How much does word of mouth affect DVC sales?

[Pennykay]

I have friends that were going to purchase on my recommendation. Since the changes, I have spoken to them because I no longer can give the glowing recommendation that I once did. They will not be buying. I really think that all of the changes in the last few months make DVC less desirable. I am also worried about the changes that may come in the future. I have also decided not to add any more points. From reading some other posts, I hear this sentiment echoed by others. I am just wondering if anyone feels that sales will be hurt by this, or if it is just affecting a small number of owners/new buyers.

 

[lisah0711]

I think that it is like anything else on the Disboards that we get an exagerated view of how much people like or dislike things because we are a vocal group. Percentage wise Disboard DVC members are a drop in the bucket. The changes may make a difference in sales or it may be the economy. If word of mouth from members really made a difference I think that you wouldn't be tripping over a kiosk everywhere you go at WDW and DL!

But for your friends, who know you, that may cinch the deal for a nonsale for them.

That's my 2 cents worth.

 

[Chuck S]

Every point based timeshare needs to be able to balance supply/demand in order for the point system to operate long term. Changing travel patterns may make changes necessary from time to time, and is allowed under the contracts. A resort sitting empty on weekends cost everyone, Disney & Members $$$$.

 

[disneynutz]

People tend to only listen to what they want to hear.

How many times do you read a thread where DISers advise someone not to buy and their next post is "we did it, we just bought BLT"?

People love Disney and Disney does a great job in the PR department. I don't think that word of mouth will have much of an impact.

 

[Pennykay]

For me, it isn't JUST about adjusting the points. It is about the multitude of changes recently. One thing may not seem like a huge deal. But the culmination of all of the changes is a big deal to me. And I don't feel that Disney has handled it well. I am a huge Disney fan, so I can honestly say it is hard to sour my on DVC, but that is exactly what has happened. I can't be the only one.

 

[bczang]

Although some of the changes may not be "perfect" DVC is still an awesome program and the properties it offers are in a class of their own.

We all bought in knowing that changes could and would be made.

I will still recommend DVC!

 

[LIFERBABE]

People tend to only listen to what they want to hear.

How many times do you read a thread where DISers advise someone not to buy and their next post is "we did it, we just bought BLT"?

People love Disney and Disney does a great job in the PR department. I don't think that word of mouth will have much of an impact.

Ever since JL took over, he has worked hard to neutralize "word of mouth" as a sales tool. DVC was built on member satisfaction, but he knew if he could market DVC like the other timeshares out there, they would not need existing members to promote their product.

How many disgruntled Westgate owners are there, or Silverleaf, etc. Yet people still buy them and they continue building resorts.

My love for DVC went away with the glassware and the mugs. Lots of people said how minor that was in the grand scheme. When someone is showing you they dont like you and they dont respect you, you need to realize it.

We are just a small group of members complaining on the internet. The ones that purchased recently are the "call and book" kind. THey dont eat, breathe and sleep DVC like many of us here. DVC could care less if they dont recommend it to friends, that's what commercials and free stuff are for.

 

[kristenrice]

I agree with the OP....

It is not so much THAT it happened, it's HOW it happened. DVC prides itself on not being like other timeshares, but their actions say otherwise. It just looks bad, the way all of this played out.

"NOTICE FROM DVC: Get your points now before the price goes up!"

No thanks, I am all set with points.

"NOTICE FROM DVC: Get your add-on now before we raise the minimum!"

No thanks, I am all set.

DEADLINE COMES.....and goes....And the points get reallocated...

Guess what? NOW you need 25-99 more points to continue taking your vacation, and NOW you can't get it without forking over MORE money for MORE points.

OK, those of us who are DVC members and read the POS knew very well that this could happen. But, what about the people who JUST bought BLT as NEW owners? I am sure that they listened to their guide (hey, this is Disney, they aren't going to mislead me, right?) and bought the number of points they would need based on the point charts and their planned vacation pattern. The guides probably told them that the points wouldn't change. "Imagine telling your friends about that sweet deal in the year 2042!" (To quote the DVC video!) Then, the chart gets changed and they are now a few points short. Maybe the guides didn't know this was coming....WHY NOT!? They are actively selling points (vacations) that upper management KNOWS will be changing. Why weren't the guides told about this?

It just reeks of sleazy underhandedness and brings to mind a "used car salesman" approach. Like management knew that the system was about to undergo a drastic overhaul, yet made sure not to announce it until it was too late for people to do anything about it. Again, this has been in the works for a while. If they KNEW that it would go into effect for 2010, why did they wait until 3 DAYS before the 2010 reservations start to unroll it? Why couldn't it have either 1) been announced earlier or 2) been postponed until 2011? It would appear that if they'd announced it earlier, people could have taken advantage of the lower prices. Or maybe adjusted their 2009 travel plans. THAT'S what comes off as "slimy". The appearance that they purposefully waited until they could charge you more money to maintain your vacation plans.

I always thought DVC was different, but I guess it was just an illusion.

