Is Disney finally seeing consumers say they're pricing themselves out of peoples ability to pay?

[Captainkidd76]

Fair enough. I didn’t look ahead a year but priced them both for a trip this past July and the difference was less than $20. FWIW we ended up staying at Royal Pacific for $434 which was relatively cheap compared to the other universal or Disney deluxes.

Given I’m out of state and have maybe 7 in park days a year I’ve never entertained buying AP so I ignore those rates

Did you go on the 4th of July?

We made a last minute trip over to UIniversal and stayed at Royal Pacific in July, 2 nights, Friday and Saturday. Paid $223 a night with an AP.

 

[Captainkidd76]

We're out of state but do buy AP for both and do price AP rates for both. I do agree for the most part.
I've never lucked into less than $300 at HR. I guess I don't go when the rates are the cheapest. We plan our trips around specific things happening in the parks rather than just finding the cheapest dates and going. We find them really even most of the time, expect this spring and summer when Disney threw some huge discounts to the AP

We did a Uni/WDW split in June. Stayed at HR and GF. GF was cheaper, fairly significantly. Both were booked at AP discounts. Disney AP rates are typically easier to come by too.

Another example is next week. We are doing 1 night at Uni then moving to Disney for 2 nights. This time I did one of the "value" resorts for Uni (we won't need the EP since we are only going for Hagrids) and the AP rates ranged from $94 - $144. Priced AP rates at Disney Values and they ranged from $97 - $137.

Yeah, I think you probably find that because you're looking more. Universal AP rates are a cinch to find. Just go to the website, under group code enter APH.

As for the Values, can't really compare the 2. Disney's Values are decorated motels with no amenities. Universal's Values are larger rooms with multiple pools, lazy rivers, slides, bowling alley.

Just taking a quick look at June 2020, here are rack rates for Hard Rock and Grand Floridian:

June 6-13 Grand Floridian: $692 per night
June 6-13 Hard Rock: $390 per night

 

[AngiTN]

Yeah, I think you probably find that because you're looking more. Universal AP rates are a cinch to find. Just go to the website, under group code enter APH.

As for the Values, can't really compare the 2. Disney's Values are decorated motels with no amenities. Universal's Values are larger rooms with multiple pools, lazy rivers, slides, bowling alley.

Just taking a quick look at June 2020, here are rack rates for Hard Rock and Grand Floridian:

June 6-13 Grand Floridian: $692 per night
June 6-13 Hard Rock: $390 per night

I should rephrase I guess. I know fully well how to look for them, had an AP at Uni for years.
They are harder to book. They are not always available for the dates but I've never not found them at a Disney resort.
And sorry, but I do compare the Values at both. Just like I compare the Deluxe at both.
I paid less than $300 a night at GF in June and over $300 a night at HR for the week before (did 5 nights at HR and 7 at GF) Disney gave a higher discount off the rack rate.

 

[Captainkidd76]

I should rephrase I guess. I know fully well how to look for them, had an AP at Uni for years.
They are harder to book. They are not always available for the dates but I've never not found them at a Disney resort.
And sorry, but I do compare the Values at both. Just like I compare the Deluxe at both.
I paid less than $300 a night at GF in June and over $300 a night at HR for the week before (did 5 nights at HR and 7 at GF) Disney gave a higher discount off the rack rate.

I don't want to call anyone anything, but sorry - I'm not buying that you paid under $300 a night for the GF. I had an AP at Disney for years and never received an AP rate of more than 50% off of rack rate.

Here is what I find - People that will defend Disney to no end (as I used to do) will never admit to Disney doing anything wrong. They can always get ridiculous rates at the hotels, they never wait in line for anything, they get Fastpasses for Flight of Passage at 9:00AM the day they're going to the park, just after they got a walk in table an hour earlier at Cinderella's Royal whatever they're calling it now. Somehow, there is always someone who can accomplish things at WDW that nobody else can.

 

[Beer Me]

Did you go on the 4th of July?

We made a last minute trip over to UIniversal and stayed at Royal Pacific in July, 2 nights, Friday and Saturday. Paid $223 a night with an AP.

