Is my math correct?

[Shellandscott]

I may be incorrect but I do not see anyone actually comparing apples to apples. I see a lot of comparing hotel rooms to DVC units of various sizes. So I looked to see what the actual price to stay at a studio in $$$ was. Per the Disney website to stay in a studio at VWL from 7-6-08 checking out 7-18-08 for 12 nights (maximizing the least weekend nights for most time spent) would be $4,861.00 before taxes. This is only the July trip. DVC was a good option for us. It may not be for everyone. However if you are going to compare paying cash to DVC, compare the actual accommodations. FYI the one bedroom would be $6,548 for the same time frame. 2 bedroom is $10,666.

 

[jvaleri1]

1.) It's difficult to get DH to take time off from work for a vacation. DVC ownership makes planning for vacations necessary.
2.) We love Disney - we've been 3 times in the past 5 years and wished we could have come more often.
3.) My MIL mentioned she wanted to do a large family vacation (8 people) in Jan in a few years for her 60th bday. It just made more sense for the larger accomodation needs vs paying out of pocket.
4.) DVC makes it easy to go to other destinations through Interval International. A week in Italy is now within our reach!

It's not for everyone but we can't wait till we go "home" on Wednesday this week!

 

[sjdisneywedding]

I was using the price I was quoted from the DVC rep of $104 per point. Not sure if I was given incorrect information or not.

My figures (I could bw wrong) were based on annual dues of $659 per year times 47 years. I'm looking long term. If you do that, you have to account for money spent on annual dues.

well its pretty odd to do it that way. you are not out the entire 47 years worth of dues to start

if you want to find the break even point you typically would go year by year

 

[DVC Mater]

I was using the price I was quoted from the DVC rep of $104 per point. Not sure if I was given incorrect information or not.

My figures (I could bw wrong) were based on annual dues of $659 per year times 47 years. I'm looking long term. If you do that, you have to account for money spent on annual dues.

I'm still confused how you got 17 trips, can you show me the math??

 

[Mickey Fliers]

Hey Boom - One other thing to consider...your family is growing in size. Currently you are a family of 5 (including your stepson). Are you planning on more kids? You will soon be outgrowing the WL accomodations. You will either need to get two rooms or downgrade your resort.

I mention this because this is exactly what drove us to DVC. We could also stay at SOG for $140/night. However, we really value our space while on vacation. We like to put the kids to bed and still have some alone time. KWIM?

Not every decision is purely financially based.

Best of luck

 

[boomhauer]

I'm still confused how you got 17 trips, can you show me the math??

Minimum points - 160 x $104 = $16,640
Dues per year - $4.12 x 160 points = $659
Dues per year times 47 years = $30,973
Total cost = $47,613
160 points would buy a MAXIMUM of 11 nights per year at WL.

11 nights at WL standard room x current rate of $225 per night = $2,783 (tax included)

DVC cost (if paid for upfront) = $47,613 divided by cost of standard room at WL = $2,783 = 17.

As for the apples to apples comparison, personally, I prefer the standard room at WL to the studio. They're the same size, but in the standard room, you get 2 queen size beds as opposed to 1 and a sleeper sofa. You also get daily housekeeping. For me, that's the best comparison to use because that is the room I prefer.

These numbers obviously are on a +/- scale. It doesn't include hotel room increases or increase in dues or finance charges. If you pay for DVC upfront, that number of 17 is going to decrease. If you finance, it will increase.

 

[boomhauer]

Hey Boom - One other thing to consider...your family is growing in size. Currently you are a family of 5 (including your stepson). Are you planning on more kids? You will soon be outgrowing the WL accomodations. You will either need to get two rooms or downgrade your resort.

I mention this because this is exactly what drove us to DVC. We could also stay at SOG for $140/night. However, we really value our space while on vacation. We like to put the kids to bed and still have some alone time. KWIM?

Not every decision is purely financially based.

Best of luck

You're exactly right. This is the MAJOR reason we started looking at DVC again. As much as we loved WL, one thing we discussed is how next year, we really want to take the twins to ASMovies. It's perfect for kids. We've always loved it there. So not every stay would be done at WL. Brings me back to wishing DVC would operate a program for stays at the Values.

 

[rantnnravin]

Minimum points - 160 x $104 = $16,640
Dues per year - $4.12 x 160 points = $659
Dues per year times 47 years = $30,973
Total cost = $47,613
160 points would buy a MAXIMUM of 11 nights per year at WL.

11 nights at WL standard room x current rate of $225 per night = $2,783 (tax included)

DVC cost (if paid for upfront) = $47,613 divided by cost of standard room at WL = $2,783 = 17.

As for the apples to apples comparison, personally, I prefer the standard room at WL to the studio. They're the same size, but in the standard room, you get 2 queen size beds as opposed to 1 and a sleeper sofa. You also get daily housekeeping. For me, that's the best comparison to use because that is the room I prefer.

