How do you make money?

[tar heel]

OP -- You're kidding yourself and showing those of us on this thread pretty dramatically how you could have gotten yourself into such a mess.

"Eating in more than not" at a WDW resort in no way equals the kind of food budget you should have every single day until you get yourself out of this mess. You don't need $50 dinners -- you need $50 weekly grocery budgets. If your friends can afford to buy plane tickets for every member of your family, are they really the kind of people who will enjoy eating what your family should be eating at a resort at Christmas time?

I'm sorry to say this, but either your DH is feeding you a line or you're feeding us one about how you could miss one house payment and have to pay $1,000 a month extra.

You need to cancel the trip and get yourself to a nonprofit financial counselor ASAP.

 

[mrsklamc]

Do you have paid time off for this vacation from ALL 3 jobs? Are your friends paying for your food (even eating in, it's going to be more expensive than at home. You don't have a car and you don't have a pantry to cook out of.) Are your friends paying to park the car at the airport?

You can't afford this trip, period. Sell the DVC NOW.

ETA: Seriously, think about this. You said your grandparents would be devastated, but you don't care enough about that to sell your DVC? You can't get the antiques back. Disney will still be there, and you will enjoy the trip more when you aren't so worried about finances. Plus, your kids are little, there is plenty of time to take them.

 

[luvsJack]

I don't own DVC but someone said taking a loss would be better than staying under the note. If they sell their DVC for less than they owe, they would still have to pay the difference; so it wouldn't get them out from under the note and isn't going to help in the short term.

Sorry, OP, I don't have a lot of advise but ; having money problems can be one of the scariest things to go through.

And, I understand it being very hard to come clean with your friends and tell them you simply can't afford the trip, no matter how cheap. It was nice of them to buy you the tickets and shows what really good friends they must be. Are the tickets refundable or will returning them, just put your friends out their money?

 

[Liberty Belle]

thanks everyone! i really do appreciate the advice - even from those few of you who came across as a bit judgmental. i probably would be thinking the same thing - how can you do a disney vacation when you are afraid of losing your home!?!?! trust me, i get it and can't truly justify it except to say the disney trip is costing us nothing but food and since we are sharing a dvc with our friends, we can eat in more often than not. (we were going to cancel it but our bff's bought our airline tickets for us because they didn't want to go without us, we have left over passes from our last trip that we will use, the kids go for free, dd will share our meals, we won't need a car rental, etc.) we already know we won't be buying any extras during the trip - it will be the cheapest disney experience we've ever had.

we are both working full time and dh actually has a 2nd part time job as well that he took on when all of this began.

we both have work issued cells - we dropped our personal cells already. we have the basic cable package no movie channels, dvr, hd or anything like that.

we stopped our trash pickup ($40/month), carwash ($26/month), we've never had lawn and snow service, etc.

i have made 2 changes to increase my paycheck by claiming 1 instead 0 on my W-4 and i used to purchase an extra week of vacation for 2% of my salary and dropped that as well. (the vacation purchase change won't take effect immediately but it's in my near future.)

i think we have 3 things that have really put us over the edge...

1. we now have our dd in daycare 2 days a week. my father used to watch her for us but can only watch 1 of the kids and the baby is easier for him and would cost more for daycare. we don't have anyone else that can/will watch her for us when we work and we have modified our schedules as much as we can to only place her 2x a week. we also use the daycare at dh's work so we get a discount there too.

2. i had to have emergency dental work that wasn't covered by our insurance and that cost us quite a bit of money that we weren't ready for. i actually haven't finished that process because we can't afford the rest of it right now - hopefully i won't end up losing my tooth.

3. thnot exactly sure how it went down but basically dh either got bad advice or (more likely) misunderstood the advice given to him by a rep at our mortgage company. ultimately he ended up "missing" a mortgage payment because he thought he was told that would make them work with him to lower our monthly rate. (makes no sense to me but i wasn't involved at this point.) when he called after the "missed" payment it was an entirely different story than he had thought and they put us onto a repayment plan that is completely beyond what we can afford - about an extra $1000 per month! if we can manage to make the payments and get this taken care of, we should be back to normal payments and a far more managable money situation come feb. we just have to get by until then.

Have you ever really, really scrimped and tried to save as much money as you can? The reason I ask this is because you say you only have to pay for food at Disney, yet list a bunch of expensive restaurants (at least more expensive than eating at home).

