Holy Diagon Alley Batman!

[BugsDaddy]

You really can't see past the bubble, can you?

I love the cruises, I love the movies and I still enjoy much of what WDW has to offer. Does that mean I'm "truly throwing my money away". My issue is that most of what I enjoy there is the same stuff that was there when I moved here nearly 25 years ago. Heck, some of my absolute favorite attractions were here when I came in 1973 with my parents. Disney seems far more interested in squeezing every last dollar out of their "guests" lately while giving them as little as possible for those dollars. I am definitely not the only one who feels that way.

You define anyone that doesn't fall on their knees at the innovative genius of Universal to be "living in the bubble". Talk about a broken record. The same stuff that you enjoyed 25 years ago is still selling today. And not just selling. Selling in record numbers and to an increasing audience world wide.

You may not be the only one that feels like you do but your actions are contributing to the problem as you think it exists. You continue to give Disney your money but you are not satisfied with the product.

 

[shepd]

If WDW really wanted to lock you down-they could have FP+ for hotel guests only-with one key click.

Sure they can if they're okay losing most of their offsite business. I have no interest in staying on property and with one click I can sell my tickets on kijiji (or not buy them at all). No FP+ = no business from me. I like theme parks, but I'm not waiting hours in line. I'd rather stay home.

 

[Mad Hattered]

You define anyone that doesn't fall on their knees at the innovative genius of Universal to be "living in the bubble". Talk about a broken record. The same stuff that you enjoyed 25 years ago is still selling today. And not just selling. Selling in record numbers and to an increasing audience world wide.

Foie gras is made from the grotesquely enlarged livers of ducks and geese who have been cruelly force-fed.

Yum!!

 

[BugsDaddy]

I said you can't total 4 parks to 2 so by your stats MK is beating IOA and US as they should being MK has been around longer. I don't doubt that Disney is kicking US butt now but lets revisit this next year. Universal is making strides and they are not trying to unseat Disney just trying to take some market share. Disney's complacency will help fuel this loss of market share. Plus dude they are theme parks as long as they are both in business I don't think they really care who is winning. Bottom line they are both making money and filling a certain niche in the market. Disney is kiddie and Universal Thrill.

I don't think you will see a lot change in next years numbers. I think attendance will go up again at each park and US/IOA might swing a few percentage points their way but no where near to threatening WDW.

I don't think Disney is being complacent. Their focus is just not where US focus is right now because they don't have to generate a response to HP to dominate the market.

 

[Mad Hattered]

I don't think you will see a lot change in next years numbers. I think attendance will go up again at each park and US/IOA might swing a few percentage points their way but no where near to threatening WDW.

I don't think Disney is being complacent. Their focus is just not where US focus is right now because they don't have to generate a response to HP to dominate the market.

Not Magic Kingdom, that is for sure. It's DHS and AK where they have the potential to pass them. I sure hope that doesn't happen in my lifetime.

 

[BugsDaddy]

Not Magic Kingdom, that is for sure. It's DHS and AK where they have the potential to pass them. I sure hope that doesn't happen in my lifetime.

If it doesn't happen in the next couple of years with the Diagon Alley expansion, it may not happen in a very long time. King Kong and Jurassic Park will not move the needle as much as they need it to and that will be their next focus. How well can you really be doing if you cannot beat out DHS in its current form? If DHS adds significant Star Wars attractions, forget about it.

 

[shepd]

I have to say, it's rather funny to watch universal's new attractions breakdown. Reminds me of the only time I went there. It was about a couple of months after they opened. Most rides were broken. My dad got our tickets dirt cheap from a a scalper. Turns out US gave everyone leaving the theme park those months a "sorry we screwed up, come back anytime, ever" pass. LOL.

Moral of the story: Wait a year after universal opens a new attraction so they can shake out the bugs.

 

[BugsDaddy]

I have to say, it's rather funny to watch universal's new attractions breakdown. Reminds me of the only time I went there. It was about a couple of months after they opened. Most rides were broken. My dad got our tickets dirt cheap from a a scalper. Turns out US gave everyone leaving the theme park those months a "sorry we screwed up, come back anytime, ever" pass. LOL.

Moral of the story: Wait a year after universal opens a new attraction so they can shake out the bugs.

In all fairness, new rides break down on both sides of the fence. It's really not all that unusual. There are always bugs to be worked out. I think the Yeti on Expedition Everest still doesn't work right half the time.

 

[Mad Hattered]

If it doesn't happen in the next couple of years with the Diagon Alley expansion, it may not happen in a very long time. King Kong and Jurassic Park will not move the needle as much as they need it to and that will be their next focus. How well can you really be doing if you cannot beat out DHS in its current form? If DHS adds significant Star Wars attractions, forget about it.

