"Hire a tutor" said the Algebra teacher

[shortbun]

Originally posted by lulugirl
So, teachers should work overtime for free? Are you serious?

We have several teachers in our school that are routinely
there until 6pm. They tutor and do other things. One thing
I can say about math tutors-it's a good idea to get someone
other than the actual math teacher. Sometimes, what the 2nd
person says differently clicks. I was failing miserably in calculous until I hired a tutor. I went to his home, he cooked wonderfully
and we ate and worked on math. It was a much more comfortable environment, kitchen table and yummy smells.
I sailed through 5 classes in calc with a high B average.
If the ability is there, keep looking until you find someone who
can make it understandable. My nephew is an Aspie and he
gets tutoring all summer long to keep him focused in a learning
mode. He gets good grades but stopping for the whole summer
isn't good for his routine oriented personality. He does have some tutoring/therapy written into his IEP but it's mostly occupational.

 

[CheshireVal]

As the OP, I'm sort of stunned by the fairly unified opinion that teachers don't have a responsibility to make sure all kids pick up on what they are teaching.

And HOW exactly are we supposed to do that? I work in a private school where class size is limited to about 16. Even then, you've got some really bright kids who totally "get it" right off the bat. Then you've got the majority of the class which takes a bit longer, and then there are always 1-2 students who really struggle. Are teachers supposed to ignore the other 14 kids in the class, pull the "slower" ones into a special session and keep going over and over it til they get it?

IMPOSSIBLE.

We have "extra help" time built into the end of our school days, where teachers are ALL available for 40 minutes after school. But at schools where this isn't possible then I don't think it's fair to make it the teacher's responsibility to make sure your son understands everything. She's probably doing the best she can with the time that she has.


I see a lot of teacher bashing around boards. I guess I can kind of understand that because we seem to have it really easy to the rest of the world. But I'm sure if the majority of you tried it for a year, you'd see things a bit differently.

As for me personally, I am giving up my ENTIRE weekend for an overnight debate trip this weekend (I'm a debate coach). I'll be gone from Friday at 1pm to Saturday at midnight. Not to mention Parent's Night the other night where I didn't get home til after 9:30. I love my job but there's only so much of myself people can expect me to give, and I'm sure most teachers on this board would agree.

 

[damo]

Is it the current teacher's responsibility to make sure that the kid has picked up on everything that has been taught before? Of course not. And this is where the problem very often lies.

 

[missypie]

Originally posted by CheshireVal
.As for me personally, I am giving up my ENTIRE weekend for an overnight debate trip this weekend (I'm a debate coach). I'll be gone from Friday at 1pm to Saturday at midnight. Not to mention Parent's Night the other night where I didn't get home til after 9:30. I love my job but there's only so much of myself people can expect me to give, and I'm sure most teachers on this board would agree.

I know that teachers give up a huge amout of time for extra activites for which they don't get paid extra. In fact, the algebra teacher in question is one of the sponsors of the Math Team, so she spends some of her weekends going to math tournaments with the really smart kids.

But yet, when something has to be cut out, it is the "Math Club" where the kids who needed extra math help used to get to go. The teacher is willing to coach the smartest kids so that they can win math tournaments, but not willing to spend time with the kids who need extra help.

Shouldn't academics come first?

(Of course here in Texas, don't even get me started on sports!)

 

[CheshireVal]

Originally posted by missypie


But yet, when something has to be cut out, it is the "Math Club" where the kids who needed extra math help used to get to go. The teacher is willing to coach the smartest kids so that they can win math tournaments, but not willing to spend time with the kids who need extra help.

Shouldn't academics come first?

Unfortunately, it's not always the teacher's choice. We're often told we're sponsoring certain things whether we like it or not. I think most teachers would be more readily available for extra help if this weren't the case.....

 

[DisneyJules]

Way to go for getting him a tutor. I struggled with math and grade 8 and had major trouble getting help from the teacher. I remember we were suppose to see her after school for extra help, something always "came up," and even when she was there, she would leave the class constantly and come back between questions, some help! Some teachers really should be there to help more, it's their responsibility to make sure those kids understand.

 

[I_Know_You2!]

Couldn't it also be the case of the math competition being the teacher's choice of use for her own time? Maybe it is his "pet project." Teachers should be allowed to use their free time any way they choose, IMO.

 

[danacara]

Originally posted by missypie

But yet, when something has to be cut out, it is the "Math Club" where the kids who needed extra math help used to get to go. The teacher is willing to coach the smartest kids so that they can win math tournaments, but not willing to spend time with the kids who need extra help.

