I need to stay away from gay day threads

[Steffi]

I'm not looking for controversy. What I'd like most is for my boyfriend and I to just be left in peace to live our lives. I'd like to be able to hold hands with him and not have to watch out for whackos that consider our mere existence as an affront to God, one punishable by beatings and death.

The T-shirt in our case should read "Airfare, $200. Hotel rooms, $400. Being able to hold hands with my boyfriend on our honeymoon and not be the only guys doing so in the park, being around thousands of people who don't think our need to express a lifetime commitment to each other is somehow offensive, being in our favorite place on earth and feeling like we belong: priceless."

That brought tears to my eyes! I hope you & your partner-to-be have the time of your lives!!!

ETA: I've never been to WDW on Gay Days, so I am kind of worried about the crowds. I'm not, however, at all worried about seeing gay couples together. I'd SO much rather have my DD see a gay couple lovingly holding hands or having their arms around each other and enjoying life than to have her witness any family fighting and cussing and being hateful at each other, which we see more than our share of on each and every trip!

 

[mjmcca]

Went last year on a pretty much last minute trip to WDW during Gay Days. ( what can I say AP was burning a hole in my pocket and I wanted to see the house that DH purchased).
I had my 2 DK (3 and 4) with me and on some days I took my CM friend's kids (3 and 5) and her teenage sister (16). Only thing that was different than normal was one day at MK the people there seemed dressed more for a club than a themepark. Nothing wrong with that. I didn't stress over Gay Days. I live in NYC maybe if they were walking naked down Main Street USA I would give them a second glance.... then again maybe not.


I cant remember if it was during that trip or one of the other trips I took last summer ( remember that AP was burning in my pocket) We had lunch at Sci fi and in the last row of my car were 2 guys who I * think* were gay ( I didn't ask). I had a great conversation with them during part of my lunch.



My last thought. On my last trip to AK my DD asked during the FOTLK during the Can You Feel the Love Tonight segment, if "they love" meaning are the 2 dancers are in love. I kind of expect the same kind of question from her if we ever do go again during gay days ( difficult now cause they have started school and we don't get out till the end of June here). I would just answer her yes they do and take it from there.

 

[MrVisible]

But we did indeed see 2 young boys {mid teens} holding hands and kissing {not just a peck} on Main street... when they stopped kissing they looked around with such hate on their faces to see who was looking. So I guess things do happen on Main Street USA.

Consider for a moment that these kids have (in all probability) heard words synonymous with 'gay' used as insults every single day they've been in school, for years. Unless they live in the most enlightened of school districts, there's very little chance that they could kiss in public where they came from without fear for their lives. Genuine, realistic fear for their lives.

From the 1995 Massachusetts Youth Risk Behavior Surveillance report:

* Gay, lesbian, and bisexual youth were more than four times as likely to report being threatened with a weapon on school property
* Gay, lesbian, and bisexual youth were almost five times as likely to report failing to attend school because of their fear about safety
* Gay, lesbian, and bisexual youth were more likely to carry a weapon in the 30 days prior to the survey
* Gay, lesbian, and bisexual youth were more likely to have engaged in a physical fight in the 12 months prior to the survey
* Gay, lesbian, and bisexual youth were more than three times as likely to have attempted suicide in the past 12 months.

I don't agree with what they were doing; public displays of affection are at best tasteless, and at worst offensive. And I don't think that hatred is the way to respond to the societal pressures that gay people are under. I'm not trying to excuse their behavior.

But these are the people we're fighting for. These kids are the reason that we must continue to keep pushing for gay people to achieve the right to marry, to be immune from discrimination in the workplace and the housing market, to be treated as equals in their schools and communities. Until they have a chance to be a legitilmate part of society, society will be their enemy, and not through their choice. These are kids for whom every day is a battle, and school is a war. They're attacked every day, and must cope with harrassment and abuse from students and teachers the likes of which most people have never seen.

If these kids had been able to come to school after they'd met, after they'd been going out for a while, and been able to hold hands without risking jeers, catcalls, physical abuse, and possibly death, then maybe they wouldn't have felt the need to make out on Main Street. Maybe they would have, 'cause you know, they're kids. But I guarantee you that when they came up for air, there wouldn't have been that hatred in their eyes.