July 11-14. $434/night. Booked through Universal’s site. I checked often for the same dates before and after booking and never saw anything cheaper. $223 is fantastic.

Again, I haven’t done the math in awhile but AP is likely not going to be an answer for me - an out of stater who spends no more than a week in any theme parks.

And to stay kind of on topic - I’m not saying Disney isn’t out of control on pricing but Universal isn’t far behind for the average tourist at peak times. If I can somehow get in on those $200-something rates for the Universal deluxes I would change my tune.

 

[Captainkidd76]

July 11-14. $434/night. Booked through Universal’s site. I checked often for the same dates before and after booking and never saw anything cheaper. $223 is fantastic.

Again, I haven’t done the math in awhile but AP is likely not going to be an answer for me - an out of stater who spends no more than a week in any theme parks.

And to stay kind of on topic - I’m not saying Disney isn’t out of control on pricing but Universal isn’t far behind for the average tourist at peak times. If I can somehow get in on those $200-something rates for the Universal deluxes I would change my tune.

Universal offers something called a Stay More Save More rate. I believe it kicks in at 5 nights. It's not always as low at $223 per night, but for example, this December:

Arrival Date Saturday, December 7, 2019 Departure Date Friday, December 13, 2019 Total Number of Nights 6 Room Type Pool View 2 Queen Room

Requests High Floor, Connecting room requested (Room connected by interior door) Room Rate Per Night Dec 7​ $280.50​ Dec 8 - Dec 12​ $261.75​ Rate Description Stay More, Save More 5 Night Discount Number of Guests 4

That is our reservation for December. If someone can find the Grand Floridian for within $200 of that rate, I'd be surprised. Another huge plus about Hard Rock - The Rewards program. We had enough points from our last stay for a free night, so we used that for the 7th night. So average we're actually paying just about $227 per night.

 

[HopperFan]

The explicitly say on the call that attendance at WDW was down:

“And at Walt Disney World, our survey data suggest that guests are deferring visitation until after Star Wars: Galaxy's Edge opens, which we believe contributed to the decline in attendance we saw during the third quarter.”

Their "survey data suggests" ... This comment has nothing to do with facts and numbers, it has to do with a survey they sent out to X number of guests asking them when they will next come and the responses leaned towards after SWGE opens. That is really meaningless.

"Decline in attendance ... third quarter" .... so April, May, June .... a quirky time of year but how do they calculate attendance ... any way they want and we'll never know because they don't share any of that information. Is it how many actual bodies walk through the gate? How many tickets were actually purchased in that time frame? Tough to give any credence to information that provides zero facts to back it up.

I'm diehard Disney here .......... I've been one of those bodies, regularly, since WDW opened. I find current "crowds" too much. For the first time in a decade we won't renew our Annual Passes. ONLY REASON why = CROWDS and what comes with it.

But if I believe them and the body count is actually down then what we have is an operation problem. When attraction lines are longer than ever, quick service lines longer than ever, walk ways more crowded than ever, stroller parking spilling out in walkways, line cutting and guest behavior negative ................ and there aren't more people?? Then Disney has an operation problem aka not enough CMs, rides not operating at capacity, food locations with slower kitchens slowing the lines down aka not enough CMs ........ just about every negative happening that would make it appear crowded could then be pointed right at management's operation choices.

Disney has one of the highest hotel occupancy rates, local hotels are also doing well and more are being built. Disney would be the number one destination for those folks ... but attendance is down? Maybe it's their excuse to their stockholders to explain why merchandise sales are down. Maybe its there excuse to raise food prices because not as much is being sold ... I mean BOG Breakfast is a perfect example of that failing thought process. Maybe it's groundwork for future major changes that impact attendance, maybe another big price hike. We just don't know, we'll never know ... Disney proclaims things folks take as fact. Numbers can be worked in any way they want to support what they want in the end.

Since we only go every 4-6 years, price is sort of irrelevant to us. It's expensive but we don't go that often. last time was 2016 and next time may be in 2022 once the current work and celebrations are done.

And I understand this and you are Disney's #1 target. The family that doesn't come often and still willing to drop a huge wallet full of money ... even though they are getting way less for the money.

