How much is the lack of AP sales affecting DVC?

[RivShore]

So let me reset the discussion. Most of you seem to be taking the tack of how this affects DVC sales. That wasn't exactly what I was going after, I was wanting to see how it affects DVC, as in how does it affect the membership and usage patterns (I may not have made this very clear in the original post...)

Maybe you should set up a poll that asks exactly what your after.

 

[jo-jo]

A poster mentioned about dvc members outside of US, well some of those may not get an AP but do get a chance to buy a very discounted ticket as mentioned in another thread. Something like a 14 day ticket for the price of 7 and free MB, etc.

 

[jpwilsoninc]

So, I've had a lively discussion with folks over on the Parks board about APs. I personally think that it is a big factor in what is going on in the DVC market currently. Folks over there think that it isn't. I know that it's been discussed here on the DVC boards, but as members, how has it affected you? I know that we, without APs, now have WAY too many points for what we need. I don't think many of the people over there understood how many DVC members had APs, not just to go multiple times a year, but I knew many people that got them just to get 2 trips out of them over different years (early July one year, late June the next). Am I wrong on this?

There is currently more than enough worldwide demand for disney parks and resorts where Disney doesn’t NEED DVC owners to keep the parks and resorts flowing with cash. When demand slows….they gonna want us all to buy APs and get us in the parks spending $$$$

 

[gavvy]

They want us, but on their terms, suppose it depends how annoyed people get with them before they suddenly need us again when things slow down....if things slow down.

 

[bwang123]

i think it has minimal impact and it's more economic factors as many have mentioned.

when we bought DVC, we never even considered buying an AP. When they offered some deep discounts many years ago, we did make more trips than usual. We haven't had one in many years and never have problems using our points.

 

[tidefan]

i think it has minimal impact and it's more economic factors as many have mentioned.

when we bought DVC, we never even considered buying an AP. When they offered some deep discounts many years ago, we did make more trips than usual. We haven't had one in many years and never have problems using our points.

So you don't think that it's impacted travel patterns? Our trip patterns have drastically changed over the past 3 years (as I've documented before). Many of our other friends that used to go many times a year now just go once, but use up points on 2 or 3 bedrooms or splurging on something like a CCV Cabin. While that is great for a trip or two, I'm not sure that people want to do that on a long term basis and if AP sales don't come back, a number of at least our DVC friends around here will be looking to reduce their membership (as an aside, I think this is part of the reason you are seeming more contracts out there on resale sites - not the only one, but I think it is a factor).

 

[bwang123]

So you don't think that it's impacted travel patterns?

i am sure it has but for a small percentage of owners. if disney thought it had that much of an impact, they could have easily brought back APs. They have the data.

 

[tidefan]

i am sure it has but for a small percentage of owners. if disney thought it had that much of an impact, they could have easily brought back APs. They have the data.

I don't think Disney cares if you use your points for 3/4 studio stays or 1 week in a cabin. Same-ish amount of points used.

We may be talking about 2 different things. I am talking about how members are using points, not about how this affects Disney on the sales side of things.

 

[HIRyeDVC]

So you don't think that it's impacted travel patterns? Our trip patterns have drastically changed over the past 3 years (as I've documented before). Many of our other friends that used to go many times a year now just go once, but use up points on 2 or 3 bedrooms or splurging on something like a CCV Cabin. While that is great for a trip or two, I'm not sure that people want to do that on a long term basis and if AP sales don't come back, a number of at least our DVC friends around here will be looking to reduce their membership (as an aside, I think this is part of the reason you are seeming more contracts out there on resale sites - not the only one, but I think it is a factor).

I think we all see what we want to see. I’m not saying what you’re saying is not true. But there are so many variables to what’s happening with the parks, crowds, hotel discounts, dvc resale glut, can be attributed to everything that’s been mentioned and more. I agree that the lack of APs could be linked to people shifting their travel patterns. If I used to have an AP and no longer have one, I probably would change my travel pattern and go fewer times but stay longer. Everyone’s situations are different. It’s hard to pin point a certain narrative to explain all that is happening in this dynamic environment

 

[tidefan]

I think we all see what we want to see. I’m not saying what you’re saying is not true. But there are so many variables to what’s happening with the parks, crowds, hotel discounts, dvc resale glut, can be attributed to everything that’s been mentioned and more. I agree that the lack of APs could be linked to people shifting their travel patterns. If I used to have an AP and no longer have one, I probably would change my travel pattern and go fewer times but stay longer. Everyone’s situations are different. It’s hard to pin point a certain narrative to explain all that is happening in this dynamic environment

Definitely agree that there are other factors, but I do think it is one of them. Just as a personal anecdote, this will be our 3rd straight year getting a 2 Bedroom at Aulani, which is how we've shifted our point use. We have been going in the June timeframe when points are cheaper. This was the first year that I had to walk the reservation. Never, ever had to do that before. Maybe that reflects just demand to Hawaii after reopening, but I also think it's DVC members using points away from the parks to a degree.

