Jon and Kate Plus 8, Official Thread--Part 7

[TanyaLovesPooh]

No kidding. Well we finally know that Jon was telling the truth about Kate ending their marriage last Oct. He wanted her to go to counseling and she refused. Then they only went to Dr. Phil sad2 who counseled them to save the brand of J&K+8. Crazy. Jon said he was trying to save his marriage and that was advice Dr. Phil gave. Nice.

We also know too that he'd been staying in the apartment above the garage since last fall.

We know this for a fact? How, because a Vanity Fair reporter says so? How is this any different than Stephanie giving her "dirt"?

I do have to admit, I totally believe the Dr. Phil part.

 

[madge]

but I assume tonights show was one of the ones that TLC was using pieces of - from previous tapings? I wonder how long ago that was filmed?

it was filmed months ago, around the time that Kate took the boys to the dude ranch. can't remember if it was before or after that, though.

 

[madge]

We know this for a fact? How, because a Vanity Fair reporter says so? How is this any different than Stephanie giving her "dirt"?

I have no idea why, but I really do believe that Vanity Fair has a little more journalistic intergrity than RadarOnline. With that said, ROL often gets "most" of the story right ... although they're sloppy with the details. To have them both confirming the marriage being over sooner than Jon & Kate claim on the show makes it a little more likely to be somewhat true to me. If Stephanie talks to a non-tabloid publication, and things can be backed up? Then I might be more inclined to believe more of her story.

I do have to admit, I totally believe the Dr. Phil part.

me, too.

 

[redrosesix]

Thanks for the compliment on my post!

However, I'm not very optimistic regarding TLC being without a paddle, although you are picking up on the exact same points that I noted.

The PA Child Labor Law only covers minors from the age of 7 to 18. Mady and Cara would fall under this for the last 2 years but not before. They have not been filmed as much recently. I think TLC are vulnerable for the last "season" though, because when does a home become a "set?" And how many hours did they film?

The sextuplets are not covered at all by the PA law. They are not covered because PA does not accept that children under 7 can "work." Legislation always lags way behind fact, and is always filed after some horrid case comes to court. I think the Gosselins may well be that case in PA.

I'm sure TLC saw the loop holes in the PA child labor law in advance and exploited them royally. The first few shows were "documentaries." Define "work." The 'tups are "playing," we were within limits with the twins, even if we didn't pull permits . . . And especially: "We have been filming for 4 years and no-one told us we shouldn't" etc.

Deniability.

I'm sure many lawyers are salivating at this one. I have a feeling that some may take the case pro bono just for the publicity. Jon may be in luck there, but kids other than the Gosselins may be the real beneficiaries if it does set precedent in court.

The Gosselin kids have been dragged through the mud, are being dragged through the mud, and will be dragged through the mud, and one hopes will survive.

Now, before people pile on and attack me for arguing for legislation against the (God-given) rights of parents . . .

I cannot imagine any decent parent not supporting Federal Child Labor Laws similar to the Coogan Law (if not more far reaching in terms of compensation) in all aspects of entertainment. After all, what are the labor laws for? To protect minors from being over-worked, to ensure that work does not interfere with education, to ensure well-being through a social worker on set to support the parent in setting reasonable limits, and to ensure that some part of the compensation goes into trust for the child.

What is to object to in that?

IMO a decent parent would be there with bells on. They would not fight reasonable legislation nor try to circumvent it. Just saying.

I think it's different now -- not only do they likely have Jodi and Beth who would be willing to testify truthfully, they also have Jon.

And the truth is that when the PA Dept of Labor completes its report, it is very possible that they will say that they are unable to protect the children under 7 but feel there is a need for it -- it won't change what has happened but could be an impetus to change the legislation.

The fact that the twins were 7 in the middle of Season 3 is also a big factor here. If they find that TLC violated the legislation with regards to Cara and Mady, people will not be ok with the fact that they can do whatever they want with the tups.

I'm not going to comment on all the permit stuff you posted, because I think we went in that direction two threads ago, and decided they weren't breaking the law..but then, what do we know LOL. Who knows if they got permits, if they were supposed to get permits. There are prob enough what if's and what fors, that it would take a labor lawyer to really figure it out.

