How many students in a class?

[PollyannaMom]

How big are class sizes around here? - 34 in DS's 3rd grade!

How big should they be? 22, in my opinion (as a parent and a substitute teacher).


There are things that you just can't do with huge classes, the students don't get the individual attention they should, and correcting becomes a monster that eats other things alive.

 

[bigbabyblues]

35 is way too many, IMO.

Last year (school is out here), DS9 had 8 in his 3rd grade class, and DS6 had 13 in his Kindergarten class. The public schools here have 26-28.

 

[PaulaSue]

In our town it is 18 to 20.

Ditto

 

[nuttylawprofessor]

The average class size in a CPS school is 28. The Illinois legislature has paved the way for class sizes up to 37, but CPS has said it will go no higher than 35. The schools that have a wealthier parent base have begun fundraising for next year, asking parents to donate anywhere from a few hundred to a few thousand dollars. Our local school is asking for $750 plus the $125 mandatory supply fee. If enough people respond, they're hoping to reinstate the 8 teaching positions lost in the school and hoping to avoid multi-grade classrooms. Forget about 35 2nd graders, try 35 kids in the 1st-2nd grade age range in one class. I can't even imagine being in a poor school that has no base for fundraising.

As for money spent to defend against the lawsuit, there really is no cost there. CPS has a large legal department. They're getting paid whether there is another lawsuit to defend or not.

 

[MM27]

The highest number I've ever had was 27. Now we are capped at 22 but that will probably go up next year because of cuts. I actually have 21 right now because a student moved a few weeks ago. You can really tell the difference with 1 or 2 kids more or less. I couldn't imagine 30+ kids in a class.

 

[Kelrykengab]

People start to freak out in my town (understandably so) at 26. My kids go to private school and we have never had more than 18. I can't imagine 35!

 

[pipersmom]

Enjoy the small public school classrooms while you can. This year my daughter had 16 in her class. The county has decided we need at least 24. There are only about 32 or so kids in each grade (K-6). Guess what the solution was....multi-grade classrooms! I'm reserving judgement -trying to, anyway- but if this goes the way I think it will, we'll be switching schools. Most of the teachers are unhappy about the switch, and I can't blame them..imagine teaching 2 & 3rd grade in the same room with one teacher. I hope it works out well, but I don't see it happening.

 

[monkeybug]

People start to freak out in my town (understandably so) at 26. My kids go to private school and we have never had more than 18. I can't imagine 35!

Same here! (about the people freaking out at around 26 kids)
When my daughter was in Kindergarten the class size's started out at around 28, but the school quickly added a third teacher and the class sizes settled out closer to 16. Well when that same group of kids moved to 1st grade they didn't add another teacher, so the two classes have around 28 kids. Parents freaked out! Thankfully most parents volunteered, so the teacher had a volunteer almost every day along with a college student who came three times a week.
Next year they are expecting more incoming students, but not adding another teacher. I know several parents who have organized meetings to discuss solutions. The big problem here is that up to 40% of the student body (at least according to the parent running the meeting) is coming from out of area. I guess the principle has tried to crack down on this, but parents go over her head to the school board and get permission for their kids to attend.
It's probably no coincidence that the same parents are usually also very active with the school and make large donations. I don't think it would upset me if they were bringing underprivileged kids here from other neighborhoods (they do that in another wealthy part of town), but that's not the case. These are for the most part wealthy families who just want their kids to go to a good school with out paying for expensive private schools.
I know some of the parents whose kids come from out of bounds, and they are wonderful families, but I also understand why people in this neighborhood are upset. They paid a lot to live here.
I know I was a little ticked when after searching for a house we could afford in this neighborhood we ended up with something much smaller than we would normally rent, and my old neighbor who was looking at the same time (we were both moving out of military housing) ended up on the other side of town in a house twice as big for around the same price, but their daughters still go to our neighborhood school.

 

[monkeybug]

Enjoy the small public school classrooms while you can. This year my daughter had 16 in her class. The county has decided we need at least 24. There are only about 32 or so kids in each grade (K-6). Guess what the solution was....multi-grade classrooms! I'm reserving judgement -trying to, anyway- but if this goes the way I think it will, we'll be switching schools. Most of the teachers are unhappy about the switch, and I can't blame them..imagine teaching 2 & 3rd grade in the same room with one teacher. I hope it works out well, but I don't see it happening.

Oh wow! I know that country schools used to be that way back in the day, but that seems like an outdated approach now! I never went to a multi grade school, so maybe there is some benefit I don't know of, but that seems like a bad idea!