These numbers obviously are on a +/- scale. It doesn't include hotel room increases or increase in dues or finance charges. If you pay for DVC upfront, that number of 17 is going to decrease. If you finance, it will increase.

ah, but if, using your calculations, you purchased a mere 4 points more it would yield you 12 nights maximum and reduce the break-even to 16 years...

ETA:
of course, if you bought the 225 point contract on the TTS right now for $80/point, it would yield 17 nights per year and reduce your break-even to 11 years ...

But honestly, i truly don't understand why you're adding it all up as an "upfront" cost. it's not as if you're paying for your wilderness lodge visits upfront.
We look at it as ensuring that we will vacation each year in the way that we truly want to. There is no way in God's green earth that we would continue to go to Disney every year - (or even dream of going to Hawaii) if we were paying a lump sum each year. And let's face it, the "vacation fund" always gets dipped into for things that are "necessities"

We are an anomaly on these boards as we chose to finance.
I look at the cost this way: we pay $150 per month plus annual dues, so that's approximately $2600 a year (+/-). Realistically, just because of the way we are, we would never bank that money. Our first trip to Disney cost us $4500 - and we stayed at All Star Movies - and loved it. Which is what got us interested. Now, we not only stay in great Disney hotels, but we are assured that we will go on a real vacation each year, something we didn't do before our first Disney trip. It's a luxury purchase - something you don't need, but would really like to have - and keep having.

 

[Mickey Fliers]

You're exactly right. This is the MAJOR reason we started looking at DVC again. As much as we loved WL, one thing we discussed is how next year, we really want to take the twins to ASMovies. It's perfect for kids. We've always loved it there. So not every stay would be done at WL. Brings me back to wishing DVC would operate a program for stays at the Values.

Yeah, if you are looking to stay at value and mod resorts or get two rooms, then DVC probably isn't for you. My husband is a bit spoiled .

I think you number crunch, speculate and calculate until the cows come home, but if it doesn't feel right for you, then it probably isn't. Like you, we were traveling at least twice per year, staying in Deluxes (Poly, CR, BC, YC - anything for a party of 5), and our accomodations were costing us approx. $4000/year. DVC was a "no brainer" for us. We also hated having to go to "bed" at 8:00 pm when we were all in one room. Yes, I still have to pay my annual dues, but my initial cost will be sucked up on year seven.

 

[sjdisneywedding]

But honestly, i truly don't understand why you're adding it all up as an "upfront" cost. it's not as if you're paying for your wilderness lodge visits upfront.
.

yes thats what I was mentioning earlier.

adding all the MF's up front is not typically the way its done.

unless of course you are deliberately trying to make the numbers not work

 

[boomhauer]

adding all the MF's up front is not typically the way its done.

unless of course you are deliberately trying to make the numbers not work

A.Why wouldn't you add all the MF's in? Do you think at some point you won't have to pay for them any more?

B.Why would anyone NOT want the numbers to work? I go to Disney twice a year. Do you think I'm purposely looking for a way to spend as much money as I possibly can?

 

[CarolAnnC]

Minimum points - 160 x $104 = $16,640
Dues per year - $4.12 x 160 points = $659
Dues per year times 47 years = $30,973
Total cost = $47,613
160 points would buy a MAXIMUM of 11 nights per year at WL.

11 nights at WL standard room x current rate of $225 per night = $2,783 (tax included)

DVC cost (if paid for upfront) = $47,613 divided by cost of standard room at WL = $2,783 = 17.

As for the apples to apples comparison, personally, I prefer the standard room at WL to the studio. They're the same size, but in the standard room, you get 2 queen size beds as opposed to 1 and a sleeper sofa. You also get daily housekeeping. For me, that's the best comparison to use because that is the room I prefer.

These numbers obviously are on a +/- scale. It doesn't include hotel room increases or increase in dues or finance charges. If you pay for DVC upfront, that number of 17 is going to decrease. If you finance, it will increase.

I just ran a quote on Disney's website for a random week in June for a standard view room. The price is $275 per night plus taxes. Remember DVC rooms include taxes already.

Also, if you have children, once they hit age 18, if they vacation with you in the same room you will pay an additional price per 3rd and/or 4th adults in the room with you.

Assuming though that you can vacation with them in the same room. By the time my DD's turned 18 we had long been booking two bedroom units for our vacations for many years.

I don't think your numbers compare. Your $275 room will be $550 at least in the next ten years, plus taxes.

LIke I said before, DVC is not for everyone, and it certainly seems like it is not for you. But, I do not believe your comparisons are fair.

 

[RobDoc]

I was using the price I was quoted from the DVC rep of $104 per point. Not sure if I was given incorrect information or not.

