January 1, 2011

[toocherie]

having bought direct from Disney, I am more concerned about my ability--if I were ever to find myself in a position where I needed to sell--that my ability to sell would be hampered because future buyers would be hamstrung by any changes. The rumors would certainly result in making it much more difficult to unload points because the buyers would not have the same "rights" we currently have.

 

[amberjack]

IF these rumored changes occurred, how would Disney treat memberships that changed hands with out being sold? Examples: gifting family members or leaving memberships to heirs. Not everyone who buys a 50 year timeshare will be around to enjoy all of its years. These technically weren't sold, but they won't belong to the original owners either. Would they be treated the same as resales? Or would the new owners get all of the benefits as the original purchasers??

 

[Lil' Grumpy]

i do not understand your exact meaning but i do know what you
are hinting @. logic isn't require unless one is trying to defend
a position or argument. though,i didn't meet with your approval,
it wasn't my objective.


but the issue here is about potential changes in the way
owners can use their memberships. i acknowledge, you
have every right to chose ssr & okw for all your trips. nor do
i doubt , that you have your reasons.

in general,

what i have been learning, is that there are many, many options
that dvc can do. besides making money the right way/s , they
could maintain a higher "interest" by addressing quality-assurance
measures. this isn't your ordinary timeshare, but disney world.
it's a power to influence & if dvc manage it right, they can
accomplished both, especially from the re-sales market.

i wouldn't be surprise if dvc open a resales department.

on the last member cruise, was an opportunity to interact with
other members. it was an educational cruise, & confirmed that
there are members are more into the status aspect not the
functional applications.

if there are restrictions on resales, then the original owners
will have more chances to switch, if they want too. but do you think
others are buying blt points so they can stay @ ssr? just by your
comments, indicated that the parks are not your priority.
they are "tops" for our family. while you are not trying for blt,
many are & doing it by resales through ssr. we already own there,
but i rather "see" members who brought through disney have
first choice @ the 7mos.., then resales, & finally those renting.
* it shouldn't matter if renters are renting from blt owners, they
should not be ahead of owners from other resorts. to me , this
is common sense.

 

[nickspace]

I would not like this change but if it happens there are many other timeshare and vacation rentals to choose from and I would not have a hard time spending my money elsewhere. Lets face it Disney is great but there is a very large world outside of Disney that many people miss out because Disney does such a good job at keeping people in their resort.

Competition is the consumers best friend as overconfidence is a suppliers worst enemy! If Disney gets too confident in their product and takes advantage of their customers many of those customers will go elsewhere. It is through service and going the extra mile for people that made Disney great and if they forget this they will experience a decline.

It take a lot of people and money to keep their product rolling along. A drop in sales could bring the company down more quickly than they realize. I hope this doesn't happen but Disney, like Rome is not too big to fail.

 

[BWV Dreamin]

I seriously doubt many are going to buy other timeshares in the event any or all of these changes take effect. DVC is unique and why people bought in the first place.

Many may sell, but again, not to purchase other timeshares. In reality, it will be such a small number that do, Disney will not care. My bet is most will suck it up and continue their ownership, grumbling along the way. And that's just what Disney is hedging on.

 

[dizfan]

I would not like this change but if it happens there are many other timeshare and vacation rentals to choose from and I would not have a hard time spending my money elsewhere. Lets face it Disney is great but there is a very large world outside of Disney that many people miss out because Disney does such a good job at keeping people in their resort.

Competition is the consumers best friend as overconfidence is a suppliers worst enemy! If Disney gets too confident in their product and takes advantage of their customers many of those customers will go elsewhere. It is through service and going the extra mile for people that made Disney great and if they forget this they will experience a decline.

It take a lot of people and money to keep their product rolling along. A drop in sales could bring the company down more quickly than they realize. I hope this doesn't happen but Disney, like Rome is not too big to fail.

Competition is a good thing in most cases. It can also be a bad thing, when a company sees the competition has done something, so they follow the lead.

I believe all the other major timeshare companies have gone to the direct vs resale approach. If Disney does implement a policy, it's because they are paying attention to what the competition has done.