 

[lacrosse_lady72]

Enjoy the small public school classrooms while you can. This year my daughter had 16 in her class. The county has decided we need at least 24. There are only about 32 or so kids in each grade (K-6). Guess what the solution was....multi-grade classrooms! I'm reserving judgement -trying to, anyway- but if this goes the way I think it will, we'll be switching schools. Most of the teachers are unhappy about the switch, and I can't blame them..imagine teaching 2 & 3rd grade in the same room with one teacher. I hope it works out well, but I don't see it happening.

I've been a student of a split before, 5/6, as a 5th grader. I felt smart as I was being taught what the 6th graders were at times. I don't remember my education being anything less than it should be however, I wonder if the 6th graders felt that way.

 

[ksjayhawks]

I taught at a small rural district and was the math teacher. I had 39 7th graders and 42 8th graders my first year. They abilities were very varied and I essentially ran 3 different classes in the 9th grade class and 2 in the 7th. They finally split into two groups in 9th grade, but that was still about 20 per class. They were great kids and I had very few problems with them.

Now I teach alternative ed and even 10 can be too many--such as my biology class this year. Not so much in academics but the dynamics of the class members! Yikes. I am glad summer vacation is here!

 

[golfgal]

Our early elementary, K-2, they keep at 20 or fewer, 3-5 they try to keep under 25, 6-8 they keep under 28 and high school they keep under 30. The elementary classes have various aids, etc. so the student/teacher ratio is close to 10:1. With budget cuts they are moving the high school classes up to 32-35 but trying to keep the elementary and middle schools the same. They do a lot of "tracking" in our high school so my guess is that the AP/Honors classes will see the larger classes since they tend to not be discipline problems and the regular classes will stay smaller because they have more discipline problems. Fortunately our district was very financially healthy until the governor cut funding to the schools. Our district is exploring the option of an operating levy this fall which will mean an increase in taxes, on average, of about $50/year. I don't have any doubts it will pass so we might not have to worry about class sizes.

They had a a campaign for district residents to express their opinion on what should be done and the superintendent was very hesitant to put forth a levy (we suggested that in our email and she replied that she didn't want to do that if she didn't have to) but it sounds like many, many people said they would support the tax increase to keep our wonderful schools like they are so my guess is we will have this.

 

[DeniseinNS]

The most the put in a class here is 21. 35 kids is way too many for 1 teacher.

 

[SDFgirl]

Here, the cap is at 24 for Elementary. If you have 25 or more students, the teacher can choose between extra pay and an aide.

My DH's aunt has been retired from teaching for years. But she was telling me that, her first year of teaching (long ago), she had 60 first graders, no aide, and no air conditioning!

Hmmm. Now that I think about it, maybe that's one of those "I had to walk uphill both ways in the snow" kinds of stories...

 

[luvmy3]

When our school has that many its usually because its the inclusion class (32 has been the highest) but there are two teachers and an assistant in those classrooms.
This year my dd has 25, my ds has 21 and my other ds has 18. 35 is way to many at any grade level for one teacher

 

[daughtersrus]

The teachers union is approaching this from a safety standpoint. There is a law in place that says that there must be 20sqft of space for every person in the classroom. With a class of 35 students + teacher= 720 square feet. From what I've read, not all of the classrooms are that large.

From an education point of view, how do they expect the students to learn in an environment like this? Are test scores going to be affected? What about the special ed students in the classes (up to 40% of the class can be special ed)? Are their goals going to be met? High school teachers could potentially have 210 students in the day with 84 of them being special ed students. How difficult is it going to be for the teacher to differentiate instruction and track IEP goals for that many students?

 

[agnes!]

... They do a lot of "tracking" in our high school so my guess is that the AP/Honors classes will see the larger classes since they tend to not be discipline problems and the regular classes will stay smaller because they have more discipline problems. ...

Maybe the AP/Honors kids should start acting up so maybe they'll get the smaller class-sizes too...

agnes!

 

[jodifla]

35 kids in a class is too much!

My son's classrooms have had about 20-22 kids in them. That's plenty for elementary school.

Now, I do think that growing up we often had 30 kids in a classroom. But study after study have shown that smaller classroom sizes = better education.

 

[jrmasm]

Doesn't sound like an ideal situation. What is the reasoning? Cost cutting?

 

[daughtersrus]

Doesn't sound like an ideal situation. What is the reasoning? Cost cutting?

Yes. If this goes through, somewhere between 2,500-3,000 teaching positions will be cut.