I am reserving a room for mid-November and there is almost zero availability. 5 months out and I can barely get a room!

WDW_Ding

Ohana means family.
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Jan 11, 2018
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467
One thing to mention right off the bat:

This is for the week before Thanksgiving and this is not Jersey Week. The crowd calendar on TouringPlans lists all the parks (except DHS because of SW:GE) around a 4, on average. There are a few days where MK is a 2! In other words, the parks shouldn't be terribly crowded.

And still, when I go to reserve a room 5 months out, there is almost no availability at all! This is for any room size...studio, 1BR, or 2BR!

I was able to get a 1BR at Saratoga, but aside from that, there were no other resorts where I could book my entire stay (7 nights) without resort hopping. And even if I were willing to resort hop, I'm not even sure it would have been possible without using Saratoga.

This lack of availability is becoming a real issue. When I first bought in to DVC I could easily book rooms 3, 4, or 5 months out.

Does anyone know why this has changed so drastically? Is DVC selling too many points? Is there just some sort of trend where people are booking farther in advance?

I'm becoming extremely frustrated with this. Does anyone else feel the same?
 
I am going to repost something I just put on another thread (is that acceptable?)

Disney is responsible for the difficulties of decreased availability at 7 months.

1. The online program makes it very easy for people to book and use their points. And they do. This is actually a good thing.

2. The program makes it easier for people to rent out their points when they aren't going to use them. This means that points get used and take up reservations, instead of expiring. However, another part of this is that Disney has made it very attractive to rent points out by raising the prices of rooms so very high. So, more points get used. If you have 50 points you are going to lose, but points only rent for $5 each then you stand to lose maybe $250. Not nice, but not a really big deal. But if points are going for $20 a point (and I have rented a lot of points at $20 a point) then your 50 points becomes $1000. That is much more significant!!!

3. Disney did establish a program in DVC that has some intrinsic value. Unlike most timeshares, where point value gradually goes to zero, the DVC points retain value, as long as they can be used to stay at the very expensive resorts that Disney has created by raising their prices. This makes it worthwhile for people to SELL their points on the RESALE market when they get tired of them, or too old for them, or their circumstances change. So, points that used to sit around doing nothing, now go into the hands of people (the resale buyers) who are more likely to use them.

4. HHI and Vero Beach owners who bought resale. This is a special sub category of resale buyers, not just because they bought contracts, and kept them active, but also because they are especially likely to shift from their Home Resort to use them at Disney World. The original owners of HHI and VB were likely to have purchased those locations because they LIKED those locations. But as the population has aged and changed and new resale buyers have come in, a very very large part of those resale buyers bought VB and HHI, with no intention to ever stay there, but because they were cheap, and it gave them an inexpensive way to stay at Disney World. This puts more pressure on the rest of the system.

5. Disney made a BIG mistake by building Aulani. I don't care how much Disney tries to put a rosy face on it and cherry pick their statistics to deny that Aulani people are actually staying at Disney world - the Aulani owners actually ARE staying at Disney World. Why? Because it costs less to fly to Orlando from EVERYWHERE in the continental United States (even the west coast), than to fly to Hawaii. Besides, Disney World is a whole lot more fun and interesting than Aulani. Just the fact that Aulani is still only about half sold out, AFTER ALL THESE YEARS, shows that people don't want to stay there. And the people who don't want to stay there includes the people who actually bought it. (I'm not talking about EVERYONE, but a significant percentage.) Disney should have known better.

6. Disney has sold too many small contracts. Contracts that only have enough points to stay in studios. So all the studios book up, and this then causes a cascade effect, forcing other people, who formerly stayed in studios, to use up their points by staying in other rooms, 1 bedroom and 2 bedroom units. These units were also more available in the past because the people using them formerly spent their points on studios.

7. Disney came up with the genius idea to designate certain units, Polynesian Bungalows in particular, but also others such as Copper Creek cabins, as "very high point reservoir units." In other words, build high point units like bungalows and cabins in order to create a lot of (inexpensive to build) points that Disney could sell. And they knew, or should have known that people would not choose to use their points so wastefully, on the Bungalows. Even better for Disney, they can now rent those out. Meanwhile the points that ARE NOT USED to stay in the bungalows go into the general pool and soak up other reservations at other places.

