I'm on the fence--WWYD?

[sdarwkcabemanmy]

There is a family down the street from us who only moved in about 3-4 mos ago. They have five kids, ranging in age from 12 to not-quite-4. The kids are allowed to roam the streets unsupervised and it's usually the not=quite-=4 year old who I see out there most often.

Unforunately, DS wants to play with the almost-4 when he sees him. I end up being the one to keep them out of trouble. And I think I've finally had it.

Yesterday, the almost-4, DS and another boy who is about 4 were all playing outside. When the almost-4 and his friend started pushing people's trashcans around (it was trash day and a lot of them hadn't been put away yet. These are not small cans either..they are nearly as tall as I am and kinda heavy even when they're empty), I asked them politely to stop. For a minute they actually did. Then they started up, pushing them into the street and stuff. I got a bit more sharp with them and told both of the boys (DS was hanging back, not sure of how to deal with this or if he should participate)to get back on our side of the streeet and to leave the trash cans alone.

At that point, almost-4's teacup chiuaua puppy gets out and makes a run for the street. I manage to catch him and hand him to almost-4 to take back inside. He goes up to the door, turns th e knob and..it's locked. He has to ring the doorbell several times and bang on the door before his older siblings open the door just enough to let the dog inside before slamming it back again. I heard the lock click and I asked almost-4 if his mom was home. He assured me she was and went back to running around in the street.

It was at this point I decided to take DS inside. He was not happy about it but I didn't know what else to do. I don't think I'm going to let him play with almost-4 any more if we see him outside. I'm getting kind of sick of being the one who keeps an eye on him when they're playing together. His own mom should be doing that...right? I realize that with 5 of her own and an infant she babysits during the day (I've seen him/her dropped off in the mornings as I'm taking DS to school) she may be slightly overwhelmed but that's not really an excuse for letting your not even 4 year old son run around outside unattended. She could at, the very least, send the oldest brother (who is 11 or 12) out to watch him.

I don't know. Should I let DS play with him anymore and just keep an eye on them or sh ould I keep him from playing with almost-4? If I weren't so cowardly, I would confront the mother directly but I hate arguing and I hate fights.

 

[1stluvispooh]

Ok we have a similar situation in our neighborhood. Although it's a family of just 2 kids. The youngest is a post child for ADHD. One of our neighbors found him on the ROOF!!!! Anyway after many incidents we just don't let our kids play with them. If they come to the door I tell them sorry we have homework, or that they just can't come out right now. The only time that I let the kids play with them is when it is all of the neighborhood kids playing together. I feel like the parents are pushing off their responsibilities on to whomever will take it. This year he is taking the special needs bus along with my daughter. The bus is no longer allowed to come down the cul du sak so we have to go to the corner. Technically the bus driver and aid are not to let the kids off the bus unless an adult is at the waiting for them but the mom sent a note saying it's ok. Well I told the school I will not be responsible for this child getting safely to his house. So from my experience I would just not let them play together. I know it might be hard and if the kid asks why tell him that you need to talk to his mom and then tell her your concerns.

 

[MinnieVanMom]

Wow, hard call.

You have your family to worry about first. It is not your responsibility to care for the neighbors child. You are a very kind and generous person to keep an eye out already.

You must do what you feel is best for you. If it were me I would call on the mom and explain that you are concerned for the little guy??? or something that sounds non confrontational. Suggest she could come out and supervise, get fresh air, walk the dog.

Last choice, your little guy can't play with the unsupervised boy. It is not fair but again, you have to watch out for your children.

I had a neighbor down the street with two boys that were always out without supervision. They went into my horse pasture, undoing the gate and were playing in the culvert with water going by fast. I caught them red handed and brought them back to mom, who was sleeping. They lied, I pointed out the mud on the bikes and my open gate! I ended up putting a lock on the gate. Then when I was riding the horses I went by and they swore at me! So I brought my horse right up to the door and got mom out again. Finally they moved! I never let my guy play with them because they just didn't have good manners and it is hard enough to raise kids. JMO.

 

[sdarwkcabemanmy]

The couple of times I have talked to the mom, I get the feeling she is overwhelmed from having so much to deal with. She's got A4 and an infant that she babysits to deal with for most of the day, on top of whatever other chores, errands, eetc she has to do. Then in the afternoon, she's got A4, the infant AND her other 4 kids to deal with. I'd be overwhelmed too. And she seems kind of young..younger than me by at least a couple of years but I could be wrong.

I've also gotten the feeling that she sees me as free babysitting, since she knows I'm going to be out there with DS. I don't hover over him, but I do at least try to keep him in sight/ear shot.

They do have a fenced backyard and they still let him roam around outside unattended.

I've thought of asking A4 to come over to our house to play, but I'm not sure how the mom would take it or if, in the future, she'd abuse the privelege simply because she can.

Yeah..I don't trust people. I have a hard time with trusting people and I have anti-social tendicies which I know are not good for DS, becuse he's a social butterfly. I am trying to work on that though.

