HelpDealing with Schizophrenic

[mamacatnv]

OP - I'd definitely contact NAMI, they are a great resource. I was able to access my local chapter where I lived for guidance as well as the chapter in the area that Mother lived hundreds of miles away.

I became Mother's legal guardian when she was approx. 65 years of age and was finally committed on an involuntary hold at a geriatric psych hospital but leading to that event was a really long road. At that point we were able to medicate because she lost her rights and I was able to mandate the meds. I had two options: She was either going to become homeless due to her inability to play well with others or I was going to mandate medication and residential care for her living environment. I chose meds and care. In those last 10 years of her life I knew I kept her safe and that was my main goal.

Mental illness sucks, our laws suck in that they tie the hands of a well meaning family and society in general sucks when it comes to dealing with the mentally ill.

 

[roseaster]

OP, I work with the mentally ill, so this may be long winded.

You are correct, schizophrenics are statistically no more likely to commit violent acts than the rest of the community.

You must look on mental illness as what it is. It is an actual illness. This is not emotional, this is not something she can control. It is a chemical imbalance that can be treated with medication, but never cured.

Mental illness is a spectrum disorder. Using schizophrenia as an example some people (like your neighbor) are very seriously affected in that she is actively psychotic and acting on her delusions. Some people are minimally affected in that they may, say, hear voices, (this is very common) but are able to ignore them and can function "normally" in society.

So with this goes medication. With the mentally ill it is a trial and error science. It is not like an antibiotic where you can test the organism and know what antibiotic will treat it. In mental illness medication (and usually it is a combination of medications) that works for one person will not work for another. We must experiment with medications, dosages, and combinations. In addition medications to mitigate the side effects of the antipsychotics have to be added in.

Medications. They have side effects. Unpleasant ones. It is a lot of the reason people are non compliant. Also the very nature of the disease itself lends itself to non compliance. Schizophrenics are, often, disorganized so following a med regime is difficult for them, and the paranoia itself is a barrier. Patients often think that the medications are poisons. As a PP said, too, response to medications varies. Some schizophrenics are completely symptom free with medications, and some are still very symptomatic, but calmer. The usual is somewhere in the middle, where the patient is having symptoms but is able to live with them and function in society.

In your case I think that the advice that a lot of people have given you is spot on. Block her. Do not engage in her psychosis. There is not point in you confronting her and reorienting her to reality. You are not a professional and you are not a trusted (if she has any) loved one. All that will do is make her angrier that you don't believe her (remember, to her these ideas are very real) or more paranoid because, after all you are out to get her and you are trying to make her and everyone else think she is crazy. (remember, the thought pattern is NOT rational)

Calling DYFS is pointless unless you actually witness her abusing or neglecting her children. She is doing emotional damage to her children, no doubt, but there is nothing that DYFS can or will do about that.

The police, also, cannot do anything. It is not illegal to be "crazy." You can be as "crazy" as you want to be as long as you don't break any laws. You MUST, however, call 911 every time she threatens suicide or any type of physical harm to herself or anyone else. Explain that she is schizophrenic and ask for a crisis trained officer.

Good luck.

 

[Domo]

1.1% of the population is schizophrenic. Compare that to 5% that have paedeophilic tendencies!

Medication and accompanied therapies are VERY important. If a patient refuses to take their meds and regularly hallucinates and has delusions, frankly they should be sectioned for their safety and the safety of others.

 

[mamacatnv]

1.1% of the population is schizophrenic. Compare that to 5% that have paedeophilic tendencies!

Medication and accompanied therapies are VERY important. If a patient refuses to take their meds and regularly hallucinates and has delusions, frankly they should be sectioned for their safety and the safety of others.

Should and Will Be unfortunately do not go hand in hand when it comes to treating schizophrenia

 

[roseaster]

1.1% of the population is schizophrenic. Compare that to 5% that have paedeophilic tendencies!

Medication and accompanied therapies are VERY important. If a patient refuses to take their meds and regularly hallucinates and has delusions, frankly they should be sectioned for their safety and the safety of others.

No.

