Is Disney at fault for disappointment?

[DisneyWishes14]

I think if Disney advertised what it's really like to thoroughly plan a WDW vacation ( I'm referring to one that includes the popular attractions: BOG, A&E, trying to get BBB before CRT) it would turn people off. Most people don't have the time to put in to stay up late for FP+, get up early for ADR's, stalk the website, etc. Most people want a vacation - stress free and magical. Disney advertises that THEY make the magic happen. But most of us on here know that it takes a lot of work on our parts to really make that magic happen for our families. Our family goes down often and has had the luxury to pick and choose our few must-do's on each trip. Over the years, we've slowly checked off our bucket list so at this point we have no desire to go to the highly in demand attractions. But for families who are going on a once and done trip, I can see how it could be very disappointing if you simply what the commercials and read the marketing material and think it's all going to be very easy.

I agree that WDW really is a reservation world unto itself. There are some places that are somewhat comparable. We found in Copenhagen that reservations were absolutely necessary and if you were late, they may not seat you. If your meal took too long and they needed the table,they would ask you to leave before you could order dessert, even if it took too long because the kitchen was slow!

 

[lustergirl]

OMG Disney is alot of work. Got to admit the first time I went I was lost. I found these boards a few months before and that was a blessing. The very first trip we took I made ADR's but cancelled a few of them because it was way too much and poor planning on the times that we ate. Now I love the planning but have to admit again that sometimes it feels like a chore.

 

[loves to dive]

Could Disney do a tad better job of letting people know that most TS restaurants required ADRs, possibly. Is it their fault someone is disappointed, nope. We are responsible for our own enjoyment, I've been on diving trips where there was nothing but sand to see at first glance. I had to get right down in there and actually look. Did someone tell me that in advance? Nope, I researched, I used my little brain. I don't go anywhere without researching it first, that includes a picnic to a new park. No, not obsessive planning, I don't plan much at Disney, no FP until night before, no ADRs until day of if at all. But I do go on line and look to see if I can take my furry baby with me to a new park, am I allowed to bring a refreshing adult beverage, are there places I can spread a blanket and read? Wouldn't buy a car without research, wouldn't buy a house, wouldn't buy a book without at least reading the reviews.

 

[MakiraMarlena]

And the 180 day reservation system is not for the convenience of the guests. It is so Disney can determine the staffing level they will need in their restaurants.

 

[ladyelizabeth]

I agree that it is on the guest to do their research. But I also understand that for newbies it can be a bit of shock the amount of planning that goes into a Disney vacation.

But honestly I do see this kind of disappointment that people talk about regarding other types of vacations - specifically cruises. And not just DCL, all cruise lines. I always check out cruise critic reviews and forums prior to sailing and the more and more reviews I read are of people complaining about certain things that I just think - "yeah, that's what a cruise is like." For example people who have never cruised before get twisted about the gratuity that is added on per person per day. Or how 18% gratuity is automatically added to a bar bill. I even once read that someone was upset that playing Bingo cost extra money (Umm. it's gambling. So yeah. It costs money.). Seriously though, you want to see real complaining - read reviews of cruises over on cruise critic.

You can see this with lots of different kinds of vacations. But I think that Disney is such a bigger scale and people feel that since they are paying so much money that it needs to be the perfect family vacation. It's really all about doing your research and finding the perfect family vacation for you. That could be commando touring or a more relaxed approach. But that's on you as a guest. And Mickey isn't going to stop by your hotel and take you around for the day.

 

[Misha72683]

I think Disney is at fault because the FP+ system is insane. The idea that you need/should book your ride 30-60 days in advance is insane. Most people don't realize that this truly needs to be done because it doesn't need to be done anywhere else. I spend the day at Hershey Park and there's nothing I need to know or do beforehand besides common sense. Obviously try to come when the park opens and do the big rides in the morning or evening. That's common sense. But to think you need to go online and pre-book 3 rides per day at specific times when most people don't even know which park they're going to be in that day is pretty crazy.

As for ADRs, I blame the visitor. It's a restaurant. You wouldn't go to your local sit down restaurant without making reservations. Now the idea of having to make reservations 6 months in advance is of course nuts but the concept of reservations for a restaurant is pretty normal and happens everywhere.

Actually, I would. I only make reservtions if it's a day I expect to be very busy (my husband's birthday is Valentine's Day, we always make reservations) or if I want to eat at a specific time, otherwise I just show up. Sometimes I have to wait,but I'm ok waiting. The issue is at Disney, it's not a matter of waiting, it's the fact that there is NO availabiity. And even with an ADRs, there are still huge waits.