8. Because it is getting harder to book, people ARE planning their vacations farther out, both in the 11 month window and in the 7 month window. They know that to get what they want, they MUST plan ahead, or they are likely to find themselves with poor options. This takes inventory out of the pool, earlier, and makes it nearly impossible to plan late notice vacations.

Am I missing any other major factors?


The fact is, even if people are only using 10% more of their points than they did in the past, this is enough to tip the balance and make it hard to get reservations with short notice. And, when you add up the points that formerly went unused, and the points being used because they are 'rentable,' and the points that are being switched to standard DVC units instead of being used on Bungalows, Aulani, HHI and VB, you will find a far greater increase in the number of people competing for the same reservations.
 
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I am going to repost something I just put on another thread (is that acceptable?)

Disney is responsible for the difficulties of decreased availability at 7 months.

1. The online program makes it very easy for people to book and use their points. And they do. This is actually a good thing.

2. The program makes it easier for people to rent out their points when they aren't going to use them. This means that points get used and take up reservations, instead of expiring. However, another part of this is that Disney has made it very attractive to rent points out by raising the prices of rooms so very high. So, more points get used. If you have 50 points you are going to lose, but points only rent for $5 each then you stand to lose maybe $250. Not nice, but not a really big deal. But if points are going for $20 a point (and I have rented a lot of points at $20 a point) then your 50 points becomes $1000. That is much more significant!!!

3. Disney did establish a program in DVC that has some intrinsic value. Unlike most timeshares, where point value gradually goes to zero, the DVC points retain value, as long as they can be used to stay at the very expensive resorts that Disney has created by raising their prices. This makes it worthwhile for people to SELL their points on the RESALE market when they get tired of them, or too old for them, or their circumstances change. So, points that used to sit around doing nothing, now go into the hands of people (the resale buyers) who are more likely to use them.

4. HHI and Vero Beach owners who bought resale. This is a special sub category of resale buyers, not just because they bought contracts, and kept them active, but also because they are especially likely to shift from their Home Resort to use them at Disney World. The original owners of HHI and VB were likely to have purchased those locations because they LIKED those locations. But as the population has aged and changed and new resale buyers have come in, a very very large part of those resale buyers bought VB and HHI, with no intention to ever stay there, but because they were cheap, and it gave them an inexpensive way to stay at Disney World. This puts more pressure on the rest of the system.

5. Disney has sold too many small contracts. Contracts that only have enough points to stay in studios. So all the studios book up, and this then causes a cascade effect, forcing other people, who formerly stayed in studios, to use up their points by staying in other rooms, 1 bedroom and 2 bedroom units. These units were also more available in the past because the people using them formerly spent their points on studios.

6. Disney came up with the genius idea to designate certain units, Polynesian Bungalows in particular, but also others such as Copper Creek cabins, as "very high point reservoir units." In other words, make bungalows and cabins in order to create a lot of (inexpensive to build) points that Disney could sell. And they knew, or should have known that people would not choose to use their points so wastefully, on the Bungalows. Even better for Disney, they can now rent those out. Meanwhile the points that ARE NOT USED to stay in the bungalows go into the general pool and soak up other reservations at other places.

7. Disney made a mistake by building Aulani. I don't care how much Disney tries to put a rosy face on it and cherry pick their statistics to deny that Aulani people are actually staying at Disney world - the Aulani owners actually ARE staying at Disney World. Why? Because it costs less to fly to Orlando from EVERYWHERE in the continental United States (even the west coast), than to fly to Hawaii. Besides, Disney World is a whole lot more fun and interesting than Aulani. Just the fact that Aulani is still only about half sold out, AFTER ALL THESE YEARS, shows that people don't want to stay there. And the people who don't want to stay there includes the people who actually bought it. (I'm not talking about EVERYONE, but a significant percentage.) Disney should have known better.

