Is anyone getting as turned off as I am?

[RedSox68]

I've heard people suggest that Disney doesn't want MK to grow anymore, because it's already choking on its own crowds during some parts of the year. However, EPCOT and AK are huge parks, that don't draw 17 million people!

It seems like MK is going to be wildly popular for years to come. But if Future World continues to be a monument/shrine to the 1980's, I can't see Epcot being a place that people are repeatedly drawn to. I overheard a conversation among teens at the AS food court recently. They were excited about 3 Epcot rides- wanting to just ride those over and over, since they were being forced to go to Epcot.

We do know that Avatar is coming to AK, and we *think* Star Wars will grow in DHS. But what the heck are they going to do with Epcot to keep people interested? Besides Food and Wine?

I agree, Epcot is stuck in the 80's and needs a desperate make-over. And speaking off the cuff (because I don't know the logistics of the land space), but Epcot World Showcase is in need of another country or two or a revitalization!

 

[NancyIL]

I was using MK just as an example, but I agree with your point. Disney has plenty to offer at the MK. Sure, I'd love to see Stitch replaced, but there are minor quibbles more than big issues. The same can't be said for EPCOT or even DHS. EPCOT is doing well because of World Showcase and a few rides, and I expect it gets a lot of locals (that's where I'd go if I lived there). If Universal is going to grab attendance, it will be from the other parks, not the MK.

I'm not a local, but I know a lot of locals who are pretty upset about Disney's entertainment cuts at the end of this month. They don't just go to Epcot for Food & Wine or the concerts: they also go to hear Off Kilter, Mo'Rockin, etc. When Sept. 28 rolls around and the 4 groups being cut are gone, with no replacements for several months, maybe more people will express their displeasure to Disney.

 

[jade1]

Now? WDW has a certain sameness wherever you go within the resort. It used to be that you could get unique stuff at each store or resort. Not anymore. I now don't have to buy something when I see it because I might not see it again! I can wait and buy it all at the World of Disney store in DTD. And when I do that, I tend to spend less since it all adds up quickly. So, I'm spending less.

We like being able to get the DTD stuff at the parks/resorts stores. No interest in DTD....yet. And the BC specific stuff-not sure is sold at DTD or other resorts but glad they offer them. Also the EPCOT countries have many items specific-at least I don't think they are at DTD as well, you could be right about that as we avoid it.

I would also bet a lot of folks saw something at DHS or wherever and waited, then were glad to find it somewhere else before heading home.

 

[mickeyluv'r]

...but on vacation, we enjoy ourselves. A few days eating bacon and beef isn't going to kill anyone.

Sigh.

I'm not any kind of food radical, but the foods I listed aren't a treat. It's the cheap stuff.

Sorry, eating that way makes me feel ill. It makes a majority of folks sick. (blood sugar spikes, etc.)

I'd much rather feel energized on my WDW vacation. I'm not saying I never eat any sweets, I'm just saying I don't want such gross options to be the only things offered.

There's something really wrong if Americans are teaching their children to think of unhealthy foods as 'special treats.'

On a funnier note...I was at a breakfast buffet this summer.. a little girl looked over at the tower of Froot Loops and called them, " the candy Cheerios."

Maybe a year ago, kids' meals at WDW did come with veggies. In the past year, they have reverted to the cheap junk. It's just sad.

 

[mickeyluv'r]

Also the EPCOT countries have many items specific-at least I don't think they are at DTD as well, you could be right about that as we avoid it.

According to the labels, much (most?) of the merchandise in the World Showcase is from China.

******************

I think Universal has a considerable opportunity right now. Universal has a very limited ability to expand outwards (looking at a map).

We recently did a split stay, and I have to confess, Universal has improved, where the WDW experience has largely diminished.

The new harry Potter area is just really amazing. It isn't just the one ride, it's the total experience of being immersed in the fantasy world of the books. People are excited about it.

Disney used to make us feel that way.

 

[jade1]

According to the labels, much (most?) of the merchandise in the World Showcase is from China.
.