 

[MakiraMarlena]

I think the above is true, have seen lots of reviews from cruisers who expected that a cruise was entirely all-inclusive and got bent out of shape that they had to pay extra for gratuities, alcohol, bingo, spa treatments, etc. Can that be considered the cruise line's fault or did the passenger just not pay attention to the reality?

And it is not true that at WDW there is NO restaurant availability. There may not be availability at the park you are in, or the restaurant you want. But there will be availability somewhere.

Running a search on the WDW site for lunch this afternoon for a party of 4 turns up a total of 34 available restaurants, including Akershus, Le Cellier, Tony's Town Square, nearly every other Epcot restaurant, Yak and Yeti and the Hollywood Brown Derby. So anyone waiting until today to book a reservation would be able to eat somewhere in each park. That won't help you if what you really wanted was CRT or Mama Melrose, but it's not true that there is no availability at all.

 

[smiths02]

See I guess I have to disagree, now maybe because when I think of popular vacation places I think of major cities and that brings much more choieces but sorry no way do I have to make a dinner reservation in Washington DC today for a trip I'm not taking until March. no way.

Now there are a few Michelin starred restaurants, like the one on top of the Eiffel tower where that maybe true but let's face it, most folks are not dropping 600 bucks on a dinner so these I don't consider "popular"

when we went to Paris, we tried to get into Moulin Rouge. Now that we did not have any success just walking up but we were able to get a reservation for the very next day.

I do agree with you that Disney is an extra level of planning, and requires much more notice than other things if you want certain experiences. But I think the same is true of other places, maybe to a lesser extent, but true.

You can go to Washington DC and do a bunch of stuff and eat at a bunch of places, but you aren't going to just walk up to tour the White House.

I don't have a passport, so I'm not just going to be able to hop a plane to Mexico. So should I complain that pre-2001, I could just drive over the border and present my driver's license.

Or the recent thing I saw on FB about the woman who could not go on her honeymoon because her passport was damaged. She was blaming the airline worker who would not accept the damaged passport.

I think Disney should dial back the ADR window, but they do send out materials about the dates. And you can have a good vacation without ADRs or even FP.

 

[alopez926]

Here's the flip side to this discussion.

I have a trip coming up in mid-November and I have to say, I almost wished I hadn't spent the last 5 months obsessively planning, trying to find the ADR's I felt would suit our party of 8, stalking MDE for "sold out" FP+. When I first started planning our trip, the projected Crowd Level for MK on our arrival day was a 5. So even though it was a "non"-recommended MK park day, i thought we'd take our chances as we have 6 first timers and who wanted to kick off their first magical trip at MK. Well, turns out it's a non-party night and Veteran's Day and Free Dining, so it's looking like our 1 day at MK will be more like a 10 and not a 5. If I switch our days now, there are no 7DMT, A&E, PP, TSMM fast passes left at all during our entire trip. And all of those ADR's I tried so painstakingly to make will need to be changed (not likely with a party of 8).

So even with all of my planning, I am frustrated and disappointed and I haven't even stepped foot in the parks yet. I'm frustrated at how long it has taken me to get ADRs and I still, 5 months in, can't get a character breakfast for my niece who has never been in WDW. I'm frustrated that the parks are going to be so crowded and I have no flexibility to change things around to create a better touring plan without losing everything I've worked hard to set up.

Is it Disney's fault that I'm so disappointed? Mostly No. The technology issues I experienced (my +10 Window didn't open) were a contributing factor to my not getting a few of my desired ADRs, but not all. I've learned the hard way that you're not going to get certain HTF meal reservations if you only have a 4 or 5 day trip planned. They're already gone before your ADR window even opens. Is that Disney's fault? No. But I sure do wish they would do something about hoarding. I'm also really ticked about the revised projected crowd levels, but certainly can't fault Disney for wanting full parks and the $$ rolling in. I do think it's ridiculous that i have to wait until Day 5 of my trip to get a 7DMT fast pass and Day 8 to get an A&E fastpass. I wish they could do something about that...but I guess there are only so many passes they can give out.

So, in short. Here I am. I'm in the know. I've done my research. I've tried to make plans at all the prescribed times. I've also created touring plans for each park. And yes. I'm disappointed. I don't want to do this again for at least a few years. This is our 7th trip in the last 6 years and this will be our last trip for a while. I really prefer some more spontaneity in my trips (the way we used to do them at Disney) and fewer crowds so we will bid Disney adieu, at least for a while.