We've struggled financially before, and when we did (mainly because I don't work in the summer) I made breakfast for supper ($1.00 for a dozen eggs, $1.00 for bread for toast, $2.50 for orange juice), spaghetti ($1.00 for pasta, $3.00 for beef, and approx. $2.00 for sauce), etc. You could eat for a week or more on what one dinner will cost you at TS restaurants in WDW.

Why did your DH do that if you could make your mortgage payments? Did you just buy the house? And you don't even have to pay child care for all of your kids? Something is wrong here. Dental work can be expensive, but one bad tooth should not make you behind on your mortgage, especially if the treatment is not complete!

Did you buy more than you can afford? If so, maybe you should think about downsizing.

 

[famsen]

Just so you all know, selling DVC is not always a good option, especially right now in this economy. It would be like selling a house for less than you owe on it.
If you finance DVC, you can also use it for a tax deduction because it counts as mortgage interest paid.

I understand OP's money problems. We are having them too and both DH and I work full time jobs and make a substantial amount of income. But it's always the case, the more you make, the more bills you have. Everyone lives beyond their means at some point. My philosophy is, you have to enjoy life. Everyone needs family time and that may mean a trip to Disney with the family; otherwise what the hell are we working for? Just to survive and exist? The heck with that. I would rather struggle a bit to be sure I can get away and enjoy time making memories with my family. The bills will get paid.

 

[mrsklamc]

I've been on both sides, and trust me, life is waayyyy more enjoyable when you aren't worrying about how the bills are going to get paid all the time. You don't have to never go on vacation, but you do have to say "Wait a minute. This isn't right right now." Disney will be there.

 

[Allison]

Everyone lives beyond their means at some point. My philosophy is, you have to enjoy life. Everyone needs family time and that may mean a trip to Disney with the family; otherwise what the hell are we working for? Just to survive and exist? The heck with that. I would rather struggle a bit to be sure I can get away and enjoy time making memories with my family. The bills will get paid.

It's simply not true that everyone lives beyond their means at some point. Many people do not.

This sounds like it's far beyond struggling a bit. The OP is concerned about losing their house.

How will the bills get paid if there is not enough income to cover the bills?

 

[Planogirl]

You need to cancel the trip and get your house payment down to a manageable level. I believe you said that you could do that by February? Then you can pull it all back together and plan your trip.

Remember that planning is half the fun anyway.

 

[Colleen27]

3. thnot exactly sure how it went down but basically dh either got bad advice or (more likely) misunderstood the advice given to him by a rep at our mortgage company. ultimately he ended up "missing" a mortgage payment because he thought he was told that would make them work with him to lower our monthly rate. (makes no sense to me but i wasn't involved at this point.) when he called after the "missed" payment it was an entirely different story than he had thought and they put us onto a repayment plan that is completely beyond what we can afford - about an extra $1000 per month! if we can manage to make the payments and get this taken care of, we should be back to normal payments and a far more managable money situation come feb. we just have to get by until then.

You might want to take the reins on this yourself, educate yourself about the programs lenders are offering now under the "Making Home affordable" initiative, and see if you can't get things back on track. We've had so many friends get bad information from their mortgage companies, and the "Miss a payment so you can start the renegotiation process" is the one I've heard the most. You really have to be aware of your options and very persistent, but if you can get through the BS to someone knowledgeable you might be able to work out a more tenable arrangement.

 

[MrsPete]

the disney trip is costing us nothing but food and since we are sharing a dvc with our friends, we can eat in more often than not.

You're rationalizing this trip. Even if you're cooking in the room, using tickets you already have, you cannot afford it, even if it is a rock-bottom price. And you said you have tickets for the kids already; doesn't that mean you're going to need to buy adult tickets? You know you're going to end up spending some money on Disney. The fact is you can stay home cheaper than you can go, and if you're looking at the possibility of losing your house, you MUST make the cheapest choice, even if you don't like it.

Look at it from the other side, the unpopular side: You have two months left before the trip. How much FREE MONEY could you make if you rent your DVC out to someone else? Can you sell the airline tickets? (The bffs -- if they're really bffs -- will understand that you're in a difficult position.) You have some Disney tickets? Sell them on eBay. Yes, you'll probably take a loss on these things, but when you're looking at losing your house, you can't hold onto these things! They'll sell better than antiques, and they'll be FREE MONEY in your pocket right now.

