How's the partial federal government shutdown affecting you?

[kdonnel]

Wow the drama is high on this one.
We've got it all, the cold and heartless who believe they are morally superior because they believe in personal responsibility and the sanctimonious high horse riders who disagree with them.

I must be doing a really poor job of presenting my beliefs or many in this thread can't separate the people from the situation. It is like everyone is just screaming, think of the federal workers, think of the federal workers, like they are children that need to be cared for.

Long ago in this thread I talked about how it was a shame the federal employees were being used in a political war that neither side would win.

If it makes me morally superior because I believe most of the federal employees could have better prepared themselves for the shutdown, so be it.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

Well then, I guess my friend lied when she posted that on her social media account, complete with photo. Miraculous what you can do with photoshop.

I didn't say she lied You posted the comment, I'm just trying to get the information regarding it for my own reading and curiosity.

I just said I can't find anything to denote that the shutdown is impacting security procedures at Customs. With all that's going on I was thinking it would be somewhere. I mean it would be just another push to get the government opened as soon as possible and would further anger more and more people if we knew no one was being checked at all and CBP was suspending their normal procedures to instead be lax on it (especially given the reason for the shutdown).

You even said in your comments to look at the the CBP website which I did but it doesn't appear to be out of the norm really. On 1/1 a total of 11people that hour with the 144 u.s and 145 non-u.s. max waited 120min+. That likely means the 11people they were pulled into secondary for further review combined with whatever wait they had in line. There was even a wait time at 198mins for non-u.s. with 193mins for u.s. but the average was 34mins and 18mins respectively (they also had more booths open). For the 198 and 193 numbers a total of 45people waited 120min+ total.

It didn't tell me that they just let everyone through with zero checking because the lines were just so long they gave up. Your comment was "My friend returned from an overseas trip and the customs line was so long they just gave up and let everyone through without screening." Ok..was I not supposed to be like "omg where and when did that happen and where can I read up on that"? I'm by nature a curious person so yeah I wanted to read up on it. I'm not saying it didn't happen I just don't have anything myself to read up on it and the data I can look up points me to nowhere in terms of coming to that conclusion. I'd like to read up on it though. Several people however have already chimed in that it's not abnormal to get through customs quickly.

 

[slpeters]

I must be doing a really poor job of presenting my beliefs or many in this thread can't separate the people from the situation. It is like everyone is just screaming, think of the federal workers, think of the federal workers, like they are children that need to be cared for.

Long ago in this thread I talked about how it was a shame the federal employees were being used in a political war that neither side would win.

If it makes me morally superior because I believe most of the federal employees could have better prepared themselves for the shutdown, so be it.

When I think about this whole issue it puts me in mind of years ago when I used to work in branch banking. I remember people would come in with a variety of issues and the one that always blew my mind was the ones whose paychecks had bounced. Actually this generally happened to poorer customers and so it usually wasn't actually that the check had bounced but just that it was uncashable. I remember the first time it happened really taking a moment to wrap my mind around that--you go to work everyday and then you just don't get paid or maybe you do but after you jump through hoops you didn't know were there or after a few extra days or weeks, but still it's not what you signed up for. I remember thinking how shady or just irresponsible these employers were. I mean I dedicate a lot to my employer--a good portion of my waking time and energy, sometimes I worry about it when I'm not there, I schedule my vacations and the like around the needs of the business, it even affects where I would be able to live to some degree. My employer is a pretty major partner in my life and in exchange I get stability, reliability and the ability to fund the lifestyle I have. I remember thinking how terrible it was that someone would take all that from their employees and then just not live up to their part of the bargain. And I can't help feeling like people are about to have that experience and in some small way I'm their employer; I'm the sleaze ball who took and took and then just didn't come through.

 

[cabanafrau]

Sooner or later people find themselves vulnerable in a situation for whatever reason. Life has a way of dealing everybody hard knocks. A very smart person once told me climbing up on the high horse was simply playing Humpty Dumpty odds.

