but what do you think would happen if Macy's decided to hold a 9/11 linen sales? Can you imagine Lexus holding a "date to remember" sale-abration like they do during Christmas.

There would be an uproar to end all uproars and believe me, I know quite a few people on the victims board. They zealously quard any thing or anyone who wants to use the term "9/11".

Heck, the gave the NFL a whole lot of flak for daring to play games on the 10th anniversary.
 

Agreed.

How about this? They release it. I want to watch it so I do. If you don't want to watch it, you don't. Simple.

How about this, they don't release and then the stockholders don't have to worry about a whole lot of loss revenue from folks picketing them.

Which one do you think they are going to go for?

As a private citizen it is very simple. As a corporation that depends on its good name it's not so very simple.

Do you remember when one of the clothing stores that cater to young adults I think it was Abercrombie and Fitch but I not 100% certain came out with that "ghettonopoly" game? All hell broke lose. And how about when vogue tried to come out with that "plantation or slave" jewelry? They couldn't issue an apology fast enough.

Face it, if you are a public company that wants to make a profit, you do not have the leisure to do what you want and still make money.
 
Sure they can. They are a private citizen but what do you think would happen if Macy's decided to hold a 9/11 sales?

There would be an uproar to end all uproars and believe me, I know quite a few people on the victims board. They zealously quard any thing or anyone who wants to use the term "9/11".

Hell, the gave the NFL a whole lot of flak for wanting to play games on the 10th anniversary.

But, there are just as many of us who believe, that BY making such a huge gigantic fuss over it each time the subject comes up, we deliver the power and the victory back into the hands of the terrorists (or the oppressors) every 9/11.

Remember, but remember with dignity.
 
Sure they can. They are a private citizen but what do you think would happen if Macy's decided to hold a 9/11 sales?

There would be an uproar to end all uproars and believe me, I know quite a few people on the victims board. They zealously quard any thing or anyone who wants to use the term "9/11".

Hell, the gave the NFL a whole lot of flak for wanting to play games on the 10th anniversary.

You're saying that Macy's can't have sale prices on Sept 11? So, everything at Macy's is not on sale but at regular price on 9/11 or it's a slight to the events of 9/11?

Sorry, but I don't get the connection.

Just like I don't get that a black man happily singing in a movie set in the post-slavery era is somehow saying he was happy about being a slave. All it says is that he was experiencing joy at that moment in time and was singing about it.

He wasn't singing "white man boss is whipping me again". He was singing "Zip-a-dee-doo-dah, zip-a-dee-ay. My, oh my what a wonderful day! Plenty of sunshine heading my way. Zip-a-dee-doo-dah, zip-a-dee-ay." Maybe he was happy about the weather and felt it was worth singing about.
 
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But, there are just as many of us who believe, that BY making such a huge gigantic fuss over it each time the subject comes up, we deliver the power and the victory back into the hands of the terrorists (or the oppressors) every 9/11.

Remember, but remember with dignity.

and I totally agree Sorsha but once again, if you're job is to make a profit for a company why tick off a lot of people who SPEND billions of dollars for the relatively minor return.

Song of the South is never ever going to give the returns that Disney expects now with it's movies. It's outdated, filmed with old technology that they have to spend money to update and potentially offensive to 14% of your population. 14% whom disney sees as a future potential bucket full of profit.

So now you released a film direct to dvd because not a studio in this country is going to play it, get limited returns and now you've potentially have a whole bunch of black folks picketing ESPN, Disney parks and Disney movies.

You're telling me this is a move you would make? Sorry, Im a business women and I'd shoot you down so fast for it. not from my views on the movie but for making a boneheaded business move.
 
You're saying that Macy's can't have sale prices on Sept 11? So, everything at Macy's is not on sale but at regular price on 9/11 or it's a slight to the events of 9/11?

Sorry, but I don't get the connection.

Just like I don't get that a black man happily singing in a movie set in the post-slavery era is somehow saying he was happy about being a slave. All it says is that he was experiencing joy at that moment in time and was singing about it.

He wasn't singing "white man boss is whipping me again". He was singing "Zip-a-dee-doo-dah, zip-a-dee-ay. My, oh my what a wonderful day!
Plenty of sunshine heading my way. Zip-a-dee-doo-dah, zip-a-dee-ay." Maybe he was happy about the weather and felt it was worth singing about.

No, I'm saying Macys would never use 9/11 to advertise a sale. True maybe he was happy about the weather or maybe he was happy about getting away from white folks for 5 minutes. You've hit the nail upon the head, the movie can be interpeted 10,000 ways and back but since a large portion of people interpt it negatively. why risk it.
Once again DISNEY HAS NO FINANCIAL REASON TO RELEASE IT. and satisfy the whims of 300 folks is not enough incentive to handle the firestorm that would surely come.

Just as you have the right to want to watch it, I have the right to let disney know what may potentially happen if they decided to release it.
 
No, I'm saying Macys would never use 9/11 to advertise a sale.

Did I miss something or is Song of the South a movie about slavery?

