just took the BLT tour... kind of bugged with DVC guide

[henri + katie's mum]

It is always interesting to hear people's reactions to guides.

I was luke warm about the guide we toured with. When we bought resale, I was paired up with another guide. Why? My husband and I have different last names. DVC (or someone) put all our info in my husband's name. When I bought resale, they had no record of me.

Still bothers me that they assumed the man was the primary decision maker. I remember waiting for the DVC tour van and giving the driver my name (as that was what I put first on the contact sheet). The driver apologized and said he was not there for us. We waited and he waited then I figured out they had put the tour in my husband's name!

 

[DVCowner2009]

While our guide was nice and genuinely knowledgeable and helpful, she didn't return the voicemail I left for her two hours after our meeting with her. That sure made my decision to go resale a little easier.

 

[DonnaL]

Wow..... I feel bad for those of you who have had the misfortune of dealing with a pushy DVC guide. I can honestly say we have never felt that way about Karen, our guide. We purchased our first contract at VWL from her back in 2001 and then added on at SSR in 2004. We haven't seen or talked to her all that much recently, but, she does occasionally give us a call while we're at WDW (we're usually there 2 to 3 times a year) or we may stop in at the DVC Preview Center just to say Hi. She has never once pressured us to try and sell us additional points (which we probably will be buying as soon as our youngest is through with college) and has always been very friendly. She is actually the reason we purchased DVC when we did.........simply because we weren't pressured into anything.

 

[kapeman]

From several posts over the last few months it appears many of the guides are starting to use sales tactics that would be considered "high pressure" vs the approach DVC has taken in the past -- I'm sure this is due to having four resorts selling at the same time, with Hawaii coming up soon. DVC has made a huge investment in these expansions and they want something to show for it.

I feel the situation will get even worse. Anyone even remotely considering DVC needs to educate themselves as much as possible before they get to the point where they start speaking to a guide as it appears it's becoming very common for them to stretch the truth a bit.

I agree with you to a point, but the main reason we are seeing this change in attitude is because of pressure from the top.

Many old timers from the original DVC days were pushed out or have been marginalized by the new management regime.


Regarding the guide, there are a number of legitimate and factual downsides to the resale market that she could/should have used to counter your argument.

 

[Dean]

I think DVC has no choice but to go more mainstream from a timeshare sales standpoint. They can do so and still be honest though this example crosses that line as well. Still you never want to invite someone to go buy somewhere else if you can help it. The other direction they could go, which we've been discussing lately as well, is to create a larger gap between resale and retail by adding value to retail, taking away from resale or both.

 

[Metsoskil]

In reality they probably will be assigned that guide if they buy resale.We toured DVC when we were in Florida last time and then bought resale. We were assigned the guide we had when we took our tour. We were told that if you have ever toured then you are attached to the guide you had at the time if they are still with DVC. Personally I would request a different assignment if our guide ahd acted that way.

We had this exact scenario. Went on the tour, got a guide who used traditional timeshare tactics (bait and switch in our case - offered incentives then told us they weren't available in our case when we came in to sign the papers). We passed on purchasing, but made sure to call a supervisor to switch guides since we planned on purchasing resale and adding on after that experience. We didn't want to be stuck with the high pressure guide for all DVC eternity. We ended up with a guide that we are very happy with and have since added on a small contract direct from DVC after our initial resale buy from the Timeshare Store.

 

[illuzion]

The ROFR stuff is DEFINATELY not true. We just (LAST MONTH) bought a BCV contract resale as a new member for $81/pt. But we got ROFR'ed the month before on an SSR contract at $68/pt (I am now very glad we did), go figure.

 

[yekcoh_99]

We recently bought a 150 BCV points from Jason @ The TimeShare Store he was great. I had interacted with Jason for a few years prior to purchasing and never was he pushy and everything he told us was true. So as far as DVC buying all BCV's back thats a flat out lie. So good luck with your decision and give Jason a call.

 

[chris4disney]

The ROFR stuff is DEFINATELY not true. We just (LAST MONTH) bought a BCV contract resale as a new member for $81/pt. But we got ROFR'ed the month before on an SSR contract at $68/pt (I am now very glad we did), go figure.

Just curious how many points were on your BCV contract for $81/pt?

 

[DisneyWalker44]

Keep in mind that all guides are timeshare salesmen. Their job - the thing they get paid to do - the thing that allows them to have a home and feed their children - is convincing people to buy timeshares from Disney.