 

[pezgirlroy]

One thing to keep in mind it isn't just the federal employees. There are many employees that are contractors that work for the federal government. These include janitors, environmental services, and other jobs of that nature. There truly are people who are living paycheck to paycheck that are being affected by this.

 

[DopeyDame]

I must be doing a really poor job of presenting my beliefs or many in this thread can't separate the people from the situation. It is like everyone is just screaming, think of the federal workers, think of the federal workers, like they are children that need to be cared for.

Long ago in this thread I talked about how it was a shame the federal employees were being used in a political war that neither side would win.

If it makes me morally superior because I believe most of the federal employees could have better prepared themselves for the shutdown, so be it.

OK, I wasn't going to reply to this line of discussion, since the thread had mercifully moved on to cute TSA dogs, but since you bring it back up...

There are some real concerns people I actually know are dealing with right now. I think all of them (and me) were responsible and as prepared as one needs to be for life's ups and downs.
All of them are typical suburban professionals. If the shut down ends in the next few weeks, it will just be a blip in their life without any significant impact. However... their boss (ie, the President of the United States, who is the boss of the employees of the executive branch) has told them that their next paycheck will be at some indeterminate time in the future. Certainly months isn't out of the question. That causes some stress.

So while my friends (and me!) aren't worried about paying the mortgage and feeding our kids, here are some things we are worried about:
How do you fill out the FAFSA for your college-age kids, given the uncertainty? Just assume everything will be fine by the time the first tuition bill is due? Do you even mention it to the kids, because they're in college and you want them focused on school?

How long can you go before you need to furlough your nanny, who you obviously don't need while you're home, but you love and don't want to lose? Will the nanny quit because she's not stupid and knows there's uncertainty?

Do you move to the private sector where you can make at least twice what you're making as a civil servant?

Do I book that dream summer vacation that we've been saving for or will we need those savings?

Should we book summer camps now to get the early bird discounts, or will dad still be home over the summer?

Of course all of these things are absolutely the definition of "first world problems" and pale in comparison to hourly employees who are struggling to make rent, or to the mom and pop restaurants who don't have their lunch crowds. But it doesn't make the situation fair or acceptable or remove the stress we feel. And these are truly the people who are *least* impacted. It only gets far, far, far worse from here.
It's not unreasonable for the million+ people effected by the shutdown to be pissed about it and to let the taxpayers (the one who normally pays their paycheck!) know. And having you focus on how people should have been better prepared, or hearing others say that we don't do anything important anyway, is a bit of a bitter pill to swallow when I'm already putting away my travel guides.

I'm reminded of Col. Jessup in A Few Good Men:
"I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain myself to a man who rises and sleeps under the blanket of the very freedom that I provide and then questions the manner in which I provide it.
I would rather that you just said "thank you" and went on your way."

But to be clear... I've never ordered a Code Red...

 

[wgeo]

If it makes me morally superior because I believe most of the federal employees could have better prepared themselves for the shutdown, so be it.

I was just wondering what you base this on? Is it just a gut feeling you have? Or do you have numbers that show XX% of federal workers only have enough money saved for 1 week and XX% have enough saved for 10 weeks? I'm not trying to be a jerk, I'm actually wondering if there are any facts that have been presented anywhere that state how exactly the 800000 federal workers affected are/are not prepared?

 

[smiths02]

OK, I wasn't going to reply to this line of discussion, since the thread had mercifully moved on to cute TSA dogs, but since you bring it back up...

There are some real concerns people I actually know are dealing with right now. I think all of them (and me) were responsible and as prepared as one needs to be for life's ups and downs.
All of them are typical suburban professionals. If the shut down ends in the next few weeks, it will just be a blip in their life without any significant impact. However... their boss (ie, the President of the United States, who is the boss of the employees of the executive branch) has told them that their next paycheck will be at some indeterminate time in the future. Certainly months isn't out of the question. That causes some stress.

So while my friends (and me!) aren't worried about paying the mortgage and feeding our kids, here are some things we are worried about:
How do you fill out the FAFSA for your college-age kids, given the uncertainty? Just assume everything will be fine by the time the first tuition bill is due? Do you even mention it to the kids, because they're in college and you want them focused on school?