The tipping point for me was this. The other day, my daughter and i were talking about Disney and Fast passes. She told me she didn't have as much fun during our trip in April because I was constantly on my phone trying to check wait times, find fast pass kiosks, and see what fast passes were available after we had used our 3. It was a real wake up call for me. I need to be more present for her. And I think we need a new vacation venue (or I need to be more willing to go old school, without the technology, and embrace the long lines ahead).

 

[smiths02]

I know many families that were dissapointed in their first WDW trips because they did not plan. The reality is 99% of vacation destinations out there do not require this kind of planning ahead. You can really just show up. And you can even get into a table service restaurant without reservations, maybe with a 30-40 minute wait.

I am a planner and always have been, but Disney needs to dial it back a bit in my opinion. You need to be able to get FP+ in the morning of the same day again, and you need to be able to get more than a hamburger or hot dog on the same day.

This is hyperbole, though, at least for MK. Granted, we didn't go at Christmas, but we went in June, so relatively crowded time. I changed around our FP+ for good rides on the same day (or night before)...it might not have been A&E or 7DMT, but you can get Space, Thunder, etc just like we did with paper FP...OR we could always wait in line.
You could have salmon with broccoli for lunch at CHH or a taco/burrito bowl at Peco's Bill...not stuck with hamburgers.

 

[hsmamato2]

Yes- Disney is at fault. here's why I think so- Because I dare you to find any 'official' Disney planning info that looks anything like the info on these boards- stressing the NEED for early planning,scouting deals,ADR's,FP+,and the NEED to scour the websites 3+ months ahead of a trip to get all your plans in order,at times down to what food you will want to eat in 3 months at a certain time of day!!!! Taking a trip without knowing all this %$#%$#% nonsense is difficult of course! And does Disney actually prepare anyone for it? NOPE. The 'unofficial' guides,boards,forums,etc help with that stuff, but not Disney itself. It's a sore point with me- I love to help my friends plan a trip,since I am familiar with Disney. Without that, it's unlike literally ANY OTHER place I've ever vacationed at. SO yes, they ARE at fault for creating such a complicated web of hoops that guests have to jump through,and NOT providing accurate up to date info on the process. I also still enjoy Disney etc- but I am not sure I would as much if I just walked in without knowing what I know.In fact I'm pretty sure I would dislike it a lot,I've frequently felt sorry for many a hapless tourist that is confused and unhappy while visiting.
........ It would be interesting to see a truthful Disney produced brochure.... the details and ridiculous red tape of MDE,FP+,ADR's are just ,well,ridiculous. (FWIW,I travel quite a lot to many varied places. Disney is the most complicated place to research alone)

 

[hsmamato2]

All that said.... I still think many times a vacation is what you make of it- so trying to just find the fun where you are is how we travel..... so we look to ourselves to enjoy where we are,wherever we go.
However I think it's a disservice to the many unhappy tourists who end up hating it to assume they 'did no research at all'- like I said,and I'm sticking by it, try to find the info we share on here in ANY Disney provided guidebook. It's all in unofficial places,which many people might think unofficial means inaccurate b/c it's not produced by Disney itself. I'd like to see that Steve Birnbaum book revised to have a blaring all caps headline ...."GET ONLINE AT 180+10 DAYS IF YOU WANT TO EAT WITH A PRINCESS" and things like that.....or "CALL,CALL,AND THE CALL AGAIN TO GET THE CORRECT ANSWER TO YOUR TECH RELATED PROBLEM" or even "ALL FP+ WILL BE GONE ON THE INTERESTING RIDES THAT WE ADVERTISE ON TV WITHIN 2 MINUTES AFTER MIDNIGHT EST,SO BE READY AT THE COMPUTER IN YOUR JAMMIES 60 DAYS OUT"
...my point being,this info is not readily found to the average person.

 

[lugnut33]

Ask yourself, why is there a crush for ADRs and advanced ride planning using FP+? It's simply because Disney has not built up a large enough capacity to handle the crowds. Everyone knows the amount of restaurants in the MK is woefully inadequate. Everyone knows both EP and HS are terribly under-built when it comes to attractions. Disney keeps stuffing more and more people into the parks without building the infrastructure to handle it.

 

[NYHeel]

Here's the flip side to this discussion.

