Just for fun, showing how crappy 1 bed value is in DVC

[Sandisw]

Interesting I never saw this mentioned before as to why. That’s good to know there is a logic behind it.

If you look at Exhibit A of some of the older resorts you can read more about it.

 

[Judique]

You guys are a lot smarter than me when it comes to the numbers aspect of all this.

But I almost always book 1Bd (or sometimes 2Bd), even if the point value is worse because I get to look at the poor slobs crammed into the studios and point-and-laugh at them.

I'm mostly in my studio by myself. I don't feel like a poor slob. Or crammed in. But those putting 4-5 into a one bedroom may feel a little crammed since sometimes they have to ALL share the same bathroom at some resorts. As far as the one bedroom, 2's company, 3's a crowd.

*I get you are probably just being silly.

I'm not quite getting the numbers aspect either. The only number truly important to me is there is enough in my vacation budget that I can vacation as often as I want and where I want.

Now, as far as the larger villas - I'll probably never vacation with 6 in a 2 bedroom again. Too crowded for me. Although I will do the 3 bedrooms. Maybe I'll book a one bedroom for 5 and a studio separately for me. I have a family that is mostly girls which is unlike the mostly boys environment I grew up in. I need order, peace and quiet but like to occasionally visit with chaos and then return home.

 

[Mikey15]

Now, as far as the larger villas - I'll probably never vacation with 6 in a 2 bedroom again. Too crowded for me. Although I will do the 3 bedrooms. Maybe I'll book a one bedroom for 5 and a studio separately for me. I have a family that is mostly girls which is unlike the mostly boys environment I grew up in. I need order, peace and quiet but like to occasionally visit with chaos and then return home.

I feel like this is where there’s a big difference between some resorts. For ones like Poly Tower, Kidani, and BLT where the 1Bds have 2 full bathrooms, the 2Bds have 3 full bathrooms. That can be a huge difference in terms of room for the fairer half to get ready!

Honourable mention to Poly studios for the second shower / sink area.

 

[Brian Noble]

Meanwhile a 2-bedroom villa has more square footage than my home.

Heck, the OKW 1BR gave my last place a run for its money.

 

[VGCgroupie]

I feel like this is where there’s a big difference between some resorts. For ones like Poly Tower, Kidani, and BLT where the 1Bds have 2 full bathrooms, the 2Bds have 3 full bathrooms. That can be a huge difference in terms of room for the fairer half to get ready!

Honourable mention to Poly studios for the second shower / sink area.

For us it's a huge benefit. We are shower before bed people and we stay at the parks til closing. So that extra bathroom helps everyone get to go to bed sooner when we are all exhausted.

 

[TheThousandthSoul]

I want to do the exercise, does anybody have a formula?
What is the value you put on your points?
I would do the following: (Amortized cost of purchase per point + Yearly Dues per point) = Value per point.

 

[Brian Noble]

I amortize the purchase across the life of the contract at 4%, as a conservative estimate of long-term inflation. I personally track discounts off of rack, assuming anything better than 50% is very good, 40-50% is good, 30-40% is "fine I guess", and below 30% is "at least I don't have to look at a really big number on the bottom of the bill when I check out." The dining bill is big enough!

So far, everything has been good to very good even in a 1BR, but I have yet to travel in some of the lower-value seasons for DVC ownership.

There's a decent argument for amortizing at a higher rate than 4%. YMMV.

 

[DoubleBaconBLT]

I dont really have down time on my trips to be making calls about the next vacation. Odd way to do it.

They've started just adding them to your account on the MDE website. Within 7 days of checkout, if you go to book, it will show the bounceback offer as part of your available discounts.

Keep in mind that all discounts are subject to availability, and they often restrict discountable inventory beyond what the non-discounted inventory would show. So for example, if you search with no discounts, you might find several options, but then they all disappear when you apply the discount.

Bouncebacks are still great discounts (though they usually cap out at 35%, so compare it to the AP or other discounts available).

 

[DoubleBaconBLT]

I want to do the exercise, does anybody have a formula?
What is the value you put on your points?
I would do the following: (Amortized cost of purchase per point + Yearly Dues per point) = Value per point.

I think it can get tricky for people because of a few common fallacies. First, you need to clearly delineate costs vs benefits. Your equation should be set to cost per point, not value per point. The cost is the net present value of everything you pay. The benefit is the net present value of everything you get. Add those together and you get the total NPV.

Second, you have to use the same timestamp for all cash flows. You can choose whatever timestamp you want, but it should be consistent. So it's not realistic to add future dues to the initial buy in without discounting those future payments back to the present or amortizing the initial payment forward (but not both). I see a LOT of people try to penalize the initial buy in because it comes up front, then scale for future dues increases, but NOT also scale the value up as room rates go up. The value of a 20 point studio purchase today might be $600 if purchased with cash, but in 30 years it will still cost 20 points while the cash rate climbs to almost $2600 (assuming 5% increase annually).

Third, if you're going to compare buying DVC to some alternative plan where you instead invest, you need to consider risk and the variability of returns. People love to just plug 7-12% interest rates in for "market returns" without considering that those investments could lose ~40% of their value in any given year (as they have numerous times in the past). A bear market is considered a pullback of 20% or more from highs and this has happened 3 times in the last 5 years. The average bear market results in a 35% drop in value. That is far more risk than most people are comfortable with, and they don't realize it until they're in the middle of it, selling to lock in a 30% loss. If you want less risk, you have to accept less return too. Fun fact: if you bought BWV direct any time in the first five years after it opened, your DVC contract would have appreciated by more than the S&P 500 over a 5, 10, and even 15 year time horizon (and that's with you using it for vacations the whole time).