What else do you have that can go on eBay? New, unopened items can be sold as Christmas gifts. How about a yard sale? Around here churches are always having consignment sales in which you can sell your kids used clothing for a decent amount.

Again, you might say, "Oh, but we don't want to take a loss!" Again, keep it in perspective: Take a loss on those things, or lose the house.

we both have work issued cells - we dropped our personal cells already. we have the basic cable package no movie channels, dvr, hd or anything like that.

The work-issued cells are enough; if you have a house phone too, drop that.

Basic cable without movie channels is still a luxury; until you're out of trouble, it needs to be dropped.

Most people can cut something off their grocery bill. Eliminate meat a couple nights a week. A $1 bag of dried beans can be the main dish for TWO meals; add some cornbread, and you have what we Southerners consider a good meal. Casseroles are very cheap to make. Try powdered milk, at least for baking. Do you have a discount bread store? The prices are amazing; I can buy 3 loaves of bread (and it isn't old or anything) for $1.50. Look at your beverages; most people spend 30% of their grocery bill on beverages, and most of them do not add any nutrition to the family table. Have you watched that granny on U-tube who teaches you to make depression-era meals? Seek out non-grocery store places to buy food; I shop at a salvage store and a food auction; I never really know what I'm going to find, but there's always something that my family would like. I can reguarly find meat for under $2, GIANT bags of cereal for $2, and french fries 10 lbs/$1.50. The grocery stores charge more for the convenience of having everything in one place.

I assume you're brown bagging your lunch? What else can you do to save at work? Do you buy sodas from the machine at 75 cents each? If so, buy 12-packs and bring your own to work.

You're taking a great step by getting rid of one car. We only had one car for the first three years of our marriage, and it's amazing how much money that plan saves! It really hurt when our work needs changed, and we were forced to add another car. When we retire, we'll definitely drop to one car again.

Read the book The Tightwad Gazette -- it's at the library. It'll give you LOADS of ideas that'll help you save money. Some of them won't apply to you, but a whole bunch of them will help you.


What's your back-up plan if you lose the house? Where are you going? If you say that any of these options are "too extreme", think about that back-up plan.

 

[Mad4Mickey]

I have not always been "comfortable" , but I have always been very good with my money .

I have a full time job and I have my Cupcakery on the side. I was always being told what a good cook I was and just sat down one night and told my DH I am going to do this and I did. It was the best thing I ever did for myself and for our savings account. Is there anything extra you can do at all ? Maybe help a friend with housekeeping ? are you a good cook? maybe help someone with cooking meals ?

Because we gave one of our houses to my DD we still pay the taxs and iinsurance on it so I kinda needed the extra money . No it was not as dire as your needs but I just sat down and had to think of what was important to me and helping my DD and my SIL to get thier life started was on the top of the list . You would be shocked at what you can do for yourself when pressed.

Think about raising your deductable on your house insurance and your car insurance . You have already done what you think you can or you wouldnt be here asking because you know how mean people can treat others on here. So I know you are in a bind just to post this. You have to really look at some of these posts and although they may hurt your feelings they have some really good ideas in them . Owning 2 DVC I know that selling it not a good idea right now so I do understand why that is not an option . I would not be going on the upcoming trip though if I were you . You may come home and be homeless

Good luck and let us know how you are doing ( do not let people run you off from your own thread LOL)

 

[aka-mad4themouse]

If selling DVC is not possible at this time, I think that the OP should still cancel this trip and rent out her points.

 

[Liberty Belle]

You're rationalizing this trip. Even if you're cooking in the room, using tickets you already have, you cannot afford it, even if it is a rock-bottom price. And you said you have tickets for the kids already; doesn't that mean you're going to need to buy adult tickets? You know you're going to end up spending some money on Disney. The fact is you can stay home cheaper than you can go, and if you're looking at the possibility of losing your house, you MUST make the cheapest choice, even if you don't like it.

Look at it from the other side, the unpopular side: You have two months left before the trip. How much FREE MONEY could you make if you rent your DVC out to someone else? Can you sell the airline tickets? (The bffs -- if they're really bffs -- will understand that you're in a difficult position.) You have some Disney tickets? Sell them on eBay. Yes, you'll probably take a loss on these things, but when you're looking at losing your house, you can't hold onto these things! They'll sell better than antiques, and they'll be FREE MONEY in your pocket right now.