You are adding to the stigma of mental illness, something we have spent many years trying to overcome, and will spend many more. People with mental illnesses are not criminals or lunatics that need to be locked in the snake pit to protect society from them. Gone are the days where institutionalizing people who are different or ill is an acceptable thing. This fear of being judged and/or locked up the precise reason why many people with mental illness won't get help.

Schizophrenia is a chronic illness. Like diabetes, like high blood pressure. If you are diabetic and refuse to follow your diet and take your medicine should you be locked up and forced to do so? I can actually make the argument that a non compliant diabetic is much ore a harm to themselves than a non compliant schizophrenic.

Yes, non compliant schizophrenics may impact people around them, but they are not inherently dangerous. Maybe annoying, and definitely emotionally trying to their loved ones. Of course anyone who suicidal or homicidal should receive help.

Comparing them to pedophiles is actually a really horrible thing to do.

 

[Domo]

Is now a good time to mention that I myself am schizophrenic? I know what I'm talking about.

 

[roseaster]

Is now a good time to mention that I myself am schizophrenic? I know what I'm talking about.

Then you should be advocating and not tearing down.

What we have done to stigmatize the mentally ill is horrible. Mentally ill people are just that, ill, they are not criminals to be locked up, they are nothing to be ashamed of to be locked away for life.

I work in a partial care program with the mentally ill, the majority of whom are schizophrenic or have schizoaffective disorder. Many, many of them have resisted treatment or programs because they don't want to be seen as "crazy."

Many isolate because they are ashamed or have been objects of ridicule and abuse in public.

I worked in the state hospital. The abuses in the past were horrible. Gone is the era of institutionalizing our mentally ill (and there were a lot of non mentally ill people lumped in there, too) Our focus, now, is to help people with mental illness achieve as much independence and contribute as much to the community as possible. Again, even in my own program we have many levels of functioning, but it is all about helping people to achieve their best.

Like it or not everyone in the U.S. has the right to accept or refuse treatment of their illnesses, whatever they may be. We can only force treatment on someone if they are an "imminent danger to themselves or other." This means that they have to be actively suicidal or homicidal or so psychotic that they are unable to meet their basic needs.

Also medicating someone and treating them against their will rarely works. They take their medicine for the time that they are in the hospital because they know it is what is required to get discharged. Once they are discharged they stop taking it, nearly immediately.

 

[NotUrsula]

Speaking of anti-psychotic meds, one of the reasons that they are problematic for people who have children is that they tend to make you sleep -- a lot. My siblings are a lot older than I am, and Mom was medicated when I was small. We lived rather out in the sticks, and I can vividly remember taking my dog and wandering all over the heck and gone during school hours with no supervision at all, because my mother was out cold on her meds. No one knew where I was, and if I hadn't been dragging around a 90 lb. German Shepard, Lord knows what I might have stumbled into with no one the wiser.

The woman that the OP was speaking of has kids who are old enough that having her sleep all the time probably wouldn't be much of an issue, but it's possible that her husband is against anti-psychotics for this reason, particularly if he is a sole breadwinner who works long hours. (Remember that someone has to maintain the health insurance coverage if anyone is going to be able to get psychiatric treatment on an ongoing basis.) It does sound like she has a pretty severe situation, but so far the only person she has threatened to harm is herself, and unfortunately, in today's world, unless you actually open a vein or create a police standoff, that is not going to get you involuntarily committed. Also, even if they are committed, cheeking meds is usually not beyond the capability of the average schizophrenic, my mother regularly managed it.

PS: I may be wrong about this, but I believe that Domo is not in the US. Involuntary commitment procedures vary a lot between countries, and so do treatment protocols. The US has almost completely dismantled residential mental health provision, so there is essentially nowhere for the mentally ill to be "sectioned" for more than a day or two unless they have committed a criminal act. There are private residential facilities, to be sure, but the cost of them is astronomical now, and most insurance programs will not pay for extended stays..