I have always said Disney ticket prices are reasonable and fair even when they keep raising the price. But due to increased crowds and decreased operating capacity & CMs ... on a daily basis I am getting much less. With an AP and regular visits I can deal with it. But if I were someone like you that planned a big trip and spending lots of money, I would not be happy.

Sorry, but I don't agree at all.

July 11-18, 2020 at Beach Club - $503 per night
July 11-18, 2020 at Hard Rock - $414 per night

The only reason it's that high is because AP rates and Stay More Save More rates aren't loaded yet. We go every year in July and the only time we ever paid more than $250 per night at Hard Rock was a year we got a Deluxe Room.

But if you want to look at a closer time when discount rates are already loaded, here you go:

December 14-21 at Beach Club - $500 per night
December 14-21 at Hard Rock - $262 per night

Anyone I have talked to that stayed at both park resort hotels says that their experience and service at Universal's is far superior to Disney's. That would factor in to my decision.

 

[Captainkidd76]

Anyone I have talked to that stayed at both park resort hotels says that their experience and service at Universal's is far superior to Disney's. That would factor in to my decision.

Count me in on that. I'm not saying Universal is better than Disney (though in many ways it is). And while I love many of the Disney Resorts, yeah, no contest - Service at the Universal hotels blows Disney out of the water.

 

[Disneylover99]

Club level, theme park views, suites etc are really ridiculous at Disney

But when it comes to standard rooms at peak times they are pretty close. We vacation in the summer and the difference between a standard room at Hard Rock and Beach Club are negligible.

Universal definitely offers more discounts off-peak - I’m just never able to take advantage.

I do agree with you. But I do find Disney creeping up very quickly. Sometimes we do split Universal Disney trips.

3 years ago, I got HardRock for the high 300’s per night. BC was way less at just over $200 per night. Last year we got HardRock for just over $400per night the Poly was just over $300 per night. This year, HardRock and the Poly were roughly the same price for our dates, just over $400 per night. Next year, I expect Disney will probably surpass Universal.

 

[Captainkidd76]

I do agree with you. But I do find Disney creeping up very quickly. Sometimes we do split Universal Disney trips.

3 years ago, I got HardRock for the high 300’s per night. BC was way less at just over $200 per night. Last year we got HardRock for just over $400per night the Poly was just over $300 per night. This year, HardRock and the Poly were roughly the same price for our dates, just over $400 per night. Next year, I expect Disney will probably surpass Universal.

Just out of curiosity, how many nights did you spend at Hard Rock? I'm sorry, I just can't imagine how people are paying so much to stay there yet are getting about 60% off of rack rates at Disney. Something isn't adding up here.

I'd love to see how things are looking going forward. If anyone on here can find a Disney Deluxe Resort for less money than a Universal Deluxe Resort for the same dates, please post your dates and rates.

 

[Disneylover99]

Just out of curiosity, how many nights did you spend at Hard Rock? I'm sorry, I just can't imagine how people are paying so much to stay there yet are getting about 60% off of rack rates at Disney. Something isn't adding up here.

Typically 3 nights at the HardRock in early to mid August. We have an AP, but couldn’t find anything for less then $400 this year so we opted to stay off site for the Universal portion of our trip. We have the Poly booked for $418.50. That includes tax.

 

[NickC]

For me, the issue isn't necessarily the cost, it's what we are paying for. I have zero interest in Pandora or SWGE, but it drives up the price, increases the crowds and, worst of all, diverts funds and resources away from preserving the nostalgia and 'magic' that makes WDW so great. If I was just looking for the 'theme park' experience without the nostalgia, then I would just go to Universal. FoP is an ok ride, but I preferred it when the parks were absolutely spotless and each blade of grass was the same length. The last time few times we went, the level of cleanliness was declining. Also, on our last trip, the busses were running slower, the lines were longer and the CMs were not as polite. There was a time, not too long ago, when everyone who worked in WDW was extremely pleasant. I may not have lost the ability to pay, but the willingness to pay is slowly fading.

 

[Captainkidd76]

Typically 3 nights at the HardRock in early to mid August. We have an AP, but couldn’t find anything for less then $400 this year so we opted to stay off site for the Universal portion of our trip. We have the Poly booked for $418.50. That includes tax.