I have a trip coming up in mid-November and I have to say, I almost wished I hadn't spent the last 5 months obsessively planning, trying to find the ADR's I felt would suit our party of 8, stalking MDE for "sold out" FP+. When I first started planning our trip, the projected Crowd Level for MK on our arrival day was a 5. So even though it was a "non"-recommended MK park day, i thought we'd take our chances as we have 6 first timers and who wanted to kick off their first magical trip at MK. Well, turns out it's a non-party night and Veteran's Day and Free Dining, so it's looking like our 1 day at MK will be more like a 10 and not a 5. If I switch our days now, there are no 7DMT, A&E, PP, TSMM fast passes left at all during our entire trip. And all of those ADR's I tried so painstakingly to make will need to be changed (not likely with a party of 8).

So even with all of my planning, I am frustrated and disappointed and I haven't even stepped foot in the parks yet. I'm frustrated at how long it has taken me to get ADRs and I still, 5 months in, can't get a character breakfast for my niece who has never been in WDW. I'm frustrated that the parks are going to be so crowded and I have no flexibility to change things around to create a better touring plan without losing everything I've worked hard to set up.

Is it Disney's fault that I'm so disappointed? Mostly No. The technology issues I experienced (my +10 Window didn't open) were a contributing factor to my not getting a few of my desired ADRs, but not all. I've learned the hard way that you're not going to get certain HTF meal reservations if you only have a 4 or 5 day trip planned. They're already gone before your ADR window even opens. Is that Disney's fault? No. But I sure do wish they would do something about hoarding. I'm also really ticked about the revised projected crowd levels, but certainly can't fault Disney for wanting full parks and the $$ rolling in. I do think it's ridiculous that i have to wait until Day 5 of my trip to get a 7DMT fast pass and Day 8 to get an A&E fastpass. I wish they could do something about that...but I guess there are only so many passes they can give out.

So, in short. Here I am. I'm in the know. I've done my research. I've tried to make plans at all the prescribed times. I've also created touring plans for each park. And yes. I'm disappointed. I don't want to do this again for at least a few years. This is our 7th trip in the last 6 years and this will be our last trip for a while. I really prefer some more spontaneity in my trips (the way we used to do them at Disney) and fewer crowds so we will bid Disney adieu, at least for a while.

The tipping point for me was this. The other day, my daughter and i were talking about Disney and Fast passes. She told me she didn't have as much fun during our trip in April because I was constantly on my phone trying to check wait times, find fast pass kiosks, and see what fast passes were available after we had used our 3. It was a real wake up call for me. I need to be more present for her. And I think we need a new vacation venue (or I need to be more willing to go old school, without the technology, and embrace the long lines ahead).

Yes, this is the problem with all the crazy reservations that are needed. You're a month out and yet you feel like you can't tweek your plans to account for changes that have occurred. That is completely nuts and really turns people off who did all the planning, research, and effort. This is why the new FP+ system is so messed up. You get locked into certain parks on certain days. Clearly that's what Disney wants but it's not very good for the customer. What if the weather is bad on your MK day? Or someone gets sick?

Now I've only been to Disney 2 times in the last 15+ years and probably 3 times in the last 25 years. I will be there for one day early next week and coming again in January for a full family vacation. But our plan is to visit Disney about once every 3-5 years. I think that's a better timeline to stay sane and enjoy your trips. But to each their own.

As far as being present for your daughter, perhaps if you involved her in the "game" of beating the lines the two of you would be more present for each other. Make it a fun kind of game where you're both involved. You can even give her the phone and let her make suggestions. That way it's not just you who is off in that other world but it's the two of you working together to beat the system. You don't have to do it every day but maybe just one day.

 

[FlightlessDuck]

The one thing I can fault Disney for regarding ADR's and FP+:

It shouldn't be necessary. It shouldn't have to be this complicated.

 

[gwek]

Travel to Disney World is an experience like no other... and that is a sword that cuts both ways.

Having said that, to me, a visitor is responsible for their own happiness (unless they've used a vacation planner or travel agent -- in which case it's reasonable to assume the specialist will tell you everything you need to know).

Because a Disney vacation is so unique, and because there's so much planning involved, there are unique resources available to everyone in the forms of books, web sites, etc. For maybe 20 or 30 bucks, you can have access to decades of experience.

