Jon and Kate Plus 8, Official Thread--Part 7

[mikki'smom]

When all of this is said and done at the end of the day I fully expect that Jon should be punished for not living up to his part of the contract...but if TLC in any way punishes Kate and the kids...if they lose even $1 from all this then I personally will start the next new thread about boycotting TLC and all of their sponsors...I hate to see all these resources being used up to pay for lawyers...that is such a waste...why can't people just treat each other decently and settle their differences with dignity and respect for one another...

 

[redrosesix]

When all of this is said and done at the end of the day I fully expect that Jon should be punished for not living up to his part of the contract...but if TLC in any way punishes Kate and the kids...if they lose even $1 from all this then I personally will start the next new thread about boycotting TLC and all of their sponsors...I hate to see all these resources being used up to pay for lawyers...that is such a waste...why can't people just treat each other decently and settle their differences with dignity and respect for one another...

Good question. My answer: $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

But as I've said before, it's not up to us whether Jon gets punished for anything -- the judge and jury will be doing that. Even if they do find that he was in breach of contract, they could just make him pay $1 ie. they may find that the breach was inconsequential or the contract wasn't worthy of upholding.

 

[DMRick]

Funny how people love to make excuses for Kate The "Kate must have had a reason to do what she did" thing is getting old real fast, considering none of us know her (or Jon) or what was really going on at their home.

So, say Kate didn't have an excuse/reason for what she did..filing for divorce. Everything was nice and sweet at home, money wasn't being taken out of the household account (except it was). Say her lawyer really didn't advise her to do that so shame on those who gave her an excuse for filing.

So, if Kate didn't file and Jon didn't file, would it have been ok for the money to all be spent down? I assume she filed because if she didn't either of them could have continued to spend the money and in this case we know Jon took some that had to be returned. I didn't realize that Kate's accounting wasn't accepted, but if it's not, she too will have to return money. Isn't that a good thing?

If filing stopped either or both from spending down the assets until it's decided whose assets are whose, I'll continue to make excuses for Kate filing. You are right, none of us know what was going on in their home.. so I would think the best thing to do would be file, and save the money while it gets sorted out.

 

[kidshop]

We'll be disagreeing about this. Not knowing why she felt she had to file, I would be in no position to say if she was right or wrong. I could never say that because one person filed first they made a decision to tear the family apart.

But in any case, even if I agreed, I would not say that she or anyone wouldn't have the right to feel sad over the break up and not want to visit places right away that they had been together at in the past.

I thought that Jon had said he planned on filing and he didn't know why Kate filed first. But it's been awhile so I'll admit I'm not sure about that.

Kate admitted it was over 'sometime last year', as Jon has said. The charade only ended a few months ago, however.

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

I've always thought there was a bit of truth in all the stories..but sorting out the bit was the hardest. I don't think much was the full truth on either side. For a lawsuit, doesn't it have to be proven that it's a not only a lie, but that there was harm caused? With J & K I think that would have been hard to prove, since they were putting so much out there themselves.

You have to prove that the stories caused harm if they were lies.

Jon is presently being sued--being painted in a bad light and all sorts of things. These stories are also compromising his income earning capabilities as a celebrity (though that is hard to type with a straight face. )

So if they were lies, they would certainly meet the litmus of slander/libel. (Always get the two mixed up. One is print, the other spoken).

Since he has done nothing to challenge them, more than likely they are true enough.

TLC will use this b/c Jon's behavior has affected TLC's relationship with advertisers.

If it's false--Jon better get onto a lawsuit--stat!

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

The bolded above is just so sweet. I'd like to have known your grandmother.





Absolutely! The only thing I can add is that I am surprised that Jon's attorney is being deposed and can't act for him in the case. What happened to attorney/client privilege?

I'm going out on a limb....a really really really really really really looooooooonnnnnnnnnggggg limb....

But Jon's defense of pulling the children--was that his lawyer had advised him that he was no longer party to the contract since the terms were changed and he was excluded.