Maybe DVC management has seen the POTC movies one too many times! "It's just good business"...(yup, remember what happened to him in the end)

 

[anna08]

. A resort sitting empty on weekends cost everyone, Disney & Members $$$$.

Chuck, aren't those weekend nights dispensed to the CRO population? Most of my colleagues who I have convinced to try villas for WDW trips are paying top dollar to fill those rooms on the weekends. I think the lower sun-thurs points are to keep the resort (and more importantly the parks) from being empty during the week when volumes are low.

 

[KLR-wlv]

Not just word of mouth - but the economy, the really high point requirements for VGC and most likely Hawaii -I really think DVC management thinks this is a never ending source of revenue that they can just keep upping points and prices. There is a cap. And I don't think that this - the worst economy since disney parks have existed - is the time to slap about 40% of current owner's who routinely vacation Sun-thurs. with the weekday point increases - along with $112 points. It's kind of like the cruise -I love DCL - but a europe cruise for a family of 5 being $20000?? Plus airfare.. I guess they're filling boats...I just can't see how that can continue in this economy. At some point - even people with $20000 to drop on one vacation may start to question the "Magic" surcharge.

 

[Deb & Bill]

Back in the old days, I think word of mouth was a big seller for DVC. We used to get things in the mail all the time about sharing DVC with our friends. You never saw a DVC commercial on TV. But that's changing.

Every since the person in charge went from a General Mgr for DVC to a VP for DVC there has been a different focus.

 

[oakmanner]

Word of mouth is not the primary source of advertisement, but Disney does put some value on it. If they did'nt they would'nt give $200 for referrals.

Plus, just a like resturants, word of mouth good or bad can have a significant impact. Look at Le Cellier (sp). Disney does not advertise this resturant any more than the others but try getting an ADR for dinner. It's reputation is almost all word of mouth.

As far as the point reallocation, we vacation Thursday to Thursday so it works out fine for us.

Dennis-

 

[DisFlan]

It didn't take word of mouth in this case, just DVC's actions. My sis and BIL were seriously looking to buy a WLV resale. They love the place - but they've decided not to purchase. They've been following the other recent changes in DVC, but the reassessment of points was the main item that caused them to back off. As my sis said, "How many MORE points will we need for the same 10 day stay in maybe a couple of years?"

I explained that, historically, reassessing points is a rare occurrence - but no sale. And honestly, after this week, I can't argue her point.

DisFlan

 

[littlestar]

I agree with the OP....

It is not so much THAT it happened, it's HOW it happened. DVC prides itself on not being like other timeshares, but their actions say otherwise. It just looks bad, the way all of this played out.

"NOTICE FROM DVC: Get your points now before the price goes up!"

No thanks, I am all set with points.

"NOTICE FROM DVC: Get your add-on now before we raise the minimum!"

No thanks, I am all set.

DEADLINE COMES.....and goes....And the points get reallocated...

Guess what? NOW you need 25-99 more points to continue taking your vacation, and NOW you can't get it without forking over MORE money for MORE points.

OK, those of us who are DVC members and read the POS knew very well that this could happen. But, what about the people who JUST bought BLT as NEW owners? I am sure that they listened to their guide (hey, this is Disney, they aren't going to mislead me, right?) and bought the number of points they would need based on the point charts and their planned vacation pattern. The guides probably told them that the points wouldn't change. "Imagine telling your friends about that sweet deal in the year 2042!" (To quote the DVC video!) Then, the chart gets changed and they are now a few points short. Maybe the guides didn't know this was coming....WHY NOT!? They are actively selling points (vacations) that upper management KNOWS will be changing. Why weren't the guides told about this?

It just reeks of sleazy underhandedness and brings to mind a "used car salesman" approach. Like management knew that the system was about to undergo a drastic overhaul, yet made sure not to announce it until it was too late for people to do anything about it. Again, this has been in the works for a while. If they KNEW that it would go into effect for 2010, why did they wait until 3 DAYS before the 2010 reservations start to unroll it? Why couldn't it have either 1) been announced earlier or 2) been postponed until 2011? It would appear that if they'd announced it earlier, people could have taken advantage of the lower prices. Or maybe adjusted their 2009 travel plans. THAT'S what comes off as "slimy". The appearance that they purposefully waited until they could charge you more money to maintain your vacation plans.

I always thought DVC was different, but I guess it was just an illusion.

Maybe DVC management has seen the POTC movies one too many times! "It's just good business"...(yup, remember what happened to him in the end)

Yep. You said it well. I feel sorry for the recent BLT buyers who were not shown those 2010 point changes. Especially with that new minimum on add-ons at BLT. And I am VERY glad I did not buy that small add-on at BLT I was thinking about.