I think that if the tables were turned, and you had the smartest child, you'd be arguing the exact opposite. It's all about point of reference.

 

[TnKrBeLlA012]

Originally posted by CheshireVal
And HOW exactly are we supposed to do that? I work in a private school where class size is limited to about 16. Even then, you've got some really bright kids who totally "get it" right off the bat. Then you've got the majority of the class which takes a bit longer, and then there are always 1-2 students who really struggle. Are teachers supposed to ignore the other 14 kids in the class, pull the "slower" ones into a special session and keep going over and over it til they get it?

IMPOSSIBLE.

That is part of the problem. If the teacher knows the majority do get it, why not take those 2 or 3 students that don't and work with them. I know from my own children the teacher goes over the problems then assigns the work. During that down time ,pull the kids that don't get it and help them out. Now I do see how kids graduate and can't even read. I did have one teacher,out of 12yrs, who took the time to help my daughter. She slowed her assignments down so she didn't have to worry about so much. She didn't get her overwelmed. She took the time and tried to work with her,even though she did have other students.Sure life would be great if every job was easy,every child was naturally smart and no one was left behind but thats not reality.

 

[SlightlyGoofy]

Math has never been and never will be my strong suit. I have friends who are teachers and they are human, some are good at what they do and some are not. Mostly they do the best they can under the circumstances. My pet peeve is that kids are not learning to read. So that I can complain, without guilt, I have volunteered to work (for free) at the school library. Did this for two years and am now working (for free) at a local Community Center where I read with struggling children. If parents, teachers and politicians were able to work together there would be far fewer children falling between the cracks IMHO.

Might a computer program be useful with the math problem? The big problem most children that I have seen have is frustration and being afraid of making a mistake and a computer program has unlimited patience and can lead a student, step by step, along the way. Just a thought.

I commend you for caring and trying to help your child. I hope you are able to find the help you need.

BTW, yes, I do know how to use punctuation, am just in a big hurry. The kids at the center are waiting. LOL

Slightly Goofy

 

[sharbear]

If the teacher knows the majority do get it, why not take those 2 or 3 students that don't and work with them.

I agree with this statement to a point. Yes, I believe that a teacher will take the time to help a few students who don't get a concept but the op's son is in a pre-AP class.

My kids are in Honors level Math classes. They have also been in "middle level" math classes. The honors classes assume that you know the material before you get to that class. They also move at a much faster pace than classes that are not Honors. I think that it is fustrating to have to explain a concept to a child when the rest of the class understands and is itching to get to the next concept. It is not for everyone and not every child can move at this faster pace. Honor's are not for every child and that's not a bad thing. But I also think that a teacher teaching a honors level class has the expectation that if a child needs help that they should seek outside help.

We don't know, maybe this teacher has tried to help this child but she knows that he needs help or he will be in a lot of hot water later. She also know how he is preforming compared to the rest of the class.

We do have Math Lab at our school, we are very lucky to have a well funded school. But to blame the teacher for what they have or don't have at school seems unfair to me.

 

[missypie]

I also think a factor is that Algebra isn't the focus of any statewide mandatory test for 8th graders. If it was, all of our kids would be coached like crazy.

In Texas, 4th graders have to take a state writing test. Months before the test they were "pre-tested" and kids who scored below a certain level were "strongly encouraged" to stay after school for special help two days a week until the test was given. I'm sure the 4th grade teachers weren't thrilled about this, but the mandate went down from the District that EVERYONE WILL PASS. So teacher time was made available (thank goodness!)

Edited to add: 1500 posts??? Good grief!

 

[danacara]

Originally posted by sharbear

My kids are in Honors level Math classes. They have also been in "middle level" math classes. The honors classes assume that you know the material before you get to that class. They also move at a much faster pace than classes that are not Honors. I think that it is fustrating to have to explain a concept to a child when the rest of the class understands and is itching to get to the next concept. It is not for everyone and not every child can move at this faster pace. Honor's are not for every child and that's not a bad thing. But I also think that a teacher teaching a honors level class has the expectation that if a child needs help that they should seek outside help.

Sharbear, really good point.

 

[Jenn Lynn]

Originally posted by danacara
I think that if the tables were turned, and you had the smartest child, you'd be arguing the exact opposite. It's all about point of reference.

ITA! It's really a no win situation with the teachers. Someone is going to be unhappy no matter what.

