Independent Audit Blasts Disney For Pulling ‘Bait And Switch’ On Florida: ‘A Mousetrap’

[MillauFr]

What did I just say - of course there is but I don’t feel the need to employ Alinsky’s rule #4 as you do because I don’t look at fellow Americans (regardless of what they believe) as enemies.

Vermin John... Vermin...

 

[Douglas Dubh]

How so? It's pretty clear that the area covered by the special district pays for pretty much everything that a city and/or county would provide, on top of Disney paying normal county ad valorem taxes.

What county services do you suppose they use that aren't paid for with special district funds? Maybe some building permits (where the county still has some responsibilities), but not police, roads, sewage, fire.

Are you doing this just to be contrarian? It's just ludicrous that you can't even acknowledge something this simple.

I tried quoting some examples from the audit but can’t get copy and paste to work. But one thing the audit claims is that Disney wasn’t required to pay impact fees like other developers would. Impact fees that are used for infrastructure in the area.

 

[Sweettears]

What about the employees that supported the bill?

Got some data to support this

 

[Sweettears]

You first.

I was in grade school once

 

[HokieRaven5]

The district didn’t charge impact fees, which is a fact.

What other counties would charge impact fees for were funded via the taxes charged by the district.

So while landholders weren’t charged impact fees in the area, they still funded infrastructure via other taxes.

 

[Christine]

The district didn’t charge impact fees, which is a fact.

What other counties would charge impact fees for were funded via the taxes charged by the district.

So while landholders weren’t charged impact fees in the area, they still funded infrastructure via other taxes.

And the "audit" sort of acts like it's a "gotcha" on the transportation impact fees. I mean, this is what Disney negotiated with Florida. It's not like they were not paying impact fees just because. But I guess it was important for the auditor to point out where Florida could possibly glean millions more off Disney if they decided to just start making them pay impact fees per hotel room.

 

[Douglas Dubh]

What other counties would charge impact fees for were funded via the taxes charged by the district.

Has that been reported by an independent source?

 

[john7994]

I tried quoting some examples from the audit but can’t get copy and paste to work. But one thing the audit claims is that Disney wasn’t required to pay impact fees like other developers would. Impact fees that are used for infrastructure in the area.

Very excited about the impact fee discussion coming to light - those in Sumter County Florida (Think Villages) - especially local businesses, apparently have a lot to say about tax hikes related to footing the bill for developers and development in the area.

Comments like “sweetheart deal” pop up time and again, maybe another special district needs some attention? That’s gonna rile up some seniors because I am sure the “family” isn’t going to gobble those fees up. The Florida legislature probably should act right away huh?

 

[bcla]

I tried quoting some examples from the audit but can’t get copy and paste to work. But one thing the audit claims is that Disney wasn’t required to pay impact fees like other developers would. Impact fees that are used for infrastructure in the area.

I was talking about Disney paying county ad valorem taxes where they use very few county services that aren't paid for with district funds. Can you at least acknowledge that?

And why should Disney pay for such impact fees? This is all the responsibility of the special district, which heavily taxes Disney. Again - they pay more in county taxes without extracting much in county services.

I suppose the alternative would be to just dissolve the district and allow the county and the cities to handle all the services that they would normally handle. Then I guess Disney would be on the hook for these "impact fees", and the taxpayers of Orange and Osceola Counties will gladly accept their property taxes going up. At least at that point Disney would get something out of the county taxes they pay and their tax bills will go way down as a result of not having to pay that right millage rate for the special district.

 

[HokieRaven5]

Has that been reported by an independent source?

There’s years worth of publicly available information.

 

[bcla]

Has that been reported by an independent source?

It's self-evident. The special district area isn't subject to many county provisions on the basis of government services being paid for by separate taxes and rendered by the district, including building permits, fire, roads, etc.

And again, they're still paying county taxes on top of the special district taxes.

 

[Douglas Dubh]

Can you at least acknowledge that?

Yes, I acknowledge you were talking about it. I’m just saying I’ve read a lot of claims and haven’t seen anything definitive.

 

[bcla]

Yes, I acknowledge you were talking about it. I’m just saying I’ve read a lot of claims and haven’t seen anything definitive.

Of course it's definitive that Disney is pretty much the only taxpayer for Bay Lake and Lake Buena Vista and that district funds pay for police and fire services that aren't paid for with any other city or county taxes other than the special district. It's not that hard to figure out. This has been discussed on DISBoards for years even before the current controversy.

That was the whole point of this district. They were an omnibus governmental entity that was paid for with high tax rates (up to a statutory 3% of property value). And on top of that the same taxpayer was still on the hook for county taxes. It was a win-win for the county, that wasn't necessarily prepared to provide the services, on top of this one big taxpayer just giving the county money where they expected very little in return for the ability of have this special government provide what they needed.

The other taxpayers of Orange and Osceola Counties certainly wouldn't find it equitable to treat Disney the same, because they know how much of a benefit it is to them that Disney is paying for the special district through high taxes while still paying county property taxes.

 

[Kwami]

Y'all are wasting your time with him. Again.

 

[Douglas Dubh]

Y'all are wasting your time with him. Again.

Well, if you’re just going to make the same claims over and over, it’s not going to change my mind. I’d like to see evidence of the claims. Until that changes, I will continue to express skepticism.

 

[luv2cheer92]

Well, if you’re just going to make the same claims over and over, it’s not going to change my mind. I’d like to see evidence of the claims. Until that changes, I will continue to express skepticism.

Since when has evidence that contradicts your beliefs ever changed your mind anyway?

 

[Douglas Dubh]

Since when has evidence that contradicts your beliefs ever changed your mind anyway?

Last time it happened.

 

[Smugpugmug]

Y'all are wasting your time with him. Again.

It's a tale as old as time. I look forward to reading the same tired back and forth with him on the next thread about RCID.

 

[john7994]

Y'all are wasting your time with him. Again.

Tbh - It doesn’t take a lot of time or effort for that matter … gotta do something while running errands …

 

[whiteness]

Here's that same guy as before, this time going through some of the evidence submitted with the report. I know, some of you will hate his humorous and irreverent spin on things, but honestly he's starting to grow on me. Legal stuff is normally pretty boring, but he manages to make it entertaining. As some of you already know, he's not pre-Disney, so you may not like his take on things. I'm not a lawyer, so I'm not competent to say how accurate his opinions are: anyway, eventually the courts will probably have to decide this.