Home Closing and Possession

[Belle & Ariel]

My daughter and son in law are closing on a home this Friday. They should be getting keys and possession at closing and set it for 10 a.m. to spend the weekend cleaning and moving.
Today she found the lady who owns it has moved out of town and will not be getting her furniture out before closing--says she will do it this weekend. It has been about 6 weeks since the contract so I don't understand why it has not been taken care of in that time.
I worry a little since she apparently is not upholding the contract will she get her stuff out this weekend. They drove by and things from the inspection have not been repaired (it was a month ago).
Our kids are using an agent who is a father of their friend. We have never seen his name in advertising and do not think he is a full time agent. We have been disappointed with his service (or lack of) and are afraid he will not protect them in getting this woman out and repairs fixed. My dad was a realtor, we have bought and sold 5 houses; we know how things should work.
The kids are very young and want to do things independently, but I see problems here. They are easy going and have talked about a double move for a few days.
What would you do? Has anyone had trouble getting a seller out?

 

[tinatark]

If their contract says they get possession at closing... then they do. We did a 3 days after closing possession contract, with a penalty for any time past closing for the seller to move.

These closings have a way of being delayed or even cancelled. I would guess the lady wants to be sure the transaction will take place before she moves. I would have their agent make the other agent aware that they do intend to take possession as the contract states - and she will have a penalty if her things aren't moved.

As far as the inspection items - the contract should have listed a specified time period for negotiation and repair - we have a house for sale under contract and the buyers had 7 days for inspection, 2 days to negotiate.

 

[StephMK]

They should not sign any closing papers until the repairs are fixed. Otherwise, they lose any bargaining power. Would they accept money instead? I would also require the woman's stuff to be out or technically wouldn't it belong to them after closing? They need to charge her to rent back this weekend if the closing goes through. She is not fulfilling her obligations as a seller. I hope it works out for them!

 

[momof1princess]

They should not sign any closing papers until the repairs are fixed. Otherwise, they lose any bargaining power. Would they accept money instead? I would also require the woman's stuff to be out or technically wouldn't it belong to them after closing? They need to charge her to rent back this weekend if the closing goes through. She is not fulfilling her obligations as a seller. I hope it works out for them!

this.

no signing of papers until repairs or made, or their money value is paid. and furniture MUST be out that day, or it will be sitting on the curb. they need a new realtor ASAP.

 

[clh2]

I am not in a position to give legal real estate advice. Suffice it to say - I would NEVER purchase a home without a real estate attorney representing my best interests. They are expensive - but in both of my house closings - the attorneys actually did something that helped our home purchases go smoothly.

What a lousy situation. Your daughter and SIL need to get their realtor off his duff - to get things moving. I'm assuming there is a listing real estate broker? He needs to be in contact with that person - to make sure that the terms and conditions of the sales contract are being met.

This includes - the repairs that were agreed upon in the final sales agreement, as well as the possesion.

I would be LIVID if I was anticipating having an empty house, after closing and then finding out sort of at the last minute - that the seller might not be out? What if painters or any other "trades-people" were on stand-by waiting to do something - even as simple as cleaning the carpets? The seller not being out has a whole ripple effect for EVERYTHING.

Also - I would assume there would be some sort of provision in the agreement for a final walkthrough of the house and the property. In my humble opinion - THIS IS A MUST DO. Your DD and SIL should go in with a checklist of the repairs that were required to be made per the sales contract, to make sure they got done.

 

[tenaseewalker]

When we bought our houses we were told by our realtor to walk through the house before going to the closing to make sure they didnt do any damage to the house when they moved out.. It was our rights as the buyer. Make sure they do a walk through of the home before they go to the closing and if the repairs from the inspection are not done then do not sign the papers. If the repairs are done to your satisfaction then go to the closing and sign. As for her possesions, if they are still in the house when you sign the papers then they are now your possesions to do with as you please

 

[seashoreCM]

Do not sign the papers until after you have walked through the house and everything is shipshape and all items not included in the sale (for example her furniture) have been removed. She has to remove the furniture (or sell it to you in writing, probably for two figures cumulatively let alone 3 or 4 figures apiece); you may not remove it to the yard or sidewalk yourself.