And that is the million dollar question, now isn't it? If they announced it tomorrow then it would mean closing down half of DHS. What would that do to attendance? Not to mention it would be 2 to 3...4...5 years after Avatar. For fun lets say Disney actually buys out Marvel from Universal Orlando. It would fund a makeover of Marvel Island and then some. What about a 3rd gate on all the land that Universal bought up across the street? Would that be threatening?

 

[Mad Hattered]

In all fairness, new rides break down on both sides of the fence. It's really not all that unusual. There are always bugs to be worked out. I think the Yeti on Expedition Everest still doesn't work right half the time.

Uhhhh....it hasn't worked at all since 2007. They use strobe lights...hence the nickname Disco Yeti.

 

[DorianDonP]

When I hear "Universal is kicking their butts" I don't translate that to mean "They are making more money than Disney", but that they are doing what WDW used to be known for, better than WDW at this current time. Capturing theme park purists with technological innovation and theming immersion. WDW used to be the leader in this regard but when it comes to new lands and ride technology, I'm not sure that can be argued honestly right now. Plus I think people are impressed with the rate Universal is adding attractions and value and a bit annoyed at the rate WDW is moving.

Now it can be argued that WDW doesn't need to do anything impressive right now because of how their overall numbers look, while the competitors need to step up their game, and that might be where the topic becomes the most divisive. Being satisfied with what WDW offers because for the longest it has offered so much vs thinking WDW can do so much better because it has in the past, plus that little competitor down the street is now inspiring the excitement that used to be just exclusive to WDW.

Disney has built up a cache of nostalgia and mindshare amongst the public that won't be cracked by a few new rides, lands, or IP acquisitions from a rival. But when the response to "Universal sure is kicking Disney's butt right now" is "Disney makes more money," then it sounds like words from a stock holder and not a theme park enthusiast. Disney practically markets itself, and that has happened because of decades of brilliance, which at this point is Universal's biggest hurdle, imo, not WDW's current output.

I can't count how many times I've heard or read people talking about the new Harry Potter world and believing that it was a new land/park at Disney, because in the past, this new exciting land, ride, park experience WOULD have been at Disney. I guess that's a compliment to Disney in a lot of ways. But it's also further proof that Universal is doing what Disney does best (except maybe in marketing? LOL).

I think Universal is doing a bang up job right now and for maybe the first time ever, WDW is starting to take notice. Not panic, but at least consider that if Universal continues expanding at this rate, leading the theming/technological/excitement race in Orlando, then that market share they have never gave a second thought to may begin slipping. And that undoubtedly would be a win for Universal, even if they never approach the overall numbers of Magic Kingdom.

I may be in the minority but I am actually excited about Avatarland, mostly because when I first saw the movie my first thought when I got home was to write a blog post about how Pandora would make the perfect theme park land. It's too beautiful and cool to fail, imo, even if people don't like the movie. And Star Wars Land, I'm sold if and when that comes. I'm rooting hard for Universal to continue to do what they are doing so that WDW does feel a little sweat for once. It'll only improve the Orlando destination as a whole.

 

[BugsDaddy]

[/b]

And that is the million dollar question, now isn't it? If they announced it tomorrow then it would mean closing down half of DHS. What would that do to attendance? Not to mention it would be 2 to 3...4...5 years after Avatar. For fun lets say Disney actually buys out Marvel from Universal Orlando. It would fund a makeover of Marvel Island and then some. What about a 3rd gate on all the land that Universal bought up across the street? Would that be threatening?

I would suspect that a Star Wars land in DHS wouldn't be operational until 2020 unless Disney threw some serious cash behind it to get it done much sooner. Regardless, DHS would take a hit in attendance during whatever time that is with probably the hope that Avatarland would give AK a bump. Which it should. The only question would be to what extent.

Disney will never purchase the rights to the legacy Marvel stuff from Universal. I doubt that Universal would sell it for anything less than a kings ransom and Disney isn't that interested in it.

What would Universal do with a 3rd gate? You have to have something to put in it that will provide a decent ROI. In order to do that, Universal would need to buy more rights. Possibly to LOTR but that might be a risk. There is no new material coming out after the last Hobbit film but it could be a good draw and lots of material to work with. Comcast just gave them a nice wad of cash for Diagon Alley though. They probably want to see a little ROI on that investment before taking another huge leap.

 

[BugsDaddy]

When I hear "Universal is kicking their butts" I don't translate that to mean "They are making more money than Disney", but that they are doing what WDW used to be known for, better than WDW at this current time. Capturing theme park purists with technological innovation and theming immersion. WDW used to be the leader in this regard but when it comes to new lands and ride technology, I'm not sure that can be argued honestly right now. Plus I think people are impressed with the rate Universal is adding attractions and value and a bit annoyed at the rate WDW is moving.

Now it can be argued that WDW doesn't need to do anything impressive right now because of how their overall numbers look, while the competitors need to step up their game, and that might be where the topic becomes the most divisive. Being satisfied with what WDW offers because for the longest it has offered so much vs thinking WDW can do so much better because it has in the past, plus that little competitor down the street is now inspiring the excitement that used to be just exclusive to WDW.

