I knew this would happen

bsnyder

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The Democrats, anticipating that Obama is a shoo-in to be elected President next month, are already laying the groundwork for the biggest flip-flop in history.

After 8 years of hearing a constant drumbeat about the dangerous, reckless deficit spending of President Bush, and the Republicans, I predict we will now be told by those same people that deficit spending really isn't a big problem and in fact, we must have more of it.

Robert Reich gets the ball rolling in an op-ed in the NY Times today:

BOTH presidential candidates have been criticized for failing — at Tuesday’s debate and previously — to name any promises or plans they’re going to have to scrap because of the bailout and the failing economy. That criticism is unwarranted. The assumption that we are about to have a rerun of 1993 — when Bill Clinton, newly installed as president, was forced to jettison much of his agenda because of a surging budget deficit — may well be mistaken.

At first glance, January 2009 is starting to look a lot like January 1993. Then, the federal deficit was running at roughly $300 billion a year, or about 5 percent of gross domestic product, way too high for comfort. By contrast, the deficit for the 2009 fiscal year is now projected to be $410 billion, or about 3.3 percent of gross domestic product. That’s not too worrying. But if the Treasury shovels out the full $700 billion of bailout money next year, the deficit could balloon to more than 6 percent of gross domestic product, the highest since 1983. And if the nation plunges into a deeper recession, with tax revenues dropping and domestic product shrinking, the deficit will be even larger as a proportion of the economy.

Yet all is not what it seems. First, the $700 billion bailout is less like an additional government expense than a temporary loan or investment. The Treasury will take on Wall Street’s bad debts — mostly mortgage-backed securities for which there’s no market right now — and will raise the $700 billion by issuing additional government debt, much of it to global lenders and foreign governments. As America’s housing stock regains value, as we all hope it will, bad debts become better debts, and the Treasury will be able to resell the securities for at least as much as it paid, if not for a profit. And if there is a shortfall, the bailout bill allows the president to impose a fee on Wall Street to fill it.

Another difference is that in 1993, the nation was emerging from a recession. Although jobs were slow to return, factory orders were up and the economy was growing. This meant growing demand for private capital. Under these circumstances, the deficit Bill Clinton inherited threatened to overheat the economy. He had no choice but to trim it, a point that the Federal Reserve chairman, Alan Greenspan, was not reluctant to emphasize. Unless President Clinton cut the deficit and abandoned much of his agenda, interest rates would rise and the economic recovery would be anemic.

Next year, however, is likely to be quite different. All economic indicators are now pointing toward a deepening recession. Unemployment is already high, and the trend is not encouraging. Factory orders are down. Worried about their jobs and rising costs of fuel, food and health insurance, middle-class Americans are unable or unwilling to spend on much other than necessities.

Under these circumstances, deficit spending is not unwelcome. Indeed, as spender of last resort, the government will probably have to run deficits to keep the economy going anywhere near capacity, a lesson the nation learned when mobilization for World War II finally lifted us out of the Great Depression.

Finally, not all deficits are equal. As every family knows, going into debt in order to send a child to college is fundamentally different from going into debt to take an ocean cruise. Deficits that finance investments in the nation’s future are not the same as deficits that maintain the current standard of living.

Here again, there’s marked difference between 1993 and 2009. Then, some of our highways, bridges, levees and transit systems needed repair. Today, they are crumbling. In 1993, some of our children were in classrooms too crowded to learn in, and some districts were shutting preschool and after-school programs. Today, such inadequacies are endemic. In 1993, some 35 million Americans had no health insurance and millions more were barely able to afford it. Today, 50 million are without insurance, and a large swath of the middle class is barely holding on. In 1993, climate change was a problem. Now, it’s an emergency.

Moreover, without adequate public investment, the vast majority of Americans will be condemned to a lower standard of living for themselves and their children. The top 1 percent now takes home about 20 percent of total national income. As recently as 1980, it took home 8 percent. Although the economy has grown considerably since 1980, the middle class’s share has shrunk. That’s a problem not just because it strikes so many as being unfair, but also because it’s starting to limit the capacity of most Americans to buy the goods and services we produce without going deep into debt. The last time the top 1 percent took home 20 percent of national income, not incidentally, was 1928.

Perhaps it should not be surprising, then, that the Wall Street bailout has generated so much anger among middle-class Americans. Let’s not compound the problem by needlessly letting it prevent the government from spending what it must to lift the prospects of Main Street.

Robert B. Reich, a secretary of labor under President Bill Clinton and a professor at the University of California, Berkeley, is the author of “Supercapitalism.”

Notice that he actually talks about the current deficit in the more meaningful % of GDP term, rather than the BIG, SCARY, HIGHER THAN EVER but not very informative, absolute number.

Expect to hear a lot more of the same, if Obama is elected. :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:
 
It's official - the liberals' favorite economist, Paul Krugman, is now on the "deficits don't matter" bandwagon:

Op-Ed Columnist
Let’s Get Fiscal
By PAUL KRUGMAN
Published: October 16, 2008
The Dow is surging! No, it’s plunging! No, it’s surging! No, it’s ...

Nevermind. While the manic-depressive stock market is dominating the headlines, the more important story is the grim news coming in about the real economy. It’s now clear that rescuing the banks is just the beginning: the nonfinancial economy is also in desperate need of help.

