It's A Not-So-Small World

[Monorail Fan:)]

How would you make Disney transportation better?

 

[Uncleromulus]

Well the first two would do it-but the cost, etc would be enormous.

 

[BillSears]

More buses would probably do it.

 

[Tonka's Skipper]

1. A new (and expansive monorail loop connecting HS and AK to TTC and/or directly to MK and Epcot.

2. A new light rail or tire on track system from some reosrts to the TTC and parks. This will take alot of study in capacity and routes, using smaller cars/trams, no driver, all computer controled.

Each car or tram would load , say at Epcot and got to PO, OKW and SSR or CBR Bk and YBC, etc.....etc......

lengthen boat service between parks and resorts.

(This one is for me) Bring a steam rail line form FW to the new DVC resort(old western theming), WL and to the TTC.

Buses will still have a big part of the show, but the whole system would not be so dependent on it.

With the more varied transportation venues, less delays and problems, systems capacitiy could be adjusted as needed.

Lastly, this kind of transportation system would bring back the wonder of Disney transportation to the guests and world for that matter.

AKK

PS unfortunitly the new *sqeuse(spl?) every buck we can out of the Disney Company* MBA's. all trying to make a name for themselves will never go for it. None of them have the imagination to see the long term advantages, they only see the next quarter profits.

I was always understood that it so much easier to keep a guest happy then to have to try and get them back after they leave!

They arent able to see the truth in Walts dreams.......and as he said(I am paraphasing here)........Biuld it with quality and it will be a success*

OK.off the grandstand........

 

[Magicbus]

Expanding the monorail line is not in the cards. The amount that it costs to move a person from point A to point B on the monorail when compared to the buses is so out of line that it's not even worth considering. And that's the case with the exisiting system. It's a money pit. Buses are dirt cheap in comparision and are able to move more people greater distances than the monorails without additional infrastructure. Monorails look very cool but what you get for the money can't be justified. Think of the monorails as an attraction rather than affordable mass transit. Love it or hate it, buses are it.

Adding more buses, which BTW is ongoing, happens if the individual resorts are willing to pay more for their bus service. Like all the resorts, WDW Transportation has a bottom line. They don't just exist to provide bus service to the resorts on their own. If the resorts want a higher level of bus service than they have now, they will be charged more. Or should I say, you will be asked to pay more to stay at that resort. Is that something you're willing to do?

 

[Lewisc]

Follow the example of some of the railroads. Put up signs that tell us approximately how many minutes until the next bus arrives.

 

[goofy4tink]

While expanding the monorail line, at first glance, always seems like a win/win, it isn't. It is horrific to be on the monorail when there is an issue. It's very easy to empty a bus load of people if there is an equipment issue. Not so easy when you're up in the air. Add to that, the A/C tends to go off, people get scared, annoyed, anxious...it's awful. Been there, done that.
I love the monorail but expansion is just never going to happen...as already stated, it is cost prohibitive.

Addtl buses would be good. But, they could probably do it with smaller buses..maybe 9 person vans, for those resort to resort runs. There just isn't a huge call for a large number of people at any one time moving from one particular resort to another. I doubt buses would really make much sense. Besides, there really isn't a huge issue with using resort to park to resort....you just have to think ahead. Can you imagine the cost to go from resort to resort??? How many people do you think are going to want to go from Pop to CBR, at any one time?? Not many. If they wanted to go to the Polynesian, then just take the MK bus and then monorail or boat over.

You know...now that I have actually written this all down...I think I'll actually go with 'it's just fine the way it is'.

 

[Tonka's Skipper]

The point on people strandedare well taken, but the new designs and track construction make them alot cheaper then you think. Compost materials advanced in the traims them selves make them very dependable and economail

The new ground rail and tire in track are also at the point a full scale syasem would move people faster then buses and maybe cheaper.


As I pointed out before........if you dont keep the magic in the place.....and are willing to settles for buses........then all you will have in the end is common amusment parks and a few fancy looking hotels.


People will go elsewhere............

 

[Tonka's Skipper]

P.S.

Goofy4 tink. I knew the designer and builder of the original trains of the monorail and he was asked to review the plans for the present trains.........welll.........after he went to forida to meet with the enginerrs of the new trains................lets just say he wasn't invited back........he called them simply * junk*.. they would never stand up to the work load.

The delays and breakdowns you talking about is a design trouble, which new generations of trains would hopefully avoid........becuase I know when the air goes out on these trains it can be murder!

AKK

 

[mothermouse]

monorail stop at every resort to parks i know it will never happen just dreaming

 

[ccudmore]

I'll reiterate the suggestion about having signs that say how long until the next bus. Most major transit systems have that already so it's not anything new. And it would really alleviate a lot of frustrations when you have no idea how long the wait will be.