Could Disney make things easier? Sure. But that's not their job. They're providing an experience, and they're fantastic at that. I suppose you could complain about something like the long lines... but anyone who's been to pretty much any other amusement or theme park (outside of maybe Universal Studios) understands that Disney has made a science of "the fast load". I live in NJ, and, let me tell you, an hour wait at Disney would be a seven hour wait at Sesame Place or Great Adventure.

Similarly, with restaurants, you can always find a seat SOMEWHERE, even if you can't get the seat you want. But how is that different than anywhere else? I wouldn't expect to stroll up to a popular restaurant in NYC and expect to be seated immediately (or, indeed, that night, in most cases!) without a reservation. Heck, we had a Maggiano's open near us a while back, and it was literally YEARS before the wait without a reservation was less than an hour.

 

[mick1229]

When you continue to raise prices to what they are at now a first time guest is going to expect an equal amount back from their investment. Disney seems ok with the "one and done" guests now ... But word of mouth will eventually catch up ..may take a long time,but eventually it will be apparent

 

[tup1830]

I agree with the poster above...eventually it will catch up. There are just too many of my millenial friends that are done with Disney. They know that they need to plan, but they don't want to plan their meal and exact order weeks in advance. They MAY start looking into things a month or a few weeks before...max. They come back disappointed and tell others.

Dollar for dollar, they get a more relaxing "vacation" on a cruise or some other destination where they don't need to do all the planning so far in advance. Yes they may be charged a few dollars more to do an activity on the day of, rather than scheduling and looking for discounts...but they can wake up and ask the kids what they want to do that day and go off and do it.

Disappointment is subjective...and from the looks of it, my friends who have the cash flow to drop an easy $10-$15K on a vacation are done with disney and making it a point to tell everyone they know!

 

[ParrotBill]

This is hyperbole, though, at least for MK. Granted, we didn't go at Christmas, but we went in June, so relatively crowded time. I changed around our FP+ for good rides on the same day (or night before)...it might not have been A&E or 7DMT, but you can get Space, Thunder, etc just like we did with paper FP...OR we could always wait in line.
You could have salmon with broccoli for lunch at CHH or a taco/burrito bowl at Peco's Bill...not stuck with hamburgers.

People should feel free to express their own opinions and not have some accuse them of lying or exaggerating. I'm glad you were able to change your FP+ but that was not my experience.

So I will be more specific from my own experiences, which includes 4 trips taken since FP+ began (and more than 50 trips prior):
-- numerous system screw ups on our FP+ requiring 30-60 min in guest services to try to fix, and never fixing most of them. One which locked us out of making FP+ for one party member for the rest of the trip.
-- Same day FP+ attempts in April and in August - at 9 am, a handful of attractions available only, for late afternoon and evening only
-- In those times of year, no walk ups to EPCOT nor hotel table service restaurants were possible
-- Hours on MDE trying to juggle meal and FP times to line up in some sensible way. FP always offering times that have absurd gaps that aren't long enough to fit a meal into so have get my 3 FP, then attempt to reschedule 2 of them to eliminate gaps or make them larger for meals. And try to juggle making ADRs and FP and different points in advance is folly. FP+ is also a money grab for Disney, to get everyone to buy their tickets far in advance so you can make your FP+. They are now making a LOT of interest on early ticket sales.
-- intolerable inability to get a reservation during "free dining" times - worst idea ever to boost hotel occupancy

"Hamburgers" was intended to represent the majority of counter service food as just that - fast food. Burgers, pizza, hot dogs, fried chicken. There are just a handful of places where you can get food like salmon with broccoli in the parks. EPCOT has a decent selection of counter service food, but MK and AK have just 1 or 2 places, and HS is a wasteland for counter service. When you try to choose healthier food at a counter service place you pay a lot for the privilege - $64 for a family of 4 (straight off the menu at CHH. The rest is fried garbage.) I'd rather spend that kind of money on a sit down meal.

Bottom line, I think it's bad to have to plan your day so specifically that your route is predetermined from meal to FP+ to meal to FP+ to meal. Great for Disney to estimate labor needs, bad for the guest that wants to take a break with a sit down air conditioned meal and did not plan it 3 months before they arrived. And forget it if you want to change your mind and go to a different park today.

 

[JustCallMeMommy]

For on-site guests, I don't know what more Disney could do. I got the message with at least two set of snail mail and automatic emails when it was time to make ADRs and FP+ reservations. Plus, every time I called, they reminded me as well.

For people off-site, I'm not sure how Disney could reach them - they don't know when or if they are coming.