 

[littleblackegg]

My mother was schizophrenic and went undiagnosed until she was in her mid 60's. Like most, she refused all meds. One of the very difficult hurdles of mental illness is the person afflicted does not see anything wrong with themselves or their behavior, everyone else is the problem. There is no reasoning, none. Frustrating does not even begin to describe what it is like to deal with an unmedicated schizophrenic.
I feel so bad for her husband and kids. I grew up in that kind of environment, my father eventually divorced her when I was in my teens and she was becoming violent. The emotional/physical damage she inflicted on all of us has taken years of therapy to sort out. Her hubby needs to plug himself and the kids into some help, sooner rather than later. NAMI, the National Assoc. for the Mentally Ill was a great resource for me.

The paranoia is typical of the disease. If I were you, I would just block her from your phone/email and not give any credence to her threats but as a concerned neighbor I would keep my eyes open and my radar going because her kids are the ones who will suffer the most and need someone who is paying a bit of attention should Mom go completely off the deep end.

I completely agree. I have worked with schizophrenic patients for many years. Jumping in and involving oneself with her symptoms will only cause more suffering. Continue to call law enforcement if she is a danger to herself or others, but disengage otherwise. It's a terrible illness, and frustrating for people in the ill person's immediate and outside groups.

 

[jahber]

You've received some good advice here from people who know schizophrenia. I'll add to it as the daughter of a paranoid schizophrenic who also suffered from bipolar disorder. My childhood was a MESS and I begged and begged my dad to divorce my mom my whole life, but of course he wouldn't because he's one of the nicest people I know and wouldn't abandon her. She took us and left him several times, but he always took her back.

Personally, I would recommend staying out of it in terms of interacting with the mom. There's no reasoning with a schizophrenic. None. I can't tell you the number of times my mom tried to convince me aliens or "bad air" or whatever were a threat to her. But if you know the kids, you can be a resource and a source of stability and safety. I learned about normal family life from my friends and at least once ran to a friend's house because I didn't feel safe with my mom. They ultimately sent me back when my dad came for me because they legally had to, but they opened their home nonetheless. And again, if you know them well, recommending therapy once they escape (because yes, it's literally escaping) is important. I ended up working through it myself, but my younger sister was hit harder. She's still occasionally visiting a therapist because a) she knows depression is partly genetic and b) she was too young to really understand and process what was happening when things got really really bad. If you can just be a nice neighbor or a friend who doesn't judge them by their mom, that's huge.

My mom died at 54 because she didn't take care of herself and I'm not ashamed to admit that my sister and I were relieved. That's what living with a schizophrenic mother can be like. When she dies, you cry tears of relief. Relief that you won't be disowned again or she won't threaten to kidnap your kids again, or whatever. So, if you could find a way to ignore her or deal with her, I guarantee her family will be eternally grateful. Truly.

 

[macraven]

 

[Chocolate Cake]

Schizophrenia is a chronic illness. Like diabetes, like high blood pressure.

No. Not like diabetes or high blood pressure. My neighbor is a diabetic. She does not harass me via texts or emails. She does not put signs in her window that say: "I know what you are doing". She does not constantly accuse me of things I did not do.

While I sympathize with someone that has a mental illness, I refuse to be abused and harassed by them. Take your meds or go to an in-patient treatment and get help. I am sorry if your life is in turmoil. It does not give you the right to wreak havoc in the neighborhood for years on end. I don't have to live in a neighborhood where I am harassed.

OP--I feel sorry for you. Your neighbor is not at peace with her life due to mental illness. However, it does not give her the right to bring the neighborhood down by harassing everyone.

 

[Goofy_Disney_Dad]

The compassion melts my heart...

 

[roseaster]

No. Not like diabetes or high blood pressure. My neighbor is a diabetic. She does not harass me via texts or emails. She does not put signs in her window that say: "I know what you are doing". She does not constantly accuse me of things I did not do.

While I sympathize with someone that has a mental illness, I refuse to be abused and harassed by them. Take your meds or go to an in-patient treatment and get help. I am sorry if your life is in turmoil. It does not give you the right to wreak havoc in the neighborhood for years on end. I don't have to live in a neighborhood where I am harassed.

OP--I feel sorry for you. Your neighbor is not at peace with her life due to mental illness. However, it does not give her the right to bring the neighborhood down by harassing everyone.