It can be agreed to hold back a portion of the purchase price until repairs are completed, but the amount held back should be what it would take the buyer to conveniently and readily have the repairs done not by himself. This will typically result in an amount more than twice what the seller intends to spend on the repairs.

Incidentally, sellers who fail to complete the sale according to the contract don't always get to just return the buyer's deposit and back out. Particularly if the buyer has spent some money in the process including financing fees and preliminary fixing up, the buyer can "tie up" the house preventing a sale to someone else for months and in some cases forcing the seller to lower his price to cover additional financing and closing costs because the bank's deadlines had expired.

 

[Brer Shay]

A night before or morning of walk through of the property should be standard. If the seller was to make repairs as a condition to the contract and they are not completed by settlement, then an amount sufficient to cover those repairs should be escrowed out of the seller's proceeds. The buyer would make/hire out the repair and submit the receipt against that escrow. In terms of items remaining in the house, everything becomes the buyers property at settlement unless there is a contractual agreement otherwise. They may not have a good real estate agent, but if they request these points, he is obligated to follow through.

As PP mentioned, the seller does have the option of walking away, but would likely be responsible for costs the buyer has already incurred. They would have to check the fine print of their contract to be sure.

 

[Happyjen27]

The realtor really shouldn't have anything to do with any of this, apart from opening the door for the buyers during the final walkthrough.

The attorney should be handling all correspondence with the seller, arranging rent paid after closing if the seller's possessions are still present and writing all of the repairs into the contract.

Sounds like your kids need to get their lawyer moving on these concerns.

 

[surfgirl]

great advice above and I agree with it.

A few other words of advice:

1) They most likely are mentally invested in this house - a seller's dream. They need to be ready to play hardball and walk away, if necessary.

2) They need to call their realtor IMMEDIATELY. Unless otherwise specified in their contract:

a) All repairs should have been completed within x days of the report. If not, buyers should be prepared to hold back enough for repairs (and don't let them short change themselves here).

b) An inspection/walk through should occur prior to closing. We've had them happen at 8am, followed by closing at 9am. If they are not prepared to take possession AS IS, then they shouldn't close.

c) All personal property should be moved out prior to inspection. I don't know what they can do with it legally if left behind, but this is an unacceptable response from the seller.

3) Give the realtor 1 business day to get answers and things resolved. If no resolution, call his office manager or broker he works for. The office has liability if this deal is screwed up.


Honestly, I think the seller is taking advantage of a 'young couple'. She probably knows they are mentally invested... and mentally re-decorating... and changing addresses. She knows that they won't make a fuss and is just going to do it and get away with it.


I get, that you as mom, may or may not be listened to... sometimes kids don't want advice from those who have been there or been through it. Could you stop at B&N and get them a 'dummies to real estate' guide or something similar? Find the chapter on inspections and closing and share that? I'm just wondering if it come from an inpartial 3rd party, it would be accepted better?

As a mom, I would be worried. If the seller is taking advantage of them this badly, what else will she do? The seller has no incentive to be careful moving furniture out, could easily take things in the contract (appliances, window coverings, even hot water heaters!) and the buyers have no recourse. Take her to court out of state? The seller has already shown she has no regard for the contract... why would she be 'honorable' in getting stuff out?

 

[mjkacmom]

We had this issue. What we did was pack our van with my IL's stuff, and sent them on their way. Seriously, we still had to deal with a full basement, a full attic, and a full fridge. We rented a dumpster.

 

[surfgirl]

thinking more about the repairs not being done, something is odd here.

Generally, when you make an offer, you put a contingency on it ... for an inspection, mortgage, etc. As each of those conditions is removed, the buyer signs a form removing the contingency.