 

[KirstenB]

How old is your son? Is he old enough to where if he had a friend come over the same age, they play well with minimum supervision from you? If he wants to play with the neighbor kid, maybe you could arrange some playdates with other kids instead. It sounds like you're in the position of being a good influence for this little kids' chaotic life!

If it were me, I wouldn't mind them playing together occasionally, but I'd be trying to invite other kids over to give your son some variety.

 

[sdarwkcabemanmy]

DS is nearly 5. He'll be 5 this spring.

Is he old enough to where if he had a friend come over the same age, they play well with minimum supervision from you?

He is I think, but I've never tried it. I don't really have a lot of friends because I have a hard time with friendships. When they taught How To Be A Good Friend 101 in school, I think I was sick or absent or something. Because I'm so used to just hanging out by myself or with just me and DS, I'm far more comfortable that way and social situations make me a wee bit nervous to say the least.

I am trying though. Over the summer, we spent at least 2-3 hrs every day at the community pool where I would attempt to get the courage to chat up other parents. SOmeteimes I succeeded, sometimes I failed. But at least I gave it a shot. And I'm trying to work on beiing more social, for DS's benefit because he is such a social butterfly. We had one playdate with a friend of his from school this summer and I want to try and do some more over Christmas break which comes up in a few weeks.

In the meantime, I will do what I can. We usually go to storytime at the library on Saturdays and I'm fairly comfortable there because I know all the regulars. Plus, there's books, which ALWAYS make more comfortable.

 

[KirstenB]

I hear you! When our 10 yr old was younger, I used to loathe play dates!! There's a fair amount of refereeing you do (or maybe that is just a reflection on dd and me! ) Anyway, she loved having friends over, so I'd just grit my teeth and roll with it.

Our younger dd Zoe is 3 and has mild autism. One of her classmates had a family situation come up, and I volunteered for him to come to our house one day. OMG, it was like throwing a superball down a hallway...you know how 20 minutes later, it's still bouncing...that was this little boy!! Anyway, bottom line, the kids had a blast, and I'm actually inviting him back over in a couple of weeks, after I recover.

The good news is...the playdates get easier as they get a little older.

 

[sdarwkcabemanmy]

I think a lot of my nervousness is due to the fact that I have raging Foot-in-Mouth-itis. I'm always saying the wrong thing or doing the wrong thing and it's really nervewracking when I do it in front of somebody new. I almost never seem to know what to say or if I'm asking too many questions, being nosy, etc.

 

[bookwormde]

Sound like our neighborhood also. The next 2 houses down have 4 children from 3-7 Y.O. I have a big yard which is fenced with a play set so my rule is if the neighbors want to play with my children it is in my backyard only well way from the road.

My kids are safe and when the other kids are playing with mine they are safe, beyond that it is tough to change other parents.

It is hard because with 30+ years volunteering in emergency services I have seen to many times how quickly such situation can turn tragic.

bookwormde

 

[koolaidmoms]

We live in a fairly good size city. Our houses are all fairly close together - separated by a driveway and a little green space on each side and fairly decent backyards.

There was a boy across the street about 6 or 7 who had a younger brother about 2 or 3. The older boy lived with dad but would come to visit mom some weekends. The mom would lock the older boy out of the house. If he wanted to go inside he had to basically beg. He would be outside 7-8 hours a day.

I did not know what to do so I called social services. I had no specific allegations but something just did not feel right. I did not have to give my name. I was told by SS if they have no calls on file and god forbid something does happen social services will look and say well no one has ever said anything about a problem there so we will leave child with mom. Just because you call does not necessarily mean they will investigate (I know here they won't unless it is a teacher or Dr.) but at least your suspicions are on file. They also said that maybe they could help them hook up with services - counseling for mom and or children. They moved within 6 months but I still hope that boy is okay.

 

[sdarwkcabemanmy]

Yeah, SS in this state is a joke, from what I understand. Growing up, I know there was one family a couple blocks over from us that got SS called on them a bunch of times for abuse (the dad would hit his daughter on the bottom with a wooden fan blade, etc) and nothing ever happened. I've also called them once on my sister, who was getting high/drunk around DD who was only a few months old at the time. They said unless I had specific proof and could show it to them, there was nothing they could do. :-/

 

[BeckyScott]

You need to set some ground rules, no matter which way you decide to do it. Both so that your child knows what to expect, and also so that the neighbor knows what to expect.

'Cause it doesn't get better as they get older. We currently have a situation with our 11-year-old and his best friend who lives about four blocks away. This child's mother obviously has a very different view of parenting. There is a fine line between having a friend over to play, and dumping the kid so mom can go bar-hop, and she's a bit confused about which is which. Since this is the first time we've had the situation come up, the rules weren't already in place and DS doesn't understand my reasoning, and I don't think I need to tell him his friend's mom isn't doing her job.

So I wish I had put rules in place before it ever came up, that would be saving me a lot of work now. No friends over on school days/evenings unless it is an emergency (and emergency status decided by me not by DS), friends on weekends depends on what plans we already have, friends staying the night on weekends must be planned in advance and they'll need to be going home by mid-afternoon Sunday... But still, since the mom routinely leaves him alone at home, that he knows in an emergency that he can come here, because I would feel awful if something happened to him. This same child is more "worldly" than DS and I'm also concerned about his influence.