What else do you have that can go on eBay? New, unopened items can be sold as Christmas gifts. How about a yard sale? Around here churches are always having consignment sales in which you can sell your kids used clothing for a decent amount.

Again, you might say, "Oh, but we don't want to take a loss!" Again, keep it in perspective: Take a loss on those things, or lose the house.
The work-issued cells are enough; if you have a house phone too, drop that.

Basic cable without movie channels is still a luxury; until you're out of trouble, it needs to be dropped.

Most people can cut something off their grocery bill. Eliminate meat a couple nights a week. A $1 bag of dried beans can be the main dish for TWO meals; add some cornbread, and you have what we Southerners consider a good meal. Casseroles are very cheap to make. Try powdered milk, at least for baking. Do you have a discount bread store? The prices are amazing; I can buy 3 loaves of bread (and it isn't old or anything) for $1.50. Look at your beverages; most people spend 30% of their grocery bill on beverages, and most of them do not add any nutrition to the family table. Have you watched that granny on U-tube who teaches you to make depression-era meals? Seek out non-grocery store places to buy food; I shop at a salvage store and a food auction; I never really know what I'm going to find, but there's always something that my family would like. I can reguarly find meat for under $2, GIANT bags of cereal for $2, and french fries 10 lbs/$1.50. The grocery stores charge more for the convenience of having everything in one place.

I assume you're brown bagging your lunch? What else can you do to save at work? Do you buy sodas from the machine at 75 cents each? If so, buy 12-packs and bring your own to work.

You're taking a great step by getting rid of one car. We only had one car for the first three years of our marriage, and it's amazing how much money that plan saves! It really hurt when our work needs changed, and we were forced to add another car. When we retire, we'll definitely drop to one car again.

Read the book The Tightwad Gazette -- it's at the library. It'll give you LOADS of ideas that'll help you save money. Some of them won't apply to you, but a whole bunch of them will help you.


What's your back-up plan if you lose the house? Where are you going? If you say that any of these options are "too extreme", think about that back-up plan.

Oh my goodness, I'd never seen her before, but went to check her out. That was just wonderful! Thank you for mentioning her. I think I'm going to buy my mom her dvd for Christmas. I had tears watching her. I'm not sure why. Maybe because she reminds me of my Granny who we lost 6 years ago.

 

[famsen]

It's simply not true that everyone lives beyond their means at some point. Many people do not.

This sounds like it's far beyond struggling a bit. The OP is concerned about losing their house.

How will the bills get paid if there is not enough income to cover the bills?

Yes, EVERYONE lives beyond their means at some point. Have you EVER charged something to a credit card and not paid it off immediately? That means you did no have the cash on hand to make that purchase. Do you have a mortgage? That means you did not have the cash available to purchase the house you wanted outright and are penalized by having to pay interest on a mortgage. That is what I am talking about. How about student loans for college? You don't have the tens of thousands of dollars to pay for yours or your child's education so you make a promise to pay when school is done; you are in debt.

I'm not saying OP should or should not go on their trip. Maybe some time away with the family will put things in perspective about what decisions and sacrifices they may have to make. Maybe this will be their last chance for many years to go on a vacation like this as a family. Whatever they do is what is meant to be.

 

[brymolmom]

Yes, EVERYONE lives beyond their means at some point. Have you EVER charged something to a credit card and not paid it off immediately? That means you did no have the cash on hand to make that purchase. Do you have a mortgage? That means you did not have the cash available to purchase the house you wanted outright and are penalized by having to pay interest on a mortgage. That is what I am talking about. How about student loans for college? You don't have the tens of thousands of dollars to pay for yours or your child's education so you make a promise to pay when school is done; you are in debt.

I'm not saying OP should or should not go on their trip. Maybe some time away with the family will put things in perspective about what decisions and sacrifices they may have to make. Maybe this will be their last chance for many years to go on a vacation like this as a family. Whatever they do is what is meant to be.