That all depends on what question you asked the DVC rep. If you asked specifically about VWL, you got incorrect information. If you asked about AKV or SSR the information was correct - EXCEPT - there is also an incentive which also reduces that pricing for purchases of 160 or more points. $104 is the price a current member would pay for 25 or 50 points , NOT what a new buyer would pay. If you just asked about the current price per point you got precisely the right answer.

Minimum points - 160 x $104 = $16,640
Dues per year - $4.12 x 160 points = $659
Dues per year times 47 years = $30,973
Total cost = $47,613
160 points would buy a MAXIMUM of 11 nights per year at WL.

11 nights at WL standard room x current rate of $225 per night = $2,783 (tax included)

DVC cost (if paid for upfront) = $47,613 divided by cost of standard room at WL = $2,783 = 17.

As for the apples to apples comparison, personally, I prefer the standard room at WL to the studio. They're the same size, but in the standard room, you get 2 queen size beds as opposed to 1 and a sleeper sofa. You also get daily housekeeping. For me, that's the best comparison to use because that is the room I prefer.

These numbers obviously are on a +/- scale. It doesn't include hotel room increases or increase in dues or finance charges. If you pay for DVC upfront, that number of 17 is going to decrease. If you finance, it will increase.

Aside from the error in the pricing you have chosen to use for your "comparison" (your numbers are still wrong in spite of the numerous corrections you've had in this thread) - if you feel the WL standard room is superior to a DVC studio then you need not do any math at all. Enjoy the standard room. Only OKW has 2 queens in a studio.

If your preference is truly for a WL standard room or a value standard room, you are probably MUCH better off just doing what you're doing. In your original comparison you were using a VWL 1BR - which is not apples-to-apples with a standard room at any WDW resort. Sounds like you're just fine with your current plan.

 

[sjdisneywedding]

A.Why wouldn't you add all the MF's in? Do you think at some point you won't have to pay for them any more?

B.Why would anyone NOT want the numbers to work? I go to Disney twice a year. Do you think I'm purposely looking for a way to spend as much money as I possibly can?

A) you DO add them all in, just not as an upfront cost
read Maters post:

I'm not sure how your 17 trips to break even thing comes from because with your numbers (using DOC's updated $98 pt for VWL direct from Disney) your upfront is $15,680. In year #8 total DVC would be $21,849 and total CASH would be $22,264. In year #9 total DVC would be $22,620 and total CASH would be $25,047 saving you $2,427 that year. Every year after that you would save $2011.80 by just paying MF. That looks like money savings to me...(not counting inflation of cash rooms going up and MF's going up as well)

you are even at about year 8, 9 for sure if you want to be safe

EVEN: you have spent on DVC what you would have if your non dvc assumptions held true

you have paid for 9 years of MF's at this point not 47(you want to figure in 47 years of MF's then you MUST figure in 47 years of non dvc stays.)

now going forward after year 8(or 9) you are saving money

B) I could care less what your motives are to be honest, (I actually defended you saying your questions are legit) Im just giving my opinion on how I calculate it

 

[boomhauer]

I just ran a quote on Disney's website for a random week in June for a standard view room. The price is $275 per night plus taxes. Remember DVC rooms include taxes already.

The numbers I was using are for January stays (low season). Late July, in deluxe resorts, are also low season.

I know the hotel rates increase on average, about 5% a year. I don't think $550 in 10 years is accurate though:

225
237
248
261
274
288
302
317
333
350

 

[DVC Mater]

Minimum points - 160 x $104 = $16,640
Dues per year - $4.12 x 160 points = $659
Dues per year times 47 years = $30,973
Total cost = $47,613
160 points would buy a MAXIMUM of 11 nights per year at WL.

11 nights at WL standard room x current rate of $225 per night = $2,783 (tax included)

DVC cost (if paid for upfront) = $47,613 divided by cost of standard room at WL = $2,783 = 17.

If you could prepay 47 years worth of MF, I think it would be fair to also take the cash price out 47 years and realize that you would pay $130,801 (2,783x47) with DVC saving you $83,188 over 47 years. Plus after year 17 you would have nothing to pay for accomadations for the next 30 years....

 

[jade1]

Not that most of us plan to ever sell-or recommend buying with the intention, but at the very least DVC contracts are an asset we can sell and recover some of the investment if needed. Paying cash for rooms is money gone forever with no chance of any recovery.

 

[CarolAnnC]

The numbers I was using are for January stays (low season). Late July, in deluxe resorts, are also low season.

I know the hotel rates increase on average, about 5% a year. I don't think $550 in 10 years is accurate though:

225
237
248
261
274
288
302
317
333
350

Oh yes it is accurate! Before DVC I stayed in WDW Resorts and the prices doubled easily in a decade. In fact, didn't the Contemporary Resort open with their guest rooms at approx $50 per night?

And the low season price for a WL room starts at $225 PLUS tax. That is today's price.

This thread seems to have run its course with the same arguments being hashed over like beating a dead horse. The OP has his original question answered now so this thread is closed.