My sister stayed with me at Saratoga just this last week and she loved the resort. But after she heard about all of this, she said she would be too scared to buy into it. She said if she just rents, Disney can't take advantage of her. I had actually walked over to the DVC sales center and picked up a points chart booklet for my sister to look at and she had been studying it when all of this came out and we read about the point changes on the DIS boards. She couldn't believe Disney changed BLT's point charts before it even opened and didn't inform the buyers ahead of time, especially with the restrictions on adding on that were going to be put in place - that is so not right. Whether it was just usual DVC bungling/bad communication or outright dishonesty, I don't know.

 

[DougandBeth]

I can tell you it is hurting. My two brothers were all set to buy on my recommendation! One brother was going for 300 pts and the other small resale contract and both have pulled out on my recommendation. I told them this thing os going downhill quickly. They are both going to view Sheraton and Marriott next month.

Disney hope you understand you are losing customers!

I personally will not be buying many food items on property next trip and I know it sounds childish but I do need to hurt them a little, they do it to us all the time.

 

[Disneyhappy]

I can tell you it is hurting. My two brothers were all set to buy on my recommendation! One brother was going for 300 pts and the other small resale contract and both have pulled out on my recommendation. I told them this thing os going downhill quickly. They are both going to view Sheraton and Marriott next month.

Disney hope you understand you are losing customers!

I personally will not be buying many food items on property next trip and I know it sounds childish but I do need to hurt them a little, they do it to us all the time.

In the last year, my uncle, my sister, my niece and a coworker went to WDW and took the DVC tour and asked us if we recommended buying in. We told them we have enjoyed our stays with DVC but did not like the direction it was heading with recent changes, so no, we could not recommend buying in. We told them if we had to do it over again, we would rent points and I have helped my sister and coworker rent points from other members since that time for their next vacation. Will our word of mouth have a major impact on sales? I highly doubt it as Disney/DVC is a marketing machine. If anything is going to hurt them, it is the economy right now, but they will still survive. And I hope they do because we still have an interest in DVC. We just could not recommend it. We knew full well things can and would change. We just didn't expect so many negative changes in so short a period of time. And I acknowlege that some of those changes were not perceived as negative by all members.

 

[ddave]

Would someone please tell me what ALL the recent bad changes are? I would really like to understand.

From these message boards it sounds like they don't let members vaction any more.

 

[Deb & Bill]

Would someone please tell me what ALL the recent bad changes are? I would really like to understand.

From these message boards it sounds like they don't let members vaction any more.

For example:

1. Suddenly, DVC removed all the ceramic mugs and real glasses out of the studios and replaced them with styrofoam cups. Not as environmental as Disney claims to be, but probably in response to a story on TV or in the newspaper about dirty hotel rooms and WDW was mentioned in the story. DVC offered the reason as no dishwashers in the studios.

2. A few years ago, commercial renters started taking advantage of transfers and DVC suddenly decided to enforce the one transfer in or out a year. Up to that point, members were able to transfer multiple times a year and it was stated as such in a previous POS. However POS before that one stated one in or out a year.

3. OKW members were "offered" the ability to add additional years to their contract. OKW members had to return notarized documents by a deadline if they wished to decline the offer. Rather than opt in, it was opt out. OKW members who opted in were supposed to receive a gift. Nothing was heard for months until a few members finally received information. Members who opted out were also supposed to receive something. Nothing was sent out.

4. Vacation Magic was suddenly stopped and replaced out of the blue with the Disney Files. Vacation Magic was all about DVC with one or two smaller stories about Disney. Disney Files is all about Disney with one or two smaller stories about DVC.

5. Eagles Pines was announced as a new future resort. Suddenly, SSR appeared and EP just seemed to disappear. EP property was sold to Four Seasons for a Four Seasons condominium.

6. AKV founding members were told they would have their names stitched on a tapestry that would hang in Kidani Village Lobby. Suddenly the tapestry disappeared and was replaced with an African robe. They were also supposed to get a miniature copy of the tapestry for as a perk. This tapestry was replaced with two different items for some of the founding members. Founding members were asking when for months before they finally heard about their copy of the tapestry. Some never got the copy of the tapestry.

7. Some early members who purchased into AKV and BLT did not receive Developer points with their purchase. Later purchasers did. The way to use the DP changed as did the number received.

8. DVC suddenly decided to raise the minimum number of points without much notice. It went from 150 to 160 to buy in. At BLT the minimum add-on went from 25 to 100.

Anyone else got something to add?

 

[disneynutz]

Don't forget the $95 fee, the switch to RCI, the point chart change, and the wait list change.

Not recent but on going, the crappy DVC computer system, and the DVC Member website that has limited info and is down more than it should be.

 

[dozerdog]

We are in the process of buying at BLT. The docs should be here tomorrow, but after reading this thread I am REALLY having cold feet!! We bought at DL for 160 pts, and got matching DL points to be used by 10/3 along with 2 premium passes and a $5.00 p/pt credit.
I haven't seen the 2010 point chart and NOTHING was mentioned about reallocating points at our mtg only 2 weeks ago. In fact our rep was careful to point out that the charts had only been reallocated 2x during the history of DVC.

Should I still sign on the dotted line??? Would love your opinion.