Set your expectations accordingly. And remember that if you buy resale, there's a good chance you'll never speak to your guide again.

 

[kapeman]

I think DVC has no choice but to go more mainstream from a timeshare sales standpoint. They can do so and still be honest though this example crosses that line as well. Still you never want to invite someone to go buy somewhere else if you can help it. The other direction they could go, which we've been discussing lately as well, is to create a larger gap between resale and retail by adding value to retail, taking away from resale or both.

I disagree.

Disney can differentiate itself enough from the competition via unique locations and their famous low-pressure sales approach that they don't have to resort to the types of tactics that the stereotypical timeshare companies employ.

I don't have the numbers, but I would be willing to bet that the sales numbers were just fine prior to the hiring of Jim Lewis.

Granted the economic situation has slowed sales, but that is an across-the-board effect and I don't that, combined with new pressure to sell, sell, sell is sufficient justification to radically change the way DVC does business.

Especially, if you begin to alienate new and long-term customers.

Once DVC starts employing high pressure sales tactics, they loose one of the main features that sets them apart from the competition.

 

[Dean]

I disagree.

Disney can differentiate itself enough from the competition via unique locations and their famous low-pressure sales approach that they don't have to resort to the types of tactics that the stereotypical timeshare companies employ.

I don't have the numbers, but I would be willing to bet that the sales numbers were just fine prior to the hiring of Jim Lewis.

Granted the economic situation has slowed sales, but that is an across-the-board effect and I don't that, combined with new pressure to sell, sell, sell is sufficient justification to radically change the way DVC does business.

Especially, if you begin to alienate new and long-term customers.

Once DVC starts employing high pressure sales tactics, they loose one of the main features that sets them apart from the competition.

They weren't able to do so for HH or VB. Some would say if it's not broke, don't fix it, IMO it's been broken from the start. I think many here on DIS see it as either low pressure or sleazy high pressure and there is definitely a middle ground. Many others do this successfully who are more aggressive but still honest overall and appropriate to the tour groups as well as current members. Marriott, Westin and Hilton certainly come to mind. I don't see any way to legitimately lay slower sales at Jim Lewis' feet, I can't think of anything he's done or that DVC has actively done that is likely to have impacted sales significantly and that includes the hot topic items we've discussed the last year or two. As for alienating a segment of their customers, I believe that is a far overestimate and over rated item but that changes can be made without doing so other than those hard core people that would feel this way with any change. Most people who buy aren't the DIS regulars, they're buying because it's Disney, nothing more or less. Disney could totally change the entire system in a way such that each and every member here would think twice about it and it still likely wouldn't have an overwhelming affect on sales in all likelihood. IMO, DVD has left a ton of sales on the table trying to be too nice and it's cost us as members multiple off property options. IMO, it's time to become more mainstream, professional but more firm. Whether they want to do tour incentives, preview stays and OPC's is debatable.

IMO DVC has survived in spite of a poor sale approach simply due to WDW and the rest of the Disney empire. They were not able to compete appropriately in HH or at VB and unless there is a change in tactics, won't be able to do so for HI or beyond either. TV and print adds alone won't be enough to make it work.

 

[calypso*a*go-go]

TV and print adds alone won't be enough to make it work.

Now Dean, what about the new Deevy See video series...won't that have people pounding on the DVC door begging to be let in?

 

[Spacemonkaay]

We toured with Anne Middlemiss on our honeymoon, and she was quite pushy and downright rude. She more than "stretched the truth" when presenting us with numbers -- she didn't even count the maintenance fees when calculating cost over time, and she always rounded in her favor . . . I caught on to what she was doing and slyly tried to get her to give us the paper she was computing these numbers on, and she flat out REFUSED to give it to us. She obviously knew she was trying to mislead us. So, because of her, my wife said "NO WAY."

We bought 160 pts. at BLT at Doorway to Dreams in March from a nice lady who was not pushy, and were sad to learn that Anne still gets a cut and is still our guide.

 

[chris4disney]

We had called DVC several years back with a few questions and spoke to a Bernard over the phone. He was very nice and not pushy. Since then we have received a few things in the mail from DVC and if there was ever a guide's name attached to it, it was Bernard. Since we just took the BLT tour with this other guide while we were visiting WDW, who would still be considered "our guide" if we should decide to buy resale? The guide that we took the tour with mentioned that she looked up and saw that we had already spoken with Bernard in the past, so she knew herself. Just curious.

