Home Daycare Next Door

[Christine]

If you're having issues with the behavior of one child, a quick conversation along the lines of "Wow, I feel for you, that one child sure can scream, can't she?", and then go on to mention that she has woken you in the morning.

Unfortunately, it's not just one child. It's several in this particular group. And now the whistle. A few years ago, it was just one girl. I think what has change drastically is that she used to do a lot of before and afterschool care and her younger child attendees were minimal. It now seems to have flipped and she has no more before and after school care and she has a bunch of kids that are mainly between 2-3 years old. She also has 2 aides now which sort of backs up the shift in her demographics. This younger kids are much louder than what she used to get.

However, if you've lived next to a business for 10 years, and used that business for part of that time, I don't think you can then try and take away a family's livelihood, and jeopardize 8 other family's ability to make theirs just because you don't like the sounds of that buisness.

My intention is not to take away her business and I think I was pretty clear about that in my original post. However, as I have found out (and I'm sure she knows), her business is not allowed by the HOA so I would hope she would be mindful of her effect on her neighbors. I'm sure when I talk with her she will make amends to rectify it. She is a nice, reasonable person so I don't expect trouble. I just feel bad about probably making her feel bad.

 

[Pumbaa_]

all it takes is one kid to change the dynamics.

Hopefully a conversation with the neighbor will open her eyes to the noise level

Good luck!

 

[lillygator]

what would you do if she didn't have a business there adn it were her and the kids being noisey - even when they left for work coming and going in teh am?

 

[Christine]

what would you do if she didn't have a business there adn it were her and the kids being noisey - even when they left for work coming and going in teh am?

I don't know. It's just hard for me to imagine that normal "family" noise would bother me. She has two kids of her own, albeit, older, and they have come and gone like normal kids for the entire time they've lived here and it's never bothered me.

I guess if I had the Duggars living next to me it would be a similar situation.

 

[sunnyday123]

So, help me understand. You used her daycare at one point. I assume it was because it was convenient for you. But, now that you no longer need her services, you have problems with her business?

That's what I was thinking!

 

[lillygator]

I don't know. It's just hard for me to imagine that normal "family" noise would bother me. She has two kids of her own, albeit, older, and they have come and gone like normal kids for the entire time they've lived here and it's never bothered me.

I guess if I had the Duggars living next to me it would be a similar situation.

I guess it just seems to me since you keep mentioning it, you are ready to use the "i'll tell the HOA" deal, if things don't go your way, so I was curious at how it could be rectified if there were no business there but just noisy kids and lots of coming and goings.

 

[castleview]

I tell my kids there is no reason to scream or shriek unless they are being threatened or attacked. It's not that hard to convey to them and if they don't listen, it's not too hard to sit them inside for a timeout.

 

[Christine]

That's what I was thinking!

Please read all the posts in the thread. I didn't realize that home businesses weren't allowed. And I never said that I was now up in arms because she's running a business. Frankly, I don't care if she is breaking the rules and I probably would have still used her daycare had I known that back that.

I only pointed out that it was against the rules because an HOA member brought it to my attention after the first complaint. Plus we have had two home daycares shut down in an adjacant county for the very same issues. My point in bringing this up was not so I could be all hypocritical about it (i.e., it was okay when I was doing it but it's not okay now). The fact is that if she knows that it's not allowed (and I'm sure she does because they did notify her about the complaint) you would think she would be doing more to control the noise so that the neighbors on either side of her don't make a complaint about her business again. I know that is how I would approach it.

And, had this noise been going on when my son was making use of her business, I would have brought it up at the time because I was having daily conversations with her and we had a more comfortable relationship. Now I only wave to her over the fence and don't have much conversation with her; hence, being a tad bit uncomfortable.

I just really wish, since she is the business owner, that she would be more mindful of the noise and not put me in the awkward position of confronting the situation. Because I do find it awkward.

 

[Mickey's Minion]

So, what would you do in this situation? This has been going on for years and I just keep my mouth shut but it's really getting to me.

My next door neighbor has been running a home daycare for about 10 years. At any given time, she has about 8 kids there, maybe more. She follows/complies with our state/county regulations, she has assistants when her numbers get high. It is a well-run daycare of which my kids used for after school care many years ago. I like her, and she's nice.

So, luckily, my whole family is out of the house Mon-Friday. Both my husband and I work full time and we leave at 5:30 a.m. and are home no later than 3:30. Kids are at school, except for the summers.

Her daycare hours are 6:00 a.m. to 6:00 p.m.