 

[supersuperwendy]

Maybe some more buses, but definitely better dispatch. I think there's tons of buses and the problem lies with dispatch. They could probably just run the system more efficiently.

 

[kaytieeldr]

The point on people strandedare well taken, but the new designs and track construction make them alot cheaper then you think. Compost materials advanced in the traims them selves make them very dependable and economail

A number of years ago, the infrastracture cost was a million dollars per "some [surprisingly short] distance" - does anybody know the exact figure? And of course, it'd just be much more expensive now even with the recession. So, saying it's a lot cheaper than we think would require first knowing what we think . Infrastructure costs for any rail or track system would be high and wouldn't offer an effective enough returin on investment to be worthwhile. Since WDW doesn't charge its Guests for transportation, there's no actual ROI - so it's not a matter of squeezing out every last buck, unless you consider that, as goofy4tink points out, resort costs (and ticket prices, and food and souvenir prices) would go up. Disney is a business, and its owners - shareholders, people like us - want to earn a profit.

 

[Monorail Fan:)]

Follow the example of some of the railroads. Put up signs that tell us approximately how many minutes until the next bus arrives.

That's a great idea!

 

[skiingfast]

If they want to spend the money, put in more monorail lines, trains, and add more buses.

 

[smidgy]

goofy4tink, you made me rethink my vote!!!

I voted for buses resrt to resort, but I (grudginly) see your point.

ok, how about occasional buses from Boardwalk to other resorts? that way if you take advantage of the nightlife or restaurants there or at Yacht/Beach club, you don't have to take a bus to DTD to get back to your resort.
the monorail resorts have MK for transfer, but the "epcot resorts" IS a destination. and not all people buy hoppers, or are even using a park ticket for that day. maybe just run the buses later in the evening, after DHS is closed.

 

[Lewisc]

Disney had a direct bus from CSR to Boardwalk. CSR is a convention hotel. Disney thought CSR guests might want to go to Boardwalk for nightly activities.

Contrary to what a transportation wizard claims, the bus was discontinued after maybe 6 months. I suspect there wasn't the demand Disney thought.

I'll add another option. Flat taxi rates. A sign would tell the guest how much the fare is between your present location and various locations.

 

[Tonka's Skipper]

Hi Kay tee,

I am going to make some calls monday is if I can get some real numbers on costs/capacity on the monorial and ground level light rail or tire in track systems. I do remember the ground level systems are not that expensive, re installation and infrastructure (certantly cheaper then a monorial extention), but they do save money operationally........no drivers....

What I think is also very important is the varied systems and operating the newest is transportation sytems, its a big draw point for people to visit.........thereby supporting the hotels/parks. All these parts support WDW as a whole.

Seems I remember the old story about all the major amusment park owners telling Walt he was wasting his money on theming and landscaping.....the trams in the parking lots.......free attractions within the parks.etc....in short......making DL the amazingly magical place it was......It was predicted DL needed 5,000 guests a day to stay open.....and would be closed down within 8 months of opening...........DL had its 1,000,000 guest at the end of the 3rd month of operation.

You are right Disney is a business........and has almost always made big profits......but they made those profits on providing their guests/ movie goers/ fans a experince far and above everyone else and people were willing to pay more for that experince........if they forget that.......disney will not continue....

AKK

 

[Magicbus]

but the new designs and track construction make them alot cheaper then you think. Compost materials advanced in the traims them selves make them very dependable and economail The new ground rail and tire in track are also at the point a full scale syasem would move people faster then buses and maybe cheaper.

As stated in a couple of previous posts, the extreme cost is not so much because of the trains but due to the infrastructure and operation. The prices you read about include whatever engineering improvements have been made. The most optimistic number I've read is 50 million per mile. How many buses is that? And that's just one mile. Who ends up paying for it, you? Once again, it's not going to happen in any major way. Maybe an extension here and there, but that's it.

 

[Tonka's Skipper]

Hey there Magic,

I see your point of course......will they spend the money???....certainly not with the present management. I know reality, but this is Disney and Magical surprizes due happen! I think you will see more then just a extensoin here and there.

I also know the bus system will always have a big part of the load...... and the design and build time for any additions, even just a extension is 5 to 10 years out.

Now the interesting thing developing is that new high speed train east/west???...will that be to the MCO?.......what will happen to a WDW station.......will it be one station?, a series?..

Will it be only buses to bring guests from the train station to the resort?....parks?.......Here I see the likely possibility of a ligth rail or tire in track system being built, it would fit in nicely!

Fun stuff to think about!

AKK