 

[disneynutz]

We had called DVC several years back with a few questions and spoke to a Bernard over the phone. He was very nice and not pushy. Since then we have received a few things in the mail from DVC and if there was ever a guide's name attached to it, it was Bernard. Since we just took the BLT tour with this other guide while we were visiting WDW, who would still be considered "our guide" if we should decide to buy resale? The guide that we took the tour with mentioned that she looked up and saw that we had already spoken with Bernard in the past, so she knew herself. Just curious.

Bernard is your Guide. Disney has a system in place to share commissions when a sale is made. They get nothing when you buy resale. Your Guide of record will always get a commission even when you buy direct with another Guide at the Preview Center, on the phone, or on a cruise. Did you ever notice a slight attitude change when the Guide that you are talking to finds out that you have a Guide already on record? We have, and some don't even want to talk to you anymore.

 

[starstruck93]

The Guide is completely misinformed if she thinks Disney ROFRs every BCV contract. There is a thread on the DVC Operations board that lists dozens of BCV contracts that have passed ROFR.

Here is what I would do if I were in your position:

1. Look at the ROFR threads on the disboards and get a feel for the prices of resale contracts that have passed ROFR (see, for example, http://www.disboards.com/showthread.php?t=1960185). Keep in mind that smaller contracts (100 points or less) are harder to find and demand slightly higher prices. Also, resale contracts that are fully loaded with points will demand a higher price than resale contracts that are virtually stripped of points. Another also, resale contracts are negotiable, so you can ask the seller to reduce the price, or pay some or all of the closing costs, etc.

2. Contact one or more of the reputable resale companies and ask them to put you on their email lists. We are in the process of buying an AKV resale from Scot at the Timeshare Store (a sponsor of the disboards), and everything is going great so far. There is no obligation on your part to get on the email list.

3. Contact DVC and ask to speak to a supervisor. Let DVC know about your experience with the Guide. I'm not sure if it will change anything, but I would hate to have your Guide's "misinformation" go uncorrected.

On a personal note, we bought BLT direct from Disney over the telephone. Our Guide, Ron, was rather low-keyed and we never felt pressured from him to buy. It took us about three weeks and 4 or 5 phone calls with Ron before we finally committed to buy, but I never he was pushing us into buying. In fact, when we finally decided to buy an AKV add-on, he agreed that the resale prices were "very competitive" compared to Disney. We had a chance to talk again after I actually made an offer on an AKV resale contract, and Ron opined that Disney probably wouldn't RORF our offer (which was $84/point). We found out last week that our offer passed ROFR, so Ron was right. So, I believe that there are some good Guides out there, as well as a few not-so-good ones.

Don't give up your dream of owning DVC! Good luck!!!

ITA! Our rep is Dan at BLT and he has been WONDERFUL! DH took the tour back in Sept. and are just now closing. He never made us feel pressured at all and was always up front with us about cost. I would def. reccomend him! Thanks! April

 

[robertdangelo]

We bought BCV through Jason at The Timeshare store last year and were very pleased with the process & customer service. We just added on 50 points at BLT. We had many of the same concerns you do, we're in our 40's... both contracts will be passed on to our DD someday... that's a re-assuring thought! We didn't need 160 points, which is why we bought a smaller contract initially at BCV. We now have two great home resorts, with same use year.

Bob

 

[Dean]

Now Dean, what about the new Deevy See video series...won't that have people pounding on the DVC door begging to be let in?

Only for target practice.

 

[JimMIA]

Then she proceeded to say and I quote... "I hate to burst your bubble, but you are not going to be able to buy BCV on the resale market! Disney buys back every BCV contract via ROFR!"

Yep, she's lying, and she's not the first and won't be the last. Our guide told us the same lie, but it was a few days after the tour when I called her and told her we were looking at resale. She actually imporved the lie a little bit.

I was told: "Funny you should bring that up. We were just called to a special meeting this morning and we were told that DVC will be ROFRing EVERY resale contract!"

I knew better of course, and bought resale and saved a bunch of money. When we bought SSR a few months later because of a great promotion, we bought through her. She messed it up. I'm not sure whether it was through ignorance or malice, but we'll never buy anything through her again, and probably would never buy direct again.