How long can you go before you need to furlough your nanny, who you obviously don't need while you're home, but you love and don't want to lose? Will the nanny quit because she's not stupid and knows there's uncertainty?

Do you move to the private sector where you can make at least twice what you're making as a civil servant?

Do I book that dream summer vacation that we've been saving for or will we need those savings?

Should we book summer camps now to get the early bird discounts, or will dad still be home over the summer?

Of course all of these things are absolutely the definition of "first world problems" and pale in comparison to hourly employees who are struggling to make rent, or to the mom and pop restaurants who don't have their lunch crowds. But it doesn't make the situation fair or acceptable or remove the stress we feel. And these are truly the people who are *least* impacted. It only gets far, far, far worse from here.
It's not unreasonable for the million+ people effected by the shutdown to be pissed about it and to let the taxpayers (the one who normally pays their paycheck!) know. And having you focus on how people should have been better prepared, or hearing others say that we don't do anything important anyway, is a bit of a bitter pill to swallow when I'm already putting away my travel guides.

I'm reminded of Col. Jessup in A Few Good Men:
"I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain myself to a man who rises and sleeps under the blanket of the very freedom that I provide and then questions the manner in which I provide it.
I would rather that you just said "thank you" and went on your way."

But to be clear... I've never ordered a Code Red...

The uncertainty is even harder to bear for the ones REQUIRED to go to work. We can't stop paying daycare because we are both working. We HAVE to think about cancelling vacations because DH is not allowed to take his hard earned vacation days (even if we have the money). DH is working (and not allowed a second job) so when is he supposed to look for another job and decide when?

Our house will not be lost, we will still eat and have electricity. We are prepared, but it stinks nonetheless.

 

[lifesavacation]

We are all pawns to some extent. If you're in a demographic that isn't negatively affected today, you will be at some point.

 

[kdonnel]

I was just wondering what you base this on? Is it just a gut feeling you have? Or do you have numbers that show XX% of federal workers only have enough money saved for 1 week and XX% have enough saved for 10 weeks? I'm not trying to be a jerk, I'm actually wondering if there are any facts that have been presented anywhere that state how exactly the 800000 federal workers affected are/are not prepared?

https://www.cnbc.com/2017/08/24/most-americans-live-paycheck-to-paycheck.html

As long as statistics play out close the 3/4 of federal works live pay check to paycheck.

Yes they could have better prepared.

 

[Searc]

One thing to keep in mind it isn't just the federal employees. There are many employees that are contractors that work for the federal government. These include janitors, environmental services, and other jobs of that nature. There truly are people who are living paycheck to paycheck that are being affected by this.

Most of those contracted employees won't receive back pay, either.

 

[kdonnel]

OK, I wasn't going to reply to this line of discussion, since the thread had mercifully moved on to cute TSA dogs, but since you bring it back up...

There are some real concerns people I actually know are dealing with right now. I think all of them (and me) were responsible and as prepared as one needs to be for life's ups and downs.
All of them are typical suburban professionals. If the shut down ends in the next few weeks, it will just be a blip in their life without any significant impact. However... their boss (ie, the President of the United States, who is the boss of the employees of the executive branch) has told them that their next paycheck will be at some indeterminate time in the future. Certainly months isn't out of the question. That causes some stress.

So while my friends (and me!) aren't worried about paying the mortgage and feeding our kids, here are some things we are worried about:
How do you fill out the FAFSA for your college-age kids, given the uncertainty? Just assume everything will be fine by the time the first tuition bill is due? Do you even mention it to the kids, because they're in college and you want them focused on school?

How long can you go before you need to furlough your nanny, who you obviously don't need while you're home, but you love and don't want to lose? Will the nanny quit because she's not stupid and knows there's uncertainty?

Do you move to the private sector where you can make at least twice what you're making as a civil servant?

Do I book that dream summer vacation that we've been saving for or will we need those savings?