Depending on what group of kids she has, sometimes it can be very noisy. We don't notice it when we are not home, of course, but when we are home in the afternoons, we get no peace. We keep the TV up pretty loud and we don't have to hear the screaming all through our dinner. We have pretty much given up on sitting outside and enjoying our deck as the kids are running around next door, screaming, or they often "engage" with us throught the privacy fence.

This summer, as with last, we have at least one "screamer" in the bunch. This kid SCREAMS literally from 4:00 p.m. to 6:00 pm. until his mother comes. Not because he/she is crying--it's a "play" scream/shriek. Last week, one of the kids decided to play/bring a whistle. At this point, even my husband had had enough.

Today, I am off of work because my daughter has invited her boyfriend from out of town. He woke up at 7:00 am today because of the screaming kids (which I noticed as I was down in my kitchen on my laptop). The entrance to her daycare is around through her backyard, so the parents walk their children between the two houses and this kid was hollering.

I don't want to put my neighbor on the defense. This is her livelihood and we do have to live next door to each other. Is there a way I can phrase this without sounding like an absolute meanie? Maybe my husband could be more gentle (I have a tendency not to be).

Additionally, our HOA charter does not allow for any type of business to be run out of the home so she is violating that. Several years ago, I heard through the grapevine that she did have a complaint against her daycare because one of the neighbors felt there was too many cars coming and going (not a noise complaint). Since no one else thought it was a big deal, it was not pursued. I don't really want to go that route, but I'm wondering how she can run a large daycare and still allow me some peace.

So, let me understand this...

She has been there for 10 years.

When it was convenient for you, you used her daycare.

All the kids are gone by 6pm, leaving you the entire evening to relax.

Now that you don't need her services anymore, you are all of a sudden concerned about the HOA? Weren't you concerned about the HOA when it was a convenient day care for you? Edited to add that I missed the part where you did not "know" that businesses were not allowed.

I think it is extreme.

We live on 1/2 acre lots but most of our "land" flows out toward the back. The neighbors behind me are much farther away than the ones beside me. Our houses are probably separated by 30 feet. Her daycare entrance is on the side of my house where my bedroom is, my family room, and my kitchen. The kids predominantly cluster down at the side of the yard that is closest to my deck and is only 12 feet from the corner of my house.

For the most part, when I get home, I turn on the TV and I can block most of it out. And, honestly, at 4PM I'm not overly concerned about noise. It does start to get to me when it is still going on at 6:00 PM and I'm trying to relax after dinner. It's not that it needs to be quiet but, geez, the shrieking (and then the whistle).

The other thing that bugs me is that if I step out on my deck to put something on the grill, I get about 4 2-year-olds running up to the deck all trying to tell me something. I know they are cute and sweet, but every time I go outside over the last few years starts to get a bit old. I sound grouchy, huh?

There is no fence? That would be my first expense - fencing.

I would also suggest a water feature on your deck to help mask the noise for the short 2 1/2 hours that you are home during her daycare hours.

I would be a bit more in your favor if this was a daycare that had always bothered you. But since you used the services for awhile, I think it is quite hypocritical to be complaining about it now that you no longer need it.

 

[Christine]

I guess it just seems to me since you keep mentioning it, you are ready to use the "i'll tell the HOA" deal, if things don't go your way, so I was curious at how it could be rectified if there were no business there but just noisy kids and lots of coming and goings.

I'm not saying that I would NEVER go to the HOA. If we have a conversation and she were beligerent with me (which I don't expect), I might then file a noise complaint. I really would never want her shut down. I would just hope for a compromise.

I don't mean to convey in my posts that I'm using the HOA to shut her down--sorry if my posts sound that way. I just think it's important to note in this particular case that she is operating illegally with the HOA and if she had too many people complaining, she actually could be shut down. She's had one complaint already. And the funny thing was, the person who complained lives on the street behind us so I'm not sure how the cars coming and going bothered them.

 

[Pea-n-Me]

So, help me understand. You used her daycare at one point. I assume it was because it was convenient for you. But, now that you no longer need her services, you have problems with her business?

This makes for interesting fodder on a discussion board. However, IRL it's human nature. We all do it. (IMO, of course.)

And the opposite is true as well. We often don't care about things until they affect us. Human nature.

 

[kimblebee]

I wonder if all the people saying it is only for a short time each day or it is no big deal would feel the same way if it was next door to your house.

 

[chloelovesdisney]

I think that you should talk to her, but I also think that you should take some proactive measures.

Put up signage on the house that reminds people to be quiet during certain hours. Something along the lines of: "This is a residence. Quiet hours in this passageway before 9 am and after 4 pm."

Also, plant some dense shrubbery next to your privacy fence. That will help. It might also help to install some kind of white noise item, like a large fan, or speakers that let you play some classical music.