However, are you saying they filed suit to continue filming the children? I thought they filed suit because Jon broke the contract, and he has interviewed without permission and wants to sign up for other shows?

I didn't read the actual paper work..jut no interest in trying to figure out the legalities, from what I glanced at, I figured they had sharp lawyers to do that and once it goes to court, I'll find out who was right..but I didn't see, from my glance that they were sueing him because he won't allow filming of the kids.

Whether or not filming the show was detrimental to the children will be a large part of this lawsuit. I'm sure that TLC anticipated that Jon would use this as his defense and wrote their petition accordingly ie. he tried to hold them to their word that they would stop taping if either parent felt it was detrimental to no avail, so he had no choice but to seek a remedy through public lobbying.

So in the first part of this lawsuit, TLC will essentially be asking the jury to find that continuing the show would be of no harm to the children. Thus Jon's actions are solely a result of greed.

With respect, I don't think it matters what this thread *decided* two threads ago. We are now looking at a whole different ball game with the new lawsuits. I thnk we can discuss it and some of us like perusing the paperwork and researching legislation.

Yes, it will definitely take labor lawyers to figure it out. I think the case, if it goes to court, will set legal precedents. Fascinating, but really sad for the children.

I agree, especially in light of the fact that the Dept. of Labor is likely to complete its report soon -- it has been nearly 6 months now (I think)

Finally. A decent article about Jon. I knew one would surface eventually. LOL

I just want to reply, because I hate it when something I said is taken out of context or misconstrued. I never said any topic is tabu (well, unless it gets the thread removed) or shouldn't be discussed. I said I wasn't interested in it, so I wasn't commenting, since I had already made my comments when we discussed a similar post a couple of threads ago, but I was interested in something else that was in the same post. Just wanted to clear that up, so someone reading just some posts, don't think I said we shouldn't discuss something. I never said that. Of course everything is 'fair game'. Has anyone said it wasn't?

Point taken. You can do what I always do when everybody is talking about Jon's clothes -- skip

 

[C.Ann]

I have no idea why, but I really do believe that Vanity Fair has a little more journalistic intergrity than RadarOnline. With that said, ROL often gets "most" of the story right ... although they're sloppy with the details. To have them both confirming the marriage being over sooner than Jon & Kate claim on the show makes it a little more likely to be somewhat true to me. If Stephanie talks to a non-tabloid publication, and things can be backed up? Then I might be more inclined to believe more of her story.



me, too.

I think this is what most of us are basing our most recent comments on.. Your "intuition" - if you will - is the only one throughout all of the J&K threads that has most often been "right on the money"..

Of course that places you on a pretty high pedestal, so you better not fall off now! LOL

 

[TanyaLovesPooh]

I don't watch the show anymore - haven't in a long, long time - but I assume tonights show was one of the ones that TLC was using pieces of - from previous tapings? I wonder how long ago that was filmed?

Kate stated in the episode that she took the little girls for a trip to Florida just before school started. Funny thing, we have berated Kate in the past for mentioning the paps in an episode, well tonight Jon had to bring them up.

 

[C.Ann]

Kate stated in the episode that she took the little girls for a trip to Florida just before school started. Funny thing, we have berated Kate in the past for mentioning the paps in an episode, well tonight Jon had to bring them up.

Another example of one being just as bad as the other.. And it will go on and on and on - as long as they can keep themselves in the limelight..

 

[madge]

Kate stated in the episode that she took the little girls for a trip to Florida just before school started.

they went to Florida in early August.

Funny thing, we have berated Kate in the past for mentioning the paps in an episode, well tonight Jon had to bring them up.

I guess they're part of the whole show is our life .. life is our show thing, aren't they? Only a few more weeks of this version of the show, why stop mentioning them now?

 

[LoraJ]

Was Mady MIA in this episode again? I don't remember seeing her.

 

[madge]

Your "intuition" - if you will - is the only one throughout all of the J&K threads that has most often been "right on the money"..

Of course that places you on a pretty high pedestal, so you better not fall off now! LOL

I'm not sure about all that ... LOL. And you'll notice I'm not weighing in much on this legal stuff. reading those documents makes my brain hurt. LOL

 

[redrosesix]

Sorry that post is so long - it looks like a VERY interesting article though! I'm hoping to have time to read it tonight!!!