8. Because it is getting harder to book, people ARE planning their vacations farther out, both in the 11 month window and in the 7 month window. They know that to get what they want, they MUST plan ahead, or they are likely to find themselves with poor options. This takes inventory out of the pool, earlier, and makes it nearly impossible to plan late notice vacations.

Am I missing any other major factors?

The fact is, even if people are only using 10% more of their points than they did in the past, this is enough to tip the balance and make it hard to get reservations with short notice. And, when you add up the points that formerly went unused, and the points being used because they are 'rentable,' and the points that are being switched to standard DVC units instead of being used on Bungalows, Aulani, HHI and VB, you will find a far greater increase in the number of people competing for the same reservations.

Thanks for this. I just found the post where you originally posted it.
 
One thing to mention right off the bat:

This is for the week before Thanksgiving and this is not Jersey Week. The crowd calendar on TouringPlans lists all the parks (except DHS because of SW:GE) around a 4, on average. There are a few days where MK is a 2! In other words, the parks shouldn't be terribly crowded.

And still, when I go to reserve a room 5 months out, there is almost no availability at all! This is for any room size...studio, 1BR, or 2BR!

I was able to get a 1BR at Saratoga, but aside from that, there were no other resorts where I could book my entire stay (7 nights) without resort hopping. And even if I were willing to resort hop, I'm not even sure it would have been possible without using Saratoga.

This lack of availability is becoming a real issue. When I first bought in to DVC I could easily book rooms 3, 4, or 5 months out.

Does anyone know why this has changed so drastically? Is DVC selling too many points? Is there just some sort of trend where people are booking farther in advance?

I'm becoming extremely frustrated with this. Does anyone else feel the same?
Five weeks from today is a Thanksgiving week. That’s typically a higher demand week for DVC. Most people who want to travel that week booked their home resort at 11 months and some switched at 7 months. You’re already two months too late. Welcome to the new DVC! Expect it to only get more difficult when DRR and Reflections are sold out.
 

DVC sell the points to fill every DVC unit (including VB, HHI and Aulani) 365 days each year. They cannot "oversell." But various factors, some of which were already touched upon, can create imbalances. Demand is also not equal across seasons/dates, unit types, or locations.

As new resorts come online, the points and units added in each is balanced, but the demand from the owners of those points - for unit types, seasons, or target resorts at 7 months to switch - is not.

This is why, for instance, I expect 7 months at BCV and BWV to grow impossible in the next 5 years. Even with some of those owners not booking at home resort or switching at 7 months, these are extremely high demand and thus a feeding frenzy at 7 months. Add in all the new points from RIV and Reflections, as well as ongoing pressure from CCV owners unable to get studios in home resort, and it will be increasingly difficult.
 
DVC sell the points to fill every DVC unit (including VB, HHI and Aulani) 365 days each year. They cannot "oversell." But various factors, some of which were already touched upon, can create imbalances. Demand is also not equal across seasons/dates, unit types, or locations.

As new resorts come online, the points and units added in each is balanced, but the demand from the owners of those points - for unit types, seasons, or target resorts at 7 months to switch - is not.

This is why, for instance, I expect 7 months at BCV and BWV to grow impossible in the next 5 years. Even with some of those owners not booking at home resort or switching at 7 months, these are extremely high demand and thus a feeding frenzy at 7 months. Add in all the new points from RIV and Reflections, as well as ongoing pressure from CCV owners unable to get studios in home resort, and it will be increasingly difficult.
Though doesn't DVC technically only sell 51 use week periods out of 52.... I'm fairly certain the component site POS for each resort declares that number of use weeks as being sold (and approved by the regulator). So there is some slush floating around, when that 1 week isn't used for maintenance as required, and slush from the lockoff premiums.