Finally, many comparisons to investing instead are invalid because DVC is a purchase, not an investment. Of course investing money results in more money than spending it. That's like saying the cheapest item on the menu is skipping lunch, and with that logic, a lot of my spreadsheets would conclude that I should eat beans and rice at every meal. DVC is not comparable to an investment - it's a way to stretch your spending further. The relevant comparison would be investing the initial buy in amount, but then withdrawing some every time you go on vacation. If you do this at rack rates, DVC is a better long term option.

When I built a DCF model for my Bay Lake Tower contract, it worked out to a 19% internal rate of return vs paying rack rates, and 12.5% vs a 25% discount on rack rates.

 

[VGCgroupie]

I want to do the exercise, does anybody have a formula?
What is the value you put on your points?
I would do the following: (Amortized cost of purchase per point + Yearly Dues per point) = Value per point.

I have tons of different calculation models. I have a one showing cost after 5, 10, 15 years. I have one factoring in dues increases based of historical average increases. I have one that considers closing costs, ones that dont consider closing costs.

When I am calculating what my cost per point is I choose to just use the simple less specific number. I just to do my cost over the life of the contract plus dues. This isnt how I factor my break even point or how I factor my decision to buy/sell. Only for my "hey this stay is costing $xx.xx per night" Its not perfect or what others may do.

 

[Girlstar30]

And here I am waking my husband up to either make the coffee or go get the coffee.

I’m a handful.

Same, I dont even know how to use it

 

[Girlstar30]

I am thinking of doing a one bedroom challenge and attempting to cook a Thanksgiving dinner in the room, should I bring my own cookware or would they supply enough for like 8 courses

 

[808blessing]

Sooo this point miser just crossed to the dark side. I split my split stay further and just upgraded to a 1 bdrm for 3 nights. It is the first time I’ve allowed myself since becoming an owner 5 years ago!! Might as well do it. Why not?
I am not going to math it but it is around twice the points as the studio I had. I did go thru the dvc rooms and justified it was one of the lowest points for a 1 bdrm on those dates. I feared I would be spoiled and want for plenty. But I shall not want for today. I shall simply DO.

Eta: And to the person who picked up my Food and Wine Boardwalk studio, you’re welcome!!

 

[Add-On-Itis]

Sooo this point miser just crossed to the dark side. I split my split stay further and just upgraded to a 1 bdrm for 3 nights. It is the first time I’ve allowed myself since becoming an owner 5 years ago!! Might as well do it. Why not?
I am not going to math it but it is around twice the points as the studio I had. I did go thru the dvc rooms and justified it was one of the lowest points for a 1 bdrm on those dates. I feared I would be spoiled and want for plenty. But I shall not want for today. I shall simply DO.

Eta: And to the person who picked up my Food and Wine Boardwalk studio, you’re welcome!!

you have been warned. it’s impossible to go back to a studio after a one bedroom

you will have this sickness after the trip. they call it addonitis

 

[Lorana]

The point jump from a studio to a 1 bed is high. The point jump from a 1 bed to a 2 bed isnt very high. Even if you take cash costs out of the equation 1 beds are very a poor value (point wise) when you compare them to studios or 2 beds

One of our reasons for DVC was because we wanted at least 1BRs; the kids could have the living room beds, and we'd have our own space, plus laundry in the room and a kitchen to make some of our meals.

Our FWs are all Studios, though, partly because it was cheaper, but also we figured we'd move to studios when it was just my husband and I. But I'd say half the time we book 1BRs anyway, as we like the space, the laundry access on longer trips, and the kitchen for making some of our meals to cut down costs.

But that difference between 1BR and 2BRs and the per point value means we're doing what Disney wants, and usually getting the 2BRs now when we travel with the kids -- partly because they're now adult children, but also because the 1BR value kills me a little inside. ;-)

 

[VGCgroupie]

One of our reasons for DVC was because we wanted at least 1BRs; the kids could have the living room beds, and we'd have our own space, plus laundry in the room and a kitchen to make some of our meals.

Our FWs are all Studios, though, partly because it was cheaper, but also we figured we'd move to studios when it was just my husband and I. But I'd say half the time we book 1BRs anyway, as we like the space, the laundry access on longer trips, and the kitchen for making some of our meals to cut down costs.

But that difference between 1BR and 2BRs and the per point value means we're doing what Disney wants, and usually getting the 2BRs now when we travel with the kids -- partly because they're now adult children, but also because the 1BR value kills me a little inside. ;-)

We book mostly 1 beds with studios and 2 beds occasionally. Even though I know the value is less still gotta have that 1 bed when I’m too cheap for a 2 bed.

 

[CarolynFH]

One of our reasons for DVC was because we wanted at least 1BRs; the kids could have the living room beds, and we'd have our own space, plus laundry in the room and a kitchen to make some of our meals.

Our FWs are all Studios, though, partly because it was cheaper, but also we figured we'd move to studios when it was just my husband and I. But I'd say half the time we book 1BRs anyway, as we like the space, the laundry access on longer trips, and the kitchen for making some of our meals to cut down costs.

But that difference between 1BR and 2BRs and the per point value means we're doing what Disney wants, and usually getting the 2BRs now when we travel with the kids -- partly because they're now adult children, but also because the 1BR value kills me a little inside. ;-)

LOL, DH loves the Kidani 1BR because, if it’s just the two of us, he gets his own bathroom. Hopefully he’ll never get the idea to book a 2BR at our home BWV for the same reason….

 

[Girlstar30]

We book mostly 1 beds with studios and 2 beds occasionally. Even though I know the value is less still gotta have that 1 bed when I’m too cheap for a 2 bed.

Same, my cutoff for travel buddies is max 5

 

[Genie+]

Oops lol

 

[Girlstar30]

Oops lol

Hey love that grand floridian one