And to provide that help, we’re going to have to put some prejudices aside. It’s politically fashionable to rant against government spending and demand fiscal responsibility. But right now, increased government spending is just what the doctor ordered, and concerns about the budget deficit should be put on hold.

Before I get there, let’s talk about the economic situation.

Just this week, we learned that retail sales have fallen off a cliff, and so has industrial production. Unemployment claims are at steep-recession levels, and the Philadelphia Fed’s manufacturing index is falling at the fastest pace in almost 20 years. All signs point to an economic slump that will be nasty, brutish — and long.

How nasty? The unemployment rate is already above 6 percent (and broader measures of underemployment are in double digits). It’s now virtually certain that the unemployment rate will go above 7 percent, and quite possibly above 8 percent, making this the worst recession in a quarter-century.

And how long? It could be very long indeed.

Think about what happened in the last recession, which followed the bursting of the late-1990s technology bubble. On the surface, the policy response to that recession looks like a success story. Although there were widespread fears that the United States would experience a Japanese-style “lost decade,” that didn’t happen: the Federal Reserve was able to engineer a recovery from that recession by cutting interest rates.

But the truth is that we were looking Japanese for quite a while: the Fed had a hard time getting traction. Despite repeated interest rate cuts, which eventually brought the federal funds rate down to just 1 percent, the unemployment rate just kept on rising; it was more than two years before the job picture started to improve. And when a convincing recovery finally did come, it was only because Alan Greenspan had managed to replace the technology bubble with a housing bubble.

Now the housing bubble has burst in turn, leaving the financial landscape strewn with wreckage. Even if the ongoing efforts to rescue the banking system and unfreeze the credit markets work — and while it’s early days yet, the initial results have been disappointing — it’s hard to see housing making a comeback any time soon. And if there’s another bubble waiting to happen, it’s not obvious. So the Fed will find it even harder to get traction this time.

In other words, there’s not much Ben Bernanke can do for the economy. He can and should cut interest rates even more — but nobody expects this to do more than provide a slight economic boost.

On the other hand, there’s a lot the federal government can do for the economy. It can provide extended benefits to the unemployed, which will both help distressed families cope and put money in the hands of people likely to spend it. It can provide emergency aid to state and local governments, so that they aren’t forced into steep spending cuts that both degrade public services and destroy jobs. It can buy up mortgages (but not at face value, as John McCain has proposed) and restructure the terms to help families stay in their homes.

And this is also a good time to engage in some serious infrastructure spending, which the country badly needs in any case. The usual argument against public works as economic stimulus is that they take too long: by the time you get around to repairing that bridge and upgrading that rail line, the slump is over and the stimulus isn’t needed. Well, that argument has no force now, since the chances that this slump will be over anytime soon are virtually nil. So let’s get those projects rolling.

Will the next administration do what’s needed to deal with the economic slump? Not if Mr. McCain pulls off an upset. What we need right now is more government spending — but when Mr. McCain was asked in one of the debates how he would deal with the economic crisis, he answered: “Well, the first thing we have to do is get spending under control.”

If Barack Obama becomes president, he won’t have the same knee-jerk opposition to spending. But he will face a chorus of inside-the-Beltway types telling him that he has to be responsible, that the big deficits the government will run next year if it does the right thing are unacceptable.

He should ignore that chorus. The responsible thing, right now, is to give the economy the help it needs. Now is not the time to worry about the deficit.

So, make sure you've got the latest talking points memorized.


It's no longer "Deficits - baaaaaad", it's "Deficits - absolutely necessary".
 
The Democrats, anticipating that Obama is a shoo-in to be elected President next month, are already laying the groundwork for the biggest flip-flop in history.

After 8 years of hearing a constant drumbeat about the dangerous, reckless deficit spending of President Bush, and the Republicans, I predict we will now be told by those same people that deficit spending really isn't a big problem and in fact, we must have more of it.

Robert Reich gets the ball rolling in an op-ed in the NY Times today:



Notice that he actually talks about the current deficit in the more meaningful % of GDP term, rather than the BIG, SCARY, HIGHER THAN EVER but not very informative, absolute number.

Expect to hear a lot more of the same, if Obama is elected. :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

Hmmm, my only concern is if a trip to WDW will decrease in cost slightly, that way I can have more ice cream treats!!!

:banana:
 
Since I am leaving for WDW in a couple hours, I will just say that I won't miss all the attack posts.

I hope you all get it out of your system by the time I return. :lmao:

Really now, remember to play nice.
 

Since I am leaving for WDW in a couple hours, I will just say that I won't miss all the attack posts.

I hope you all get it out of your system by the time I return. :lmao:

Really now, remember to play nice. na na na boo boo!!

What, and you didn't invite US to go along???


hehehehehehehe

Hey...PIRATE!!!!
 
If Obama wins, and there's a super-majority, the next 4 years are going to make 1933 and 1965 seem like a picnic.

We've still not recovered from those debacles.
 
If Obama wins, and there's a super-majority, the next 4 years are going to make 1933 and 1965 seem like a picnic.

We've still not recovered from those debacles.

Amen!
 
Barney Frank is now on board with the "Deficits aren't anything to fear" talking point. He's added a new twist, by addressing the "paygo" promise the Dems pushed before the '06 elections.

"I think there are a lot of very rich people out there, whom we can tax down the road, and recovery some of this money."
 


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