I do not agree. Some people live WITHIN their means always. However, I disagree that just by having some debt means that you are living above your means. I have NEVER charged something to a credit card and not paid it off immediately (I do it to get Disney points and for the convenience of paying one bill at the end of the month). I do have debt in the form of a mortgage payment that is well within my means. Did I HAVE to take out a mortgage for it? Likely no - could have come up with the cash in other areas - savings, retirement. But it makes good financial sense for dh and I to have a mortgage given our financial situation - for tax purposes and because it makes sense to leave our retirement where it is.

With education loans - again, if I chose to go to a 6 figure a year school - I might agree that it is above my means (when I was a college student or recently graduated). But since I got low-interest loans and went to a state school, even though I was in debt - I consider it within my means since I did not have difficulty making the small monthly payment.

I often have this discussion with my sis - who does live above her means. She is too of the opinion that 'everyone' does it at times. And she is also of the opinion that because we make more money than she and her husband, that is the reason we don't have as much difficulty with bills. The reality is - no matter how much you make - it is easy to live above your means. And we choose to live within ours. And it IS a choice that almost everyone can make (except for those who even have difficulty buying food for their family and keeping shoes on their feet).

And I don't think taking a trip to WDW is a good decision in a bad financial situation. It is like saying you have to pay lots of money for good family memories. You can make memories with a $5 picnic at the park next door. This is a good thing to teach your kids. OP - get your finances in order and then SAVE for a trip and pay for it upfront.

 

[tony67]

Don't know a lot about your true details of your situation but would canceling your trip and paying on the mortgage do anything but postpone the inevitable?

That’s the first question you need to ask yourself. It's tough but true.

I have far too many friends in MA that are in the same boat. Prices got too high. People bought beyond their means when things were good. Never thought about the what ifs.

How do they buy a 350-400K house with no money down when they make a combined 60K?
Condemmed houses were going for 180K.
Many had chances to sell and pay off the mortgage and walk away, but they said NO I won't take the loss, I have XXX dollars in this and want to make something. There are so many houses for sale in my area it is ridiculous. Many houses could be on the market but the banks are holding them back (foreclosed) so they do not flood the market.
There is a 400K (cost to build!) house in my area that would have a tough time getting $250K today. No one has ever lived in it and the owner will never be able to sell it IMO. He has no idea what he will do with it.

It's time for people to wake up. Do you really want to struggle to keep a house that will most likely be worth another 10%-15% less a year from now? (This is quite possible in MA - I've seen numerous articles on this)

Talk to a professional who can review your actual situation.
If your too far gone, take the vacation. You may not get another one for a while.

If not then I agree with the previous poster who said, "And I don't think taking a trip to WDW is a good decision in a bad financial situation. It is like saying you have to pay lots of money for good family memories. You can make memories with a $5 picnic at the park next door. This is a good thing to teach your kids. OP - get your finances in order and then SAVE for a trip and pay for it upfront. "


BTW - Those of us who lived within our means have also been screwed. We are paying for everyone else. I wish I had lived beyond my means. I wouldn't feel so cheated.

 

[wdwfan16]

thanks everyone! i really do appreciate the advice - even from those few of you who came across as a bit judgmental.

I did not see judgmental posts but helpful posts. Please take what they say to heart.

i probably would be thinking the same thing - how can you do a disney vacation when you are afraid of losing your home!?!?! trust me, i get it and can't truly justify it except to say the disney trip is costing us nothing but food and since we are sharing a dvc with our friends, we can eat in more often than not. (we were going to cancel it but our bff's bought our airline tickets for us because they didn't want to go without us, we have left over passes from our last trip that we will use, the kids go for free, dd will share our meals, we won't need a car rental, etc.) we already know we won't be buying any extras during the trip - it will be the cheapest disney experience we've ever had.

Have them cancel your tickets and take a credit with the airlines. Plan to go in a year and make payments to them to cover the credit. It will cost you far more than you think. Does DH's second job pay him vacation pay? If not, then you lose that income and fall farther behind. If you and your DH took vacation could he work more hours at his 2nd job to make extra money and you stay home with kids and do anything you can for a few $$$. Can either or both of you cash out your vacation and just keep working?

i have made 2 changes to increase my paycheck by claiming 1 instead 0 on my W-4 and i used to purchase an extra week of vacation for 2% of my salary and dropped that as well. (the vacation purchase change won't take effect immediately but it's in my near future.)