 

[wallyb]

Originally Posted by dizneydiva2005
But we did indeed see 2 young boys {mid teens} holding hands and kissing {not just a peck} on Main street... when they stopped kissing they looked around with such hate on their faces to see who was looking. So I guess things do happen on Main Street USA.

I know this is an example of mad impetuous heady youth-
But what ever happen to leading by example?

Treating (and conduct oneself) as you would like to be treated.

I’ve got some gay friends who have done some militant-ish stuff and all I can think is - Was getting people pissed with you your goal? Way to get accepted!

I’d think just go have a great time be friendly and courteous and maybe, just maybe, people won’t see us as the evil monsters out to overthrow the straight universe. Or even WDW.

 

[gppnj]

Personally, I love the gays.

 

[DVC~OKW~96]

Do ya' now?

 

[LuluLovesDisney]

Originally Posted by dizneydiva2005
But we did indeed see 2 young boys {mid teens} holding hands and kissing {not just a peck} on Main street... when they stopped kissing they looked around with such hate on their faces to see who was looking. So I guess things do happen on Main Street USA.

I know this is an example of mad impetuous heady youth-
But what ever happen to leading by example?

Treating (and conduct oneself) as you would like to be treated.

I’ve got some gay friends who have done some militant-ish stuff and all I can think is - Was getting people pissed with you your goal? Way to get accepted!

I’d think just go have a great time be friendly and courteous and maybe, just maybe, people won’t see us as the evil monsters out to overthrow the straight universe. Or even WDW.

I agree. Teens are dramatic- gay, bisexual, straight or celibate Christian missionary. I teach them all, and they are almost ALL overly dramatic. And *don't* read the "Shocking" thread - what teens have been seen doing in WDW/other parks by other DISers has ruined me for life.

 

[dizneydiva2005]

Originally Posted by dizneydiva2005
But we did indeed see 2 young boys {mid teens} holding hands and kissing {not just a peck} on Main street... when they stopped kissing they looked around with such hate on their faces to see who was looking. So I guess things do happen on Main Street USA.

I’ve got some gay friends who have done some militant-ish stuff and all I can think is - Was getting people pissed with you your goal? Way to get accepted!

I’d think just go have a great time be friendly and courteous and maybe, just maybe, people won’t see us as the evil monsters out to overthrow the straight universe. Or even WDW.

Sounds like you have a smart head on your shoulders. I have this bestest, funny, sweetest, most caring, wears his heart on his sleeve, friend who is gay... he doesn't hide it but it doesn't throw it in my face either. It's a way of life for him... he's not out to change the world.

 

[dizneydiva2005]

I agree. Teens are dramatic- gay, bisexual, straight or celibate Christian missionary. I teach them all, and they are almost ALL overly dramatic. And *don't* read the "Shocking" thread - what teens have been seen doing in WDW/other parks by other DISers has ruined me for life.

Oh gosh, I remember the day when I was a teenager. Everything is Drama, drama, drama!!!! As we get older, we learn to chill and not everything is worth flippin' out over.

 

[jejune]

Originally Posted by dizneydiva2005
But we did indeed see 2 young boys {mid teens} holding hands and kissing {not just a peck} on Main street... when they stopped kissing they looked around with such hate on their faces to see who was looking. So I guess things do happen on Main Street USA.

a few years ago there was an ad campaing up here in canada where you saw two men about to kiss, the text above it said something like "does it bother you? it bothers homophobes". i guess those two guys at disney just were trying to point out that there's no reason for them to be ashamed of who they are just because it makes some people uncomfortable (PDA aside, i mean). knowing myself i would have ended up buying those two mickey bars.

 

[dwheatl]

I hope this comes out right....
Someday little kids will see gay couples holding hands and sneaking a quick kiss and will say, "Ewww, they're kissing!" just like they would for a hetero couple. **sigh** That's my dream, anyway.

I think it's sad that parents are concerned that WDW isn't the place for their kids to learn about homosexuality. Actually, I agree--the kids should have learned about it a long time ago. They should know it is a normal way of life for many loving people.