I would like to point out that the OP is accepting the "harassment." This neighbor is sending her emails and texts which the OP can very easily block but chooses not to. It would be an entirely different story if the neighbor were beating on her door or screaming on her lawn. At that point she has action to call the police, which, in that case, I would advise her to do, but as long as she is accepting communication she is feeding into the delusions.

Schizophrenia is, indeed, a chronic illness just like diabetes and high blood pressure. It follows the same pattern in that left untreated it has physical and psychological consequences. You cannot lock someone up for opting to forego treatment, you cannot force treatment upon someone if they don't want it, regardless of their diagnosis.

The way schizophrenia works is that given her paranoia, likely, if the neighborhood would stop engaging her she will retreat into her delusions. It's not ideal for her family, and not healthy for anyone, but, unfortunately, that is her husband's problem.

There a millions of untreated, unmedicated mentally ill people in this world.

 

[Chocolate Cake]

You cannot lock someone up for opting to forego treatment, you cannot force treatment upon someone if they don't want it, regardless of their diagnosis.

My compassion ends when someone refuses treatment and that leads to them harassing me. The OP did say that she is not blocking her because she feels like she is better off knowing when neighbor is having an episode. OP must do what makes her feel safest. She is not dealing with a mentally stable person. I would be so upset if a neighbor littered her windows with signs accusing fellow neighbors of something.

The way schizophrenia works is that given her paranoia, likely, if the neighborhood would stop engaging her she will retreat into her delusions.

Do you really think this is the neighborhood's fault? If they would stop engaging her? What in the world.

It is so easy to say these things. But would you really want to live in a neighborhood where one person harasses everyone and hangs signs in her windows? Day after day?

 

[Chocolate Cake]

The compassion melts my heart...

Where do you draw the line at compassion for the mentally ill? I am currently dealing with a mentally ill neighbor. Please see my garbage thread. I haven't reported back, but it has escalated to where she is now putting fecal matter on my porch. She has been caught on camera and charges have been filed. But she is not in jail and continues to do these disgusting acts.

I don't care if she is mentally ill. I don't have compassion for her. She is disrupting my life. I deserve to live in the nice neighborhood that I chose many years ago. One person shouldn't be able to ruin it under the guise of "mental illness".

Just like the OP. She should not have to look at crazy (yeah, I said it) signs hanging from a neighbor's windows or be harassed. As others have mentioned in this thread, this can go on forever until the mentally ill person dies. Your patience and compassion can run thin after a while.

 

[roseaster]

You can't change prejudice. It is just how some people are going to be. They are going to latch on to old stereotypes and keep them alive. It serves no purpose and it helps no one, but it is there.

The "not in my back yard" mentality has been an ongoing issue with the mentally ill for a long time. The old stereotype that the mentally ill are violent has been going on forever.

If someone commits a crime, such as vandalizing your property, then, by all means, report it. There is no crime in signs in a window. There isn't a thing anyone can do, unless they have an HOA, about how someone chooses to decorate their house. The last thing I want to look at are signs on people's lawn endorsing certain presidential candidates, but I'm stuck with it, but I am stuck with it. It's part of living in a community.

Again, the OP chooses to accept communication with her. In the case of the OP she can very easily disengage by blocking her emails and texts, she chooses not to because she chooses to remain involved. She said she chooses to do so because of old stereotypes and prejudices, the the neighbor "will kill her whole family." The OP has no evidence that this neighbor had done, or plans to do anything violent towards anyone else.

OP, back to the actual advice you asked for.

Disengage. Block her texts, block her emails. She is not your responsibility. If she commits an actual offense such as trespass upon or vandalize your property or threatening you or anyone else including herself call 911. Explain that she is mentally ill and ask for a crisis trained officer. They will know how to deal with her.

There is absolutely nothing you can do about her or her behavior unless a crime is committed, which, so far, it has not been. She is a nuisance, for sure, but that is about it.

She sounds like a very ill woman. Living like this must be a torture for her.