 

[Cindy B]

Originally posted by missypie
I also think a factor is that Algebra isn't the focus of any statewide mandatory test for 8th graders. If it was, all of our kids would be coached like crazy.

In Texas, 4th graders have to take a state writing test. Months before the test they were "pre-tested" and kids who scored below a certain level were "strongly encouraged" to stay after school for special help two days a week until the test was given. I'm sure the 4th grade teachers weren't thrilled about this, but the mandate went down from the District that EVERYONE WILL PASS. So teacher time was made available (thank goodness!)

Edited to add: 1500 posts??? Good grief!

Here in the 8th grade GEPA, (NJ- Grade Eight Proficiency Assessment) algebra is a main point.

Language Arts is also streesed in the GEPA. If during the pretest, students are determined that they need extra help, class time is made for them during the school day.

They get permission from the guidance department, and the child study team, along with the special education teachers.. to miss a non grade/non academic subject like gym, art, or computer skills. Then a veteran Language Arts teacher is made available, (or gets paid extra, since it is her prep (off) time to teach a 8 week long regimented basic skills language arts assessment.

Here in NJ they start the testing and assessment in the 3rd grade

 

[year2late]

Originally posted by missypie
I know that teachers give up a huge amout of time for extra activites for which they don't get paid extra. In fact, the algebra teacher in question is one of the sponsors of the Math Team, so she spends some of her weekends going to math tournaments with the really smart kids.

I am not sure I understand your point. Are you faulting the teacher for donating time to the Math team rather than donating hertime to kids for tutoring?

 

[Cindy B]

Originally posted by year2late
I am not sure I understand your point. Are you faulting the teacher for donating time to the Math team rather than donating hertime to kids for tutoring?

I think that is the OP's intent.

Sometimes teachers don't get volunteered for Math Team, Debate Team, etc. The administration PICKS YOU TO DO IT!

I've seen it happen at my school. The cheerleading coach had an emergency maternity leave, and my Language Arts teacher wound up with a note in her box to cover for Teacher X because of her baby!

 

[Planogirl]

It sounds to me like some here are assuming that the teachers have full control over their extra activities. I think that they are often pressed into certain activities, whether they like it or not.

Also, the OP said the teacher had other commitments. Maybe it's true and can't be helped.

 

[year2late]

I guess I am thinking I don't care if the teacher has other commitiments or not. It is great when you have a teacher go above and beyond, but what if he/he doesn't? Are they a bad person? No. It says they would like personal time or time with their families. They should not have to justify it! What should count is whether they are doing a good job in the classroom.

 

[jel0511]

As a sister to two teachers (one a former teacher now), SIL to two teachers, and best friend to one teacher I feel I have to say something. Teaching is like a job just like any other, just they are teaching people. Teachers are not there to coddle children, and are not fully responsible for all their learning, they can only do so much. Teaching children is a three way street, the teacher plays a part, the student plays a part and the parent also plays a part. Everyone has to do their job, but teachers are not there to be indispensible to their students who are struggling. They can help when they feel their help might be warranted, but if a student just isn't getting it, probably they need more then the extra time a teacher can spare. They are NOT required to help people after school, and usually don't because it can open a can of worms. If you're helping Johnny, why can't you help Andy too. Also, Alison could use some extra help, her mom says, it can just keep growing until you're basically teaching all of your struggling students after school. There has to be a cut off somewhere. It is possible that this Teacher is also a tutor afterschool herself. A lot are, as tutoring is a very lucrative after-school job for teachers, my brother does some and he makes a LOT of money for a few extra hours of work. Also, most teachers (at least the ones I'm familiar with) usually do recommend those students who are having problems grasping most concepts to seek help other from them. As stated, sometimes the student just isn't "getting" that teacher's style, and another fresh approach might be enough to get it to click. Another misnomer is that some of these extra-curricular activities teachers moderate/supervise are all volunteer, usually they are not. They usually receive a small stipend, usually $500 - $1000 per semester to be the coach/advisor/supervisor, especially when competitions are involved. My best friend who is a highschool history teacher does get this small stipend for being the advisor for Mock Jury. Believe it or not, when my sister was teaching, she got an extra $500 a semester just for being a homeroom teacher. All she had to do was take attendence!! Teaching is one of the most noble professions IMO, but they are not and should not have to be available whenever a student is failing, and shouldn't be expected to put in the extra time if they don't have it. They are people and should be allowed to pick and choose their activities after work just like everybody else. A one-off session after school is one thing, but it seems like the OP's son needs more than that and I think the math teacher was definatly correct in suggesting a more permant solutuion to her problem.