Truthfully, until there's a "Pedophile Priest Day," the kids will be fine at WDW. (Oh, my bad. Did I actually write that? Oh well. Can't take it back now! )

Dotty, this is off-topic, but I thought this comment was hurtful. Why did you have to say "pedophile priest" and not just pedophile? Stereotyping priests is like stereotyping anyone else. You are taking the horrendous behavior of a few and generalizing to the whole group. My DS just graduated from a Jesuit school, where he was shown kindness and support by all of the staff, priests included, as he was coming to terms with his sexuality. He went to the prom with a boy who had graduated from there two years ago, and nobody blinked an eye. That's a lot better than he could have expected at many public schools.
As for gay days, it sounds OK to me, but there was one picture on the website of what looked like half a million sweaty, topless men packed together at the pool party at the "official" hotel, and it gave me claustrophobia and I felt a little uncomfortable. Maybe it's just the thought of so many men, and none of them attracted to me!

 

[aidensdad]

My wife and son and I were there this year for gay Days and the crowds were not bad at all for most of the rides early except for dumbo But it was A great time at Disney as usual, we are all human beings strait or gay, for the people who are worried about seeing inappropriate things this is gay days not teen days sorry teens.

 

[Stacerita]

Personally, I love the gays.

Me too!

 

[ashjohnson80]

Me too!

me three!

 

[PHILCT]

The best part of Gay Days 2006 for me, was watching 2 very charming young gay guys riding the Boat back from the Park to their Disney Resort on the closing Saturday Evening of Gay Day.

These 2 guys had an entire Brownie Troop and the adults accompaning them, howling, laughing and singing all the way back to the Resort. Even the Boat Captain looked a little suprised how much fun this large group was having at the end of a very late day.

I just kept smiling and laughing, as these two guys had an entire troop of Brownies under their magical spell !

It was a great boat ride,and a great way to end Gay Day,

Phil

 

[DawnM]

Tom Cruise is strait! You are too funny!

Dawn

AMEN! I am so sick and tired of hearing how gay people are ruining marriage! Tom Cruise is straight yet he can go around talking about his baby out of Wedlock! Liz Taylor, where do we start?! Straights have done a good enough job of ruining the sanctity of marriage all on their own!

 

[Ember]

Just my random two cents:

I recently asked about the impact of Gay Days on the parks on the wedding boards because I learned my honeymoon would fall during that time. I wanted to know how political the days were (the DIS article states it's a very politically charged event) and how bad the crowds get. Though I have to say, I was more concerned with the crowds... I got a few very nasty responses. I didn't feel asking these questions was in any way an attack.

I didn't feel the need to defend my people-are-people beliefs to ask the questions. After all, the only information I had lead me to believe it was an event I might want to avoid. I deal with politics like this regularly and, quite frankly, I don't want to do it on my honeymoon. (Example: I spent the last few months in heated debates over the inclusion of a children's book featuring a child with two mom's in an elementary library.) Rather then simply take the DIS article at face value I looked for further information and opinions and got blasted for it.

I think some acceptance in both directions would be a good thing. Not everyone who has questions about an event like Gay Days is out to attack people. Only though educating people will barriers break down. But if people are afraid to ask questions then they will never have the information they need to make desicions regarding issues such as this. You can't fight ignorance with impatience.

As a final thought: I hope one day things like Gay Days are no longer needed. The true test of equlity is when special status is no longer required. I hope one day the idea that human rights are for everyone is something so unremarkable that no one gives it a second thought.

 

[MrVisible]

Ember,

This October, my boyfriend and I are getting married. We'd love to do a Disney wedding, but of course, that's not allowed under park rules. So we're doing a small wedding with our family and friends present in our town, and then that night we're flying out to Disneyland.

We didn't know it when we planned our wedding date (we're getting married on the fifth anniversary of our first date) but that weekend is Gay Days at Disneyland.

I want you to take a moment to try and appreciate what that means to us. For that weekend, we will be among people who don't think we're really weird for wanting to hold hands during the fireworks show. We'll be able to wear Mickey groom hats, and we won't be freaks standing out from the crowds. We won't be worried about people taking offense if we say something that reveals we're a couple, like "I wonder how the dogs are doing" or "Let's go back to our room, I'm tired."