You can go much higher than 1. How much was your tax refund last year? What do you do with all that money. I suspect it was in the thousands. Up your year end W4 to about 10, to get some of that refund and then change it again in January to get back your tax refund each week.

i think we have 3 things that have really put us over the edge...

1. we now have our dd in daycare 2 days a week. my father used to watch her for us but can only watch 1 of the kids and the baby is easier for him and would cost more for daycare. we don't have anyone else that can/will watch her for us when we work and we have modified our schedules as much as we can to only place her 2x a week. we also use the daycare at dh's work so we get a discount there too.

2. i had to have emergency dental work that wasn't covered by our insurance and that cost us quite a bit of money that we weren't ready for. i actually haven't finished that process because we can't afford the rest of it right now - hopefully i won't end up losing my tooth.

3. thnot exactly sure how it went down but basically dh either got bad advice or (more likely) misunderstood the advice given to him by a rep at our mortgage company. ultimately he ended up "missing" a mortgage payment because he thought he was told that would make them work with him to lower our monthly rate. (makes no sense to me but i wasn't involved at this point.) when he called after the "missed" payment it was an entirely different story than he had thought and they put us onto a repayment plan that is completely beyond what we can afford - about an extra $1000 per month! if we can manage to make the payments and get this taken care of, we should be back to normal payments and a far more managable money situation come feb. we just have to get by until then.

1) This maybe something you cannot change and it is a fixed cost to you.

2) This will most likely become a tax write-off (amount above 7.5% of your AGI) when you include other medical costs. This is a priority to complete IMHO. Far more important than a WDW trip.

3) This makes no sense. What happened to that payment you never made?

 

[Colleen27]

Don't know a lot about your true details of your situation but would canceling your trip and paying on the mortgage do anything but postpone the inevitable?

That’s the first question you need to ask yourself. It's tough but true.

That is a good point. Foreclosure is not a short process, and we know a few people in our area who found they were better off to let the house go, bank the mortgage money for the 10-12mo foreclosure takes here, and move on. Yes, it is a terrible blemish on one's credit rating, but if the mortgage payment is unsustainable, it is better to get out in front of it, save up as much as possible, and secure alternative housing rather than selling belongings/running up charge cards/letting other bills go unpaid to pay this month's mortgage when you know you don't have the income to pay it next month or the following.

 

[palavra]

Wow, some of you guys are really judgmental. Ever heard the statement about walking a mile in someone else's shoes?

The OP mentioned several reasons why her family is in finacial trouble, most of which werre beyond their control. In the early years of my marriage, we were financially stable, paying off credit cards and not using credit. We both had decent jobs although our healthcare was only adequate at best. During the second year of our marriage, I had emergency surgery due to an ectopic pregnancy. Since the insurance company considered my pregnancy pre-existing, because we had not reported it (we didn't know about it), they only paid for about 40% of the bills. We spent years paying that back. Our credit was ruined because we couldn't afford basics any more without using credit. This lady stated that she had emergency dental work that can run into the thousands. Not everyone has that kind of money saved up. Until you've been in a situation like ours, try to offer kindness and help rather than judgment. You may be financially sound now, but your situation may change for the worse, through no fault of your own as well.

Oh, and those who say cancel the trip. If everything is paid for other than food, what good would that do? They have to eat whether they are at Disney or at home. Since they will ahve access to a kitchen, they can grocery shop in Orlando just as easily as at home.

 

[aka-mad4themouse]

Oh, and those who say cancel the trip. If everything is paid for other than food, what good would that do? They have to eat whether they are at Disney or at home. Since they will ahve access to a kitchen, they can grocery shop in Orlando just as easily as at home.

Food will cost more than groceries purchased for a week at home. At home, you have your pantry staples that round out a meal. You have the local grocery store that you're familiar with, sale items you can take advantage of and a competitive market. The OP will not have a car, is traveling by air and will have to rely on either a grocery service or the mercantile at AKV. That's pricier than shopping on your own. And the OP does not intend to eat every meal out of the villa, so there will be the added expense of dining out at least a few times.

The OP also needs to rent an ECV at the rate of $30-$45 per day for the week that she is there. That's more than $200 that could go towards helping out with household expenses instead.

The DVC points could be rented out instead of being used. Those rented points could generate close to $2K.

It's not an expense-free trip. It is naive to believe otherwise.