 

[dj~merlin]

i can't remember , but i don't think you're an owner yet? [nick]

i thought you was looking into dvc? anyhoo...i think dvc is something
special & dvc has a the strong potential , not only to do future
sales but to used a recycle approach where they can make even
make more.

however, i don't understand the lack of support toward their biggest
rewards potential, "the owners". but i think it may be from the changes
in our economy , and the surge of resales.

we support all owners , from all the resorts.

but dvc = wdw, reality is what it is, the most desirable vacation
spot in the world. ps, i have travel around the world.

 

[nolanboys]

We bought a SSR resale contract this spring. I will be extremely disappointed if Disney changes what I thought I was buying into and hope to be grandfathered in to any changes. It will also sour me on WDW. We thought about adding points at the Black Friday sale, but are going to wait and see if there are changes come Jan.1. I hope that Disney realizes that many of us are WDW's biggest fans. I have helped friends plan trips and convinced many to take their families. I have drummed up quite a bit of business for them. Sour me and not only will you make me not want to add on in the future, but I'm not going to be getting others to spend their $ there.

 

[disneynutz]

We bought a SSR resale contract this spring. I will be extremely disappointed if Disney changes what I thought I was buying into and hope to be grandfathered in to any changes. It will also sour me on WDW. We thought about adding points at the Black Friday sale, but are going to wait and see if there are changes come Jan.1. I hope that Disney realizes that many of us are WDW's biggest fans. I have helped friends plan trips and convinced many to take their families. I have drummed up quite a bit of business for them. Sour me and not only will you make me not want to add on in the future, but I'm not going to be getting others to spend their $ there.

If I remember correctly, there are around 20 million visitors to just the MK each year. If the 400,000 DVC members never refer anyone again, I don't think that Disney will really feel the affect.

Even if you decide to sell, you need to find someone to buy and as far as Disney is concerned, nothing has changed.

If nothing else, being a DVC owner has taught me that Disney will do what's best for Disney, without much regard for how the DVC members are impacted.

Bill

 

[Doug7856]

We bought a SSR resale contract this spring. I will be extremely disappointed if Disney changes what I thought I was buying into and hope to be grandfathered in to any changes. It will also sour me on WDW. We thought about adding points at the Black Friday sale, but are going to wait and see if there are changes come Jan.1. I hope that Disney realizes that many of us are WDW's biggest fans. I have helped friends plan trips and convinced many to take their families. I have drummed up quite a bit of business for them. Sour me and not only will you make me not want to add on in the future, but I'm not going to be getting others to spend their $ there.

I think you hit the nail on the head. Walt Disney World lives and breaths on the goodwill it has with its fan base. Fans who talk up their experience at Walt Disney World and share their passion for their Disney vacations are a huge source of the customer base and company profits.

When Disney dips into the goodwill "well" and makes a withdraw, they will pay for it. Iger made this point recently with regard to the poor Disney product known as "Disney California Adventure" and the company is paying big bucks to solve the problem.

Over the past several years, Disney has withdrawn from the goodwill well with it's DVC members. The withdraws have been relatively small, but have created dissatisfaction amongst its most loyal followers. If Disney does the extreme options mentioned here, I predict it will be the last straw for many of Disney's most loyal guests. At some point it will reach a tipping point. I know I bought from Disney because it was different. If they lose that difference, what does the company have left?

 

[PurpleTurtle]

IF these rumored changes occurred, how would Disney treat memberships that changed hands with out being sold? Examples: gifting family members or leaving memberships to heirs. Not everyone who buys a 50 year timeshare will be around to enjoy all of its years. These technically weren't sold, but they won't belong to the original owners either. Would they be treated the same as resales? Or would the new owners get all of the benefits as the original purchasers??

