Here now LOVE FP+ (seriously)

[morethananyonex]

By the title of the OP I expected to read a post about how great FP+ was, but it read as how great rider swap was. I don't think anyone is truly dismissing her FP+ experience but her OP is more about how rider swap helped her have a successful day riding rides multiple times and not so much FP+

FP+ didn't cause rope drop to allow you to ride multiple rides. FP+ didn't create the rider swap program, that allows 2 members of your family to have multiple rides.

I personally still see where the FP part of it helped. She was able to ride several headliners without incident and without having to wait in a 70+ minute line for one ride.

OP talks all about riding headliners multiple times during one day. FP+ can only be credited for one of them, and not any RnRC rides. So, from what I see, FP+ is awesome because OP's family rode ToT, TSMM and Star Tours once. Yay?

Rope drop and rider swap are awesome because OP's family rode all the other stuff and repeated rides. Those rides have nothing to do with FP+, and could have been accomplished the same way with FP-, so it doesn't make sense to use them as proof FP+ is awesome. Maybe it got their butts in gear to get to RD, but RD is what really gave this family the amount of rides they had.

I don't doubt OP had a great time. FP+ just wasn't the cause of the majority of it from what she describes.

 

[surferdave]

....... which she would have also been able to do with legacy FP since she was at rope drop and FPs would have been available.

If she said "we slept in and were able to enter the park during peak crowds at dinner time and still ride 3 things with little wait", that's something I could buy being because of FP+. With legacy FP, there wouldn't be any left late in the day for the headliners during spring break. (That's would still not be a successful park day by my definition, but it is for some.)

In addition, they only started enforcing FP- return times shortly before introducing FP- to prepare everyone for the shift; prior to that change you could have returned to the attraction any time after your start time. People used to argue here a lot about whether they should enforce the return time or not, and about Fastpass lines backing up because of people returning at the same time. Ironically I don't think the FP lines ever backed up like they are now.

 

[JimmyV]

And no, FP+ wasn't the sole reason she was happy but it played a part and that should be ok. Just because other things COMBINED with FP+ made her visit a great one, it shouldn't dismiss the benefit OP saw from using it.

This is a fair point, and perhaps, (being that this is a "strategies" board), there should be a thread on how to combine FP+ with Child Swap to maximize your riding experience. Sounds like a great way to get the most out of one's day. But it cannot be overlooked that a family that does not use Child Swap that wants to do ToT 4 times and TSM 3 times would be looking at:

• Arrive at RD.
• Ride TSM as a SB. 10 minute wait.
• Turn around and ride TSM a second time as a SB. 50 minute wait.
• Go to ToT and ride SB. 40 minute wait.
• Turn around and do ToT a second time SB. 50 minute wait.
• Return and do ToT later in the day for a third time in the SB line. 60 minute wait.
• Ride TSM a third time using FP+. 15 minute wait.
• Ride ToT for your fourth time using FP+. 10 minute wait.

Total wait time=235 minutes. It doesn't sound as if this was anything like what the OP experienced. So what kept the OP from having to wait for an aggregate of 235 minutes? FP+ or something else?

 

[mom2rtk]

In addition, they only started enforcing FP- return times shortly before introducing FP- to prepare everyone for the shift; prior to that change you could have returned to the attraction any time after your start time. People used to argue here a lot about whether they should enforce the return time or not, and about Fastpass lines backing up because of people returning at the same time. Ironically I don't think the FP lines ever backed up like they are now.

So true. I wonder about some of the posters who used to get so worked up about that. I haven't seen them in a while. So either they stopped going to Disney or their heads exploded when FP+ rolled out.

 

[OtherScott]

When it suits them, many people here point out the influence that we may have on first timers and how we should strive not to mislead them. It was clear to me that FP+ was at best the third biggest factor in her very successful day. I think that's an important distinction for anyone who is using reports on this planning board as a model for their plans.

We're quantifying personal preferences now? We have the ability to reduce the dynamic to the static, the whole into it's parts?

Not trying to single this post out, but this is what I mean when I say we're blind. On the level that Disney needs to be financially successful, we have no idea how many scenarios exists where specific factors compliment/offset all others.

 

[JimmyV]

We have the ability to reduce the dynamic to the static, the whole into it's parts?