I'm not convinced yet that DRR will put more stress on the system, than already exists, initially (maybe in 10-15 years when resale owners increase to a high percentage, at current rates ~10%, at the L14 that can't reserve at DRR, but then again DRR should have similar resale turnover) because it will have some benefits, thus for each owner wanting to switch out opens space for someone to switch into. I really think the stress at 7 months is coming from the visibility into the reservation window, outside of larger point units (though the Cabins fill much more frequently at 7 months than the Bungalows; even fill sometimes at 11 months during peak DVC time), that the online tool allows. People get afraid when they see booking disappearing thus feel compelled to reserve (their home resort when they see resorts won't be open at 7 months to them) thus creating 0 availability at 7 months which prevents any switching from happening. I think making it impossible for you to see the availability outside of 7months+7 days for resorts you don't own at might actually be a good thing.
 
You might still be able to get something by using the wait list. Make sure you make 2 wait list requests, and choose the resorts that have the largest number of rooms available. You already have something at SSR. That leaves OKW and AKL.

I believe OKW has ONLY one class of studios = Standard View
At AKL choose Kidani. Kidani has massive numbers of Standard Studios and Savannah Studios.

By choosing the larger resorts you have more studios, and therefore more chances for someone to cancel, so you can get them on the waitlist.
 
/
...I believe OKW has ONLY one class of studios = Standard View
...
OKW has two booking categories. One is Near Hospitality House (Bldg 11, 12, 13, 14 23, 24, 25, 26). The other category is just called Villas with no other descriptor. They are all the other buildings. None are called Standard. They both require the same amount of points.
 
I'm not convinced yet that DRR will put more stress on the system, than already exists, initially

My theory on this is from the lack of symmetry of demand. More people want to book BCV and BWV at 7 months than dream of switching to OKW, and the guides selling Riviera are telling people it's not a problem to get either (or VGC or VGF...) at 7, because magic pixie dust yay. When you look at the total points at RIV, and the demand/desire of the units many of these eager new owners will want to try in their upcoming visits, I would expect them to become more challenging at 7 months, especially for the crowds of "I bought AUL/HHI/VB/SSR but never stay there!" people.
 
My theory on this is from the lack of symmetry of demand. More people want to book BCV and BWV at 7 months than dream of switching to OKW, and the guides selling Riviera are telling people it's not a problem to get either (or VGC or VGF...) at 7, because magic pixie dust yay. When you look at the total points at RIV, and the demand/desire of the units many of these eager new owners will want to try in their upcoming visits, I would expect them to become more challenging at 7 months, especially for the crowds of "I bought AUL/HHI/VB/SSR but never stay there!" people.
I get that. Though for me personally I don't think DRR is anything like those in terms of desirability. I think plenty of L14 owners will be glad to hop on to stay at DRR if they see availability which is why I don't think it will stress the system (but perhaps stress a given resort as you suggest but the system as a whole probably not, unlike the other resorts you suggest); I would actually will take a guess and say it eases the stress somewhat on Epcot resorts as DRR owners are more likely to want to switch to MK resorts thus giving MK owners more Epcot options. I do think DRR is a resort that is being sold very heavily on its own ammenities rather than the DVC Reservation Component, but I do think buyers are told they can switch just don't think that DRR isn't AUL/HHI/VB/SSR in terms of amenities when referring to WDW access.
 
I get that. Though for me personally I don't think DRR is anything like those in terms of desirability. I think plenty of L14 owners will be glad to hop on to stay at DRR if they see availability which is why I don't think it will stress the system (but perhaps stress a given resort as you suggest but the system as a whole probably not, unlike the other resorts you suggest); I would actually will take a guess and say it eases the stress somewhat on Epcot resorts as DRR owners are more likely to want to switch to MK resorts thus giving MK owners more Epcot options. I do think DRR is a resort that is being sold very heavily on its own ammenities rather than the DVC Reservation Component, but I do think buyers are told they can switch just don't think that DRR isn't AUL/HHI/VB/SSR in terms of amenities when referring to WDW access.

I've definitely already seen people Elsewhere talking about hwo they were offered Riviera or Aulani but really want to stay at $RESORT_NAME but their Guide says it's no problem, and RIV is so muc cheapr (direct) than $RESORT_NAME and longer contract. The usual. :rolleyes2 As ever, hard to tell what the bias of people buying because it's what's offered vs. buying where they want to stay is.
 