 

[connorlevismom]

I would like to point out that the OP is accepting the "harassment." This neighbor is sending her emails and texts which the OP can very easily block but chooses not to. It would be an entirely different story if the neighbor were beating on her door or screaming on her lawn. At that point she has action to call the police, which, in that case, I would advise her to do, but as long as she is accepting communication she is feeding into the delusions.

Schizophrenia is, indeed, a chronic illness just like diabetes and high blood pressure. It follows the same pattern in that left untreated it has physical and psychological consequences. You cannot lock someone up for opting to forego treatment, you cannot force treatment upon someone if they don't want it, regardless of their diagnosis.

The way schizophrenia works is that given her paranoia, likely, if the neighborhood would stop engaging her she will retreat into her delusions. It's not ideal for her family, and not healthy for anyone, but, unfortunately, that is her husband's problem.

There a millions of untreated, unmedicated mentally ill people in this world.

The problem is, nobody is "engaging" her. Nobody responds to her at all, even when she is speaking directly to them. Nobody emails or texts her back, but she keeps doing it. So your theory of stop engaging her and she will retreat into herself is not the case here. NOBODY responds! Nobody but her is actually doing anything in this situation. So how are we engaging her? Her neighbors across the street can simply be playing in their front yard with their little boy and she will come out and start screaming at them to stop looking in her windows. Again those neighbors do not respond to her, or even look at her. But she keeps doing it. At what point is it harassment by her? Getting emails about "you will all be responsible if something happens to me" and "all of you who are in on this are going to be exposed" - that is not ok with me. Accusing me of putting pig and dog lights on my car and house to torment her are one thing. Emails with threatening tones are completely another. The last one said my son is going to figure out one day what I have done and he is never going to forgive me. Leave my kids out if it.

Again, I do not block her because I prefer to know when she is having her delusions. Things lately have gotten much worse, and I prefer to know that. I makes me feel safer knowing, rather than wondering what is going through her mind. I do not respond to her, ever. We did end up emailing her husband and letting him know about the texts and emails we have been getting and that we want them to stop.

Her son and my son play together and he is always welcome at my house and is over several times a week playing basketball with the neighborhood kids. So I hope that he feels we are a safe place.

 

[Goofy_Disney_Dad]

Where do you draw the line at compassion for the mentally ill? I am currently dealing with a mentally ill neighbor. Please see my garbage thread. I haven't reported back, but it has escalated to where she is now putting fecal matter on my porch. She has been caught on camera and charges have been filed. But she is not in jail and continues to do these disgusting acts.

I don't care if she is mentally ill. I don't have compassion for her. She is disrupting my life. I deserve to live in the nice neighborhood that I chose many years ago. One person shouldn't be able to ruin it under the guise of "mental illness".

Just like the OP. She should not have to look at crazy (yeah, I said it) signs hanging from a neighbor's windows or be harassed. As others have mentioned in this thread, this can go on forever until the mentally ill person dies. Your patience and compassion can run thin after a while.

I know how you feel. Just the other day I had this disabled person going really slow in their wheelchair in front of me on the sidewalk, completely disrupting my need to move quickly. It happens every time they leave their house. If they can't move their wheelchair faster and stop disrupting my life, maybe they should move to an in-patient living facility so I can enjoy my life again. I don't care if they're disabled. I don't have compassion for her. She is disrupting my life. I deserve to live in the nice neighborhood I chose to many years ago. That dang disabled, wheelchair person moved in and ruined everything...

 

[Chocolate Cake]

I know how you feel. Just the other day I had this disabled person going really slow in their wheelchair in front of me on the sidewalk, completely disrupting my need to move quickly. It happens every time they leave their house. If they can't move their wheelchair faster and stop disrupting my life, maybe they should move to an in-patient living facility so I can enjoy my life again. I don't care if they're disabled. I don't have compassion for her. She is disrupting my life. I deserve to live in the nice neighborhood I chose to many years ago. That dang disabled, wheelchair person moved in and ruined everything...

No comparison to someone harassing you, putting signs in their window with accusing messages towards you, or (in my case) having a bowel movement on your front porch. No comparison whatsoever. I am sure you know that and are just being contrary.