Not that hard. Use a spreadsheet and fill in the anticipated wait times for:

• TSM-1
• TSM-2
• TSM-3
• ToT-1
• ToT-2
• ToT-3
• ToT-4

using four columns:

• Column 1 = No FPs used at all
• Column 2 = Using FP- (anticipating the maximum number of FPs that could be pulled for these rides in a day.)
• Column 3 = Using FP+ only (which is what I did above)
• Column 4 = Using FP+ in conjunction with Child Swap.

Compare results. See which variable is most impactful. surferdave is predicting that FP+ will be the third most impactful variable.

 

[MrInfinity]

Wow. OP wrote about having a great time and ppl are tearing her argument apart as if it was a debate. "No you're wrong - don't tell me you liked FP+, you had a good time because of... ". Do you guys really not have anything better to do than debate another's good time? I go back to normal life for a few days, come back out to the forum, and the same 5-10 ppl are still ranting on every positive thread.

"I like that house because it's green"

"No, you like the house because of this and this and that... the fact that it's green doesn't matter as evidence proves you've liked blue houses too, and these other things clearly benefit you more. In fact the green can easily be changed and any house can be made green for a trivial cost".

I mean really? Can't ppl just say they like something w/o a debate? This is a fansite after all. You have to expect some ppl are going to actually like things. Berating every positive opinion about how they're wrong is not productive. Having to post on every... single... thread about FP+ and how the OP isn't right, FP+ really is bad. Ugh.

For most guests, FP+ is a benefit. For most Dis'ers, FP+ is not. This is a given, we know it, it's not going to change, so move on.

Taraaplin, I'm glad you had a good time. That is refreshing to hear amid all the doom and gloom of the Disney forums. I'm really unsure what to expect for our coming May trip... we never had a problem with waits in the past, but ppl are making it out to be like you're in line all day. It's nice to hear folks writing back that it's not really the case. Thanks!!

 

[nicollecheyenne]

I don't understand why when someone has a positive FP+ experience, its like a race to see who can post first and 'inform' an OP of why FP+ wasn't why they had a good time, rode a ride, etc. but give some other reason. Or come up with silly things like 'what will you do without rider swap?' Did I miss that post? In all honesty, can someone direct me to a link about them taking away that perk? I dont mean to come off as a smart a** but I just get so tired of seeing this happen. I was told a while back when I was reading a thread about the number of negative posts FP+ was generating that if I didn't like reading about it just to skip over those particular posts. Here is a poster who had positive things to say and it still turns into a contest to see who can beat down the OP into saying, 'Oh, you're right. My opinion was invalid and wrong. You win. Oh mighty Disney commandos'. I think its incredibly frustrating to those of us who, in spite of FP+ (as so many like to say) still love our Disney time and actually see the benefit of it. Everyone tours differently. Everyone has different priorities on a Disney vacation. Not everyone has taken a dozen trips with and without FP+. Can't we all just be nice to each other? OP, I'm glad you had a great trip! Sounds like FP+ AND RS made for a fabulous time Looking forward to our October trip!

So true! Some people just refuse to let people form their own opinions and love to hear themselves talk...

 

[Magpie]

surferdave is predicting that FP+ will be the third most impactful variable.

Who cares if FP+ is the first or third or fourteenth most impactful variable?

If it had a positive impact, then it had a positive impact. The fact that other elements also had positive impacts does not take away from that. A good touring plan will take into account all elements and attempt to combine them to your best advantage.

 

[JimmyV]

"I like that house because it's green"

"No, you like the house because of this and this and that... the fact that it's green doesn't matter as evidence proves you've liked blue houses too, and these other things clearly benefit you more. In fact the green can easily be changed and any house can be made green for a trivial cost".

A very interesting analogy. Now, assume that the house isn't really green at all, but the buyer only thinks it is. There will be people who will jump on their opinion as you have suggested above, and there will be people who think to themselves: "I'm glad she like that house. It isn't really green afterall, but it is quaint that she thinks it is and likes it. So C'est la vie!" And I suppose that there will be a third group who also think the house is green and agree with the buyer. This is human nature.

 

[surferdave]

I didn't need a spreadsheet to see that, but thanks Jimmy.

You guys are awful busy defending someone who wasn't attacked.