I am not getting that exactly right, but I do remember reading something to that effect.

So it would make sense to have the attorney deposed to find out what he advised. I'm sure he doesn't have to say anything, but if he can't properly defend what he did (or in the off chance his client lied), it would certainly would be something that he would want to clear up I would think.

Again--going out on a limb and by no means am I articulate about it--but I hope it makes sense.

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

And that is the thing that will probably ruin TLC's reputation in some people's eyes. Yes, they're going after Jon, but it's the family $ that will be used to combat them. Just further proof that TLC doesn't give a hoot about the Gosselins no matter what their warm and fuzzy press releases say. All they care about is lining their own pockets. No wonder Jon called them a monster.

But they have a right to do that.

They have a right to have their contracts honored.

I mean--there are people who do illegal things all the time or they break contracts without caring.

It isn't the party suing for damages fault that they had a family.

I by no means want anything to happen to the children--but it is not fair to TLC to have to turn a blind eye b/c Jon opted to allegedly violate his contract just b/c he has 8 kids.

I would say--Jon should have thought about his children ahead of time and used a courtroom to get out of the contract and then he can be free to frolic all he wants.

Contracts suck--and you should NEVER enter one without understanding every teeny detail about it and your liability should you opt to ignore those teeny details.

 

[redrosesix]

So, say Kate didn't have an excuse/reason for what she did..filing for divorce. Everything was nice and sweet at home, money wasn't being taken out of the household account (except it was). Say her lawyer really didn't advise her to do that so shame on those who gave her an excuse for filing.

So, if Kate didn't file and Jon didn't file, would it have been ok for the money to all be spent down? I assume she filed because if she didn't either of them could have continued to spend the money and in this case we know Jon took some that had to be returned. I didn't realize that Kate's accounting wasn't accepted, but if it's not, she too will have to return money. Isn't that a good thing?

If filing stopped either or both from spending down the assets until it's decided whose assets are whose, I'll continue to make excuses for Kate filing. You are right, none of us know what was going on in their home.. so I would think the best thing to do would be file, and save the money while it gets sorted out.

In Kate's own words, the decision to separate was actually made some time last year -- Jon confirmed this, but also said they kept it secret because of the show. We don't know why, or what was happening at home at that time, even less than we know what has gone on since then. Which is why I have a problem with people making excuses for everything Kate does. I'd rather just stick to the facts. For example, we know for a fact that Jon stopped the filming but none of us really knows why -- then again, some of us don't care.

IMO, Kate and Jon taking money from the bank account is all part of the chaos that happens as the divorce proceedings approach. Both of them removed money from the account thinking the other was removing money from the account. They should have had a provisional division of assets as soon as the arbitrator was assigned ie. $100,000 or so given to each spouse, or arrangements made for pay from TLC to be given directly to each spouse rather than deposited to the JKIG account.

As for Kate's accounting info, it was submitted but never reviewed -- she doesn't have carte blanche to spend as she pleases since half of every dollar in that bank account is Jon's. The accounting info for all of the other accounts has never been reviewed by either Jon's team or the arbitrator.

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

When all of this is said and done at the end of the day I fully expect that Jon should be punished for not living up to his part of the contract...but if TLC in any way punishes Kate and the kids...if they lose even $1 from all this then I personally will start the next new thread about boycotting TLC and all of their sponsors...I hate to see all these resources being used up to pay for lawyers...that is such a waste...why can't people just treat each other decently and settle their differences with dignity and respect for one another...

As for punishing KAte and the Kids. That would be up to the judge (or jury--depending on how damages are dealt with in PA) to decide the amount. The joint assets would be accessible to pay those damages I am guessing. This isn't TLC's fault and something Jon should have considered. I would think the kids assets might be untouchable, but I do not know how PA law works in that regard once an asset is set up in a child's name.

*************

On a side note, there are attorneys out there who do just that.

