Inappropriate Coworkers (long post)

[UncleKyle]

I manage a wireless store and a few of our outside sales people. Most of us are in our 20's but we have a new guy that works here that is in his mid 40's. Being guys around the office we all like to joke around and say men things. Most of it we wouldn't say around a lady and yes some of it is about women.

But the 40 year old takes some stuff to a degree that even we kinda get uncomfortable with. We all make sexual comments but when he says them, they become a little more graphic and just seem inappropraite for someone his age. The other thing is that he's married and none of us are. The stuff he says is things I don't even say about other girls when I have a girlfriend! Us single guys like to flirt with our lady customers but he almost harrasses them. I've even had to ask him to watch his behavior around our one office girl who works a few days week. He didn't like that, but then again I don't think he likes someone half his age being in charge, but thats another story. Anyway, most of us are on our best behavior but she gets very uncomfortable around him and thinks he's creepy. (I know this because she was my best friend before I hired her)

The sad part is my boss who owns the store is in his 40's and acts like the other guy too. Not always to the degree that he does but it still weirds me out. Anyone else dealt with this? Do all men become bigger perverts as they get older?

 

[EsmeraldaX]

I'm not sure how it is when you work retail, but what they are doing is harrassment and they , IMO, should be reported.

Is there a district manager you could talk to?

Keep in mind they may bring up the flriting/comments that you made if you bring this up to them.

Another thing you could do is say a customer complained but I don't know if you want to go down the "lying about customers complaining" route.

As for all men getting this way when they get older, I don't recall my dad ever being like this, none of my BFs family members are like that and I don't really think it has anything to do with gender/age just lack of class and respect for women.

Harmless flirting and joking around are fine but there is a line and it sounds like these guys have crossed it.

 

[jrydberg]

Perverts grow up to become perverted old men.

The only thing that I find a little odd in that story is that there seems to be the implication that it's worse because it's coming from an older guy. If it's inappropriate behavior, it doesn't matter how old he is.

I guess my point is, it seems like (from your brief description) that it's more a matter of degree than anything. And if the younger guys are setting a tone in the workplace that condones sexual comments and flirtatious behavior, then it's easy to see how one person could go too far. Make it very clear to EVERYONE what is and is not acceptable.

 

[UncleKyle]

Esmeralda, just to clarify, he isn't saying these things around other women, just us guys. Almost everything he's said that made us guys uncomfortable was when it was just us guys joking around. I think it's more that we're uncomfortable because of his age and the graphic nature of stuff he said.

He's made a comment or two around the office girl but not enough to make her complain about it to me directly. It was more she was in on a conversation and the stuff he said was creepy for someone his age to say. If it came from college guy 22 or 23 she would have laughed. She just commented that the way he acts creeps her out and she thinks he's a dirty old man.

 

[Pin Wizard]

If it were me, I would put an end to anyone talking that way. And whoever is the manager has to be the one to set the example.

 

[caitycaity]

Originally posted by Pin Wizard
If it were me, I would put an end to anyone talking that way. And whoever is the manager has to be the one to set the example.

 

[UncleKyle]

I knew the Anita Hills would be out in full force when I posted this.

Just so I don't look like the next Clarence Thomas (by the way, if he had looked like Denzel Washington, we'd never know what sexual harrasment is) I'll give you an example of what happens. When we're in the store we see many people go in an out the UPS Store next to ours. Now all of us salesmen are 24/25 year old single guys. If we see a hot girl we look and say "Hey look at her, she's hot"

The 40 year old will then tell us what he would like to do with her. Doesn't say it around other women just us guys, but we still look at each other when he's done talking and go back to work.

 

[DukeStreetKing]

Just my opinions based on your posting:

You are setting just as bad an example by being a part of the conversations. Everyone needs to stop having these conversations regardless of who is around and who isn't.

I have been through many, many training classes and seminars on proper office behavior (and proper behavior in general) because my firm does not ever want to have to deal with this type of behavior and the lawsuits that can come from it.

And just for the record, the term "office girl" seems very sexist and derogatory to me, but that's probably just my ingrained training coming out.