 

[JimmyV]

Who cares if FP+ is the first or third or fourteenth most impactful variable?

If it had a positive impact, then it had a positive impact. The fact that other elements also had positive impacts does not take away from that. A good touring plan will take into account all elements and attempt to combine them to your best advantage.

I agree with you. I am merely pointing out that it is measurable.

 

[OtherScott]

Not that hard. Use a spreadsheet and fill in the anticipated wait times for:

• TSM-1
• TSM-2
• TSM-3
• ToT-1
• ToT-2
• ToT-3
• ToT-4

using four columns:

• Column 1 = No FPs used at all
• Column 2 = Using FP- (anticipating the maximum number of FPs that could be pulled for these rides in a day.)
• Column 3 = Using FP+ only (which is what I did above)
• Column 4 = Using FP+ in conjunction with Child Swap.

Compare results. See which variable is most impactful. surferdave is predicting that FP+ will be the third most impactful variable.

Spreadsheets = checkers
Behavioral analysis = chess

Would someone (anyone) be more willing to do rope drop knowing that they had FPs (FP+) lined up for a more relaxing afternoon, as opposed rope drop being just an early start to a long day of constantly sticking to a plan maximize FPs (FP-)?

If the question is "Which system allows for the most amount of FPs on any given day?" then why are we still arguing? Legacy wins.

Just not sure that's the question.

 

[EMode]

So true! Some people just refuse to let people form their own opinions and love to hear themselves talk...

I was just looking to read something super positive about FP+. Believe it or not some of us non FP+ lovers want there to be positives
What I learned from the OP is that her use of rider swap let her kids ride many times. Not really what I was expecting on a thread that was titled LOVE FP+ (seriously).
I would have titles it LOVE RIDER SWAP (seriously).

 

[*disgal*]

Who cares if FP+ is the first or third or fourteenth most impactful variable?

If it had a positive impact, then it had a positive impact. The fact that other elements also had positive impacts does not take away from that. A good touring plan will take into account all elements and attempt to combine them to your best advantage.

That is SO true. I just think that because of the title, I expected to read how FP+ really made a difference. I mean, it doesn't say, love rider swap, love rd.

Don't get me wrong, I'm glad the OP's strategy worked. I like to hear that people had a great time at disney.

I guess I just see it differently. Not that you're wrong and I'm right. I just see that FP- could have done what she did and probably more since she was at rd . That's why it surprised me a little when I read the post after I read the title. That's all. I don't have my panties in a knot or anything.

 

[klitteral2009]

Wow. OP wrote about having a great time and ppl are tearing her argument apart as if it was a debate. "No you're wrong - don't tell me you liked FP+, you had a good time because of... ". Do you guys really not have anything better to do than debate another's good time? I go back to normal life for a few days, come back out to the forum, and the same 5-10 ppl are still ranting on every positive thread.

"I like that house because it's green"

"No, you like the house because of this and this and that... the fact that it's green doesn't matter as evidence proves you've liked blue houses too, and these other things clearly benefit you more. In fact the green can easily be changed and any house can be made green for a trivial cost".

I mean really? Can't ppl just say they like something w/o a debate? This is a fansite after all. You have to expect some ppl are going to actually like things. Berating every positive opinion about how they're wrong is not productive. Having to post on every... single... thread about FP+ and how the OP isn't right, FP+ really is bad. Ugh.

For most guests, FP+ is a benefit. For most Dis'ers, FP+ is not. This is a given, we know it, it's not going to change, so move on.

Taraaplin, I'm glad you had a good time. That is refreshing to hear amid all the doom and gloom of the Disney forums. I'm really unsure what to expect for our coming May trip... we never had a problem with waits in the past, but ppl are making it out to be like you're in line all day. It's nice to hear folks writing back that it's not really the case. Thanks!!

Now don't you know this is a discussion board? meaning people are ready to discuss how wrong you are when you happen to like a certain way of touring? Posting something positive should come with its own flame suit! Can't wait to hear your take on FP+ in May.

 

[*disgal*]

I was just looking to read something super positive about FP+. Believe it or not some of us non FP+ lovers want there to be positives
What I learned from the OP is that her use of rider swap let her kids ride many times. Not really what I was expecting on a thread that was titled LOVE FP+ (seriously).
I would have titles it LOVE RIDER SWAP (seriously).