I have a friend locally who does that. Her business is called Peaceful Beach Mediation. (though every time I pass her office it looks like meditation -- where's the yogi emoticon when you need one!) Anyway, she only deals with divorces in a peaceful matter for those couples who wish to do it that way. I don't think she deals in contract disputes though.

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

I haven't read the papers in a while, but I thought the monetary amount they were suing for was rather low, anyone know what that is? I thought they were suing more for Jon to live up to the contract.

Maybe the amount was listed in the contract and thus they can't get more.

 

[redrosesix]

As for punishing KAte and the Kids. That would be up to the judge (or jury--depending on how damages are dealt with in PA) to decide the amount. The joint assets would be accessible to pay those damages I am guessing. This isn't TLC's fault and something Jon should have considered. I would think the kids assets might be untouchable, but I do not know how PA law works in that regard once an asset is set up in a child's name.

*************

On a side note, there are attorneys out there who do just that.

I have a friend locally who does that. Her business is called Peaceful Beach Mediation. (though every time I pass her office it looks like meditation -- where's the yogi emoticon when you need one!) Anyway, she only deals with divorces in a peaceful matter for those couples who wish to do it that way. I don't think she deals in contract disputes though.

The TLC lawsuit is being argued in Maryland.

I looove the idea of your friend's business -- it would be great if most couples would choose to end their marriages that way especially when there are children involved.

Maybe the amount was listed in the contract and thus they can't get more.

If I remember correctly, the only damages that were actually listed in the claim were for the day that Jon refused to show up for filming -- and that amount was $30,000

 

[DMRick]

In Kate's own words, the decision to separate was actually made some time last year -- Jon confirmed this, but also said they kept it secret because of the show. We don't know why, or what was happening at home at that time, even less than we know what has gone on since then. Which is why I have a problem with people making excuses for everything Kate does. I'd rather just stick to the facts. For example, we know for a fact that Jon stopped the filming but none of us really knows why -- then again, some of us don't care.

How can we stick to facts we don't have. It's all (just like most divorces, he said she said). I don't care when the marriage was over. If Kate feels uncomfortable taking her children to church as a broken family, that's her feelings and decision. I wouldn't hold that (or judge them) against either of them. You can say I'm making excuses for her..but in reality, I'd make the same excuse for anyone, who says it's too hard on them at this time to get to church. Luckily what you or I say or our opinions just doesn't matter in Kate's walk with God. If she's lying, it's something she will have to deal with. If she's not, I feel sorry for her that even at church she doesn't feel comfortable yet.

IMO, Kate and Jon taking money from the bank account is all part of the chaos that happens as the divorce proceedings approach. Both of them removed money from the account thinking the other was removing money from the account. They should have had a provisional division of assets as soon as the arbitrator was assigned ie. $100,000 or so given to each spouse, or arrangements made for pay from TLC to be given directly to each spouse rather than deposited to the JKIG account.

Except it appears that isn't how the law works in this state.

As for Kate's accounting info, it was submitted but never reviewed -- she doesn't have carte blanche to spend as she pleases since half of every dollar in that bank account is Jon's. The accounting info for all of the other accounts has never been reviewed by either Jon's team or the arbitrator.

Are these facts we know about? That the amount she took out wasn't reviewed? I do assume that half of all the bill's are also Jon's, yet Kate seems to be in charge of paying the mortgage, etc. This is stuff that has to be worked out yet. But none of this has anything to do with why Kate does or doesn't take the kids at this time to church. It's not even been questioned if Jon does, and I hope it isn't. I'll leave that judging up to Another. We can only guess at their feelings. I just know I wouldn't want to be judged on feelings no one else could feel.

Excuses seem to be made on both sides..which makes sense, since some are on Jon's side and some are on Kate's side. At least we agree that we are all on the kids side. If either of them do something for the kids, that's good.

 

[madge]

Similarly, I have to keep reminding myself that although Kate has been assigned responsibility for the Gosselin accounts during arbitration, all the money does not belong to her alone. Up until June, when she filed, it was communal property. Until the divorce is final and division of property settled, Jon could easily petition for access to family monies existing pre-June to pay his attorney fees.