This is us. My parents were the original owners of our DVC. They have both passed away, and I inherited their contracts (my brother the other half). While my parents did buy all of their contracts directly from Disney, I have no idea how they would treat us, as resale buyers or direct buyers. I can tell you that they treated us very poorly throughout the entire process of getting things moved into our names. I assume they would give us the fewest benefits possible, considering how we were treated by member administration. It was such a heartbreaker for us, too, b/c my parents were some of the very first OKW owners. My mother passed away after they had owned for about a year and a half. My father absolutely loved that place. He took us many times and loved being there with his grandkids more than just about anything else in this world. He would never stay anywhere else. I know he would be mortified at how we were/have been treated. So, here we go again, I guess ;-)

 

[Sammie]

If nothing else, being a DVC owner has taught me that Disney will do what's best for Disney, without much regard for how the DVC members are impacted

Welcome to the new DVC.

 

[maburke]

This is us. My parents were the original owners of our DVC. They have both passed away, and I inherited their contracts (my brother the other half). While my parents did buy all of their contracts directly from Disney, I have no idea how they would treat us, as resale buyers or direct buyers. I can tell you that they treated us very poorly throughout the entire process of getting things moved into our names. I assume they would give us the fewest benefits possible, considering how we were treated by member administration. It was such a heartbreaker for us, too, b/c my parents were some of the very first OKW owners. My mother passed away after they had owned for about a year and a half. My father absolutely loved that place. He took us many times and loved being there with his grandkids more than just about anything else in this world. He would never stay anywhere else. I know he would be mortified at how we were/have been treated. So, here we go again, I guess ;-)

Sorry for your trouble, and for your loss. Can you give more details as to how you were treated?

 

[alldiz]

**** ALL ONLY RUMOURS _ DONT SHOOT THE MESSENGER *****

In no meaningful order.....

Effective January 1st, 2011 or sooner....Resale Contract/Owner changes:

This document was approved by Disney's President a couple of months ago and sent to the board for final approval. It has not yet been released to the mere worker bees.....

Possible changes:
A) $1,000.00 DVC 'membership' fee to register your account after closing.
What......pay more money after you already paid closing costs???? Is this for new contracts?
B) Restrict Resale points to DVC use only, no RCI, DCL, ABD.
This would be the least offensive change but it still "devalues" my membership
C) Resale points only good at Home Resort.
Wow....glad I love WLV....this is ridiculous.
D) Resort points only good at 7 months, no home resort advantage!
Remember, read your POS, Disney can at anytime modify the terms of Home Resort Advantage, they have done this in the past with Holiday Lotteries!
Absolutely ridiculous
E) Prior resales may *NOT* be grandfathered in.

I have to say these changes would make everyones membership less valuable. I have 150pts resale and added on 50pts through Disney.
I would never buy another point if these changes take place. Who would???? If I bought new points through Disney.....they would be useless to sell with all of these changes. Am I the only one that thinks this would completely ruin DVC?????
Kerri

 

[chalee94]

I dont see the logic of "protecting their new sales". New sales have the advantage of longer contracts. with resales, you are buying "partial" contracts compared to the original sale date.

not true, BTW.

if you buy an AKV contract direct, it will expire in 2057. if you buy a "used" AKV resale, it will expire on the same date in 2057.

if you buy BCV direct, it will still expire in 2042 just like a BCV resale.

some resales are "stripped" of current use pts and some have more pts available than a contract purchased directly.

anyone buying at BLT now will be staying in a "used" room - whether they buy direct or resale...

there is currently no difference between a resale owner and a direct owner - it will be interesting to see how they try to differentiate the two.

 

[Sammie]

I have to say these changes would make everyones membership less valuable. I have 150pts resale and added on 50pts through Disney.
I would never buy another point if these changes take place. Who would???? If I bought new points through Disney.....they would be useless to sell with all of these changes. Am I the only one that thinks this would completely ruin DVC?????
Kerri

I don't think it would ruin it but it would definitely change it.

Options C and D would have the most adverse affect.

 

[Nancy]

I think Disney would be opening itself up to some serious lawsuits from members that have already purchased through resale if this rumor was indeed true. Not to mention all the negative publicity, something Disney tries to avoid at all cost.

They have the way to control the resale market by using ROFR so what would be gained by doing this ?