See, for me, this is the opposite of politics. My very existence is an incentive to political debate; as soon as anyone finds out I'm gay it's a political issue. Should I go with my boyfriend to his work Christmas party? Politics. Do we go to the neighborhood association meeting together? Politics. Have you any idea how exhausting that is?

On our honeymoon, we're going to be surrounded by people who just don't care if we're gay. It's really, literally, no big deal. Have you got any idea how much I'm looking forward to that?

In the thread you refer to, your biggest question was whether this was an overtly political event. If it was, you didn't want to go. Let me ask you: is there any way for a group of gay people to get together in public and not have politics involved?

I'm sorry you made the decision to avoid Disneyworld on Gay Days next year. I would think that being surrounded by people who love each other, despite societal condemnation, despite peer pressure, familial pressure, religious and political pressure, despite the ever-present threat of being beaten and killed for who we love... I would think that that would be, to someone as open-minded as you seem to be, a confirmation of love's power, and a reminder of how precious love really is.

 

[Ember]

MrVisible,

You have a point. I think it's a shame that you do happen to have a point, but you do. But there is a differece between being able to hold your partners hand and enjoy his complany and feeling the need to make a statement.

The DIS article states Gay Days has "in my opinion, deformed – into what is now nothing more than a vile spectacle of self indulgence and indecency." It goes on to read: "but the sheer number of people who seem to go out of their way to rub their sexuality in everyones face during this ‘event’ is nothing short of disgraceful." Near the end he begings his conclusion with: "I’m fed up with watching a place I love get defiled by the kind of twisted nonsense that routinely takes place during Gay Days. The Magic Kingdom is not the place to make a stand, or to further an agenda." (Source: http://www.wdwinfo.com/disney-gay-days.htm)

To me it's the difference between the passive and the agressive. To draw an analogy: there is a difference between being religious (even overtly so) and proselytizing. I have been around this angry, out to prove a point attitude quite enough in my everyday life.

However, rather then blindly accept the opinion of the author I sought more information. I have never been to Gay Days, I don't know what it's like. If it was more a be and let be enviornment, just a gathering of people who happen to be gay, I would be perfectly fine with that. But the harsh responses I got in answer to my questions led me to believe that the author of the DIS article was perhaps correct. I don't need (or want) anyone's sexuality rubbed in my face in the effort to prove a point, just as I don't need religion shoved down my throat.

I also prefer Disney on the less crowded side of things. After finding out school also lets out at that same time the desicion was pretty easy to make. I do hope you have a wonderful honeymoon, and that the trip is everything you hope it will be.

 

[RickinNYC]

Ember, those harsh responses were from pretty much one person that is not representative of the entire gay community. You said you were very aware of that and didn't allow that person to cloud your judgement. It seems, however, that you're having a change of heart? Please don't let that one person make you change your mind.

Also, that article you are referring to was written by only one gay man, not the entire community at large. My partner and I have never been to Gay Days, nor do we plan to do so intentionally. If we happen to be there at that time, so be it. That said, I can't completely answer your question in terms of whether it's politically motivated. What I can say, though, is that I do not agree with the tone of said article. I found it to be rather harsh, written by a gay man notwithstanding, and it simply fueled the fire of those that are closed minded. "See? Even a gay guy agrees with us!" I thought it was wrong to post it as an official statement of the DIS board. But that is just my own opinion.

I think Mr. Visible hit the nail on the head. Yes, it's political only in that a number of those gay and lesbian attendees are making a statement that we ARE a part of society, we ARE your neighbors. Personally, I made that active political statement for years, many years ago. Now, I prefer to simply make my political statements in a much quieter tone, simply by holding my partner's hand while we stroll the streets of 5th Avenue while shopping. I don't need a week in Disney World to remind me that we need to do this every day of our lives.

As to whether it's an "in your face" statement, I've no idea. I can tell you, however, that I have a LOT of friends, all heterosexual, that have gone to WDW during Gay Days and they strongly felt that it was just not a big deal at all.

I think if you were to change your dates, you're making a quiet political statement of your own. One that supports those who are vehemently and ignorantly trying to deny the gay community some basic civil rights. I'd like to think, because you have stated that you are in full support of our acceptance, that you might not want to be associated with those people. At least I hope so.

It shows a testament to your strength of character to have the courage to post something that might prove to be an argumentative stance against gays and lesbians on this board.