If you're so against the movie and would picket and boycott if they released it, why don't you picket and boycott now because Splash Mountain (an open and very popular ride) is based on the movie? It's a bit hypocritical if you don't. If "Zipp a dee doo dah" is so bad, you should be angry because it's played all through that ride.
 
So now you released a film direct to dvd because not a studio in this country is going to play it, get limited returns and now you've potentially have a whole bunch of black folks picketing ESPN, Disney parks and Disney movies.

You're telling me this is a move you would make? Sorry, Im a business women and I'd shoot you down so fast for it. not from my views on the movie but for making a boneheaded business move.

BUT that was the point of the Treasures releases!!!

They were relesed, only at the holidays, specifically for collectors, in such a format that Disney could release material out of the vault that they might not be able to release in any other way.

It was more of a historical project than a money-making project.

And sorry, you can picket, argue, and continue to be offended all you like. We will never see eye to eye on this.

It is my belief that if you continue to deny the history of this film, you deny part of the history of your people. It may not be a NICE part of your history, but it is there all the same, and if you deny people the chance to understand the circumstances that led to the creation of this film by wanting to sweep it under the rug because it is unpleasant, than history is doomed to repeat itself over and over for lack of understanding.

Stop being offended, and start being proud. Take back the power and stop giving it away. I always tell my children, when you give someone else the power to make you feel upset and angry and hurt, you have given away your power and given it TO THE PERSON WHO HAS HURT YOU. Take back your power.

Its just a movie.
 
Oh, the sad cultural loss that comes from rigidity and misunderstanding.

A good friend visited the Magic Kingdom two years ago with her children. Her oldest son quickly noted that almost every attraction there was based on a Disney animation classic.

But he drew a complete blank when they arrived at Splash Mountain. My friend had seen SOTS many years before as a child, so the ride was particularly rich for her. But her son (like 99% of the children who go through this attraction) was deprived of that, left wondering during the gussied-up flume ride what the meaning was behind all the little animals running around.

But that's apparently fine with some people here. Use the iconography, but hide where it came from and what it says.

But it gets worse. The mindset behind that censorship is driven by a dark, revisionist philosphy of reviewing the past. One that states that a film made sixty-six years ago must comply with modern mores. Yes, SOTS shouldn't be a celebration of the bond between a child and a mentor. No, the dynamics should play on the suspicions and frictions between the cultures, include dark machinery, legal actions and certainly more venomous dialogue.

That mindset completely ignores the fact that what Walt Disney created in 1946 is masterful storytelling. Despite a range of characters (some much less sympathetic than others) we are rooting for everyone by the end of the film, because everyone wants the best for the kid and nobody questions their motives. You rarely find this kind of power in modern scripts - especially scripts that are this simple and straightforward. There is no pretense or "agenda" machinery, nobody is trying to make a case, make a point, or prove anything - it's just a story about love and a summer in a place that a child should and would never forget.

Yes, never. Because this story behind this film includes a stunning list of contributors. The script (attributed primarily to Dalton Reymond but including six other writers) is a charming, evocative adaptation of the Brer Rabbit stories of Joel Chandler Harris, brilliantly adapted for the screen with their wonderful patois.

The vibrant color photography by the great Greg Tolland is simply dripping with the atmosphere of the rural American south.

And the animation sequences, directed by Wilfred Jackson, are arguably some of the finest work that has ever come out of the Disney studio. Most are funny, terrifically staged vignettes (the tar-baby sequence is particularly memorable) and all are melded beautifully into the live action. There is one particularly incredible moment when Uncle Remus shares his pipe with a frog, strikes a match and casts his fishing-rod, where the action flares in three dimensional fashion from reality to fantasy.

The movie is also full of wonderful music; the classic Zip-A-Dee-Doo-Dah number, but also a plethora of traditional african melodies - no less than ten songwriters are credited.

As others have observed, James Baskett is simply unforgettable as the big-hearted Remus (tibit: he also does the voice of Brer Fox) with the kids (Driscoll, Leedy and Patten) delivering performances far beyond what one normally saw from child actors in the 40s.

But no, the censors have decided none of that matters. Yep, because of the old South Imagery and presence of so-called "happy darkies" this thing needs to be buried (or among the even more livid, "burned".) And that generations born after 1975 must be deprived of the opportunity to enjoy what Walt felt was one of his greatest achievements.

What a noble goal. :sad2:

wfj-3-web3.jpg

Song of the South rocks
People who want to ban it are fools
Song of the South rocks
 
BUT that was the point of the Treasures releases!!!

They were relesed, only at the holidays, specifically for collectors, in such a format that Disney could release material out of the vault that they might not be able to release in any other way.

It was more of a historical project than a money-making project.

And sorry, you can picket, argue, and continue to be offended all you like. We will never see eye to eye on this.

It is my belief that if you continue to deny the history of this film, you deny part of the history of your people. It may not be a NICE part of your history, but it is there all the same, and if you deny people the chance to understand the circumstances that led to the creation of this film by wanting to sweep it under the rug because it is unpleasant, than history is doomed to repeat itself over and over for lack of understanding.

Stop being offended, and start being proud. Take back the power and stop giving it away. I always tell my children, when you give someone else the power to make you feel upset and angry and hurt, you have given away your power and given it TO THE PERSON WHO HAS HURT YOU. Take back your power.