Should we book summer camps now to get the early bird discounts, or will dad still be home over the summer?

Of course all of these things are absolutely the definition of "first world problems" and pale in comparison to hourly employees who are struggling to make rent, or to the mom and pop restaurants who don't have their lunch crowds. But it doesn't make the situation fair or acceptable or remove the stress we feel. And these are truly the people who are *least* impacted. It only gets far, far, far worse from here.
It's not unreasonable for the million+ people effected by the shutdown to be pissed about it and to let the taxpayers (the one who normally pays their paycheck!) know. And having you focus on how people should have been better prepared, or hearing others say that we don't do anything important anyway, is a bit of a bitter pill to swallow when I'm already putting away my travel guides.

I'm reminded of Col. Jessup in A Few Good Men:
"I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain myself to a man who rises and sleeps under the blanket of the very freedom that I provide and then questions the manner in which I provide it.
I would rather that you just said "thank you" and went on your way."

But to be clear... I've never ordered a Code Red...

Again I have never said that there won't be real problems as the shutdown lingers on.

Just because I pointed out that with some preparation, many could have been better prepared doesn't mean I don't understand the effects as this lingers.

 

[DopeyDame]

The uncertainty is even harder to bear for the ones REQUIRED to go to work. We can't stop paying daycare because we are both working. We HAVE to think about cancelling vacations because DH is not allowed to take his hard earned vacation days (even if we have the money). DH is working (and not allowed a second job) so when is he supposed to look for another job and decide when?

Our house will not be lost, we will still eat and have electricity. We are prepared, but it stinks nonetheless.

Absolutely! I was just thinking of daycare issues earlier today. And gas to and from work all the time, and (depending on the job) work clothes, food, etc.

 

[luvsJack]

https://www.cnbc.com/2017/08/24/most-americans-live-paycheck-to-paycheck.html

As long as statistics play out close the 3/4 of federal works live pay check to paycheck.

Yes they could have better prepared.

Have you even bothered to read that article you keep spouting about?

It doesn't say, not even once, that these people are living above their means or wasting money or any of the things you are accusing people of. It says that inflation has continued to grow but paychecks do not. Heck it doesn't even say how much those paychecks are, how many of those people are living in high cost of living areas, nothing.

You are making assumptions based on your biased views.

Are there some workers that could have been better prepared? Absolutely. Are there many who ARE prepared? Yes. Are there some that do not have enough income TO prepare? Yes and that is the group of people that you fail to have any thought toward because it doesn't fit what you want to see.

 

[luvsJack]

DD got some good news today!! She will be heading back to work soon! One of her supervisors has resigned so he will be leaving this week. One of the other women in her office has applied for his job and is likely to get it, that leaves a spot in the office and will allow dd to go back to work!! But, additionally, the office "lead" will be applying for the other woman's job and she wants dd to apply for her position! So she could even get a promotion out of it!! And if that all falls into place the single mom will get to come back too! (DD actually even offered to let the single mom go back a head of her but they said no, policy wouldn't allow it. Even though she wouldn't do it, dd could in theory sue them for taking someone with less seniority back before her)

 

[barkley]

One thing to keep in mind it isn't just the federal employees. There are many employees that are contractors that work for the federal government. These include janitors, environmental services, and other jobs of that nature. There truly are people who are living paycheck to paycheck that are being affected by this.

i am always amazed by how many people i know who don't consider that they will be affected by this kind of shutdown b/c 'i don't work for the government' when in reality their jobs are in whole or part either directly funded or supported by government funds. plenty of private day cares have large populations of kids whose parents get fed daycare assistance (or county or state which in whole or part starts w/fed funds), service providers (landscaping, pest, hvac, maintenance....) w/local contracts at agencies/organizations that get fed funding, medical staff at offices, clinics and hospitals highly reliant on medicaid/medicare reimbursements, laundering/office supply businesses and food industry workers/transporters who provide supplies to schools/workplaces...the list goes on and on. it all trickles down, when one part has to shut down or drastically cut back it will ultimately impact others they utilize. more immediately the staff initially impacted will cutback on what spending they can which results in even more businesses/people feeling the pinch.

it will be interesting to see what the post holiday retail spending stats look like-i think some may be holding on to those holiday gift cards to cover more basic needs as this shutdown continues on.