If the neighbor tries but cannot get the noise level down, I suggest investing in some good insulated windows on that side of the house. The outside noise level in our home dropped to nothing after we had new Andersen windows put in. (If it comes to this, I'd ask her to help pay for them; you wouldn't need them if it wasn't for her business.)

I think these are all great ideas. She is being inconsiderate and should realize that a kid should not be blowing a whistle all day, she should know to ask the parents to keep in down when coming and going from her business in a residential area, etc.. She's lucky the HOA hasn't shut her down, my guess is that some of the people on the board may have made use of her services, lol. It's great to have a good daycare in the neighborhood, but certainly not if it's right next door to you.

 

[Christine]

She has been there for 10 years.

When it was convenient for you, you used her daycare.

I'll repost this again since I've had to say it several times:

Please read all the posts in the thread. I didn't realize that home businesses weren't allowed. And I never said that I was now up in arms because she's running a business. Frankly, I don't care if she is breaking the rules and I probably would have still used her daycare had I known that back that.

I only pointed out that it was against the rules because an HOA member brought it to my attention after the first complaint. Plus we have had two home daycares shut down in an adjacant county for the very same issues. My point in bringing this up was not so I could be all hypocritical about it (i.e., it was okay when I was doing it but it's not okay now). The fact is that if she knows that it's not allowed (and I'm sure she does because they did notify her about the complaint) you would think she would be doing more to control the noise so that the neighbors on either side of her don't make a complaint about her business again. I know that is how I would approach it.

And, had this noise been going on when my son was making use of her business, I would have brought it up at the time because I was having daily conversations with her and we had a more comfortable relationship. Now I only wave to her over the fence and don't have much conversation with her; hence, being a tad bit uncomfortable.

I just really wish, since she is the business owner, that she would be more mindful of the noise and not put me in the awkward position of confronting the situation. Because I do find it awkward.

All the kids are gone by 6pm, leaving you the entire evening to relax.

It's usually by 6:30 and they are outside that entire time. The evenings don't bother me all that much because I can block most of the noise out. The few shriekers and the whistle blower, however, have taken it to the point that I can still hear them over my very loud TV. Night after night, this just gets old. But yes, I have two full hours to relax after they leave.

Now that you don't need her services anymore, you are all of a sudden concerned about the HOA? Weren't you concerned about the HOA when it was a convenient day care for you?

Not concerned about the HOA at all.

There is no fence? That would be my first expense - fencing.

As stated in my OP, there is a 6 ft privacy fence however, there are 2 inch gaps between each slat.

I would also suggest a water feature on your deck to help mask the noise for the short 2 1/2 hours that you are home during her daycare hours.

We have that plus a white noise machine in the house. You have no idea how loud they are. When I have other people stop by (like my neighbor down the street) she's like "Geez, that is awful." It's pretty bad.

 

[chloelovesdisney]

I can only imagine how loud they are because I have just two toddlers next door and they can shriek up a storm when they get going.

The neighbor is running a business in a residential area and it's up to her to keep the noise to a minimal level or she should move her business out of the house and rent a space for her daycare. It's not up to the homeowner do make tons of expensive changes to her home/yard to make it tolerable to live in due to a business next door that's not even supposed to be there.

I think the pp's idea to put up signs to please keep it down is a great idea. I'm sure the parents coming and going are just rushed to get to work and not really thinking about the fact that your bedroom and kitchen windows are right next to them. If the parents refuse to keep it down and be cooperative then I would complain to the HOA.

 

[Mickey's Minion]

I wonder if all the people saying it is only for a short time each day or it is no big deal would feel the same way if it was next door to your house.

If it was only 2-2.5 hours and was completely done by early evening, the OP said 6pm, and only weekdays, it wouldn't bother me at all. And I am assuming this is only a problem in the summers when the kids are outside playing.

But I am a live and let live person. If it was from 4am-6am every morning, I might feel differently.

Living in a neighborhood is always a bunch of compromises. I would strongly believe that tolerating some noise from 3:30 - 6:00pm M-F would be something that I could easily compromise on. My evenings and weekends are not affected, so I wouldn't see the big deal. Not everything in a neighborhood HAS to be my way.

As for the 7am, we have neighbors that mow their lawns that early. We just close our windows and crank up the AC. And the OP says she is out the door by 5:30 am, so they are hardly ever affected by the morning noise unless they are taking a day off.

 

[Wishing on a star]

Hey Christine,

I am so sorry that you are getting questioned/flamed here. I see no reason.

I have issues with my hearing. And, just personally, I can say that the incessant screaming, shreiking, and whistles, etc.... would be excruciating.

It sounds like the situation today is much different/worse than it was years ago.