Its just a movie.

what? totally lost me on this.

Anyway I didn't mean to start an entire whole thing on race relations.

It's pretty simple to me. I and others like me frind the movie offensive. I'm happy you like the movie but I don't have to "get over" any thing nor do I have to "take back my power" as you say. All you're saying is that you feel I should as the way you would.

Sorry by protesting I am taking back my power (?). Disney hasn't released the movie so it's a moot point.
 
For anyone who wants to see the movie, or at least get a taste of it, it is posted on You Tube. The version posted by "johnnynl" is decent quality and seems to cover the whole movie in 10 parts of about 10 minutes each.
 
I and others like me frind the movie offensive.

And what of Gone With The Wind and Show Boat? Both those films are currently in distribution and beat SOTS hands down in terms of the stereotypes you find offensive. But one doesn't find a clamor about them in review forums or attempts to have them "banned." Nope, they get a free pass. :rolleyes:

But SOTS must be permanently verbotten.

Of course, that has nothing to do with (a) Disney being an easy target (i.e. highly visible brand which is particularly sensitive to its image) and (b) the fact SOTS by virtue of being a Disney film with a heavy animation element holds particular appeal to children. No, those aren't factors at all as to why this one movie is singled out as horrific, odious residue that must be banned.

1500-1251gone-with-the-wind-posters11.jpg


Show_boat.jpeg


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what? totally lost me on this.

Anyway I didn't mean to start an entire whole thing on race relations.

It's pretty simple to me. I and others like me frind the movie offensive. I'm happy you like the movie but I don't have to "get over" any thing nor do I have to "take back my power" as you say. All you're saying is that you feel I should as the way you would.

Sorry by protesting I am taking back my power (?). Disney hasn't released the movie so it's a moot point.

Perhaps you can tell us, specifically, what you find offensive about the movie. And you can't say "happy darkies" and leave it at that. What are the specific scenes or dialogue that you find offensive and why?
 
what? totally lost me on this.

Anyway I didn't mean to start an entire whole thing on race relations.

It's pretty simple to me. I and others like me frind the movie offensive. I'm happy you like the movie but I don't have to "get over" any thing nor do I have to "take back my power" as you say. All you're saying is that you feel I should as the way you would.

Sorry by protesting I am taking back my power (?). Disney hasn't released the movie so it's a moot point.

OK, I didn't mean to lose you, nor did I mean to start an argument on race relations. Especially on the DisBoards. That's not my cup of tea either. Let's see if I can explain myself a little better though, just so I don't seem like an insensitive cad.

Feel free to protest all you like, and I understand that it offends you, and that you are really sensitive to this, I do get that, but here's how I view it.

You know how, when there's a couple of kids (not saying you're being childish but I have kids and I watch mine do this, so I use this as an illustration) and one is pushing the other's buttons? If the one whose buttons are being pushed allows herself to get all worked up about it and start stamping her feet and waving her arms and crying... well, then the button-pusher has won - she has accomplished her goals. And the child who was being harassed has lost her power - she has given that power up to her oppressor, in this case her bratty sister.

On the other hand, if the one whose buttons are being pushed looks her sister in the eyes, waves a hand dismissively at her, and says "Pffft, you're not worth my time" and walks away, it totally takes the wind out of the other one's sails. The child who was being harassed has reclaimed her power.

Now, if we look at this in the grand scheme of things, you could choose to say "This is just a 70 year old kids' movie. In the grand scheme of things, this movie isn't worth my time. I choose not to give it any power over me." Then dismiss it and walk away. Now you have the power over the movie. Or you could, every time someone who would like to examine it from a historical perspective brings it up, scream about burning it and jump up and down and wave your arms and organize protests and stomp your feet. In that case, where's the power? The movie still has control over you.

THAT was simply the point I was trying to make. Nothing else.
 
Note to those looking for a copy of the film. The best ones are sourced from the Hong Kong laserdisc release. I has the same 625 line scan rate as the Japanese version below (which resulted in this being the highest resolution version of any the authorized home video release Disney ever made of this film) but unlike the Japanese version there are no subtitles.

Song_Of_South.jpg
 
Note to those looking for a copy of the film. The best ones are sourced from the Korean Laserdisc version below. The 625 line scan rate on that resulted in this being the highest resolution version of any the authorized home video release Disney ever made of this film and unlike the Japanese version there are no subtitles.

Song_Of_South.jpg


Which goes to show that Disney HAS released it. It's just not released HERE in the US.
 
Which goes to show that Disney HAS released it. It's just not released HERE in the US.

Oh yeah, its been released almost everywhere BUT in the USA. If you search Amazon/eBay etc, you can find all kinds of copies (mostly VHS etc but still) but the problem is that they are European format, which mean they won't play in our VHS players, unless you have a specially designed "all regions" VHS player. REALLY hard to find anymore.

I did see one DVD copy on sale over on Amazon; I would imagine someone had a European copy, which they converted to a USA copy (I know it can be done, its just complicated and requires technical bits and pieces) then burned onto a DVD.
 
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