RIV will certainly have some impact. It'll be hard to ascertain until it's open and more contracts are sold, but anything with easy park access will inevitably be popular. While the monorail is nostalgic and convenient in many ways, I suspect the skyliner gondolas will be much quicker and more efficient. There's the inevitable fear of the unknown, but that will pass once people get used to them. And compared to waiting for buses or monorails, people will quickly come to love them and they will be a sought-after amenity in the near future, which will push up the popularity of resorts connected to it and further drive RIV sales.
 
I've definitely already seen people Elsewhere talking about hwo they were offered Riviera or Aulani but really want to stay at $RESORT_NAME but their Guide says it's no problem, and RIV is so muc cheapr (direct) than $RESORT_NAME and longer contract. The usual. :rolleyes2 As ever, hard to tell what the bias of people buying because it's what's offered vs. buying where they want to stay is.
That is the crux of the problem now, DVC is simply getting very large at WDW. But my main point is DRR should be a desirable location to switch into for other resort owners (along with DVC relying less on the DVC Reservation Component, say compared to when SSR was the active sold resort) so should ease up some on BCV/BWV 7 month window. Also DRR isn't the cheapest resort if you as a direct buyer really never intend on staying there so I think some buyer do intend to stay at DRR. Though I agree it is hard to tell any true demographics of a direct purchaser (even resale for that matter) because such a small sample set of the actual buyers is available on social media.

Overall DRR should be easy access to two parks thus making it desirable so any openings there will be gladly taken by those that hoped to switch into BCV/BWV I would guess. As of right now as soon as 7 months hit people are jumping onto DRR for stays.
 
OKW has two booking categories. One is Near Hospitality House (Bldg 11, 12, 13, 14 23, 24, 25, 26). The other category is just called Villas with no other descriptor. They are all the other buildings. None are called Standard. They both require the same amount of points.
Thank you.

So, can you Waitlist both categories at once, or do you need to do it separately?
 
That is the crux of the problem now, DVC is simply getting very large at WDW. But my main point is DRR should be a desirable location to switch into for other resort owners (along with DVC relying less on the DVC Reservation Component, say compared to when SSR was the active sold resort) so should ease up some on BCV/BWV 7 month window. Also DRR isn't the cheapest resort if you as a direct buyer really never intend on staying there so I think some buyer do intend to stay at DRR. Though I agree it is hard to tell any true demographics of a direct purchaser (even resale for that matter) because such a small sample set of the actual buyers is available on social media.

Overall DRR should be easy access to two parks thus making it desirable so any openings there will be gladly taken by those that hoped to switch into BCV/BWV I would guess. As of right now as soon as 7 months hit people are jumping onto DRR for stays.

This is the main reason DW and I are interested in staying there. We'll shoot for BWV/BCV villas at the 7 mo mark but will gladly default to DRR to see what it's about.
 
Thank you.

So, can you Waitlist both categories at once, or do you need to do it separately?
Separate waitlists because, even though they require the same number of points, they are different booking categories. The same is true for BWV boardwalk view and p/g view.
 
Thank you.

So, can you Waitlist both categories at once, or do you need to do it separately?

Like all booking categories each one is it's own waitlist. At least there's only 2 so you can waitlist them both. It's a little silly at some resorts you cannot for example just choose to waitlist "studio". At AKV if you just want to stay there in a studio you'd have to be able to set up 6 waitlists in order to cover them all! And if what you'd like is to just get in their and would take either a studio or a 1BR? Instead you have to make your best guess at the type of room that someone else is going to release. And spend time stalking for the other views if all you really want is a room.
 
As of right now as soon as 7 months hit people are jumping onto DRR for stays.

As of right now, it's new and novel. Same thing was not atypical with CCV or Poly at inception. How long that lasts is the question mark.
 
I am going to repost something I just put on another thread (is that acceptable?)

Disney is responsible for the difficulties of decreased availability at 7 months.