So you CAN get it at China.

But my question was can get you get it at DTD?

 

[FLchick415]

It's my understanding that Disney DOES offer healthy options. Am I wrong? Most of the menus I see almost always offer carrots or apple slices with the kids meal in place of french fries.

 

[msb578]

It's my understanding that Disney DOES offer healthy options. Am I wrong? Most of the menus I see almost always offer carrots or apple slices with the kids meal in place of french fries.

You are not wrong. I am not discounting what others have said, but at some places the fries were barely listed as an alternative.

 

[Don Disney]

Cancelling our trip this Nov......1st reason-can no longer take kids out of school for low crowds.2nd reason-cost(double the cost from 2008-2010).3rd-FP+(NEVER USED IT...HATE THE IDEA OF 60 DAY OUT PLANNING FOR RIDES)!! 4th and finally...just not enough new attractions other than the"New Fantasyland".....We've had great trips in the past,but like a lot of others,time to spend my $$$$ somewhere else...just not worth the cost anymore.

 

[Davey Jones II]

By the time they open Avatar, there will be a whole generation who doesn't even know what it is

No. The first of the sequels will be out by then, and almost certainly ruling the box office.

I've never faulted them for building Avatar Land (or whatever it will be called). I just fault them for not giving us more new stuff like that, faster. That's all.

I know that Disney plays it much closer to the vest these days, because they are tired of everything constantly leaking onto the internet. But I hope they will announce something at the next D23. They have six stateside parks, and the only one with anything in the pipeline is AK.

 

[Davey Jones II]

I agree, Epcot is stuck in the 80's and needs a desperate make-over. And speaking off the cuff (because I don't know the logistics of the land space), but Epcot World Showcase is in need of another country or two or a revitalization!

Yeah, I get the feeling that they just don't know what to do with Epcot. IMHO, it was conceptually flawed from day one, although I never visited in the early years (I hear that some of the yesteryear attractions, like Horizons, were great).

I just made our trip schedule, and I've got Epcot slated for 1.5 days out of eight. World Showcase takes up half the park (or so it seems) and soon will be down to two attractions (Three Cabaleros and The American Adventure). The park is huge and burns a lot of shoe leather, but we never spend a great deal of time there. Educational? Thanks anyway. I may not be a kid anymore, but I still go to WDW to have fun.

Reportedly, DHS will be revitalized for years to come with a Star Wars land. AK will get Avatar. MK is endlessly popular. It looks like Epcot will be the also-ran at WDW, unless they can figure out what the heck to do with it. At the very least, the park needs one new killer E Ticket.

 

[mickeyluv'r]

It's my understanding that Disney DOES offer healthy options. Am I wrong? Most of the menus I see almost always offer carrots or apple slices with the kids meal in place of french fries.

Not so much on TS menus any more. A year ago, yes.

The QQ meals still list carrots and grapes. The bags are TINY. One bag we got, the mini carrots were so old they were dried out and WHITE- though technically not yet expired. (you know when baby carrots get all nasty).

Kid's TS pizza and pasta used to come with a veggie. Now you just get cheese pizza and pasta.

The kids meals in Tutto Italia were: fried cheese sticks, pasta in cream sauce, or pasta with tomato sauce. The only kids' veggie option is a Romaine salad for an extra $6!! Desserts are gelato or sorbet.


The Mickey Check Meals offered in some places do come with a small veggie -but you have to order the meal exactly as it is on the menu. There's no subbing apple for yogurt. The only beverages allowed are lowfat white milk or water.

Garden Grill - at $18 to $20- gives kids ONE dinner option: a chicken drumstick, orange Mac and cheese (straight out of the box!), fried sweet potato fries, a spring of Broccoli. (that one did have a veggie! ), dessert is a cupcake.

Six months ago, they had a make your own kids salad at AoA that was amazing. The kids could pick any greens, any veggies, and protein (shimp, chicken, even tofu!) They also had an amazing kid meal in the tandoori section, where kids could pick a slice of baked acorn squash! as one of their sides. And both were considered quick serve!

