International Resale - frustrated!

[michellev]

Does anyone here have experience with buying a resale from an international seller? Our resale experience is getting frustrating and I'm looking for some support.

Everything was going smoothly. Submitted contract Sept 30, passed ROFR Oct 10, recvd closing docs 29, wired money and faxed docs 10/30.

Today is Nov 17 and the title co. still hasn't received closing docs from the international seller (Argentina I think). The problem seems to be getting the docs notarized.

GMAC has been okay with answering questions, etc., same with the closing co. I know they have an apt with the U.S. Embassy to get the docs signed, but I don't know when this apt is.

I can't find any dates on our docs to specify when this stuff has to be in and I'm worried about how long we will be in limbo.

Any advice or experience with this? I guess there isn't much we can do besides keep in close contact with GMAC. I'm just so sad that this is dragging on for so long.

 

[Melani]

I have no international experience, but I feel your pain.

We too are waiting to close on a GMAC resale which went through Disney on Oct. 10th, only we still haven't received our closing documents or made final payment.

 

[michellev]

Really? That's crazy. Is the hold up with your title search?

 

[Melani]

I don't know. Every time I call my agent she says everything seems fine.

 

[bavaria]

The problem seems to be getting the docs notified.

Do you mean 'notarized'?

Getting things notarized in other countries is not like in America - it can be costly and time consuming. I cannot speak for Argentina, but based on the fact that they had to make an appointment at the US Embassy I suspect that the buyer has little option.

The OKW notarization requirement was a challenge for many international owners, for instance, as getting something notarized can cost considerable time and money.

 

[michellev]

Yes, that's a typo. I must have been thinking of being "notified" by GMAC when I wrote that.

Do you know why some international countries require having the U.S. Consulate notarize documents instead of a lawyer? I'm international and just went to a notary, I'm curious as to why it's different for Argentina?

I think part of the error in the process was communicating what would be required upon receiving closing docs. We didn't know we required a notary in advance, so I'm guessing the seller didn't either.

 

[MikeyNS]

I found GMAC to be painfully slow. When we purchased our resale I thought it was quick because the paperwork was finished so quickly, but then we waited and waited and waited for a few months. PAINFUL. Would not recommend GMAC anymore. I think it just might be the typical GMAC delay.. have patience if possible.

 

[disneynutz]

You are buying a U.S. real estate interest. The notarized documents need to be recognized by the U.S. Having them notarized at the U.S. Consulate guarantees that the proper procedures were followed.

 

[bavaria]

Yes, that's a typo. I must have been thinking of being "notified" by GMAC when I wrote that.

Do you know why some international countries require having the U.S. Consulate notarize documents instead of a lawyer? I'm international and just went to a notary, I'm curious as to why it's different for Argentina?

I think part of the error in the process was communicating what would be required upon receiving closing docs. We didn't know we required a notary in advance, so I'm guessing the seller didn't either.

The notary process in Canada is still easier (and less expensive) than in many other countries. I would not use that as an indicator for what happens elsewhere.

Again, I cannot speak for Argentina but it may well be that your buyer is an American and that is the easiest route for them. They may be balking at the notary fees if they use a traditional route. I know that many did here when the notary requirement was announced for the OKW extension decline. Certainly the UK posters were frustrated and the minimal allowance given by DVC did not cover the cost.

 

[Melani]

I found GMAC to be painfully slow. When we purchased our resale I thought it was quick because the paperwork was finished so quickly, but then we waited and waited and waited for a few months. PAINFUL. Would not recommend GMAC anymore. I think it just might be the typical GMAC delay.. have patience if possible.

Wow, that sounds like us. Our offer was accepted and paperwork submitted by 9/26. - on 10/10 we had to fax Disney an addendum about points. We recieved copies of all that paperwork 3 days later in the mail (including where the sellers had signed) - and then nothing.

WAITING & WAITING & WAITING. IT'S SO HARD!!!

Well I shouldn't complain, at least we can still afford to pay cash for it.

 

[dsanner106]

The notary process in Canada is still easier (and less expensive) than in many other countries. I would not use that as an indicator for what happens elsewhere.

Again, I cannot speak for Argentina but it may well be that your buyer is an American and that is the easiest route for them. They may be balking at the notary fees if they use a traditional route. I know that many did here when the notary requirement was announced for the OKW extension decline. Certainly the UK posters were frustrated and the minimal allowance given by DVC did not cover the cost.

I don't know what your notary process is in your country, but I am a notary in the US and the standard fee is 2 dollars, and can be waived at the notaries discretion. I have only charged one person ever, typically providing the service for free.

Drew

 

[bavaria]

Yes, I realise that. But in other countries notaries are not as common (I understand that in America often one can even have documents notarized at the bank) nor do they serve the same function.

In Germany real estate notary fees are 1.5% of cost; in Canada and the UK fees vary and in many other countries finding a notary is not that easy, and one must make an appointment.

Ask the UK OKW owners here how little value the token from DVC went towards notary fees and the time required to have the documents notarized.

 

[bavaria]

Here is some information on the notary difference in America

With the exception of Louisiana, whose private law is based on civil law rather than common law, a notary public in the United States of America has powers that are far more limited than the role of a civil law notary in the rest of the world. There are far more notaries in the United States than in other countries (4.5 million, compared with 900 in England and Wales).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Notary_public

Civil law notaries are trained jurists who often receive the same training as advocating jurists — those with a legal education who become litigators such as barristers in England and Wales and Northern Ireland or avocats in France and in Quebec. In Scotland notaries are qualified solicitors and members of the Law Society of Scotland

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Civil_law_notary

Argentina also has civil law notaries. Again, I suspect that this accounts for at least part of the delay. I know that it is has taken me quite some time and money in past to use a notary.

 

[kylie]

I have just sold some points to US Buyers and I am in The UK. I quoted $70 for each signature on the documents (there are only 12 notaries in N Ireland). Fortuantly I am At OKW at present and brought all documents and had them noterized in the US. The process has went smothly and quickly and one of the two sales has closed already. The delay on the second was due to Disney's non response on ROFR. Now if I could only do something about the 10% tax on international sales....

 

[michellev]

I paid $60 in Canada to have my docs notarized.

We heard from the seller and she has an apt on the 25th and said she will FedEx the docs back. Hopefully everything will go to Disney shortly after that. (fingers crossed)