 

[UncleKyle]

Originally posted by DukeStreetKing
And just for the record, the term "office girl" seems very sexist and derogatory to me, but that's probably just my ingrained training coming out.

Never fails with me, no matter how I put it, it become sexist. The reason I call her office girl is because she comes in 3 days a week and makes copies, writes checks, sends out invoices, and fills out our service center paperwork. I know it was offensive because I just asked her if it was and she said she was offended too. She says she's the Office Princess.

 

[CEDmom]

But if you know how this guy is going to react to your comment why make it at all. Your really instigating this.

 

[DukeStreetKing]

UncleKyle, here's a little friendly advice.

You and the rest of the office staff need to curtail the "extracurricular" conversations before someone really takes offense and files a harrassment suit. I'm sure the corporate office will not take that charge lightly and heads will certainly roll.

I'm not trying to be a killjoy, I'm just telling it like it is. Take it for what it's worth. I enjoy a good flirt as much as the next guy, but there is a time and a place for it, and work is not it.

 

[Maleficent13]

Here's another point of view. If I'm walking past your store, and a bunch of you 24/25 yr olds feel the need to comment on how hot I am...

Please, feel free. And in as loud a voice as you can manage. Make sure I hear it. I'll grin all day.

Seriously though: I see the difference you are explaining, and I understand it and agree with you. However, I agree with the other posters too in that you have to stop even the most harmless of comments, in order to stop the ones that aren't so harmless. In a business setting, you can't be too cautious.

 

[Jenn Lynn]

Originally posted by DukeStreetKing
UncleKyle, here's a little friendly advice.

You and the rest of the office staff need to curtail the "extracurricular" conversations before someone really takes offense and files a harrassment suit. I'm sure the corporate office will not take that charge lightly and heads will certainly roll.

I'm not trying to be a killjoy, I'm just telling it like it is. Take it for what it's worth. I enjoy a good flirt as much as the next guy, but there is a time and a place for it, and work is not it.

I agree with DukeStreetKing.

Your *innocent* guy talk could get overheard by the wrong person and then you are going to be in trouble.

I also agree that you are the manager and should set the example.

 

[sgtdisney]

I don't understand why it is any more crass or vulgar because it comes from an older, married guy. Either the tone of the conversation is wrong, or it isn't. It doesn't depend on the age, or even the sex, of the people participating in the conversation.

If there are inappropriate discussions being held in the work place and you, the manager, is participating in them, you will be held equally culpable if you or your company is ever reported. I would tread lightly here, and put a stop to all of it, if it is inappropriate.

 

[Karel]

Sounds like he's trying hard to fit in with the younger guys.

Sounds like you can't accept him because he's older.

 

[battricia]

My own personal opinion is that anything that you feel shouldn't be said infront of a woman shouldn't be said at all. If there's a reason you don't feel comfortable saying it infront of a woman, there's obviously something wrong with what is being said, so why would you say it? It's like saying racist things because there isn't a person of that race in the crowd, It is not OK.

As for your work situation, as some have already said, you've all set the tone already that it's OK to talk about this stuff, and now it's just a matter of degrees. Like I said, all this behaviour should be ut to an end.


tricia.

 

[figment52]

Sounds like he is "taking the bait" you youngers guys are giving him and using it as a starting off point. Easy solution, don't give him any more bait.

Find some other way to pass the time that looking out the window and comment on the people walking by. How would you like it if that female was your sister and someone was making those comments about her!!

As for the Office Princess - you go girl!! I like your style.

 

[acepepper]

Are you younger guys embarrassed because it's like hearing your dad say this type of stuff? That's what it sounds like.

As for talking about women in a lewd way, what's the problem? It's what guys do. I can't believe all the killjoys on these boards sometimes.

 

[Lanshark]

It's unprofessional, immature behavior no matter what the age.

 

[pw2pp]

Would it be okay for you if one of the 25 year-olds said what he would "like to do with her"?
Why should HE have to be silent just because of "his age"?
Maybe he is going through a mid-life crisis or wants to fit in with the guys. Maybe he feels out of place being the only "old" guy.
Maybe what ALL of you are doing is wrong.
If you don't like the direction it is all taking, maybe ALL of you should stop.
Just a thought.