Sorry. I was typing while you were posting......prac said the same thing. How embarrassing.

 

[JimmyV]

Spreadsheets = checkers
Behavioral analysis = chess

I know that we disagree on this, but I think that you are way overplaying the behavioral analysis angle of FP+. I don't believe that FP+ is some great social experiment on human behavior engineered by some Nobel-nominated Stanford PhDs. The use of MBs to track guest movements and spending patterns? Sure. But 3 FPs a day doesn't seem to be enough to gather any sort of behavioral data, especially as guests age out of certain attractions. In 2014 a family might get FPs for a whole bunch of princesses. In 2017 they might get FPs for a whole new set of rides. What does Disney learn from that other than the fact that the family has kids who have gotten older. They didn't need to spend billions to figure that out. FP+ is checkers. It is a really cool app driven system that allows guests to emotionally invest in their vacation months before it actually takes place, and it locks them in to days in the parks so that they do not venture northward on I-4. That's it. The rest of MDE may be far more advanced. But FP+ is simply this year's model of last year's product, only using machines that cost less to upkeep and smart phones, because that is what kids these days love to use. Why have them playing Angry Birds in line when they could be using the Disney app. But behavioral science. No. This isn't it. So while it is easy to dismiss people's opinions by claiming that we are blind and cannot see the behavioral science aspect of this, that in and of itself requires a lot of blind faith to believe that this is what is actually going on.

 

[OtherScott]

You guys are awful busy defending someone who wasn't attacked.

"I love FP+"

"I'm glad you're having a great trip, but you should credit it to showing up at rope drop and using rider swap, that's what all your success is about."

Not an attack...not sure what it is...or why

 

[morethananyonex]

Wow. OP wrote about having a great time and ppl are tearing her argument apart as if it was a debate. "No you're wrong - don't tell me you liked FP+, you had a good time because of... ". Do you guys really not have anything better to do than debate another's good time? I go back to normal life for a few days, come back out to the forum, and the same 5-10 ppl are still ranting on every positive thread.

"I like that house because it's green"

"No, you like the house because of this and this and that... the fact that it's green doesn't matter as evidence proves you've liked blue houses too, and these other things clearly benefit you more. In fact the green can easily be changed and any house can be made green for a trivial cost".

I mean really? Can't ppl just say they like something w/o a debate? This is a fansite after all. You have to expect some ppl are going to actually like things. Berating every positive opinion about how they're wrong is not productive. Having to post on every... single... thread about FP+ and how the OP isn't right, FP+ really is bad. Ugh.

For most guests, FP+ is a benefit. For most Dis'ers, FP+ is not. This is a given, we know it, it's not going to change, so move on.

Taraaplin, I'm glad you had a good time. That is refreshing to hear amid all the doom and gloom of the Disney forums. I'm really unsure what to expect for our coming May trip... we never had a problem with waits in the past, but ppl are making it out to be like you're in line all day. It's nice to hear folks writing back that it's not really the case. Thanks!!

When people claim they hate FP+ and it ruined their trip because they had a dirty resort room, bad service at dinner, and couldn't ride headliners standby in the afternoon, they get called on it and rightly so. FP+ had nothing to do with that. Their opinions and reports get ripped apart because their reasoning behind FP+ sucking does not make sense.

When people claim they love FP+ and then go on to list things they did that for the most part have nothing to do with FP, why shouldn't they get called on it? Having a great time is not debatable. Having a great time because of FP+ (therefore FP+ is awesome) absolutely is when the supporting argument with things that FP+ had nothing to do with. FP+ was responsible for one ride each on ToT, Star Tours, and TSMM in this case. FP+ was not responsible for the kids getting multiple rides on the headliners, riding multiple times at RD, or any other rides through the stand by lines. The title of the thread is all about FP+ love, but the content of the post has little to do with FP at all.

So in summary, OP says they rode ToT 4 times, TSMM 3 times, RnRC 1 time, GMR 1 time, Star Tours 2 times. Only 3 of those 11 rides have anything to do with FP+. That's why many of us are questioning how the post is evidence of FP+ being great, when all it really does is shows how effective RD and RS are.