 

[pezgirlroy]

i am always amazed by how many people i know who don't consider that they will be affected by this kind of shutdown b/c 'i don't work for the government' when in reality their jobs are in whole or part either directly funded or supported by government funds. plenty of private day cares have large populations of kids whose parents get fed daycare assistance (or county or state which in whole or part starts w/fed funds), service providers (landscaping, pest, hvac, maintenance....) w/local contracts at agencies/organizations that get fed funding, medical staff at offices, clinics and hospitals highly reliant on medicaid/medicare reimbursements, laundering/office supply businesses and food industry workers/transporters who provide supplies to schools/workplaces...the list goes on and on. it all trickles down, when one part has to shut down or drastically cut back it will ultimately impact others they utilize. more immediately the staff initially impacted will cutback on what spending they can which results in even more businesses/people feeling the pinch.

it will be interesting to see what the post holiday retail spending stats look like-i think some may be holding on to those holiday gift cards to cover more basic needs as this shutdown continues on.

This affects so much more than people realize. I have multiple friends who are affected right now and they are not technically federal employees.

 

[kdonnel]

Have you even bothered to read that article you keep spouting about?

It doesn't say, not even once, that these people are living above their means or wasting money or any of the things you are accusing people of. It says that inflation has continued to grow but paychecks do not. Heck it doesn't even say how much those paychecks are, how many of those people are living in high cost of living areas, nothing.

You are making assumptions based on your biased views.

Are there some workers that could have been better prepared? Absolutely. Are there many who ARE prepared? Yes. Are there some that do not have enough income TO prepare? Yes and that is the group of people that you fail to have any thought toward because it doesn't fit what you want to see.

You need to read some more articles about how poorly Americans as a whole manage their money.

Here is another.

https://www.cnbc.com/2018/03/15/bankrate-65-percent-of-americans-save-little-or-nothing.html

39% report they can't save because of expenses, another 16% because they just haven't got around to doing it, and 13% because of debt(I would theorize that the expenses in the first 39% led to this 13% in most cases).

Only 16% say it is because their job isn't good enough, i.e. they don't make enough.

 

[dreamer17555]

My mother is a fed furloughed employee. She has some savings (as do I) but it's going to take all of that savings if this lingers on. She was prepared for a month-long furlough (assuming retroactive pay to rebuild her savings) but not longer. She is scared. She hears months and months and even years and she rightfully worried.

She (and my family) are cutting back on everything. My daughter turns 17 at the end of January. There will be no going out to celebrate like normal unless it is resolved with backpay by then. My DD understands that but I hate that we have to lose our traditions because of this. In the meantime, I am debating if I should pull her brother from an after-school YMCA program. Its only $200 a month but right now my mom can help watch him and every penny will be important if this lingers for months. On the flip side, my son is autistic and this is the first time he has enjoyed interacting with peers. He has kids to play with for the first time ever in his life, he has a routine that works for him, and his social skills are improving. He does not adjust well to back and forth so it is not as simple as cancel and then go back later for him.

Simply put none of this is fair. Compassion and empathy are not hard to come by. I feel it for those impacted by natural disasters or any numerous events, I do not need to judge if they should have been more prepared. But for the grace of God go I...

 

[DopeyDame]

One of my heros and inspirations, Nancy Grace Roman, died on 12/25. Because of the government shutdown, NASA's PR office wasn't around to give her the shout-out and send-off she deserves.

So here's my best effort to help them:

Nancy Grace Roman was the Mother of Hubble Space Telescope and the first NASA Chief of Astronomy. She broke countless barriers for women in science. I have no doubt that my life would be different now if not for her brilliance and courage and perseverance.

I'd encourage you all to read a little more about her: https://www.npr.org/2018/12/30/680994535/nancy-grace-roman-mother-of-hubble-space-telescope-has-died