 

[HIRyeDVC]

Definitely agree that there are other factors, but I do think it is one of them. Just as a personal anecdote, this will be our 3rd straight year getting a 2 Bedroom at Aulani, which is how we've shifted our point use. We have been going in the June timeframe when points are cheaper. This was the first year that I had to walk the reservation. Never, ever had to do that before. Maybe that reflects just demand to Hawaii after reopening, but I also think it's DVC members using points away from the parks to a degree.

Alabama and Hawaii are closely connected. We too love Aulani, 2BRs, in June. But our real love is DLR and WDW.

 

[RivShore]

Definitely agree that there are other factors, but I do think it is one of them. Just as a personal anecdote, this will be our 3rd straight year getting a 2 Bedroom at Aulani, which is how we've shifted our point use. We have been going in the June timeframe when points are cheaper. This was the first year that I had to walk the reservation. Never, ever had to do that before. Maybe that reflects just demand to Hawaii after reopening, but I also think it's DVC members using points away from the parks to a degree.

And as others have pointed out...this is just one data point.

I think the first question you need answered is - how many DVCers had APs pre-covid and now don't have them; how many never had them (or haven't for many years); and how many have had them all along.

If the first option is a small percentage, then the discussion is closed IMHO.

 

[tidefan]

Alabama and Hawaii are closely connected. We too love Aulani, 2BRs, in June. But our real love is DLR and WDW

Southwest Airlines was a game changer on that for us...

And as others have pointed out...this is just one data point.

I think the first question you need answered is - how many DVCers had APs pre-covid and now don't have them; how many never had them (or haven't for many years); and how many have had them all along.

If the first option is a small percentage, then the discussion is closed IMHO.

Hence the "personal anecdote" comment in my post.

Not sure what your issue is but almost every DVC owner we knew personally had APs. Yes, that is a small sample size, and more importantly, it is probably a regional thing. But your blanket assertion that not many DVC members carried APs is a large jump to make, I think.

 

[Jayunit09]

We mainly bought direct last year to have access to future resorts and wanted the points right away for a trip. Sorcerer AP access was something we thought maybe we would use in retirement, but not an issue at the moment. We are a young family from NH who bought with plans to go every other year (I am sure that will fluctuate as time goes on, but at the moment it does not really affect us.

From a personal perspective, although I know DVC has nothing to do with active sales of AP being allowed, I do think someone with a real estate interest on Disney property should have access to some form of an annual pass, even if the pass only worked while staying on property with points.

 

[tidefan]

We mainly bought direct last year to have access to future resorts and wanted the points right away for a trip. Sorcerer AP access was something we thought maybe we would use in retirement, but not an issue at the moment. We are a young family from NH who bought with plans to go every other year (I am sure that will fluctuate as time goes on, but at the moment it does not really affect us.

From a personal perspective, although I know DVC has nothing to do with active sales of AP being allowed, I do think someone with a real estate interest on Disney property should have access to some form of an annual pass, even if the pass only worked while staying on property with points.

I'm pretty sure that DVC would love to have AP's for members. However, those aren't controlled by DVC, but rather by DPEP who probably has a whole other set of criteria they are working by which probably isn't the same as DVC. As others have mentioned, this is probably set on a higher level to coordinate across different Disney divisions.

 

[RivShore]

Southwest Airlines was a game changer on that for us...

Hence the "personal anecdote" comment in my post.

Not sure what your issue is but almost every DVC owner we knew personally had APs. Yes, that is a small sample size, and more importantly, it is probably a regional thing. But your blanket assertion that not many DVC members carried APs is a large jump to make, I think.

Wow, so you claim I misinterpreted your comment while misinterpreting my comment. Sounds about right for the interwebs. LOL

I was not trying to make the jump to a conclusion of any kind. I was just asking for data that was something more than anecdotal, that is all.

 

[tidefan]

Wow, so you claim I misinterpreted your comment while misinterpreting my comment. Sounds about right for the interwebs. LOL

I was not trying to make the jump to a conclusion of any kind. I was just asking for data that was something more than anecdotal, that is all.

Then I apologize. I read your comment to come across as that no members were even buying AP's. Apologies if that wasn't your intention.

I think that the only entity that has actual data is Disney themselves. Outside of that, everything is a biased sample...

 

[Chili327]

Not sure if my situation helps, but I am new to DVC & my plan is to bank & borrow (so only going to WDW every 3 years) I'm definitely not in need of an AP. (maybe this is part of the original conversation, & not what you wanted to know. lol)
I think a lot of people like myself that don't have "plenty" of money are getting into DVC with small contracts as their main (to bank & borrow), instead of small contracts as add-ons.

 

[RivShore]

Then I apologize. I read your comment to come across as that no members were even buying AP's. Apologies if that wasn't your intention.

I think that the only entity that has actual data is Disney themselves. Outside of that, everything is a biased sample...

No problem! Maybe I will set up a poll here to at least get a bit more data. This is an interesting debate you have started!

 

[kilik64]

No problem! Maybe I will set up a poll here to at least get a bit more data. This is an interesting debate you have started!

Any poll here is gonna be greatly skewed.