After an inspection, once repairs are completed to the buyer's satisfaction, they remove the contingency. Assuming all other contingencies are removed, it is a 'contingent-free contract' ... which would have more penalties for either party if they walk away (but can still walk away).

Did the buyers remove the contingency?

If so, the seller has no incentive to complete the repairs - agreed to, or not. Because the buyer removed the contingency.

If not, the buyers can walk away with virtually no penalty.


This deal is missing some basic "home buying 101" actions. I would talk to the buyers about being ready to walk away - because, if they aren't careful, they could end up OWNING the house, but being forced to EVICT the owner. Not a pleasant scenario.

 

[angwill]

When we closed we walked through the house right before signing on the closing. There were things in the contract they did not fix and junk still left that we had stated in the closing papers they had a week to take care of. They didn't and unless we wanted to take legal action we had to fix those things ourselves and threw out their left over belongings and junk. Our realtor had nothing to do with making sure the old owners held up their end of the agreement. We could also have not closed and either postponed or walked away but who wants to do that on the day of the closing when they need to move in?

One other problem we ran into was a family member of the old owners stopping at our mail box daily to go through the mail and take theirs out. We had to report them to the post office for mail tampering to get them to stop when they refused to after being asked to stay out of our mailbox.

 

[Sheaboys]

If repairs were negotiated to be done, by closing, then they have to be done. If something happened and they were not, the attorney will hold back money from the seller until completed.

Buyers, have the right to do a walk thru prior to closing, to make sure they home they are purchasing is up to their standards.

If there is no amendment or contingency to the contract, which is a legal document, then the seller can not of access to the home after closing.

Their agent, the selling agent, and their attorney should all be on the same page.

I suggest, they delay their closing, until after the seller has moved, made the repairs, and they do their final walk through.

 

[chimilady]

They should not sign any closing papers until the repairs are fixed. Otherwise, they lose any bargaining power. Would they accept money instead? I would also require the woman's stuff to be out or technically wouldn't it belong to them after closing? They need to charge her to rent back this weekend if the closing goes through. She is not fulfilling her obligations as a seller. I hope it works out for them!

Yup, I would either refuse to sign the papers, as they did not keep up with their contract, or I would ask for money. If they go through, they forfeit their rights to get the stuff fixed. They can ask for more money though and have their own contractor fix it (that's what I would personally do, because then you know it's done right).

 

[kamik86]

I wouldn't be signing for closing. I am also supposed to close on a house soon and we have a walkthrough that morning to be sure everything is out and the place is left as it was supposed to be.

I also know that the only item we asked to be fixed from the inspection was done (it was outside the house and can be seen if you drive by).

 

[pixiewings71]

We had a few things that needed to be fixed prior to our taking possession but the previous owners didn't take care of them so instead we had a clause that we would be given money to pay for them. They money was taken from the closing costs and we had the agreed upon amount given back to us at closing. It was really very easy as we did the walk through the day before the closing, we had the papers drawn up by our realtor and had our lawyer review them before signing so we were good at the actual signing. We also had it stated that if the previous owners weren't out they had to pay x amount of dollars daily as rent, that motivated them to move out quickly. lol
Good luck to them, I hope they are able to get her out of the house fast!

 

[undertheradar]

I would request a walkthrough the morning of close. This should be done before you go to close, take photos that can be shown of any items left in the house, and any repairs not completed. Any items left in the house once keys change hands would be the buyers and I would suggest changing locks that same day. Any repairs accepted on the contract need to be done before you sign for the home. Get your agent busy and if he fails to do so, contact his broker. This should all be handled before papers are signed at close.

 

[CarlisleMom]

As for the furniture still inside...it's my understanding that the seller has until closing to get their stuff out. When we sold our old house the deal fell thru the night before closing. Since we had moved the week before I was then stuck with selling an empty house.

Always take that walk thru before closing and address any issues before signing.

 

[Belle & Ariel]

Thank you all for your responses.

I have asked her to read them all here.