1. The online program makes it very easy for people to book and use their points. And they do. This is actually a good thing.

2. The program makes it easier for people to rent out their points when they aren't going to use them. This means that points get used and take up reservations, instead of expiring. However, another part of this is that Disney has made it very attractive to rent points out by raising the prices of rooms so very high. So, more points get used. If you have 50 points you are going to lose, but points only rent for $5 each then you stand to lose maybe $250. Not nice, but not a really big deal. But if points are going for $20 a point (and I have rented a lot of points at $20 a point) then your 50 points becomes $1000. That is much more significant!!!

3. Disney did establish a program in DVC that has some intrinsic value. Unlike most timeshares, where point value gradually goes to zero, the DVC points retain value, as long as they can be used to stay at the very expensive resorts that Disney has created by raising their prices. This makes it worthwhile for people to SELL their points on the RESALE market when they get tired of them, or too old for them, or their circumstances change. So, points that used to sit around doing nothing, now go into the hands of people (the resale buyers) who are more likely to use them.

4. HHI and Vero Beach owners who bought resale. This is a special sub category of resale buyers, not just because they bought contracts, and kept them active, but also because they are especially likely to shift from their Home Resort to use them at Disney World. The original owners of HHI and VB were likely to have purchased those locations because they LIKED those locations. But as the population has aged and changed and new resale buyers have come in, a very very large part of those resale buyers bought VB and HHI, with no intention to ever stay there, but because they were cheap, and it gave them an inexpensive way to stay at Disney World. This puts more pressure on the rest of the system.

5. Disney made a BIG mistake by building Aulani. I don't care how much Disney tries to put a rosy face on it and cherry pick their statistics to deny that Aulani people are actually staying at Disney world - the Aulani owners actually ARE staying at Disney World. Why? Because it costs less to fly to Orlando from EVERYWHERE in the continental United States (even the west coast), than to fly to Hawaii. Besides, Disney World is a whole lot more fun and interesting than Aulani. Just the fact that Aulani is still only about half sold out, AFTER ALL THESE YEARS, shows that people don't want to stay there. And the people who don't want to stay there includes the people who actually bought it. (I'm not talking about EVERYONE, but a significant percentage.) Disney should have known better.

6. Disney has sold too many small contracts. Contracts that only have enough points to stay in studios. So all the studios book up, and this then causes a cascade effect, forcing other people, who formerly stayed in studios, to use up their points by staying in other rooms, 1 bedroom and 2 bedroom units. These units were also more available in the past because the people using them formerly spent their points on studios.

7. Disney came up with the genius idea to designate certain units, Polynesian Bungalows in particular, but also others such as Copper Creek cabins, as "very high point reservoir units." In other words, make bungalows and cabins in order to create a lot of (inexpensive to build) points that Disney could sell. And they knew, or should have known that people would not choose to use their points so wastefully, on the Bungalows. Even better for Disney, they can now rent those out. Meanwhile the points that ARE NOT USED to stay in the bungalows go into the general pool and soak up other reservations at other places.

8. Because it is getting harder to book, people ARE planning their vacations farther out, both in the 11 month window and in the 7 month window. They know that to get what they want, they MUST plan ahead, or they are likely to find themselves with poor options. This takes inventory out of the pool, earlier, and makes it nearly impossible to plan late notice vacations.

Am I missing any other major factors?


The fact is, even if people are only using 10% more of their points than they did in the past, this is enough to tip the balance and make it hard to get reservations with short notice. And, when you add up the points that formerly went unused, and the points being used because they are 'rentable,' and the points that are being switched to standard DVC units instead of being used on Bungalows, Aulani, HHI and VB, you will find a far greater increase in the number of people competing for the same reservations.
Probably the BEST DVC post I have ever seen. THANK YOU.

PS - booked NOV 2019, our home Resort (BRV) at 11 months. Booked APR 2020, our home Resort (BRV) at 11 months.
December? BOOKING , our home Resort (BRV) at 11 months for NOV 2020.

Buy where you want to stay, book at 11 months :).
 
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