Hard Rock looks pretty booked for August. Portofino and Royal Pacific are both available for under $350 for the random dates I put in. I didn't look, but you might want to try seeing the rates for 5 nights. That's when the SMSM rates kick in. I would keep checking your dates though. I don't necessarily like this but Universal's inventory is constantly changing, as our rates. It's a pain in the butt, but well worth it.

 

[NickC]

The Hard Rock has a lot more to offer for the price. It is possible to walk to US and IOA, and of course, City Walk. And you get the express pass for staying on-site. Imagine having that perk in WDW. How much would they charge for that?!

 

[Disneylover99]

Hard Rock looks pretty booked for August. Portofino and Royal Pacific are both available for under $350 for the random dates I put in. I didn't look, but you might want to try seeing the rates for 5 nights. That's when the SMSM rates kick in. I would keep checking your dates though. I don't necessarily like this but Universal's inventory is constantly changing, as our rates. It's a pain in the butt, but well worth it.

It’s okay. We just finished our Universal stay. We ended up staying at The Drury for $89 per night plus free parking. It was great! We found we didn’t really need express pass anyways.

I had been stalking the prices long before the AP discounts opened up for my dates. At one point I could have got Portofino for the $300’s months ago, but I’m just not a fan of the place. I’d rather stay at HardRock or RPR. I know it’s cheaper to stay more nights, but 3 nights at Universal is enough for me.

 

[ksdave]

We went to Disney earlier this year after not being there for many years. To us, the VALUE is no longer there, everything is too expensive (food/hotels/etc.) and the huge crowds mean you near spend 2+ days in a park to do what you used to be able to do in 1 day. We have zero interest in going back. I'm sure most companies project higher revenue/earnings in the future, but often that doesn't happen. There are LOTS of other places to go on vacation, it isn't like Disney is the only choice.

We feel exactly the same way. The only reason we are going next month is because it is our granddaughter's first trip and we only live 4 hours away. And we are only going for a couple of days. We would much rather spend our hard-earned $$$ on cruises, trips to places like the Biltmore and Charleston, etc., than on WDW. I think the that the coming economic downturn will hit Disney very hard and very fast.

 

[Captainkidd76]

The Hard Rock has a lot more to offer for the price. It is possible to walk to US and IOA, and of course, City Walk. And you get the express pass for staying on-site. Imagine having that perk in WDW. How much would they charge for that?!

Yup - IT's why we always stay Hard Rock or Royal Pacific. It is the single greatest perk in the theme park industry.

 

[DarthGallifrey]

"If it were then the attraction lines wouldn't be so long"

Sometimes WDW reduces ride capacity when crowds are relatively smaller. The did it a couple of Januarys ago.

This. The week I was there in July the standbys were certainly long but I had no problem adjusting FP times and getting new ones beyond my first 3 day of. I also noticed a lot of people not understanding what fastpass was. This is completely anecdotal to my experience but it seemed to me based on talking to CMs and my personal experience with seeing many people getting confused about FP+ that standbys are long in part due to poor planning from people visiting and decreasing the staff running the rides.

 

[Beer Me]

The Hard Rock has a lot more to offer for the price. It is possible to walk to US and IOA, and of course, City Walk. And you get the express pass for staying on-site. Imagine having that perk in WDW. How much would they charge for that?!

Exactly. Its a great perk. I don’t think Disney could have an unlimited fast pass option as a perk because there are too many deluxe rooms. Or they restrict it to certain deluxe resorts or room types and charge accordingly.

The cash value at Universal for express is around $150/day per person. Disney could offer it for $500 and would probably sell out instantly. It would be madness.

I don’t love FP but it’s a tolerable compromise given Disney’s bigger crowds and higher demand.

 

[Ninja Mom]

"If it were then the attraction lines wouldn't be so long"

Sometimes WDW reduces ride capacity when crowds are relatively smaller. The did it a couple of Januarys ago.

To wit: http://1e2e79e255ccc28ed3b5-b1ba41d...cf1.rackcdn.com/bonus-len-testa-interview.mp3

~NM