So TLC by filing this case is essentially draining funds that could be used to support the children. I rather think that stinks!

I agree!

 

[NCRedding]

I haven't read the papers in a while, but I thought the monetary amount they were suing for was rather low, anyone know what that is? I thought they were suing more for Jon to live up to the contract.

They are suing for damages "in excess of $30000.00" which is the amount that is required in Maryland to obtain jurisdiction in the circuit court, where they filed. The damages granted could be much higher than that based upon the evidence presented at trial.

 

[DMRick]

They are suing for damages "in excess of $30000.00" which is the amount that is required in Maryland to obtain jurisdiction in the circuit court, where they filed. The damages granted could be much higher than that based upon the evidence presented at trial.

Thanks..I guess I skipped over the 'excess' of $30,000. I hope Jon and Kate really did secure the kids share. If not, then shame on Jon for breaching the contract (if it's found that he in fact, did) and shame on them for not securing it...he could cause the kids to lose what they already filmed for. I hope it comes out, if he could have just said no more filming. We'll know if he could have prevented this lawsuit, or if he really just used the kids for bargaining for himself.

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

Thanks..I guess I skipped over the 'excess' of $30,000. I hope Jon and Kate really did secure the kids share. If not, then shame on Jon for breaching the contract (if it's found that he in fact, did) and shame on them for not securing it...he could cause the kids to lose what they already filmed for. I hope it comes out, if he could have just said no more filming. We'll know if he could have prevented this lawsuit, or if he really just used the kids for bargaining for himself.

does anyone know if under PA law that anything set up under the kid's names in terms of trust funds or college funds is untouchable?

If so--the kids won't lose any of that money.

 

[madge]

I wonder what the possibility is that this will be settled and never actually see a courtroom. While TLC has Jon under the gun right now for the alleged breach of contract ... they're not 100% innocent in this case. And that will come out at some point.

 

[daughtersrus]

does anyone know if under PA law that anything set up under the kid's names in terms of trust funds or college funds is untouchable?

If so--the kids won't lose any of that money.

If the money is in a revocable trust the grantor of the trust can change it at any time that he/she wants. From what I've read, Kate set up revocable trusts with her being the grantor. That means Kate could change the trust at anytime including withdrawing all of the funds.

Now, she has said repeatedly that the money is safe and secure but no one knows what the future brings.

 

[DMRick]

If the money is in a revocable trust the grantor of the trust can change it at any time that he/she wants. From what I've read, Kate set up revocable trusts with her being the grantor. That means Kate could change the trust at anytime including withdrawing all of the funds.

Now, she has said repeatedly that the money is safe and secure but no one knows what the future brings.

I thought Jon said he could get to it also if needed. I also thought he said he (or did he say they?) would use it if he (they) had to. Or was that implied? Maybe some of it is in a 529 (I think that is the number for college funding)..although can that be touched, as long as tax is paid on it?

Madge..what is likely to come out about what TLC has done illegally? I know that a lot here are not pleased with TLC's filming tatics, but have they done anything illegal that we know about? This is going to be a very interesting case if it goes to court.

 

[TanyaLovesPooh]

Excuses seem to be made on both sides..which makes sense, since some are on Jon's side and some are on Kate's side. At least we agree that we are all on the kids side. If either of them do something for the kids, that's good.

100%

I thought Jon said he could get to it also if needed. I also thought he said he (or did he say they?) would use it if he (they) had to. Or was that implied? Maybe some of it is in a 529 (I think that is the number for college funding)..although can that be touched, as long as tax is paid on it?

That is exactly what Jon said. On The Insider, the woman asked Jon if they have any money put aside for the kids. Jon's reply was they had a revocable trust and that 80% of the earnings went to the kids. She went on to ask if they (Jon/Kate) could use that money if need be and his exact answer was "Absolutely!".