 

[FLchick415]

I don't eat at a lot of the sit down places, and a lot of times I bring my own snacks. Fruit, carrots, etc. So I don't really pay that much attention to the menus unless it's something I really want lol

 

[lborne]

Well, I did not real all the posts, but ......

I tend to agree that there are more changes over the past 20 or so years that I hate than love.

The characters have become an attraction unto themselves. I used to hate the idea of waiting in line for them, but then I look back when my wife and I were kids in the 70s and we don't have any photos of just us and the characters because crowds just mobbed them. There was no organized line.

I also love F&W festival. Yes, it has been around a while, but I remember some people cursing that it was just going to increase crowds. And it did, but it is still something Disney has done right, IMHO.

I love Magic Bands, but not so much FP+. But it does have the potential to get better. Funny how technology can sometimes make things worse - ie, when your MB does NOT work and you have to wait in a huge line to have guest services fix it.

Probably my biggest complaint of all is the dining plan and how it has ruined eating at Disney for me. I used to get annual passes just to be able to have dinner on a whim at DW, EPCOT or one of the resorts. I remember being able to call a day in advance to reserve a table at California Grill, or being able to walk up and get a table at most restaurants. And the food was different at each.

I hate how Main Street has become a shopping mall with the same merchandise as every other store. I miss the penny arcade and the magic shop. As Florida residents, these are the little things that kept us coming. We were over the commando mode once the kids tired of it, and then just want to stroll the parks and see interesting things other than major attractions.

 

[JennaDeeDooDah]

Yeah, I get the feeling that they just don't know what to do with Epcot. IMHO, it was conceptually flawed from day one, although I never visited in the early years (I hear that some of the yesteryear attractions, like Horizons, were great).

I just made our trip schedule, and I've got Epcot slated for 1.5 days out of eight. World Showcase takes up half the park (or so it seems) and has only two attractions (Maelstrom and The American Adventure). The park is huge and burns a lot of shoe leather, but we never spend a great deal of time there. Educational? Thanks anyway. I may not be a kid anymore, but I still go to WDW to have fun.

Reportedly, DHS will be revitalized for years to come with a Star Wars land. AK will get Avatar. MK is endlessly popular. It looks like Epcot will be the also-ran at WDW, unless they can figure out what the heck to do with it. At the very least, the park needs one new killer E Ticket.

My husband and I have often talked about how we wish we could see Epcot how Walt first imagined it. He didn't get to finish designing his dream so his team ended up taking a bit of what he designed, putting in some of their own stuff, and we ended up with what we now know as Epcot (past and future). I really wish it was possible to know exactly what Walt had envisioned.


Oh, and Horizons was pretty neat. I can't ride Mission Space without feeling ill, so I definitely preferred Horizons. My husband had only been to WDW once when we met and it was back when he was 14. When we were planning our honeymoon, he kept talking about a ride that he really wanted to go on, but didn't remember what it was called. He also couldn't tell me much about it except that it was about a family who traveled through time. Not thinking about how he hadn't been in 12 years, I naturally thought about Carousel of Progress. I took him on that so excited for him to get to re-experience something that he loved. We got off... and he told me he really enjoyed it, but that wasn't it. Then he told me that he thought the ride was in Epcot. And then I knew. And I had to break it to him that that ride was no more.

 

[clsteve]

Yeah, I get the feeling that they just don't know what to do with Epcot. IMHO, it was conceptually flawed from day one, although I never visited in the early years (I hear that some of the yesteryear attractions, like Horizons, were great).


Reportedly, DHS will be revitalized for years to come with a Star Wars land. AK will get Avatar. MK is endlessly popular. It looks like Epcot will be the also-ran at WDW, unless they can figure out what the heck to do with it. At the very least, the park needs one new killer E Ticket.

I know what you're saying.

And it's unfortunate because EPCOT was amazing from the mid 80's to early 2000's.

Funny thing is, I would hazard to bet that EPCOT is still a huge moneymaker: food, alcohol and events like F&W.