You say that she now has as many as two aides, which indicates that she has even more children. She has probably taken on some kids for 'summer care' while school is out? It also sounds like the ages and behaviors of the children have changed.

Just personally, I have to admit that I would also be very aware that she is openly breaking HOA rules. It might be tempting to shut her down.. But, it doesn't sound like the HOA is going to do anything anyhow.

I love the idea of putting up the signs!!!!!
BIG ones.
QUIET PLEASE - PRIVATE RESIDENCE, PLEASE RESPECT OTHERS.

I would place these where they are visible from all directions.

I would also consider investing in a better privacy fence, with some beautiful plants/trees/shrubs.

 

[Christine]

I can only imagine how loud they are because I have just two toddlers next door and they can shriek up a storm when they get going.

The neighbor is running a business in a residential area and it's up to her to keep the noise to a minimal level or she should move her business out of the house and rent a space for her daycare. It's not up to the homeowner do make tons of expensive changes to her home/yard to make it tolerable to live in due to a business next door that's not even supposed to be there.

I think the pp's idea to put up signs to please keep it down is a great idea. I'm sure the parents coming and going are just rushed to get to work and not really thinking about the fact that your bedroom and kitchen windows are right next to them. If the parents refuse to keep it down and be cooperative then I would complain to the HOA.

Those toddlers really are loud!! And I know they are very young and not easily dealt with.

I don't think anyone in the whole situation is doing anything purposely. I'm sure when the parents walk them in during the morning they aren't even aware that there are people next door. Luckily, we get up so early we are gone when most of it occurs. But it is glaringly noticeable when we are home. I often think to myself, especially after this morning when our house guest was awakened by the noise: How would I feel about this if I was home all day? A retiree? A SAHM? It's okay to experience it once every few months, but day in and day out it starts to wear on you. Also the parents will often stop on the path/walkway to her entrance and have "conversations" with their kids. It's usually the kid crying, the parent is admonishing or pleading, and so forth. I doubt they realize they are as loud as they are. My house guest was in the third bedroom down from the entrance so he wasn't even right next to the walkway and it woke him up. So yeah I was a bit annoyed.

I guess with the weather being so hot, she let them outside to play from 7:00 a.m. to 9:30 this morning. They usually play outside until lunch, they nap, and then they are outside again from about 2:30 until they are all picked up. It's a LONNNNGGG stretch of noise.

 

[Mickey's Minion]

It's usually by 6:30 and they are outside that entire time. The evenings don't bother me all that much because I can block most of the noise out. The few shriekers and the whistle blower, however, have taken it to the point that I can still hear them over my very loud TV. Night after night, this just gets old. But yes, I have two full hours to relax after they leave.

But it is not night after night. It is afternoon after afternoon.
As stated in my OP, there is a 6 ft privacy fence however, there are 2 inch gaps between each slat.

Seems like the first and easiest solution would be to get some extra slats and close up those gaps. Not very expensive and would stop the eyeballs looking at you.

We have that plus a white noise machine in the house. You have no idea how loud they are. When I have other people stop by (like my neighbor down the street) she's like "Geez, that is awful." It's pretty bad.

Living with neighbors is not always easy. I do like the idea of putting up signs on your property to remind the daycare that it is a residential area.

Sorry if this is not your intention, but the constant mentioning "If I went to the HOA" does give the impression that you are ready to get them involved, even if you say you won't do it. You mention the HOA and what they would do in every single response.

Fix your fence first, put up your signs and mention to the neighbor that you have noticed that the noise has escalated over the years and if after say, 4 or 5, she could keep it down a bit as you are trying to unwind after work. Give her until 4 or 5 to let the kids play. That seems like a fair compromise. When confronting somebody, it is always a good strategy to compliment what they are doing right first. Tell her that you really loved it when your son was there, that you are so glad that there is somebody reliable for parents to go to, etc, then add the "however, you may have not realized since you are in the middle of it, the noise has escalated a bit over the years. Would it be possible to have the kids start winding down at 4?

However, I would talk to her before putting up signs, otherwise it may seem a bit passive aggressive to line the walkway with signs before you mention it to her.

And really, the power of water, ie; a fountain on your deck or if you are inclined to do a bit more landscaping, a pond with a waterfall, does wonders to mask noise.

Of course, if you are inclined to being a bit passive aggressive, I would all of a sudden become a fan of Lady Gaga and bring a boom box onto my deck right around the time the parents start picking the kids up.

You could also become a hobby bee keeper with the hives right up against that fence. Then sweetly offer the neighbor some wonderful fresh honey.

 

[chloelovesdisney]

Perhaps the HOA can intervene and have the neighbor install a better fence, shrubs, etc., since she is the one with the business that is not supposed to be there and causing the issues.