 

[DisDreaminMom]

I've been in this situation a few times and my mom was put in this situation when I was a kid because she was a SAHM. Listen, your son does not need to make any attachments to this kid. Sorry to sound mean, but these people will be the first ones to blame you if anything ever happens. It's too bad the mom is overwhelmed, but keep your door and mouth shut. Tell her you'd be happy to babysit her DS for a fee with a contract and signed liability waiver, but don't ever tell them you'll watch the kid while you are out with your son, because one of these days, the mom or siblings will see you and your kid doing something outside and automatically assume you are in control of their son when he bugs them and they kick him outside. If you can't even speak to an adult now about the kid, what if there is an emergency?

4 is too young to be left alone outside. Period. First you are rescuing the puppy, then it's the kid. Don't put yourself in that position. This will only get worse as the child gets older. Pray that they move.

 

[bopper]

How would you like the relationship between the boys to work?
One way to do it is to say that you would like them to play together, but only when you arrange it first. So if you see the 4 yr old neighbor walking around the street, you could take him back to his house and say "4 year old was walking down the street, I wanted to make sure you knew that. If he would like to play with Son, why don't you give us a call and I can let you know if we are free. Would tomorrow be okay? Say from 10-12 (or whatever)?"
This way you are saying that you would like the kids to play, but are establishing boundaries. You are not confronting and are not being mean. If the kid won't listen to you when they play, then you just march him back over and say "Johnny isn't listening when I tell him to stop knocking over garbage cans. Maybe we could try another day." Johnny probably doesnt' have alot of restrictions placed on him, but I am sure he can learn if you are consistent and want to make the effort.

 

[mechurchlady]

Some of my late night thoughts.

Why would a mother not worry about her toddler.
Why doesn't she immediately run around looking for the toddler.
Is there a problem that stops her from caring from the children such as drinking, drugs, medication, exhaustion, medical or mental illness.
OK, so some kids are escape artists but when the kid returns home and is locked out I would be worried.
Lack of parenting is seen in the trash can episode.

I would worry about letting a kid play with a toddler who has no parental supervision and who does not have a mother screaming "Johnny where are you, get your rump in here NOW!". If the mother cannot keep the child safe at home then what bad habits has it learned and how is its socialization skills.

On the other hand there was a Reader's Digest article called "Why Johnny Can Read" that talked about doomed children who grow up to be successes. The kid in the ghetto has a grocer who encourages the child. The neighbor who takes in a latch key kid and gives them the love of photography. I see kids online who are rebellious monsters and in time with some nudging by careing people them kids change for the better.

Definitely I feel that someone needs to teach the woman proper child care bt at the same time maybe you can help the child from a life of drugs, booze and jail. Not sure how but something has to be done. Sends the child prayers.

 

[NEVERENOUGHWDW]

I would keep the kids apart...the other child seems to have no respect for adults or other people's property.
Even if the mother was out I wouldn't trust her based on her lax/non-existing parenting style.

 

[sdarwkcabemanmy]

Well, I've kind of made up my mind.

I am not going to let DS play with the boy down the street, period. I don't want his mom to see me as free babysitting because I do not want to be responsible if they get into trouble. That's HER job, not mine.

*sighs*
It's sad that I had to make this decision because DS is such a social butterfly and he is friends with EVERYBODY. He's even got a few of the girls in his class chasing after him (which is hilarious, tbh ) and he's popular with a few of the teachers at his school as well.

I don't want DS to feel like he's being punished because he can't see A4, but I don't know how to explain to him that he's no longer allowed to play with A4 either.

 

[NEVERENOUGHWDW]

Well, I've kind of made up my mind.

I am not going to let DS play with the boy down the street, period. I don't want his mom to see me as free babysitting because I do not want to be responsible if they get into trouble. That's HER job, not mine.

*sighs*
It's sad that I had to make this decision because DS is such a social butterfly and he is friends with EVERYBODY. He's even got a few of the girls in his class chasing after him (which is hilarious, tbh ) and he's popular with a few of the teachers at his school as well.

I don't want DS to feel like he's being punished because he can't see A4, but I don't know how to explain to him that he's no longer allowed to play with A4 either.

Good Luck, even though it's tough you have made the right decision.

 

[mechurchlady]

It is a tough call and you did the right thing. As you said she is getting a free child caretaker. Also you have no way of knowing if that kid is healthy, trained in hygiene, or if he might have an allergic reaction because mom did not tell you. It hurts deeply to see animals roaming the streets or kids being neglected but that is what government agencies are for. It is one thing to have a neighbor who is a working mom or is sick but when a woman does not care about her children then why help her out. I have no children save for the kids I meet online and to me children are gifts from God that are to be treasured more than a rare work of art and to be protected not just turned loose on the street. Find someone your son likes and take them in and mentor them and help them grow.

Hugs and chocolates on your hard decision.