In some ways, World Showcase has become their de facto Pleasure Island - Only with an earlier opening, an earlier closing, and a much higher ticket price - making it more profitable and more manageable.

I mean, they've had no probs quickly adding the La Cava's and Tutto Gusto's. Not complaining - I love both.

Perhaps that's why the other side of the lake has languished for so long - revenue has been flowing just fine as is. Still doesn't make it any less painful - especially remembering the way it used to be....

It's why the rumors of the "Freezing" of Maelstrom and Norway have been a head scratcher - why risk breaking up that gravy train?

 

[disnut8]

Just for some background....
I live in Florida and have been going to Disney for over 40 years.
Recently, though, I've noticed changes that are turning me off to want to visit, or spend my money there.
For example: * the fastpass+ thing and having to plan before you go.
* ending the American Adventure Fife and Drum Corp. (and not replacing it with any other patriotic program)
* people reserving throwaway campsites at Fort Wilderness just to get their magic bands
*......and don't get me started on those!
* and now we're gonna have to start paying between 10 and 20 dollars just to park at Downtown Disney.
* oh, and Starbucks

The list goes on, but these are just a few at the tip of my fingers.
Sorry. Had to vent.

I live in Georgia and my husband and I have over 60 trips to Disney World. Most just the two of us, a lot with our son, now grown and gone with a family of his own, some with that family as well. Some with in-laws and some with my dad and stepmother. And some with all of us. So, a variety of experiences.

I am also an annual passholder and think I will be until I can't afford it or I'm no longer on this earth.

The Fastpass thing? Yeah, didn't like having to "plan" but for this last trip over Labor Day, I was changing things just a few days before we got into the car and drove down to Disney World. Nothing of my day was carved in stone. And, we got to do the things that meant the most to us without a delay and then we saw what else we could when we could.

The Fife and Drum - yeah, that sucked.

Throwaway campsites? Well, if people have that much $$$ to do that just for magicbands, then they can do it. It's kind of like saying "those people in the higher level of the hotel reservations shouldn't be doing that, they should just have a room like everyone else."

I think paying for parking at Downtown Disney is a step in the correct direction so people don't just park there for the free stuff and then go to the parks. If you are on Disney property, take a bus.

Starbucks? Who cares? If people are paying for the coffee, let them. Not a big deal. It's not like there's a huge sign over every entrance to every theme park loudly saying "STARBUCKS IS HERE, STARBUCKS IS HERE!"

 

[MakiraMarlena]

It's why the rumors of the "Freezing" of Maelstrom and Norway have been a head scratcher - why risk breaking up that gravy train?

folks are going to stop eating and drinking around the world because there's going to be a Frozen ride in Norway? I hadn't planned on it. I'll just skip Norway. I did anyway, they had boring beer and I'm not a fan of aquavit.

 

[minnie mum]

I haven't read through the whole thread, but to respond to the OPs opening question, yes, I'm getting thoroughly turned off by Disneys moves over the last couple of years. MDE is a fiasco that they had no business forcing on guests before it was reliably usable. The decline in almost all aspects of guest experiences coupled with continued price increases (unless you were willing to super size your vacation with costly hard ticket or premium events). The continuing decline in the quality of Disney dining. But the recent cuts to entertainment at Epcot, plus today's announcement about the demise of Maelstrom and their decision that celebrating the national culture within a WS pavilion now takes a back seat to further over saturation of their latest moneymaker - its probably the last nail in the coffin for us.

We have a vacation booked for this winter that I can't cancel. After that, I think I'm done.

 

[Hunterr]

I wish Fastpass changes were limited to simply putting the ticketing systems in a central place in the park near the entrance of the park.

That eliminated the need to run all over the park for fast passes.

I'm a local, so I can go whenever, but it kinda sucks to have to compete in peak seasons for fastpasses with everyone who comes on vacation who have booked passes in advance.

With that said, if I was not a local, then yes, booking the fastpasses in advance would be awesome!

But it does limit the spontaneity.