Disney has built up a cache of nostalgia and mindshare amongst the public that won't be cracked by a few new rides, lands, or IP acquisitions from a rival. But when the response to "Universal sure is kicking Disney's butt right now" is "Disney makes more money," then it sounds like words from a stock holder and not a theme park enthusiast. Disney practically markets itself, and that has happened because of decades of brilliance, which at this point is Universal's biggest hurdle, imo, not WDW's current output.

I can't count how many times I've heard or read people talking about the new Harry Potter world and believing that it was a new land/park at Disney, because in the past, this new exciting land, ride, park experience WOULD have been at Disney. I guess that's a compliment to Disney in a lot of ways. But it's also further proof that Universal is doing what Disney does best (except maybe in marketing? LOL).

I think Universal is doing a bang up job right now and for maybe the first time ever, WDW is starting to take notice. Not panic, but at least consider that if Universal continues expanding at this rate, leading the theming/technological/excitement race in Orlando, then that market share they have never gave a second thought to may begin slipping. And that undoubtedly would be a win for Universal, even if they never approach the overall numbers of Magic Kingdom.

I may be in the minority but I am actually excited about Avatarland, mostly because when I first saw the movie my first thought when I got home was to write a blog post about how Pandora would make the perfect theme park land. It's too beautiful and cool to fail, imo, even if people don't like the movie. And Star Wars Land, I'm sold if and when that comes. I'm rooting hard for Universal to continue to do what they are doing so that WDW does feel a little sweat for once. It'll only improve the Orlando destination as a whole.

Yes, the company with the most money wins at the end of the day. You can talk nostalgia, magic, innovation and technology but attendance and the P&L of these two organizations is what is going to matter. People talk about Disney as if they are so greedy and Universal is some sort of creative den full of non-profit geniuses just creating rides to make the world a better place. Both are in business to make money and that is ok.

I agree that competition is good. It will take a lot more than HP to threaten the Disney empire into putting more resources in Orlando.

 

[PlutoMars]

Video from a guy that waited in line for four hours for Gringotts and after it broke down at least 7 times, they shut down the attraction and made everyone leave. He was not amused.

http://youtu.be/LPk95zQ1TyQ

In the end, he didnt think the ride should have opened after it experience so many issues during testing.

 

[JimmyV]

And, I would argue that UO IS a DESTINATION.

Not until they add at least one more park and two hotels. Then they will be getting enough guests spending their ENTIRE time at Universal to give Disney pause. Not until then.

Boy, people have short memories. Universal Orlando has more attractions, more hotel rooms, more restaurants, and a more vibrant entertainment district than WDW did from 1971-1980. And yet back then, no one doubted that WDW was a vacation destination. This idea that Universal isn't a "destination" seems to be rooted in the fact that people don't do 10 day vacations there. But that's not the test. When we first started going to WDW in the summer of 1972, we stayed 3 and sometimes 4 nights at the Contemporary and our friends thought we were being extravagant. It took a looooong time before WDW warranted a full week. But the fact that WDW warrants more time than Universal is not a basis to conclude that Universal is not a destination. If you conclude that, then you would have to agree that WDW was not a destination until very recently, and that is just silly.

 

[JimmyV]

And while it may seem like a distinction without a difference to some, Disney didn't budget anywhere near $1.5B for "magic bands", and I'm not sure we've even seen the finished product yet.

There is a bit of wishful thinking here. Disney already canned the guy in charge of the initiative, so obviously they weren't pleased with something. It would be odd to fire the guy in charge when the "best is yet to come". The folks who stand mouth agape at the unimpressiveness of what the money has been spent on may be right. It is natural to think: "this can't be the whole thing". But it might just be.

 

[PlutoMars]

And the new leaders in innovation have their featured attraction down yet again this morning as the line grows.

https://twitter.com/Annabelle_16/status/486849753880080384

 

[sonofanarchy]

And the new leaders in innovation have their featured attraction down yet again this morning as the line grows.

https://twitter.com/Annabelle_16/status/486849753880080384

Yeah. That never happens at Disney.

 

[clsteve]

And the new leaders in innovation have their featured attraction down yet again this morning as the line grows.

https://twitter.com/Annabelle_16/status/486849753880080384

I'm not sure why you're holding onto this like a piece of flotsam in a stormy sea. All new attractions have this issue when they open - even ones based on decades-old technology. Here's the downtime report for 7DMT 6/15 to 7/4 (re:Josh): http://easywdw.com/reports11/7dmtjune.pdf

Dashes represent downtime showing it was down 9 hours out of the 15 on opening day, has had one full day where it was down for all but one hour, and has seen significant outages each day except one.

Time to move on, I would think.......

 

[sonofanarchy]

Rode Gringotts this morning. While I give Diagon an A+ along with the que for the ride, the ride itself only gets a C+ from me. I was very underwhelmed. Forbidden Journey is much better.