ETA: I read it and really like the article! Very telling IMO! I'm ready to head home but am excited to see what y'all think! It's long but worth the read for sure!

A very good read, you're right -- it was worth it.

It wasn't particularly sympathetic to either of them. I did find myself feeling quite disappointed that neither of them seems at all the way they portray themselves on TV ie. it's as if they really are acting on the show, but also disappointed that in some ways they are a lot like they were on the show (just not the good parts)

Of course, I always want to know who the sources are, but Vanity Fair has always been a few cuts above the tabloids as far as responsible journalism. In any case, it was the quotes that made the article -- the fact that their reporter was actually there. For example, when Kate was talking about the stress of the divorce, etc. on the kids (which we've already been discussing) and the PR rep cut her off -- no, that wasn't supposed to be part of the storyline for Kate + 8 (if I have it right, it's "a single mom and her children taking this journey of coping", or something like that)

Thanks for posting it - definitely worth some thought and some discussion.

 

[C.Ann]

I'm not sure about all that ... LOL. And you'll notice I'm not weighing in much on this legal stuff. reading those documents makes my brain hurt. LOL

Sorry, Madge - but you have been pretty much "right on" - so don't try to weasel your way out of it now...

No pressure....

 

[3prettyprincesses]

We know this for a fact? How, because a Vanity Fair reporter says so? How is this any different than Stephanie giving her "dirt"?

I do have to admit, I totally believe the Dr. Phil part.

Vanity Fair is a more reputable magazine IMO. I hardly think that the author of that article, writing for Vanity Fair, would get away with telling flat out lies and fabrications of what Kate said. Just my honest opinion, but this article seems to ring true. And for the record, it's not terribly favorable towards Jon either. His behavior for the last few months certainly isn't going to win him Father of the Year.

This reporter obviously spent time with Kate and Steve. There are direct quotes. That's the part that got me, Kate's words sounding so cold and arrogant. The FAO shopping trip was eye-opening as was her self-inflated comments about co-hosting the view. She said it's so easy for her and laughs at people that say it must be so hard to do tv. I think TLC has done an excellent job of puffing her up so much that I'll be surprised if her head gets through the door. Honestly, what does she have to offer the media? Oh, besides her 8 beautiful children.

 

[madge]

Sorry, Madge - but you have been pretty much "right on" - so don't try to weasel your way out of it now...

No pressure....

people skills, I have .. legal skills, notsomuch.

 

[C.Ann]

Honestly, what does she have to offer the media? Oh, besides her 8 beautiful children.

Great way of summing it all up.. DD said she was trying to watch her when she was on The View, but she kept falling asleep..

 

[madge]

about tonight's show:
http://watching-tv.ew.com/2009/10/19/jon-kate-plus-8-recap-butterflies/

 

[madge]

and Jon? Shut up.

http://www.theinsider.com/news/2954478_Jon_Gosselin_on_the_Balloon_Boy

 

[3prettyprincesses]

about tonight's show:
http://watching-tv.ew.com/2009/10/19/jon-kate-plus-8-recap-butterflies/

Ok, this part made me spit just a little bit of my diet coke out!

"It was a dismayingly Kate-centric episode. Even the balloon ride became less about the hot-air ride than about whether Kate, in high heels and a short skirt, could get into the balloon basket without giving the girls and the balloon men an accidental anatomy lesson."

 

[C.Ann]

about tonight's show:
http://watching-tv.ew.com/2009/10/19/jon-kate-plus-8-recap-butterflies/

"Ask Kate" for next week? Let's get real.. Given her past history (remember when they used to do those segments on the couch about answering emails and how they both said they just deleted any negative comments?), if anyone asks a question that even "hints" that she's less than wonderful and "doing it all for her kids", she won't answer it..

Leave it to TLC though to try to find a way to suck the viewers in.. LOL.. They're getting desperate..

 

[C.Ann]

and Jon? Shut up.

http://www.theinsider.com/news/2954478_Jon_Gosselin_on_the_Balloon_Boy

Could you at least spit out the gum, Jon?