In my opinoin, the only thing it would accomplish would be less people buying into the DVC philosophy. Less people buying in means less $$ spent at parks, hotels on site, food, etc., etc. I know we wouldn't have joined DVC if it were not for buying resale.

I don't see this rumor as being correct.

Same with us, resale was the only way my husband would agree to purchase since he is not a Disney fan. This was bought for me and the kids to enjoy. I did my research for a long time before buying and have friends and family that are DVC members. If these rumors were reality when I was buying I would never have bought in..way too restricting.

 

[PEANUT1]

I would be extremely bummed if this happens. The main reason I love DVC so much is the ability to stay at the different places...I would hate to be pigeonholed into just one place. This year alone we made 3 trips...stayed at Treehouses, Boardwalk and Animal Kingdom. If I HAD to stay at Saratoga every time... I would be taking less trips and travel elsewhere instead That would make me very sad.

 

[wcpamotm]

Options C and D would have the most adverse affect.

Without question. Mid-December is one time of year we're most likely to go, and if VWL remains as tough to get in December as it has been lately, I fear with options C and D in effect, we may get shut out entirely.

 

[tjkraz]

I think you hit the nail on the head. Walt Disney World lives and breaths on the goodwill it has with its fan base. Fans who talk up their experience at Walt Disney World and share their passion for their Disney vacations are a huge source of the customer base and company profits.

When Disney dips into the goodwill "well" and makes a withdraw, they will pay for it. Iger made this point recently with regard to the poor Disney product known as "Disney California Adventure" and the company is paying big bucks to solve the problem.

Over the past several years, Disney has withdrawn from the goodwill well with it's DVC members. The withdraws have been relatively small, but have created dissatisfaction amongst its most loyal followers. If Disney does the extreme options mentioned here, I predict it will be the last straw for many of Disney's most loyal guests. At some point it will reach a tipping point. I know I bought from Disney because it was different. If they lose that difference, what does the company have left?

Thing is, there really isn't any evidence to support this supposed erosion in goodwill.

DVC has published its own survey results claiming that members are as satisfied as ever. Take that with a grain of salt if you wish but there are also independent satisfaction numbers produced quarterly by Market Metrix. With few exceptions, DVC has regularly been the leader in the timeshare segment and in 2010 its numbers are as strong as ever.

This comes despite the Internet uproar over loss of valet parking, point reallocations, changes in the booking windows and so on.

The forums a great--don't get me wrong. But the more I read, the more I think there is a substantial disconnect between the vocal minority on the web forums and the larger body of DVC members.

There are times I wonder if people have started to confuse all of the baseless rumors with changes that were actually implemented. Not really much use in devaluing DVC's reputation over things like Top of the World Lounge closing or the annual pass discount being eliminated, but some posters talk about such changes as if they happened 6 months ago.

Reports of a dirty room or a scratched dining room table lead to 10 page discussion threads denouncing "the new DVC." As if these things NEVER happened ten or fifteen years ago...

In the end I suspect this thread is just more of the same. It's certainly possible that DVC will do something to differentiate between direct and resale buyers. But eliminating non-Home bookings and refusing to grandfather those who bought resale over a decade ago....not sure those pass the sniff test. Moreover, I'm certainly not going to bother re-evaluating my outlook on DVC based upon rumor and innuendo--I'll wait for a confirmed list of changes.

If DVC really did not care about members as is implied by some posters, just think of the changes they could have implemented. Does pool hopping help promote new sales? How about members being exempt from the DDP seasonal pricing, the lack of any minimum stay or ticket purchase with the DDP?

Wouldn't it help sales if the booking windows were 11/10 months? Booking a non-home resort would be much easier if the home resort priority were only 1 month as the POS permits. Be a lot easier to sell those remaining SSR and AKV points if owners could book BLT and BCV at 10 months.

Why not charge reservation change fees, housekeeping fees, parking fees, etc.?

Ultimately, there will always be some balance between what is good for members and what is good for DVC. Some owners will live and breathe with every rumor and change. For the vast majority of others, DVC is just the thing that allows them to make a cheap hotel or cruise reservation every year or so.